How far right do you have to be

[happyhoix]

To piss off the Pope?? 

The Pope fired a Texas bishop.

www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/pope-francis-ousted-a-texas-bishop-signaling-he-may-finally-be-done-with-ultraconservative-us-catholics/ar-AA1jLUA8?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=25a40a9f134f4be1aaa47a30e806a471&ei=7

Bishop was disgruntled that the Pope was (gasp - clutch your pearls) softening the Church’s stance on gays and women serving as priests. 

[Tennesseer]

Nov 11, 2023 23:07:34 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

To piss off the Pope?? 

The Pope fired a Texas bishop.

www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/pope-francis-ousted-a-texas-bishop-signaling-he-may-finally-be-done-with-ultraconservative-us-catholics/ar-AA1jLUA8?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=25a40a9f134f4be1aaa47a30e806a471&ei=7

Bishop was disgruntled that the Pope was (gasp - clutch your pearls) softening the Church’s stance on gays and women serving as priests. 

Even popes have standards.

[giramomma]

I really like this pope.

I really don't like the brand of Catholicism that I'm seeing in my neck of the woods and it's not even ultra conservative.

As the boomers pass, Catholicism is going to take even a bigger hit than it already has.

It's not doing so well with my kids. We'll see if the missy gets confirmed. So, far, the faith is 0 for 3 for my kids.

[teen persuasion]

Nov 12, 2023 13:25:01 GMT -5 giramomma said:

I really like this pope.

I really don't like the brand of Catholicism that I'm seeing in my neck of the woods and it's not even ultra conservative.

As the boomers pass, Catholicism is going to take even a bigger hit than it already has.

It's not doing so well with my kids. We'll see if the missy gets confirmed. So, far, the faith is 0 for 3 for my kids.

Yeah, we are the "young people" in our parish, and DH's retired!

There are no children lately, DS5 and one other girl were/are the last altar servers. And she's graduating next June, so then there will be none. Just ten years ago the church used 4 servers at each mass, and there were enough kids that they took turns, maybe serving once a month.

All my kids got confirmed, but none attend once they get into college.  DS2 is definitely done with the church, due to the stances on LGBTQ issues and the whole sexual abuse scandal in our diocese.

[djAdvocate]

Nov 12, 2023 13:25:01 GMT -5 giramomma said:

I really like this pope.

I really don't like the brand of Catholicism that I'm seeing in my neck of the woods and it's not even ultra conservative.

As the boomers pass, Catholicism is going to take even a bigger hit than it already has.

It's not doing so well with my kids. We'll see if the missy gets confirmed. So, far, the faith is 0 for 3 for my kids.

i find it interesting that the most loved leaders of the traditionally conservative institution of Catholicism are all liberals.

[resolution]

The good news is that pope francis has already appointed more than 70% of the cardinals that will be voting to replace him, so hopefully he picked men that will align with his pastoral views. He is a breath of fresh air compared to the leadership in the US, but he's still a conservative: no women deacons, no marriage for priests, etc. But at least his focus is on ministering to people rather than trying to crack down on whoever is the current victim of right wing culture wars.

The bishop he replaced had made a bunch of posts on social media saying Francis wasn't the true pope, and was traveling around the country to lead right wing protests that the local bishops didn't want. For example he led a protest at a football game in California because the half time entertainment was gay and anti catholic, even though the bishop there just wanted to ignore it and asked him not to protest. I don't think the pope really had a choice because the bishop had really gone off the rails.

[thyme4change]

Nov 12, 2023 17:03:34 GMT -5 resolution said:

The bishop he replaced had made a bunch of posts on social media saying Francis wasn't the true pope, and was traveling around the country to lead right wing protests that the local bishops didn't want. .

Is he saying the election was rigged and he has proof that Francis stole the Pope-hood?

[Tennesseer]

Nov 12, 2023 22:35:11 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Nov 12, 2023 17:03:34 GMT -5 resolution said:

The bishop he replaced had made a bunch of posts on social media saying Francis wasn't the true pope, and was traveling around the country to lead right wing protests that the local bishops didn't want. .

