The Working Poor

[midwesterner (banned)]

theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/the-working-poor

The Working Poor

As the middle class in America continues to be slowly wiped out, the number of working poor continues to increase. Today, nearly one out of every three families in the United States is considered to be "low income". Millions of American families are finding that they can barely make it from month to month even with both parents working as hard as they possibly can. Blue collar American workers from coast to coast are having their wages decreased at a time when it seems like the cost of virtually every monthly bill is going up. Unfortunately, there is every indication that things are only going to get worse and that average American families are going to be financially squeezed even more in the months and years to come.

Unfortunately, things are not going to be getting any better for the working poor. In the new "one world economy" that our politicians keep insisting is so good for us, millions upon millions of American workers now find that they have to compete for work with laborers on the other side of the globe that are willing to work for slave labor wages. This is causing millions of jobs to leave the United States and it is forcing wages down.

Millions of Americans now find that they are making substantially less than they used to. If that has happened to you, perhaps you can take comfort in the fact that you are not alone. Or perhaps it is not that comforting. In any event, American workers are not just competing with each other anymore. Now there is the constant threat that all the jobs could just be sent overseas.

As wages are forced down, a record number of working Americans are finding themselves forced to turn to food stamps and to other government anti-poverty programs. Millions of Americans have been forced to take part-time jobs in order to supplement their incomes. Millions of others have been forced to take part-time jobs because that is all they can find.

This is all part of a long-term trend. The numbers don't lie. About the only people doing well are those on Wall Street and the very rich. Nearly every other segment of the population is getting poorer.

The following are 10 statistics that I have shared previously, but I think that they do a really good job of highlighting the plight that the working poor in this country are now facing....

#1 In 2009, total wages, median wages, and average wages all declined in the United States.

#2 Since the year 2000, we have lost 10% of our middle class jobs. In the year 2000 there were about 72 million middle class jobs in the United States but today there are only about 65 million middle class jobs. Meanwhile, our population is getting larger.

#3 As 2007 began, only 26 million Americans were on food stamps, but now 42 million Americans are on food stamps and that number keeps rising every single month.

#4 Since 2001, over 42,000 U.S. factories have closed down for good.

#5 One out of every six Americans is now enrolled in at least one anti-poverty program run by the federal government.

#6 Half of all American workers now earn $505 or less per week.

#7 The number of Americans working part-time jobs "for economic reasons" is now the highest it has been in at least five decades.

#8 Ten years ago, the United States was ranked number one in average wealth per adult. In 2010, the United States has fallen to seventh.

#9 In 1976, the top 1 percent of earners in the United States took in 8.9 percent of all income. By 2007, that number had risen to 23.5 percent.

#10 According to one recent study, approximately 21 percent of all children in the United States are living below the poverty line in 2010.

[kman]

You found government figures that are true?

[neohguy]

I agree with the article that says this is a long term trend. It's more evident in some parts of the country than others.

[djrick]

"The point of the food stamp program is to subsidize workers that save nothing and earn only the bare minimum to survive. We want more of those in the US, because they're more easily controlled by their bosses.

It's also a subsidy to employers of the lowest-paid workers, the ones who are paid only enough to continue to subsist. In such positions, employers will pay the bare minimum for survival. $200 a month in food subsidy for those in this income bracket is $200/month less that the bosses need to pay to keep their workers alive."

[z]

The low pay is also a way for some unscrupulous employers to abuse their employees. Because the wage is so low an employee can't save any money and without some savings they are apt to take the abuse rather than quit. Quitting too many jobs can make an employer reluctant to hire you and even then you would just be trading one crappy job for another crappy job.

[dancinmama]

Jan 7, 2011 12:14:36 GMT -5 @neohguy said:

I agree with the article that says this is a long term trend. It's more evident in some parts of the country than others.

I would go as far as to say that it is pretty evident in ALL parts of the country. There may be pockets that have been devastated (i.e., Detroit, New Orleans, etc.), but I don't think there are any areas in the country that haven't been severely effected.

