State property and school taxes

[jerseygirl]

Living in north jersey the property taxes are difficult. Although about 80% of the property taxes in most towns are for town schools( elementary middle and high). For our house taxes are $17,000 with extra for sewers (about $600) and water. We have a well so just electric. Other towns are higher. Yes good schools but only in suburbs for most part. Good portion of state sales taxes (6% but not on food clothing) go to the inner city sadly pathetic schools. Suburban schools get very little from state

Just saw countrygirl post about a house they might possibly buy ($830 taxes) and have read about others being also low.
The new bill Inflation reduction probably will pass. All of the NJ and NY Democrats had said the SALT limit of $10000 must be removed for them to vote yes. Well they all voted to approve but SALT still at $10000. So many folks in Ny, nj and CT can only take $10000 deduction and not entire property taxes
My question - do you who have these low property taxes pay additional taxes for schools?
If all you’re paying are these low taxes, how do your towns manage? Do state taxes contribute to schools? Police? Teachers? Roads? Municipal employees?
Yes nj Ny ct probably pay teachers police etc well but unlikely excessively more than other states

Not asking political questions, just the mechanisms for paying in low tax states

[stillmovingforward]

My DD1 lives in Arizona and pays in 1 year what I pay in 2 months for taxes. The schools, roads, and social services are terrible she says.

[busymom]

Taxes on a 3-bedroom house with a 3-car garage run around $3,000 for an entire year here.  That does include money for schools, but we get billed separately for sewer & water.  


Now one of the big perks for living here is we get property tax REFUNDS, which are based on how much you earn.  We get our refund this Fall, based on 2021 income, which will get us a return of over $1,400.  Now you understand how we can save money here, compared to Florida, where we paid "sticker price" on property taxes.  

[nidena]

My property taxes, here in IN, are just over $1200/yr.  I don't pay any extra tax bills for schools, as far as I know.  They're just part of that $1200.

[stillmovingforward]

Mine in Washington are about $7,000 to $8,000. No rebate. And we have sales tax and pay for water and sewer separately. We don't pay separately for school though.
It's all bundled together when I pay my property tax.
We have excellent services though. I'd pay more if it would guarantee others would have a better safety system.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Aug 16, 2022 21:38:21 GMT -5 busymom said:

Taxes on a 3-bedroom house with a 3-car garage run around $3,000 for an entire year here.  That does include money for schools, but we get billed separately for sewer & water.  


Now one of the big perks for living here is we get property tax REFUNDS, which are based on how much you earn.  We get our refund this Fall, based on 2021 income, which will get us a return of over $1,400.  Now you understand how we can save money here, compared to Florida, where we paid "sticker price" on property taxes.  

Same state and just saw my property tax refund has been processed!  Should be hitting my account within a week.  

I pay $2800/year and will get about $1400 back.  Schools are included.  I guess sales tax covers some things and I know MN charges a lot to people for auto registration every year which goes for roads and mass transit.  People with newer cars can pay several hundred a year to register their car.  I get around that by owning cars more than 10 years old and playing the flat $35 or whatever it is once they hit that age. 

[teen persuasion]

I'm in NY. My property tax is about $1900; includes fire, police, water districts, trash and recycling. Actual water usage is extra, 3x year. My school taxes are also about $1900 after the STAR exemption, which is about $600. The library is about $25 included on the school tax bill.

We received some state tax rebate in the past month, I think it was around $1k. Those are always unpredictable and a surprise, both timing and amount.

[NastyWoman]

California is complicated due to prop 13. Upon the sale or a major remodel (think addition or something like that) of a home the property is set. After that  they can only raise the assessment amount by 2%/year. So the same homes may have a very different property taxes depending on when the home was last sold. Bond measures need to be approved by the voters and that if approved those amounts are added on to the tax bill. Those are not subject to how long you have held onto your home though.

[daisylu]

Wouldn't it be better to compare property tax rates, not the amount paid?

Our real estate is taxed at .61 per $100 of assessed value. But we live in a rural area in the most northern part of Virginia, and I am sure that our home value is assessed for far lower than a home in more populated counties. Like those that include the areas of Virginia closer to DC, Fairfax, Arlington, etc.

Personal property, which includes cars, RVs, trailers, and dogs (yes, dogs - though they call it a license fee that you never receive a license for) is $4.23 per $100 of assessed value.

