daisylu
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Post by daisylu on May 26, 2023 11:03:42 GMT -5
The article is about how female children were treated differently than males. I(F) am the oldest child of my parents. I had a brother born when I was almost 2 who died from SIDS at 2 months old 5 days before my second birthday. My parents later had another child, DSis who is 4 years younger than me. I have a brother who was adopted at age 7 and I was 19 - after his mom, a family friend passed. Most of my life I have not enjoyed having a sister but some of these stories make me glad I was not raised alongside a brother. Some of them are a symptom of different time, but this one hit hard as the woman is the same as age as my DD. Have some things not changed that much? link
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gs11rmb
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Post by gs11rmb on May 26, 2023 11:09:42 GMT -5
The article is about how female children were treated differently than males. I(F) am the oldest child of my parents. I had a brother born when I was almost 2 who died from SIDS at 2 months old 5 days before my second birthday. My parents later had another child, DSis who is 4 years younger than me. I have a brother who was adopted at age 7 and I was 19 - after his mom, a family friend passed. Most of my life I have not enjoyed having a sister but some of these stories make me glad I was not raised alongside a brother. Some of them are a symptom of different time, but this one hit hard as the woman is the same as age as my DD. Have some things not changed that much? linkShe's 23. Why on earth doesn't she move out of her parents home.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on May 26, 2023 11:41:24 GMT -5
I’m the oldest of 3, next my sister and then my brother.
It really is hard to differentiate loosening the reins on the eldest vs the gender. There was a HUGE difference between the tightness of the reins between me and my sister, and then my sister and brother. The reins loosened as we flew the next. My brother did remain in the nest much longer than either my sister or I.
My parents didn’t do my brother any favors.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on May 26, 2023 11:42:45 GMT -5
We really are a gender agnostic household. It takes a lot of effort and intention. We also raise our kids so that fair is not equal. And dysfunction happens no matter how many siblings you have or don't have. I was expected to diet/exercise with my mother in high school. It was my job to support her. Consequently, I equated being 125 the same weight as 225. I saw myself as the same size as her. It wasn't until I weighed 225 that I realized that 125 and 225 weren't the same and my mom had issues.
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Post by minnesotapaintlady on May 26, 2023 12:06:21 GMT -5
The article is about how female children were treated differently than males. I(F) am the oldest child of my parents. I had a brother born when I was almost 2 who died from SIDS at 2 months old 5 days before my second birthday. My parents later had another child, DSis who is 4 years younger than me. I have a brother who was adopted at age 7 and I was 19 - after his mom, a family friend passed. Most of my life I have not enjoyed having a sister but some of these stories make me glad I was not raised alongside a brother. Some of them are a symptom of different time, but this one hit hard as the woman is the same as age as my DD. Have some things not changed that much? linkShe's 23. Why on earth doesn't she move out of her parents home. Right? That was my first thought. I mean, I lived at home until I was 23, but I pretty much had no rules...like from about age 12 on. So, it was basically free room and board with no expectations whatsoever. There's no way I would have stuck around with a curfew as an adult.
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daisylu
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Post by daisylu on May 26, 2023 12:43:53 GMT -5
She's 23. Why on earth doesn't she move out of her parents home. Right? That was my first thought. I mean, I lived at home until I was 23, but I pretty much had no rules...like from about age 12 on. So, it was basically free room and board with no expectations whatsoever. There's no way I would have stuck around with a curfew as an adult. None of which negates the fact that she has much more rules to follow than her younger brother, and likely has her entire life. The stories are about how females were treated differently than their male siblings.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on May 26, 2023 12:50:53 GMT -5
My parents only had girls and I only had girls. My sister has a girl and a boy. Nephew is definitely treated differently than the rest of the kids. Nephew is expected to do traditional male things like yard work or fixing things. Dad would never ask the girls to push a lawnmower. Hell, I'm 44 and have never done it.
The girls are a little more guarded than he is. They're all adults, so there aren't really any rules for them, but we'd worry more about the girls safety than nephew's. The fact that he's a big dude probably plays I to that also. We don't expect better from one or the other, they're just treated a little differently because of traditional roles.
