NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 20:38:45 GMT -5
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 9, 2011 20:46:09 GMT -5
Here's what I got after I filled out the questionaire with my email address
View 2011 Military Pay Charts The email address already exists .
So I cannot download the Military Pay Charts for Retirement Pensions... or have it emailed to me...
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 21:11:15 GMT -5
Not pension. Pay. The point is that the pay is enough. Nowhere near close to minimum wage or lower as you said. So I don't see why there has to be a pension on top of that when similarly paid (or even far less paid) private sector employees don't have pensions. The military has a sweet ride like all public sector employees. It is high time that we rightsize the public sector compensation.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 9, 2011 21:11:17 GMT -5
It depends on rank PI - but I would say average retirement pay for 20 years is around $1800 per month. Ok thanx Ratchets that seems about right to me
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Jun 9, 2011 21:12:57 GMT -5
www.navycs.com/2012-military-pay-chart.htmlNot exactly poverty level, plus you get free room and board, healthcare, education funding, so you have to take all of that into account. More importantly, these folks would be WalMart greeters otherwise in many cases. It's not like they gave up a great career to join the military. So they are already being overpaid. Finally, the county can't afford to pay so much. Do you know what the deficit is? Sounds like a good deal... why didn't you go for it?
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 21:13:07 GMT -5
By the way it is obscene that someone can collect retirement pay after just 20 years of service whent he average American works for 45 years in his/her lifetime.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 9, 2011 21:15:14 GMT -5
Ok I thought that oldrex was talking about pensions for retired military...
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 9, 2011 21:22:49 GMT -5
By the way it is obscene that someone can collect retirement pay after just 20 years of service whent he average American works for 45 years in his/her lifetime.
Yea I know but in some cases 20 years is the longest that one can serve for various reasons.. But some of us are still serving as volunteers for our wounded and the only pay we get is a "thanx" from some of our wounded and the staff at the VA..or at a Fisher House..
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Jun 9, 2011 21:23:20 GMT -5
By the way it is obscene that someone can collect retirement pay after just 20 years of service whent he average American works for 45 years in his/her lifetime. Some even get a plot of land...
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 9, 2011 21:29:02 GMT -5
Some even get a plot of land...[/quote][/color]
With a real nice headstone too ...but only a select few are buried at Arlington Cemetary because they are running out of land to bury all of the dead from our wars..
And when a jahead passes he is supposed to get a guard slot in Heaven either guarding the streets there or at the main gate..
BTW when I was active I certainly didn't think I was overpaid just the opposite I always thought that I was underpaid..
Red Sox vs Yankees just started so Bye Guys take care..P.I.
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 21:35:59 GMT -5
www.navycs.com/2012-military-pay-chart.htmlNot exactly poverty level, plus you get free room and board, healthcare, education funding, so you have to take all of that into account. More importantly, these folks would be WalMart greeters otherwise in many cases. It's not like they gave up a great career to join the military. So they are already being overpaid. Finally, the county can't afford to pay so much. Do you know what the deficit is? Sounds like a good deal... why didn't you go for it? Because I can make far, far more doing what I do. I didn't opt for the WalMart greeter position either.
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 21:36:33 GMT -5
By the way it is obscene that someone can collect retirement pay after just 20 years of service whent he average American works for 45 years in his/her lifetime. Some even get a plot of land... Emphasis on some.
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Jun 9, 2011 21:37:34 GMT -5
Sounds like a good deal... why didn't you go for it? Because I can make far, far more doing what I do. I didn't opt for the WalMart greeter position either. Then what are you complaining about?
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 21:39:22 GMT -5
Because I can make far, far more doing what I do. I didn't opt for the WalMart greeter position either. Then what are you complaining about? Military pensions paid out of my tax dollars. The private sector gets no pension. The public sector needs to stop getting pensions as well. And just not the military, any public sector employee qualifies. I am sick and tired of paying high taxes to support the public sector.
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Jun 9, 2011 21:43:04 GMT -5
Then what are you complaining about? Military pensions paid out of my tax dollars. The private sector gets no pension. The public sector needs to stop getting pensions as well. And just not the military, any public sector employee qualifies. I am sick and tired of paying high taxes to support the public sector. So because you made the choice to enter a high paying job in the private sector, knowing you would not get a pension, retired military should not get what they were promised... because you don't want to pay taxes for it?
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 21:46:08 GMT -5
Military pensions paid out of my tax dollars. The private sector gets no pension. The public sector needs to stop getting pensions as well. And just not the military, any public sector employee qualifies. I am sick and tired of paying high taxes to support the public sector. So because you made the choice to enter a high paying job in the private sector, knowing you would not get a pension, retired military should not get what they were promised... because you don't want to pay taxes for it? ROFL all you want, taxes today are obscene and so is govt largesse and any true conservative would stand up and be counted in cutting spending and lowering taxes. Starting with the public sector pay. In fact we should also shrink the military to about 1/20th the current size.