[comokate]

"Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke provided his latest economic outlook in testimony before a Senate panel Friday.

Bernanke reiterated the Fed’s view that the economy is recovering at a slow pace, and still requires the unprecedented level of loose monetary policies implemented by the U.S. central bank.

As for fiscal policy, Bernanke stated that “the federal government is on an unsustainable fiscal path. Yet, as a nation, we have done little to address this critical threat to our economy. Doing nothing will not be an option indefinitely; the longer we wait to act, the greater the risks and the more wrenching the inevitable changes to the budget will be.”

While this may sound all well and good, everyone is already aware of the worsening fiscal condition of the U.S., and actions speak louder than words. Bernanke provided no specific recommendations on how to lower the federal deficit, instead only paying lip service to the growing problem."
www.goldalert.com/2011/01/bernanke-u-s-on-unsustainable-fiscal-path/

A transcript of his testimony is available here:

www.federalreserve.gov/newsevents/testimony/bernanke20110107a.htm

[Deleted]

Is this the fault of the enonomy? or the person? or bad luck?

Why is it that some are thriving....and others cant feed or clothe themselves?

Why is it that some business'es are booming, and others closing their doors?

Why? Why is this occuring? What has changed?

1. Our industries have changed. You used to be able to get a decent job with decent pay with only a high school education. That is NO longer the case....and i dont see the old days returning ( the line workers of old are a dying breed). If you dont have the prerequisite education or skills, the DOOR is not open.

2. Our primary education system has been dumbed down. Kids are graduating high school, and some of them are barely able to add and multiply, and let's not even talk about literacy

3. Education costs continue to rise...so fewer are even trying to get into the better schools....and even if you graduate, the student loans are killing the lesser degree types. There are a number of career paths that pay very well....but too many are not even earning enough to cover their loans

4. We are becoming a country full of lawyers....and very few of anything else.

Way too many are taking the easy path through college when they do get there.....if you look at the best engineering schools in our country, exchange students comprise a LARGE percentage of those that are graduating...and they are taking their degrees back to india, china, and so on....

Lots of problems....and Government is NOT the answer.

[neohguy]

I disagree gdgyva. Industry changing is not the problem. Outsourcing industry is the problem. Almost anything is capable of being outsourced today and this includes brain jobs.
You are correct that some "individuals" will thrive but the country (US) won't.

[comokate]

Is this the fault of the enonomy? or the person? or bad luck?

Why is it that some are thriving....and others cant feed or clothe themselves?

Why is it that some business'es are booming, and others closing their doors?

Why? Why is this occuring? What has changed?

What has changed? Sociopathic behavior has been increasingly rewarded, and on the rise, for the last 25 years. We, as a nation, are reaping what has been sown.
Taking care of our families, and others less fortunate , used to be considered an expected and admirable behavior. Now it's , "every man/woman/child/handicapped/elderly person for themselves". Public tax monies have been used to bail out private banks, which in turn thanked those very tax payers by slapping higher/additional fees on every transaction they could, refusing to modify home loans forcing many into foreclosure ( and banks selling those homes under market value), and tightening lines of credit for small business owners. The "Golden Rule" was replaced by the corporate "Golden Parachute". The biggest "trickle down" phenomena of the Reagan years was the collective acceptance of these ideas and practices.

[midwesterner (banned)]

Como, Great find!!! This points to exactly what's going on. From what he was saying it looks like inaction is not an option for this marxist/keynesian/anti free market insiders. I'm guessing QE3 is on it's way sooner than later.

Weimar Republic here we come.

I disagree gdgyva. Industry changing is not the problem. Outsourcing industry is the problem. Almost anything is capable of being outsourced today and this includes brain jobs.
You are correct that some "individuals" will thrive but the country (US) won't.

Bingo Neo!!!

[Deleted]

Kate

That is only PART of the equation

There has always been greed....look at rockefeller or getty or any of the so called monopolists from the turn of the century...they were ruthless

Personal responsibility has changed....
Work ethic has changed....
Believing in a man's word has changed....