Our total comes to about $4,000/year for the house and 2 newer vehicles. School taxes are included. Our schools are all decent and roads are mostly well maintained.

[finnime]

I agree with daisylu, the rate is probably more reliable a measure than absolute dollars. Also, the property tax rate vs. the income SALT rate matters. My oldest niece lives in NH, so no income or sales tax, but their property tax rate is astronomical even compared with the high-tax Massachusetts or the county in Maryland I recently left. And then when it comes to income, some states tax pensions and SS and others, not so much, so that matters when you're retired. And then there's the cap on property tax increases that someone mentioned. When property values jumped by 20+% in one year the cap really saved a lot of people (including me) in Maryland. THe only way they caught up to a more real valuation was when the property was sold.

I always thought it made more sense to live in an area with excellent public schools and pay more in taxes than to live where sending them to private schools was necessary. That may be the latent yankee in me. In the northeast sending children to public schools for grade school then to private colleges is traditional. In the south, the reverse is more common.

[raeoflyte]

1/3rd of schools funding comes from property taxes, 2/3rds from state sales tax.

Our property taxes had always been very low - $1000 - $1500 a year low for the properties we've owned. And we'd calculate 1% for taxes on new construction homes which was pretty much always much higher than the real #. The assessor valuations were always ridiculously low. The last years theyve significantly increased those valuations though. Our taxes jumped another $200 per month.

[Cookies Galore]

I'm in Southeastern PA. My total millage rate is 38.003: county 3.923; community college 0.39; municipality 12.23 (I have a hand in that one remaining steady!); and school district 21.46. I just looked it up, I don't know that off the top of my head, lol. Put into numbers we paid $3,232 for real estate and school taxes this year.
I'm in a literal small town (5,000 people in 0.8 square mile, but we're in the same school district as a larger township that is the third largest employment center in the region, behind Center City and University City [Philly] so I'm grateful they're keeping our school taxes relatively low. Compared to other districts in my county.

Aside from that, there's really nothing much that's a crazy expense. State sales tax is 6% and essentials aren't taxed, PA income tax is a flat 3.07%, our local wage tax is 1% (thought I pay 3.44% since my employer is in Philly). Car registration is just a flat $38 a year, plus some counties tack on an extra $5 with registration. My county uses that extra fee to fund a popular municipal grant program. We've been awarded money for a few projects since it's been implemented.

[jerseygirl]

So for the responses seems most live in areas where school costs are included in property taxes.
Thinking most Cost is for teacher salaries although of course there are other

In NJ teacher average teacher salaries are about $76000. Of course differ by experience, degrees etc
County also makes a difference with in general counties closer to NYC being more expensive for real estate and larger salaries. Bergen county highest

NJ is most populated in country so state taxes also paying for the constant road repairs .But each town in general pays for local road repairs . But again about 60-80% of town prop taxes for schools

How do your state’s average teacher salaries compare to NJ? Cause I’m seeing a huge difference in prop taxes which I thought might be schools not included in states with the lower taxes.

Our town tax rate is $2.554/$100. Houses are expensive in NJ. Nice town but not fabulous, schools have good ratings (but we sent 2/3 kids to private HS). About 30,000 population Suburban mostly 1/4 to 1/2 acre lots, no town center just some shops near the train station. Volunteer fire dept. good new library. Near major highways so easy commuting

www.nj.com/data/2021/05/nj-teachers-earn-11k-more-than-the-national-average-heres-the-highest-paying-district-in-each-county.html

[minnesotapaintlady]

Aug 17, 2022 8:25:54 GMT -5 jerseygirl said:

How do your state’s average teacher salaries compare to NJ? Cause I’m seeing a huge difference in prop taxes which I thought might be schools not included in states with the lower taxes.

There is such a huge variation in average.  From 40K to 140K by school district in my state.  Minneapolis is at 76K and St Paul 87K.  It looks like 60K or so is probably the average statewide.  The average for the district in my county is 64K.  LCOL area.

[geenamercile]

Aug 17, 2022 8:25:54 GMT -5 jerseygirl said:

So for the responses seems most live in areas where school costs are included in property taxes.
Thinking most Cost is for teacher salaries although of course there are other

In NJ teacher average teacher salaries are about $76000. Of course differ by experience, degrees etc
County also makes a difference with in general counties closer to NYC being more expensive for real estate and larger salaries. Bergen county highest

NJ is most populated in country so state taxes also paying for the constant road repairs .But each town in general pays for local road repairs . But again about 60-80% of town prop taxes for schools

How do your state’s average teacher salaries compare to NJ? Cause I’m seeing a huge difference in prop taxes which I thought might be schools not included in states with the lower taxes.