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Post by minnesotapaintlady on May 26, 2023 12:59:15 GMT -5
Right? That was my first thought. I mean, I lived at home until I was 23, but I pretty much had no rules...like from about age 12 on. So, it was basically free room and board with no expectations whatsoever. There's no way I would have stuck around with a curfew as an adult. None of which negates the fact that she has much more rules to follow than her younger brother, and likely has her entire life. The stories are about how females were treated differently than their male siblings. My experience was way different. I was let to do whatever, but when my mom remarried when I was 17 my brothers (10 and 7) were kept under a lot tighter leash than I was. But they were out of there the minute they graduated high school too.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on May 26, 2023 13:03:30 GMT -5
She's 23. Why on earth doesn't she move out of her parents home. Right? That was my first thought. I mean, I lived at home until I was 23, but I pretty much had no rules...like from about age 12 on. So, it was basically free room and board with no expectations whatsoever. There's no way I would have stuck around with a curfew as an adult. I had rules, but they were pretty reasonable given my mom grew up on a midwestern farm. I remember the shock I had when I went to college in Indiana and the dorm rules were stricter than what I had at 15/16 yrs. old. The expectations on us were like much of Lake Wobegon - be better than average but do not brag about it.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on May 26, 2023 13:07:41 GMT -5
The article is about how female children were treated differently than males. I(F) am the oldest child of my parents. I had a brother born when I was almost 2 who died from SIDS at 2 months old 5 days before my second birthday. My parents later had another child, DSis who is 4 years younger than me. I have a brother who was adopted at age 7 and I was 19 - after his mom, a family friend passed. Most of my life I have not enjoyed having a sister but some of these stories make me glad I was not raised alongside a brother. Some of them are a symptom of different time, but this one hit hard as the woman is the same as age as my DD. Have some things not changed that much? linkShe's 23. Why on earth doesn't she move out of her parents home. I can top that. I rented a room from an adopted daughter, who only moved out at age 50 because both adoptive parents were dead and the home had to be split with a bio son or two. Adoptive mom always wanted a daughter so she did everything in her power to keep her with her and make sure she was dependent. One of the bio sons helped her buy the condo and some other stuff. The story could be a three season mini series minimum.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on May 26, 2023 13:23:04 GMT -5
This surprises me not. Maybe I was blessed in that there were only girls and as the eldest I had some good things and some not so good things. I believe had I been male, mom would have not started me watching my siblings the minute they were at least a year old. Since they were a little over a year apart, they almost came as a pair. Since I was three years older than one, four years older than my youngest sister it often felt like I was a designated free agent. 2 parents 1 eldest daughter and two daughters close in age. They shared a large bedroom together for years and it wasn't until we moved to another house AND dad had a shell put on the ranch, did we get all our own rooms. Heck the upstairs bathroom wasn't functional until I went to college and I think I got that room in HS?
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Spellbound454
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Post by Spellbound454 on May 26, 2023 13:28:25 GMT -5
I think the bar was set lower for me because I was a girl and parents didn't expect much. (My achievements were inspite of them.... not because of them)
What a bloody stupid thing to saddle your kid with.
Glad to say society has moved on a bit since then.
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busymom
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Post by busymom on May 26, 2023 14:01:49 GMT -5
I had to do some traditionally "boy" jobs around our place when I was growing up, but my Dad's knees deteriorated to the point that he could no longer mow the lawn, so Mom & I did that, and other yard work too. Both of my parents grew up on a farm, so it wasn't a big deal for girls to do tasks like that when no boys were available. (Mom grew up in a household with many sisters, but only one brother, so the girls had to help on the farm.)
Now, the household DH grew up in was very different. The boys had no curfew at all, and the girls did. (Which probably explains why one of DH's brothers used to get into trouble.)