We are the "me" generation.....and i am as guilty as others

But i am damn tired of my hard earned dollars going to those that can help themselves...but refuse to because of the difficulty.....it is easier to let someone else do the hard work so they can profit off of it

We have all become cynical of our fellow man....

[comokate]

Jan 7, 2011 13:58:39 GMT -5 @gdgyva said:

Kate

That is only PART of the equation

There has always been greed....look at rockefeller or getty or any of the so called monopolists from the turn of the century...they were ruthless

True. That is why protections were put into legislation that helped prevent public exploitation by those "monopolists". Those protections have been chipped away over the last few decades by special interest groups lobbying our policy makers. The few people brave enough to voice concern over the apathetic acceptance of public exploitation and increasing monopolies, are chided, berated or worse.
Less than 10 percent of the population has seen an increase in their income/assets. Unless the remaining 90 percent wake up and decide to work together, we are looking at a very long term, progressive decline in the standard of living for most.

[midwesterner (banned)]

Stocks slide on jobs disappointment

articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/Dispatch/market-dispatches.aspx?post=b63d2acd-9d3b-43ba-92e9-c4a3853bc5ba

Most economists were hoping for gains of 150,000 jobs or more. Instead, the Labor Department said that jobs grew by 103,000.

The U.S. unemployment rate fell to 9.4%. But that may not be good news. In fact, it reflects a work force decline of 260,000. In other words, people stopped looking for work.

Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke said it may take four or five years for the jobs market to recover from the effects of the 2007-2009 recession. But the economy will be "moderately stronger" in 2011 than in 2010, he told the Senate Budget Committee today.

[midwesterner (banned)]

THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Press Secretary
For Immediate Release September 14, 1993

REMARKS BY PRESIDENT CLINTON,
PRESIDENT BUSH, PRESIDENT CARTER, PRESIDENT FORD,
AND VICE PRESIDENT GORE
IN SIGNING OF NAFTA SIDE AGREEMENTS

THE PRESIDENT:It's an honor for me today to be joined by my
predecessor, President Bush, who took the major steps in negotiating this North American Free Trade Agreement; President Jimmy Carter, whose vision of hemispherical development gives great energy to our efforts and has been a consistent theme of his for many, many years now; and President Ford who has argued as fiercely for expanded trade and for this agreement as any American citizen and whose counsel I continue to value.

We will make our case as hard and as well as we can.
And, though the fight will be difficult, I deeply believe we will win.
And I'd like to tell you why. First of all, because NAFTA means jobs. American jobs, and good-paying American jobs. If I didn't believe that, I wouldn't support this agreement.

For two decades, the winds of global competition have
made these things clear to any American with eyes to see. The only
way we can recover the fortunes of the middle class in this country so
that people who work harder and smarter can at least prosper more, the
only way we can pass on the American Dream of the last 40 years to our
children and their children for the next 40 is to adapt to the changes
which are occurring.


In a fundamental sense, this debate about NAFTA is a
debate about whether we will embrace these changes and create the jobs
of tomorrow, or try to resist these changes, hoping we can preserve
the economic structures of yesterday.

I believe that NAFTA will create 200,000 American jobs in
the first two years of its effect. I believe if you look at the
trends -- and President Bush and I were talking about it this morning
-- starting about the time he was elected president, over one-third of
our economic growth, and in some years over one-half of our net new
jobs came directly from exports. And on average, those export-related
jobs paid much higher than jobs that had no connection to exports.
I believe that NAFTA will create a million jobs in the
first five years of its impact. And I believe that that is many more
jobs than will be lost, as inevitably some will be as always happens
when you open up the mix to a new range of competition.

Many Americans are still worried that this agreement will
move jobs south of the border because they've seen jobs move south of
the border and because they know that there are still great
differences in the wage rates. There have been 19 serious economic
studies of NAFTA by liberals and conservatives alike; 18 of them have
concluded that there will be no job loss.