Is he saying the election was rigged and he has proof that Francis stole the Pope-hood?

Coincidentally its the same 19 co-defendents indicted in Georgia providing the bishop his proof.

[resolution]

Nov 12, 2023 22:35:11 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Nov 12, 2023 17:03:34 GMT -5 resolution said:

The bishop he replaced had made a bunch of posts on social media saying Francis wasn't the true pope, and was traveling around the country to lead right wing protests that the local bishops didn't want. .

Is he saying the election was rigged and he has proof that Francis stole the Pope-hood?

Bishop Strickland called him a usurper of the chair of peter and an underminer of the deposit of faith. The conservative's basic argument is that the previous pope shouldn't have been allowed to retire, and since pope benedict was still alive when pope francis was elected, that makes the election invalid. 

The bottom line is that pope francis has been rebuking the conservative bishops and priests in the united states, saying they are backwards and have replaced their faith with political ideology, and they have responded by implying he is not the true pope. It just happens that Strickland went a bit further than the others and got himself removed.

If you are curious, there is more info at the link, but it's a bit dry.  catholicreview.org/bishop-strickland-removed-from-diocese-after-accusing-pope-of-backing-attack-on-the-sacred/

[MN-Investor]

When Protestants disagree with their leaders, they just go off and form another Protestant branch. Don't like women pastors? Split off and form your own denomination. Don't approve of gay pastors or same sex marriage? Split off and form your own denomination.

That's were Roman Catholic priests are stuck. There's only one Roman Catholic Church and the head of that is the Pope. That's it. You can't split off and form a new church and be Catholic without a Pope.

By the way, my husband was raised Catholic. Went to a Catholic grade school. His priest was aghast when my sweetie told him he was going to attend the nearby Lutheran college. His priest predicted that he'd end up marrying a Lutheran girl if he went there. Yeah. He did.

[teen persuasion]

Nov 13, 2023 0:51:27 GMT -5 MN-Investor said:

When Protestants disagree with their leaders, they just go off and form another Protestant branch. Don't like women pastors? Split off and form your own denomination. Don't approve of gay pastors or same sex marriage? Split off and form your own denomination.

That's were Roman Catholic priests are stuck. There's only one Roman Catholic Church and the head of that is the Pope. That's it. You can't split off and form a new church and be Catholic without a Pope.

By the way, my husband was raised Catholic. Went to a Catholic grade school. His priest was aghast when my sweetie told him he was going to attend the nearby Lutheran college. His priest predicted that he'd end up marrying a Lutheran girl if he went there. Yeah. He did.

Its also interesting to compare the internal systems and decision making hierarchy. There's a Methodist church across the street from my library, and the library's cleaning/maintenance crew (married couple) are on the exec committee for the church. When the committee/congregation don't like what the pastor is doing, boom, he's fired and sent packing, and then the committee finds and hires a replacement.


Totally different from my experience in our Catholic parish: priests are told by the diocese where they can serve; they might be able to move to a different parish - a past priest in our parish learned of an opening elsewhere and left for greener pastures, leaving us with no priest. The parish was at the mercy of the diocese, waiting for them to 'find' another pastor for us. Needless to say, there are no *more* priests, just fewer each year as the older ones retire/die off. We spent months with nearby pastors filling in for us. Ultimately, the diocese just declared the pastor of a nearby parish (previously merged, like ours) to be our pastor, too. Yeah, one nearly retirement age priest was now pastor of *two* parishes, each of which consisted of 2 or 3 former parishes, all aging buildings with too long neglected maintenance. Once he retired, then what? The diocese is now creating *families* of parishes. Once again, we were in limbo waiting for a new pastor to be assigned to our new family of parishes; we got a few assistant priests, for now. Five parishes (all formerly merged, so previously many more) are now one family. We (the congregation) can see the handwriting on the wall - eventually more sites will close, and my site is an outlier and smaller. It's just a matter of time. We've been warned that as priests leave there are no replacements, we just lose that priest, but there are limits to how many masses they say a day, especially due to the logistics of masses at multiple sites thruout 2 counties instead of at one church. So each time we lose a priest, we will consolidate more.