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Opti
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Post by Opti on May 26, 2023 14:16:13 GMT -5
I had to do some traditionally "boy" jobs around our place when I was growing up, but my Dad's knees deteriorated to the point that he could no longer mow the lawn, so Mom & I did that, and other yard work too. Both of my parents grew up on a farm, so it wasn't a big deal for girls to do tasks like that when no boys were available. (Mom grew up in a household with many sisters, but only one brother, so the girls had to help on the farm.) Now, the household DH grew up in was very different. The boys had no curfew at all, and the girls did. (Which probably explains why one of DH's brothers used to get into trouble.) My dad had severe asthma and my mom did not want him to drop dead, so he was not supposed to mow the lawn at all after a certain age. I know I thought he might not make it past 40, but he's outlived mom partially by not getting Alzheimers. I mowed the lawn with an electric mower attached to a very long cord and was the only one allowed to do the really long extension cords mowing the levels down to the creek. Probably due to my age at the time. Not sure if we really had a curfew, but I know my parents decided they needed one after popular sis screwed up.
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daisylu
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Post by daisylu on May 26, 2023 14:18:01 GMT -5
I think the bar was set lower for me because I was a girl and parents didn't expect much. (My achievements were inspite of them.... not because of them) What a bloody stupid thing to saddle your kid with. Glad to say society has moved on a bit since then. Maybe likely to living in a different country, but I am 48YO and my parents expected a whole of a lot from me. IME in the US, girls are held to much higher expectations than boys.
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Pink Cashmere
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Post by Pink Cashmere on May 26, 2023 15:14:26 GMT -5
My parents only had girls and I only had girls. My sister has a girl and a boy. Nephew is definitely treated differently than the rest of the kids. Nephew is expected to do traditional male things like yard work or fixing things. Dad would never ask the girls to push a lawnmower. Hell, I'm 44 and have never done it. The girls are a little more guarded than he is. They're all adults, so there aren't really any rules for them, but we'd worry more about the girls safety than nephew's. The fact that he's a big dude probably plays I to that also. We don't expect better from one or the other, they're just treated a little differently because of traditional roles. DD had a real meltdown the first time I made her cut the grass. She is 2yo than DS, and this was when DD was around 14yo, when DS was still small for his age. We’d just got back from a vacation on the Gulf Shore, and “Hurricane Elvis” came through our area while we were gone. My house wasn’t damaged, but we didn’t have power for about a week. My grass had grown so fast and so thick that the lawn mower kept cutting off when I was mowing it. My rule was that when I was cutting the grass in the heat, EVERYBODY had to come outside, even the dogs lol. So DD was sitting on the patio, laughing because she thought it was funny how I was struggling. So I told her to go put on some tennis shoes so she could do it and I would sit on the patio. Cue an epic meltdown with tears flowing and snot running. She said she shouldn’t have to cut the grass because she’s a girl. I said “I’m a girl too”. Part of the reason she was so upset (besides the fact that she was lazy) was that she didn’t want the boys in the neighborhood to see her cutting the grass. I did not relent. She had really pissed me off thinking it was funny that I was struggling. So I showed her what to do and sat my ass on the patio and watched. She cried the whole time. I was not moved. My Mom never made me cut the grass because my allergies were so bad. I can’t remember if she made my brother do it. When I bought my house my Mom went with me to buy a lawn mower and when we got back to my house she showed me how to use it and cut my grass.
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jerseygirl
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Post by jerseygirl on May 26, 2023 16:33:37 GMT -5
Had 2 boys one girl. When we went to ILs, immigrants, their grandma d Only wanted the girls and ladies to do dishes
Nope boys must do their share
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on May 26, 2023 18:58:30 GMT -5
She's 23. Why on earth doesn't she move out of her parents home. Right? That was my first thought. I mean, I lived at home until I was 23, but I pretty much had no rules...like from about age 12 on. So, it was basically free room and board with no expectations whatsoever. There's no way I would have stuck around with a curfew as an adult. I'm guessing there's some family, cultural, or religious pressure. If she moves out - she may be "turning her back" on her family/culture/religion. Not everyone is willing to jump into the unknown (ie - leave their family and friends behind and start someplace fresh on their own). Especially if what has been put in your head about being on your own is that everyone will be out to get you (and that bad outcomes are highly likely if you go out on your own.) That's one of the differences between daughters and sons - what they are told they are worth. Another is what their place is/what their duties and obligations are. (It was assumed I would become a teacher, nurse, or be some sort of secretary/office worker after Jr. College. And of course it was assumed I was eagerly looking forward to getting married and having kids! Every girls dream! )
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on May 26, 2023 19:05:24 GMT -5
Right? That was my first thought. I mean, I lived at home until I was 23, but I pretty much had no rules...like from about age 12 on. So, it was basically free room and board with no expectations whatsoever. There's no way I would have stuck around with a curfew as an adult. None of which negates the fact that she has much more rules to follow than her younger brother, and likely has her entire life. The stories are about how females were treated differently than their male siblings. and then how was she treated all this time? likely in a very smoothering way and maybe bought into too much of it and is paralyzed in place.....we can see it...maybe she can't could also be finishing school and wasn't allowed to go dorm or parents wouldn't pay.....