In a few moments, I will sign side agreements to NAFTA
that will make it harder than it is today for businesses to relocate
solely because of very low wages or lax environmental rules. These
side agreements will make a difference. The environmental agreement
will, for the first time ever, apply trade sanctions against any of
the countries that fails to enforce its own environmental laws. I
might say to those who say that's giving up of our sovereignty, for
people who have been asking us to ask that of Mexico, how do we have
the right to ask that of Mexico if we don't demand it of ourselves?
It's nothing but fair.

This agreement will create jobs, thanks to trade with our
neighbors. That's reason enough to support it. But I must close with
a couple of other points. NAFTA is essential to our long-term ability
to compete with Asia and Europe. Across the globe our competitors are
consolidating, creating huge trading blocks. This pact will create a
free trade zone stretching from the Arctic to the tropics, the largest
in the world -- a $6.5 billion market, with 370 million people. It
will help our businesses to be both more efficient and to better
compete with our rivals in other parts of the world.

[Deleted]

Less than 10 percent of the population has seen an increase in their income/assets. Unless the remaining 90 percent wake up and decide to work together, we are looking at a very long term, progressive decline in the standard of living for most.

This decline started 3 decades ago when a single wage earner per family could no longer make it. After 30 years of both parents working, now once again it's getting hard to make it again. (simply put) What will be the next step down? I am curious what your "waking up" means and how it will stop this progression to a yet ever lower standard of living in the US, that global wealth redistribution policies like NAFTA tend to do.

[z]

Stop shouting at us midwesterner!

[neohguy]

Jan 7, 2011 15:25:02 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

Less than 10 percent of the population has seen an increase in their income/assets. Unless the remaining 90 percent wake up and decide to work together, we are looking at a very long term, progressive decline in the standard of living for most.

This decline started 3 decades ago when a single wage earner per family could no longer make it. After 30 years of both parents working, now once again it's getting hard to make it again. (simply put) What will be the next step down? I am curious what your "waking up" means and how it will stop this progression to a yet ever lower standard of living in the US, that global wealth redistribution policies like NAFTA tend to do.

To be honest with you jma, I sometimes think we've passed beyond the ability stop it. I'm not a big Michael Moore fan but I think the satire Idiocracy pretty much describes it.

[midwesterner (banned)]

I am curious what your "waking up" means and how it will stop this progression to a yet ever lower standard of living in the US, that global wealth redistribution policies like NAFTA tend to do.

I'm assuming your addressing me? Waking up, well that's a multi step process. Takes some years, some never do, and others wake up really fast as is happening now. Waking up, what do mean? Well, for an example of what I'm talking about the movie the matrix works well at explaining this. If you haven't seen, I suggest you do. Neo always knew something wasn't right about his world. He was confused, but saw so many just going through the motions of life, questioning nothing. He was presented with the opportunity to pull the curtains back and see what's really going on, by taking the red pill.

So he did and was instantly snapped out of his false reality and out of the Matrix into real life. He could see what was happening and now discovered the truth.

In a sense that is a situation we deal with, but not on a machines controlling us level, but on a Matrix of lies, media brainwashing through master manipulators, and financial serfdom. They want a New World Order, a global ruling power of the elite, but needed to do this in secret. They have set up a pyramid power structure with the very elite at top, and used mass media before the Internet came out, using very scientific methods of propaganda and brainwashing so it's all subtle and slow. This empire is financial in nature, using debt notes to control our lives bying them having the control over creating money.

Now this is a very, very slimmed down version of our reality we face as a human race. I suggest you take this step by step. Here is a good film to start with.

EndGame

[Deleted]

Actually I was asking for Kate's thoughts as I quoted her post. But thanks for the reply.

[comokate]

Jan 7, 2011 15:25:02 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

Less than 10 percent of the population has seen an increase in their income/assets. Unless the remaining 90 percent wake up and decide to work together, we are looking at a very long term, progressive decline in the standard of living for most.

This decline started 3 decades ago when a single wage earner per family could no longer make it. After 30 years of both parents working, now once again it's getting hard to make it again. (simply put) What will be the next step down? I am curious what your "waking up" means and how it will stop this progression to a yet ever lower standard of living in the US, that global wealth redistribution policies like NAFTA tend to do.