I'm sorry, if *my* site closes, I'm done. I'm not driving to another county for mass. That's it. Other congregants have told us they are church shopping, checking out the Methodist church, and they are very dedicated Catholics - he's a lector and was on previous councils, she's in the choir and organizes cleaning/decorating the church. So every merger/closure causes more losses.

[mollyanna58]

I know a young man who is studying to become a priest. I wonder how many there are in his seminary class.

[Tennesseer]

Word origin:  seminary


late Middle English (denoting a seed plot): from Latin seminarium ‘seed plot’, neuter of seminarius ‘of seed’, from semen ‘seed’.

[NastyWoman]

Nov 12, 2023 22:35:11 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Nov 12, 2023 17:03:34 GMT -5 resolution said:

The bishop he replaced had made a bunch of posts on social media saying Francis wasn't the true pope, and was traveling around the country to lead right wing protests that the local bishops didn't want. .

Is he saying the election was rigged and he has proof that Francis stole the Pope-hood?

Someone (Pope Francis?) switched the black smoke for white. And he had the fake smoker brought in by bus I'm sure.

[giramomma]

Nov 12, 2023 17:03:34 GMT -5 resolution said:

The bishop he replaced had made a bunch of posts on social media saying Francis wasn't the true pope, and was traveling around the country to lead right wing protests that the local bishops didn't want. For example he led a protest at a football game in California because the half time entertainment was gay and anti catholic, even though the bishop there just wanted to ignore it and asked him not to protest. I don't think the pope really had a choice because the bishop had really gone off the rails.

We've had bishops too that have said the Pope wasn't a true Catholic leader.

They weren't rabid about publicly stating it.

[resolution]

An interesting article from the perspective of a parishioner in Strickland's diocese. Makes me wonder how often he was preaching against the pope.

In my own parish, we had a priest that was getting more and more into the Latin Mass. The pope wrote new rules trying to limit the spread, but instead of following them, our priest doubled down and changed a bunch of our regular English masses into Latin. He just got moved to a different church and we have a new priest that is slowly changing things back into English.

www.ncronline.org/opinion/guest-voices/joseph-strickland-was-my-bishop-heres-why-he-had-go

[andi9899]

I was raised catholic and I haven't been to church in forever. I baptized my kids but neither goes to church. I doubt they baptize their children. Catholicism is slowly dying.

[dondubble]

Nov 13, 2023 22:05:14 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Nov 12, 2023 17:03:34 GMT -5 resolution said:

The bishop he replaced had made a bunch of posts on social media saying Francis wasn't the true pope, and was traveling around the country to lead right wing protests that the local bishops didn't want. For example he led a protest at a football game in California because the half time entertainment was gay and anti catholic, even though the bishop there just wanted to ignore it and asked him not to protest. I don't think the pope really had a choice because the bishop had really gone off the rails.

We've had bishops too that have said the Pope wasn't a true Catholic leader.

They weren't rabid about publicly stating it.

Well he IS a Jesuit.🥳

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Nov 15, 2023 14:19:38 GMT -5 andi9899 said:

I was raised catholic and I haven't been to church in forever. I baptized my kids but neither goes to church. I doubt they baptize their children. Catholicism is slowly dying.

Ditto.  I think that the last time I went to church, it was for my niece's confirmation.  That was nearly 20 years ago.

[dondubble]

Nov 15, 2023 16:07:19 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Nov 15, 2023 14:19:38 GMT -5 andi9899 said:

I was raised catholic and I haven't been to church in forever. I baptized my kids but neither goes to church. I doubt they baptize their children. Catholicism is slowly dying.