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Jun 9, 2011 21:50:05 GMT -5
ROFL all you want, taxes today are obscene and so is govt largesse and any true conservative would stand up and be counted in cutting spending and lowering taxes. Starting with the public sector pay. In fact we should also shrink the military to about 1/20th the current size. Cut spending and lower taxes all you want. But not on the backs of our military.
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 22:08:47 GMT -5
ROFL all you want, taxes today are obscene and so is govt largesse and any true conservative would stand up and be counted in cutting spending and lowering taxes. Starting with the public sector pay. In fact we should also shrink the military to about 1/20th the current size. Cut spending and lower taxes all you want. But not on the backs of our military. Spending has to be cut for everything. No sacred cows.
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Post by lakhota on Jun 9, 2011 22:11:53 GMT -5
Why are some people so afraid that they want such a giant military complex? I say military spending needs hammered.
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Jun 9, 2011 22:18:45 GMT -5
Spending has to be cut for everything. No sacred cows. You can cut defense spending without taking away from military personnel. Don't you think they are giving enough already?
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 9, 2011 23:58:30 GMT -5
Spending has to be cut for everything. No sacred cows. You can cut defense spending without taking away from military personnel. Don't you think they are giving enough already? No, I don't. It's a voluntary military. They could have done something else. Look, there has to be cuts everywhere if USA is to become prosperous again. I am OK with elders living in the streets, elders who have paid SS taxes all their life but won't get paid SS. Everyone has to sacrifice here for the good of the country. The military cannot be an exception. Cut Medicare, Medicaid, DoE (no more free public schooling, we can't afford that, send your kids to private school or homeschool them), military, everything. We have to pay the interest on the loans, and every other penny should go towards paying off the principal. When the national debt is all paid off then we should save for emergency for another 10 years or so of annual budgets. Only then we should think about spending again. This would probably take 25-50 years, and would result in a gut wrenching Depression, but if you want the country to be in solid financial footing again, that's the price. We were a net creditor till Reagan started the downward spiral and every single other President other than Clinton has contributed to the mess. Someone needs to stand up and say no and stop the bloddletting.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 10, 2011 5:35:44 GMT -5
No, I don't. It's a voluntary military. They could have done something else. I am grateful they didn't do something else but decided to volunteer to serve their country. I think today's military is by far the best of the best, especially the Navy Seals, Air Force Rescue, Marine Recon, and Army Special Forces. No their pay and pensions should not be cut, but yes waste and fraud should be cut in the vast military defense contracts agency. I would also say that you are getting your bang for the buck in taxes being spent on military pay and pensions and calling that a "Sacred Cow" Ok!! But do see where you are coming from but disagree with you and Lakhota...cutting the military pay and/or pensions is not something I would agree with at this time. It could put our National Security at further risk...IMHO And military pensions are earned and not that excessive if @ $1800.00 per month is the average monthly payment for enlisted with 20 years of service as suggested by Ratchets.
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Jun 10, 2011 6:12:03 GMT -5
Everyone has to sacrifice here for the good of the country. The kind of sacrificing you're talking about is not for the good of the country.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 10, 2011 7:14:51 GMT -5
A military pension of @$ 20,000 - @$30,000 a year is a small price to pay for what the enlsted pensioners did to receive that amount IMHO. It was not easy getting to 20 years during the 60s & 70s....and during the Carter Years there was significant downsizing which forced early retirements with less than 20 years of service. And I am sure Leon Panetta doesn't want to see that happen again or else troop morale will do down the toilet in no time at all..
But it will be interesting to see where he wants to cut and he did not address this subject yesterday in his senate confirmation hearings..He probably will if and when he is confirmed as Sec Def which seems to be a slam dunk, I think??