I'm in agreement with you. I use the phrase "waking up" to mean having people get involved in local/national government. Demand transparency in financial and legislative matters. Demand public monies be spent for *public* use. Demand to know what hands were in the Social Security till ( which would have remained more than solvent had it not been bled dry to fund other "projects" ) and hold them, their estates, culpable. Legislate consumer/public protection/anti-monopoly laws. Provide tax credits to businesses that employ 80 percent of their work force within the US. Stiffly penalize businesses/corporations that refuse to do so. Send the IRS investigators out in full force to recoup money from corporations that off-shored their little empires to evade US taxes.; use that money to give domestic start-up manufacturing businesses backing. Give hefty incentives for domestic auto manufacturers to ( once again) develop an electric car suitable for all climates and pocket books. Vote out anyone who refuses to do these acts and vote in those who will work *for* their electorate.

[Deleted]

Kate



Demand transparency in financial and legislative matters. agreed

Demand public monies be spent for *public* use. not sure what you are meaning here

Demand to know what hands were in the Social Security till ( which would have remained more than solvent had it not been bled dry to fund other "projects" ) and hold them, their estates, culpable. would be great but i dont see it happening

Legislate consumer/public protection/anti-monopoly laws. already on the books

Provide tax credits to businesses that employ 80 percent of their work force within the US. i like it

Stiffly penalize businesses/corporations that refuse to do so. how about we just tarriff everything that comes in?

Send the IRS investigators out in full force to recoup money from corporations that off-shored their little empires to evade US taxes. you cant penalize companies for doing what was on the books as laws (but we can change the laws)


use that money to give domestic start-up manufacturing businesses backing. (use the proceeds of the tarriffs to do this)

Give hefty incentives for domestic auto manufacturers to ( once again) develop an electric car suitable for all climates and pocket books. define domestic gm builds in canada toyota builds in kentucky? and govt giving the car manufacturers money has already been done.....they are like airlines they WILL find a way to screw it up anyhow

Vote out anyone who refuses to do these acts and vote in those who will work *for* their electorate. until the lobbyists get to them to where they are bought and paid for also

I like some of the ideas....but some just wont work. The incentives to hire here will NOT work if foreign manufacturers can build the same thing for 1/3 of the cost...that is why we HAVE to have tarriffs

[Deleted]

All good ideas if the thinking is that all US Global companies fit the outsourced manufacturing profile being discussed.

However, there are many Global companies like mine that do not fit this profile.

I’m talking about off-shore business, winning profits off-shore, not out-sourced US jobs. Tariffs on goods – that’s fairly tangible. Increased taxes on off-shore Ops falls flat for me.

[nicomachus]

In a capitalist society, there must always be a race to the bottom in terms of wages. Whether the jobs are on shore or off, the owners will always insist on the bigger cut, the biggest cut they can get; in illness and old age, you won't be able to make anything; and should your industry no longer be in demand due to social changes, your only hope is to either try to learn a new skill, at which you will only be able to demand the lowest comparative wages due to your status as novice, or to rely on the bureaucracy that tries ever so desperately to mechanize some kind of safety net. Making things worse, every society, capitalist or socialist, will have conservatives who want to shrink that safety net or even get rid of it all together.

The only solution is to decentralize ownership of the means of production so that we become a self-reliant society with no motive to outsource our own wealth. Wealth will then be defined in terms of resources and potential to produce.

[vl]

I agree with the article that says this is a long term trend. It's more evident in some parts of the country than others.

Read more: notmsnmoney.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=moneytalk&action=display&thread=1162#ixzz1AS3Pr4Td

I think it's fascinating to see which parts of the country are thriving and which are wallowing. Texas is a great fishbowl. The place sucks in every possible way, yet, draws more there each month with the promise of jobs. Flat out, it lacks the resources to support the people it has now. We've seen this before. Shoddy housing popping up on arid land with trucked-in water and commuter jobs without substance. When it retracts, it goes ALL the way down.
Adversely, Michigan is approaching a 1 in 5 reliant on Food Stamps scenario. We aren't unable to work, employers want advanced degrees to do the same work we did before. Differently, we can sustain indefinitely because we have AMPLE resources.