Ditto.  I think that the last time I went to church, it was for my niece's confirmation.  That was nearly 20 years ago.

I have been to a couple funerals in the last 20 years. No weddings, baptisms or confirmations. I use to donate to my Jesuit prep school about every other year, but that stopped because of all the pedophilia.

[giramomma]

DH goes to mass. The kids and I don't.

[teen persuasion]

Nov 15, 2023 12:48:22 GMT -5 resolution said:

An interesting article from the perspective of a parishioner in Strickland's diocese. Makes me wonder how often he was preaching against the pope.

In my own parish, we had a priest that was getting more and more into the Latin Mass. The pope wrote new rules trying to limit the spread, but instead of following them, our priest doubled down and changed a bunch of our regular English masses into Latin. He just got moved to a different church and we have a new priest that is slowly changing things back into English.

www.ncronline.org/opinion/guest-voices/joseph-strickland-was-my-bishop-heres-why-he-had-go

DH spent a few weeks visiting his dad in Florida recently. He said FIL's church was having Latin masses! 

I've noticed that our new pastor, who's fairly young at 40ish, has been bring back old chanted responses. I thought all that stuff went out with Vatican II (way before my time, so certainly before his). I'm finding I'm most comfortable with the 80+ yo retired priest who's still helping out - he feels the most progressive of the bunch, and the younger priests all feel like throwbacks. Its bizarre. Somebody mentioned it's the seminaries' influence, bringing back the old stuff. I wonder which seminaries are still operating; the one in my region tried to shift to more lay educational things to make up for the shrinking number of seminarians, but was abruptly closed.

[Tiny]

Do the parishes that say Mass in Latin teach Latin to the kids in CCD (or in Private school)? Do they have adult classes? Is the sermon in Latin??

[resolution]

Nov 15, 2023 22:34:40 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Do the parishes that say Mass in Latin teach Latin to the kids in CCD (or in Private school)? Do they have adult classes? Is the sermon in Latin??

In my parish, the sermon was in English, but everything else was in Latin, including all of the gospel readings and the responses. They have a book that has everything in Latin and English, so that in theory people would know what they were saying, but in practice it is too fast to read the Latin and the translation. They also had a schola doing all of the singing in Latin, so it was more like listening to a concert than attending a service. 

I only went to one Latin mass, and decided it wasn't for me. I was relieved when the pope made new rules to discourage it, and then dismayed when my parish kept promoting it more and more. Our new priest has announced that we had a 2 year transition period to switch back to English, so it should go away relatively soon.

[resolution]

Nov 15, 2023 20:55:28 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

Nov 15, 2023 12:48:22 GMT -5 resolution said:

An interesting article from the perspective of a parishioner in Strickland's diocese. Makes me wonder how often he was preaching against the pope.

In my own parish, we had a priest that was getting more and more into the Latin Mass. The pope wrote new rules trying to limit the spread, but instead of following them, our priest doubled down and changed a bunch of our regular English masses into Latin. He just got moved to a different church and we have a new priest that is slowly changing things back into English.

www.ncronline.org/opinion/guest-voices/joseph-strickland-was-my-bishop-heres-why-he-had-go

DH spent a few weeks visiting his dad in Florida recently. He said FIL's church was having Latin masses! 

I've noticed that our new pastor, who's fairly young at 40ish, has been bring back old chanted responses. I thought all that stuff went out with Vatican II (way before my time, so certainly before his). I'm finding I'm most comfortable with the 80+ yo retired priest who's still helping out - he feels the most progressive of the bunch, and the younger priests all feel like throwbacks. Its bizarre. Somebody mentioned it's the seminaries' influence, bringing back the old stuff. I wonder which seminaries are still operating; the one in my region tried to shift to more lay educational things to make up for the shrinking number of seminarians, but was abruptly closed.

I suspect Mount St Mary's in Emmitsburg is promoting the conservatism and Latin mass. We have had large groups of seminarians attending some of our social events after Latin mass, and they are almost an hour away and not connected in any way with our parish.