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Jun 11, 2011 1:50:03 GMT -5
When you talk about Afghanistan you have to also talk about Pakistan..and some will ask why are we involved in Pakistan too, we have given them $20 billion on aid,. about 3/4 of it going to the Military in the past ten years. Most of the supplies that go to Afghanistan pass through Pakistan, trucks mostly , hundreds a day..also the Taliban is there too in the mountains, the faction that has their roots into Afghanistan, as well as the faction that is also fighting the Pakistan government and military too, plus supposedly as Quida..we know who they are. When we pulled out of the area after the Russians pulled out, Pakistan became very friendly with the Chinese and are still friendly with the Chinese. Article I will post shows the connection. Close ties now, actually actually putting Pakistan under it's umbrella as a protectorate in case any one attacks them. A new deep water port that they, Chinese , are paying 80 % for in Pakistan and the Pakistani ans are now wanting the Chinese to build a Naval Base there, naturally Chinese Naval ships to be stationed there and that is very close to the Persian Gulf, plus a pipeline from Iran for Gas and oil through Pakistan to the new port is in the planning stages..Sooo...when you question Afghanistan, you also have to question why Pakistan. ------------------------------------------------------------ english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2011/05/2011527104451497291.html----------------------------------- [Click on link to read article] ----------------------------------- Opinion Do the China-Pakistan pipeline shuffle From the Gwadar port complex to fighter jet sales, strained relations between the US and Pakistan are benefiting China. Pepe Escobar Last Modified: 27 May 2011 16:34 "Gwadar is Pakistan's first deep water port; constructed with Chinese investment it will play a crucial role in moving Middle East oil to energy hungry China for decades to come [EPA] China is adamant that the West "must respect" Pakistan's sovereignty. The message was delivered during Pakistani Prime Minister Yousuf Gilani's recent four-day visit to Beijing, which celebrated no less than six decades of strategic relations - involving, among other issues, nuclear collaboration and support over the ultra-sensitive Kashmir question. The Times of India reconstructed the message as a stark warning that: "any attack on Pakistan would be construed as an attack on China." Chinese diplomacy dwells on too much sophistication for such a crude outburst; but even enveloped in red velvet, the message - in view of the non-stop US drone war over Pakistan's tribal areas, not to mention the "get Osama" raid in Abbottabad - was indeed a bombshell. Whatever the merit of charges that Islamabad helps some Taliban factions - such as the Haqqani network in North Waziristan - the Pakistani politico-security-military establishment has had enough of being treated by Washington as a mere satrapy, or worse, a bunch of punks. Pakistani popular opinion, from urban centers to tribal areas, roundly abhors Washington's drone war. And even before the Navy SEALS raid to get Osama the sordid Raymond Davis case was configured as the ultimate humiliation. Davis, a CIA asset, shot two Pakistanis dead in broad daylight in Lahore; an American "extraction team" killed another one who was trying to save Davis from arrest; and then the CIA paid blood money to finally extract Davis out of the country. Sovereignty? What sovereignty? Strategic ports There's frantic spin in the US especially among the right that Pakistan must be taught a lesson because it "harbors terrorists". The mighty conceptual leap would be for these righteous, misinformed, armchair warriors to advocate teaching China a lesson. Gwadar is an ultra-strategic deepwater port in the Arabian Sea, in Pakistani Balochistan, not far from the Iranian border and only 520 km away from the hyper-strategic Strait of Hormuz. Beijing financed close to 80 per cent of the construction of the port via the China Harbor Engineering Company Group. The port is currently managed by Singapore. The lease will end soon - and it will go to China. Islamabad now wants the Chinese to build a naval base at Gwadar. That will be a monster geopolitical earthquake in a crucial node of "Pipelineistan" as well as the New Great Game in Eurasia"
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Post by lakhota on Jun 11, 2011 1:56:31 GMT -5
Sooo, is America supposed to go broke trying to keep up with the Chinese? That game didn't work out well for the Soviet Union.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Jun 11, 2011 9:28:08 GMT -5
Sooo, is America supposed to go broke trying to keep up with the Chinese? That game didn't work out well for the Soviet Union. Good point...possible we with draw from certain parts of the globe...understand if we do so , allies in the areas will look to make accomadations with the Chinese...India, Japan, Korea, still not guaranteeing the attackks from those who think us the devil, I doubt if they will turn on the Chinese..Chinese never try to change a regime, whatt hey do is not their business..all they care, will you sell us your ..[whatever they have that they could use and are interested in } With draw and settle for a militarily strong nation and second tier in all other things..possible. When I bring these little tidbits up..I am not saying I have the answe to them...just letting some know, the simple answers , there are no simple answers and there are consequences, but these things are happening..and to ignore them, as if by ignorance of , they are not happening , doesn't mean they are not happening..pretty much as you do on a lot of your posts.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 11, 2011 9:49:32 GMT -5
Sooo, is America supposed to go broke trying to keep up with the Chinese? That game didn't work out well for the Soviet Union. News Flash we are not like the Soviet Union...and we know that we cannot and will not try to keep up with China... But nice try to dodge the OP once again...Afghan is a waste of tax payers money with Billions of waste. i.e. building infrastructure and buildings that the Afghans don't want nor can they maintain.. Giving money to the Afghan government that is funneled to the Taliban.. Giving money to the Afghan National Security that is a joke since they inform the Taliban when the US plans to strike one of their facilities or training areas. Here is where we waste tax payers money and NOT on our military pay/pensions.....IMHO
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 12, 2011 20:43:02 GMT -5
It's not like they gave up a great career to join the military
Did you ever hear of Pat Tillman and his brother, and other athletes who went into the military after they received offers to play pro sports??
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handyman2
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Post by handyman2 on Jun 12, 2011 20:54:02 GMT -5
Lakhota: I have asked myself this same question more than once and cannot come up with a reasonable answer. Just a big waste of money and a bigger waste of American military. When over there will be nothing accomplished nor gained. Just lives and money thrown down a dark hole.
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