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on May 26, 2023 20:21:31 GMT -5
I don't doubt that males and female siblings are treated differently. I think it's also hard to make a judgement based on sex alone, though. Sample sizes are pretty small. I look at my son and DD1. DS always was very good about doing things like providing parents contact info when he was going to houses, etc. We didn't always meet the parents. DS was always very open about activities, and other kids' family situations. DD1 almost didn't go to the spring dance because we weren't provided parental contact information. We need more than "I'm getting ready at a friends house. Here's the address."
This could be easily misinterpreted as us favoring DS. We didn't. He just played by the rules more in that regard.
DD1 is the only one of my kids who gets/got an allowance. DS and the peanut do exactly 0 above bare minimum. Don't get me wrong, they will do things when asked. It also usually takes a couple of asks, and is usually accompanied with b*tching. DD1 will not only do what we ask with minimal asking, but she might see something else needs to be taken care of, and just does that as well, without us asking. She goes above and beyond. So, she gets a reward for it. It absolutely looks unfair that DD1 is the only kiddo who gets an allowance, just on that fact. One of my coworkers was an oopsie. This coworker was born when their parents were teens, I think while still in HS. My coworker had a different upbringing the rest of their siblings..The rest of the siblings (both sex) came along a decent amount of time later, when the parents had more stability. So, what my coworker was afforded and what their youngest sibling was afforded were quite a bit different. Definitely things were not equal. My colleague seemed pretty OK with it.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on May 26, 2023 20:23:20 GMT -5
None of which negates the fact that she has much more rules to follow than her younger brother, and likely has her entire life. The stories are about how females were treated differently than their male siblings. My experience was way different. I was let to do whatever, but when my mom remarried when I was 17 my brothers (10 and 7) were kept under a lot tighter leash than I was. But they were out of there the minute they graduated high school too.
Mine was the complete opposite. I grew up in a conservative and religious Mexican family. Girls were definitely held to a different standard than boys. Mmy grandma made all the girls learn how to make tortillas from scratch because we needed to be able to cook for our husbands when we got older and the boys got to go outside and play. We were taught to be submissive while "boys will be boys". It's all pretty effed up when you think about it. Growing up in a family like that is probably why I'm such a savage now. I've tried to unlearn a lot of that and just teach my girls to be good people who are accepting of others. Not all the traditions are gone, but a lot of it is.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on May 26, 2023 20:56:41 GMT -5
My parents only had girls and I only had girls. My sister has a girl and a boy. Nephew is definitely treated differently than the rest of the kids. Nephew is expected to do traditional male things like yard work or fixing things. Dad would never ask the girls to push a lawnmower. Hell, I'm 44 and have never done it. The girls are a little more guarded than he is. They're all adults, so there aren't really any rules for them, but we'd worry more about the girls safety than nephew's. The fact that he's a big dude probably plays I to that also. We don't expect better from one or the other, they're just treated a little differently because of traditional roles. DD had a real meltdown the first time I made her cut the grass. She is 2yo than DS, and this was when DD was around 14yo, when DS was still small for his age. We’d just got back from a vacation on the Gulf Shore, and “Hurricane Elvis” came through our area while we were gone. My house wasn’t damaged, but we didn’t have power for about a week. My grass had grown so fast and so thick that the lawn mower kept cutting off when I was mowing it. My rule was that when I was cutting the grass in the heat, EVERYBODY had to come outside, even the dogs lol. So DD was sitting on the patio, laughing because she thought it was funny