If you're wondering where this will go, look to the kids in Middle and High School right now. It is a FOREGONE FACT that they are over-stressed and not generating the advanced intelligence the curriculum is supposed to yield. In fact, they are falling apart. Basically, button pushers are doomed and will be hard-pressed to shift away from administrative roles when demanded to do so. Technology moved too quickly to overtake labor. LABOR supports a nation, not Twittering.
As we head for dead (the bottom), look for a shift back to more peaceful and rewarding living, using technology to AID not replace labor. Talk to any kid. They know what they have to do to survive and will, it's the degree'd dumb-ass with a Blackberry addiction that won't.

[comokate]

A friend of mine from "back home" sent this...check out the slide in prices in the graph to the lower right of the page.
www.zillow.com/homedetails/38137-Afton-Dr-Sterling-Heights-MI-48310/83642640_zpid/
www.zillow.com/homes/sterling-heights,-mi_rb/

While Michigan may be experiencing a faster decline, Minnesota is in no great shape either. Historically a land of farmers, unions never took hold here. This has resulted in a workforce that is accustomed to no benefits, low wages, and an "employment at will" mentality. I was scheduled to work 8 hours yesterday; I got 4 but was expected to be "on call", *unpaid*, all day. My property taxes have increased 6 times in the twenty years I've had my home. With sliding home prices, I still have equity, but who knows for how long?
www.zillow.com/homes/st-paul,-mn_rb/0-_price/0-_mp/#/homes/for_sale/St.-Anthony-Saint-Paul-MN/275535_rid/45.003063,-93.121931,44.942707,-93.252908_rect/12_zm/1_rs/1_fr/
I agree with everything VL said except the part regarding labor. I have a "degree" yet my job entails working hands on patients. Guess what? We have not been safe either. Most employers decided to cut all full time staff to part time, which means no 401K, no health insurance ( yet we work in health care...), no vacation, no holiday pay, etc. Recently a hospital here even got work visas for bringing in nurses from the Phillipines, letting their nurses, American citizens, go. Nice mindset, eh?
I am sick to death of the "me first" mentality of corporate businesses , which has also bled in to privatized,stock holder owned, "corporate" health care. It doesn't matter what job skills are, no one is safe in this country anymore.
There has also been a fundamentally negative shift in viewing our young people having children. The children born today are our nation's future workers...unless the current trend will continues to be outsourcing all work.
Europe's demographics have changed largely due to their indigenous birthrates going down. Their aging population is in need of young workers, and they have turned to importing those workers from third world countries. Those workers have refused, largely, to "assimilate" into the local culture and they have clashed mightily. We are/will be facing the same scenario, because we've lost whatever shred of decency, compassion, and care for *our own people*.
Personal responsibility is a great thing. We hear about it all of the time. Where is the demand for "corporate/employer responsibility" ?? We are constantly told CEO's *deserve* their salaries because you only get the best in the field that way. Can't the same argument be said for everyone else?

[comokate]

"The official minimum wage has been set at 3,000 takas (£28) a month, up from 1662 takas, in the first raise since 2006. The new pay structure starts in November and has seven grades, with the highest pay fixed at 9,300 takas. Workers and labour rights groups have pressed for a monthly wage of 5,000 takas. Bangladesh's garment exports mainly to the US and Europe earn nearly 80% of the country's export income.

[/b] [/quote]
www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jul/29/minimum-wage-workers-bangladesh-protests

"28 British Pounds" is approximately $43.36. That is the total monthly take-home "upgrade" for these people.

Which is substantially less than the US Ford worker made in 1914...