how I was struggling. So I told her to go put on some tennis shoes so she could do it and I would sit on the patio. Cue an epic meltdown with tears flowing and snot running. She said she shouldn’t have to cut the grass because she’s a girl. I said “I’m a girl too”. Part of the reason she was so upset (besides the fact that she was lazy) was that she didn’t want the boys in the neighborhood to see her cutting the grass. I did not relent. She had really pissed me off thinking it was funny that I was struggling. So I showed her what to do and sat my ass on the patio and watched. She cried the whole time. I was not moved. My Mom never made me cut the grass because my allergies were so bad. I can’t remember if she made my brother do it. When I bought my house my Mom went with me to buy a lawn mower and when we got back to my house she showed me how to use it and cut my grass. Yeah, I don't think I'd have had a melt down, but I'd be surprised. I also wouldn't have taunted someone struggling. If I'd ever taunted my mother for any reason I'd have been knocked into next week. I've never cut grass because I never had to. My family lived and still does for the most part on top of each other. I always say I grew up in Mayberry because I kind of did. When we lived in the old house that I lived in from birth to 10 yo, we lived next door to.my great grandparents. My dad and great grandpa filled the traditional male roles. Plenty of uncles showed up from time to time also. Then I lived in my current house which is next door to my grandparents. Dad and grandpa did everything with the same uncles showing up. Now my dad and uncles do it since grandpa died. I do some things that would be considered male jobs since I'm single, but for the most part if I need help, my dad or uncle or cousin or nephew are available. I've never been truly on my own in the world which is a huge blessing.
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Post by minnesotapaintlady on May 26, 2023 21:14:59 GMT -5
My experience was way different. I was let to do whatever, but when my mom remarried when I was 17 my brothers (10 and 7) were kept under a lot tighter leash than I was. But they were out of there the minute they graduated high school too.
Mine was the complete opposite. I grew up in a conservative and religious family. Girls were definitely held to a different standard than boys. Mmy grandma made all the girls learn how to make tortillas from scratch because we needed to be able to cook for our husbands when we got older and the boys got to go outside and play. We were taught to be submissive while "boys will be boys". It's all pretty effed up when you think about it. Growing up in a family like that is probably why I'm such a savage now. I've tried to unlearn a lot of that and just teach my girls to be good people who are accepting of others. Not all the traditions are gone, but a lot of it is. Yeah, that is nothing like my family at all. My mom was one of 9 kids and my grandparents ran a dairy farm back when family farms were successful. The girls (there were 4 of them) had to work the farm just as much as the boys. My grandmother, mom and my aunts are not submissive in any way. LOL My Grandma did do all the cooking and cleaning on the farm, but she also would haul cattle in the one ton truck and went to business college in the 50's which was nearly all men back then. My mom was milking cows and driving tractor as soon as her feet could hit the clutch (like age 10 or 11), and while she probably went a bit far in the letting me run rogue she also did a good job of setting an example of a woman taking care of everything herself. There was never "girl stuff" or "guy stuff", she did construction projects, held a full time job, mowed the lawn, fixed things that broke, emptied the mousetraps... So, that was my normal for what women did growing up. Ironically, cooking and cleaning were not something I remember her doing much of.
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nidena
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Post by nidena on May 28, 2023 9:08:24 GMT -5
In reality, every child is raised differently from each other even if raised in the same household.
You could have multiple children, all of the same gender, and their rearing will differ from each other because of age, experience, finances, etc of the parents and age, personality, etc of the children.