Daily TWiP - Henry Ford raises minimum wage to an unheard of five dollars a day today in 1914
www.nashuatelegraph.com/news/9043....es-minimum.html

[Deleted]

I find the "poor" topics kind of interesting. It's like everyone believes that it would be easy to get rich EXCEPT the rich somehow stop others from becoming rich. Not true as far as I'm concerned. I don't believe that it's easy to become rich. I think that AT LEAST 20% of our population are lucky just to be able to dress themselves in the morning. Another 20% are lucky to pay their bills every month not because they are being "held down" by the rich but because they don't know the difference between a want & a need, can't control their spending, or slept thru their math classes from grades 1 thru 12. In life the 40% that I've talked about are what you would call cannon fodder because they make themselves cannon fodder.
Of the 60% left some of them will become rich but very few because it takes luck & skill & some will have neither in their lives. Plus a lot of them, as they make money will spend it as fast as it comes in. That action doesn't promote becoming wealthy.
Poor people are bad for the country because they can't consume as much as people with more money. Your not going to be able to eliminate them though with our form of government. Socialism will raise their standard of living but the problem there is that they will consume more than they produce so someone else has to support them (same thing as with welfare). Then you take away their incentives (& their children's incentives) to get ahead (again, the same as our welfare system). Not always but most of the time, BTW.
So what's the answer to the "poor" problem. Well to my way of thinking there is no answer because there really isn't a problem. There will always be poor people, just like there will always be people that don't want to work (I don't like to work, I'm lazy, but I did work long enough & hard enough to get a retirement check. I also learned to use my head to make money rather than physically working). If you want to help the poor then you give them opportunities to improve their lot in life (like college loans). If they don't take those opportunities, oh well. Just my thoughts.

[comokate]

"Oh Well" ??
How about ceasing to export the majority of manufacturing jobs to countries that pay slave labor wages with no safety protections for their employees ? You think the American worker can ( or should) be required to work in these conditions ? :
"In the night of December 2nd, 1984, a Union Carbide plant in Bhopal, India, began leaking 27 tons of the deadly gas methyl isocyanate. None of the six safety systems designed to contain such a leak were operational, allowing the gas to spread throughout the city of Bhopal [1]. Half a million people were exposed to the gas and 25,000 have died to date as a result of their exposure. More than 120,000 people still suffer from ailments caused by the accident and the subsequent pollution at the plant site.

These ailments include blindness, extreme difficulty in breathing and gynaecological disorders. The site has never been properly cleaned up and it continues to poison the residents of Bhopal. In 1999, local groundwater and wellwater testing near the site of the accident revealed mercury at levels between 20,000 and 6 million times those expected. Cancer, brain-damage and birth-defect-causing chemicals were found in the water; trichloroethene, a chemical that has been shown to impair foetal development, was found at levels 50 times higher than EPA safety limits [2].Testing published in a 2002 report revealed poisons such as 1,3,5 trichlorobenzene, dichloromethane, chloroform, lead and mercury in the breast milk of nursing women [3]. In 2001, Michigan-based chemical corporation Dow Chemical purchased Union Carbide, thereby acquiring its assets and liabilities. However Dow Chemical has steadfastly refused to clean up the site, provide safe drinking water, compensate the victims or disclose the composition of the gas leak, information that doctors could use to properly treat the victims."

www.bhopal.org/

indiejourno.com/2010/06/08/bhopal-gas-leak-verdict-indias-moment-of-shame/

I guess working for less than 50 dollars a month, with no employee safeguards, is always an option in your eyes-

[comokate]

I don't believe anyone ever stated "everyone become rich". I also don't believe that is is outrageous to expect to be paid a fair and decent living wage for a fair day's work. And to be able to work in an environment in which you will not lose life and limb.
Is that asking too much?
So many people (mind you, not all) in the "Boomer" generation and beyond seem to feel as if they "got theirs", the hell with everyone else.
Previous generations in this country, after the Great Depression, were fortunate enough to be paid living wages, have guaranteed pension plans, and many times were the recipients of VA benefits for higher education and home loans.
Now our returning soldiers, as well as the 9-11 First Responders, have had to fight for health care.
Is this behavior our country should be proud of?
Do you think pulling the rug our from the younger generations is going to make them feel very kindly towards towards anyone over the age of 50 ?