You just often see bigger differences when the age and/or gender of the children are vastly different from the other.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on May 28, 2023 9:58:14 GMT -5
Mine was the complete opposite. I grew up in a conservative and religious family. Girls were definitely held to a different standard than boys. Mmy grandma made all the girls learn how to make tortillas from scratch because we needed to be able to cook for our husbands when we got older and the boys got to go outside and play. We were taught to be submissive while "boys will be boys". It's all pretty effed up when you think about it. Growing up in a family like that is probably why I'm such a savage now. I've tried to unlearn a lot of that and just teach my girls to be good people who are accepting of others. Not all the traditions are gone, but a lot of it is. Yeah, that is nothing like my family at all. My mom was one of 9 kids and my grandparents ran a dairy farm back when family farms were successful. The girls (there were 4 of them) had to work the farm just as much as the boys. My grandmother, mom and my aunts are not submissive in any way. LOL My Grandma did do all the cooking and cleaning on the farm, but she also would haul cattle in the one ton truck and went to business college in the 50's which was nearly all men back then. My mom was milking cows and driving tractor as soon as her feet could hit the clutch (like age 10 or 11), and while she probably went a bit far in the letting me run rogue she also did a good job of setting an example of a woman taking care of everything herself. There was never "girl stuff" or "guy stuff", she did construction projects, held a full time job, mowed the lawn, fixed things that broke, emptied the mousetraps... So, that was my normal for what women did growing up. Ironically, cooking and cleaning were not something I remember her doing much of. My mom was older than yours and grew up in small farm town Wisconsin. She drove the tractor the best, but her father would never admit it to her in public nor would he allow her to drive it if he was around. She had to drive the tractor only when he wasn't there. He apparently was well regarded enough in later years that when my sisters spent part of the summer there, he toured his regional area with them as a rep. There was definitely guy and girl stuff, and it did mess my mom up. She was the black sheep of her family and weirdly became the least dominant member of our family once we were all old enough. I think she was exhausted about it all, and when she was young her choices were wife, teacher or nurse. That is it. Her mother was treated like crap by that community because she conceived on her wedding night and her first son arrived early. She never got over it, and it was obvious when dementia hit her in her later years. She remembered her anger and had no filter to stop it anymore. They both did their best to appear female enough to be accepted and cut off parts of themselves to do so. It might be why I get so angry and ornery at times.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on May 28, 2023 14:26:05 GMT -5
My experience was way different. I was let to do whatever, but when my mom remarried when I was 17 my brothers (10 and 7) were kept under a lot tighter leash than I was. But they were out of there the minute they graduated high school too.
Mine was the complete opposite. I grew up in a conservative and religious Mexican family. Girls were definitely held to a different standard than boys. Mmy grandma made all the girls learn how to make tortillas from scratch because we needed to be able to cook for our husbands when we got older and the boys got to go outside and play. We were taught to be submissive while "boys will be boys". It's all pretty effed up when you think about it. Growing up in a family like that is probably why I'm such a savage now. I've tried to unlearn a lot of that and just teach my girls to be good people who are accepting of others. Not all the traditions are gone, but a lot of it is. And My MIL had 8 boys and no girls. Her older boys all cook b/c she needed help and they were all she had. MIL showed DH how to iron a shirt when he wanted his shirt pressed before a school dance.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 30, 2023 15:35:44 GMT -5
In reality, every child is raised differently from each other even if raised in the same household. You could have multiple children, all of the same gender, and their rearing will differ from each other because of age, experience, finances, etc of the parents and age, personality, etc of the children. You just often see bigger differences when the age and/or gender of the children are vastly different from the other. I found I parented my kids differently because they were different people with different wants and needs.
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zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,865
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Post by zibazinski on Jun 7, 2023 18:53:24 GMT -5
Both DD and DS think I favored the other. So I either did a terrible job or a terrific job. DS married a CPA who is extremely busy. He cooks, cleans, and does laundry. I’m proud and amazed because I always thought of him as Ward Cleaver. DD rides horses and shows them, figure skates and enters competitions for it. Plus, working as a PA In infectious disease. So her days are from 7 am to 9 pm. They do have a house and someone that cleans every other week. Either her boyfriend cooks or she doesn’t eat. Funny enough, I did everything because I wanted them to concentrate on school and extra curricular activities. Both were in intensive HS programs.
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