Our town tax rate is $2.554/$100. Houses are expensive in NJ. Nice town but not fabulous, schools have good ratings (but we sent 2/3 kids to private HS). About 30,000 population Suburban mostly 1/4 to 1/2 acre lots, no town center just some shops near the train station. Volunteer fire dept. good new library. Near major highways so easy commuting

www.nj.com/data/2021/05/nj-teachers-earn-11k-more-than-the-national-average-heres-the-highest-paying-district-in-each-county.html

In VA- the state puts money into the schools, as well as the counties.  The states part comes from the sales tax, the counties comes from the property taxes.  You would find a huge range of teacher salaries here lower in the south and west of VA, higher with the North and East parts.  I am not even sure it is really fair to lump all of them together, but then the cost of living and housing is a huge difference too.  Maybe looking at what percentage of budget goes to the schools may help as well? 

[TheOtherMe]

In Iowa some of the property tax dollars go to the schools.  There is also a surtax on the state tax return for the school district where you live.  

I didn't mind paying high property taxes when our schools were considered good.  Now the legislature doesn't fund them at a level needed to retain good teachers and actually teach the kids.

[bean29]

I live in Wisconsin.  We also get sucker punched by the SALT Tax limitations, but we are a Red State. Go figure.  Some say we are Purple, but only for President, for everything else the Republicans are in control.

My Tax  bill is $8,268 on an Assessment of $402,900 which is low.

Taxes include Schools, Community College (subsidized but not free), Sewerage district (but we still pay a water bill), Garbage Pickup and we also get the streets plowed and obvs. Police.

Have to Shut down my computer.

[pooks]

Idaho is not a low tax state (not as high as others). When we moved our total tax liability was roughly the same as in MD or a little higher. ID has income tax, sales tax(even on groceries), and property tax.

My house in Boise was 7K for property taxes for 2022 and will go up for 2023, no idea how much and there isn't a cap.  

Schools are funded mostly from the state general fund and supplemented by school district levies, which require a supermajority to pass in a vote by the public.  Boise is really good at getting levies to pass.  The levies are included in my property tax. 

[jerseygirl]

Say what you will about Chris Christie, he had a bill passed that limited property taxes to increase of 2%/year. If town wanted bigger increase then needed to justify to state.
One year we had almost 10% increase. Now keeping around 2% so grateful

[Tiny]

Aug 16, 2022 20:58:07 GMT -5 jerseygirl said:

My question - do you who have these low property taxes pay additional taxes for schools?
If all you’re paying are these low taxes, how do your towns manage? Do state taxes contribute to schools? Police? Teachers? Roads? Municipal employees?

I do NOT pay low property taxes. My property taxes cover local schools, pensions (teachers is the biggest bite), forest preserves, library, police, fire, infrastructure, and my local government workers. I live in a suburb with 50,000 residents.

I have relatives in a very low property tax place. It's not very urban. There are no street lights. The public schools are poor. if you need fire/police/ambulance it could take 20 to 30 minutes for them to get to you depending on what else is going on and time/day and if it's a period of "we can't pay them so they aren't working". There are very little social services. And even enforcement of building codes is lax (there's no inspector to inspect the work done - so paying for "permit" is just a waste of money even though it's "required".) The roads are in good condition though. That's pretty much what gets maintained.

There are lots of very expensive houses in that low property tax place. I'm guessing the people who live there do not want to pay for stuff they do not use.  And so want to pay HOA fees or pay more for other services on a "pay upfront when you use it" basis.     

(I have relatives in Florida who complained bitterly about the property taxes here... but who aren't really paying less for the same services (or recieving less services) in Florida.  They pay HOA fees to maintain their streets and lights and trees and any sort of "community" stuff (pool, club house, whatever. They pay for a gated community so they have a less likely need of local police.  Not sure what they do about fire and ambulance.      I think it makes my relatives happy that only people like them are benefiting from the money they pay for their local services.  ) 


Switching gears to my local schools and State. I use to assume public schools got the same kind of funding as my local urban densely populated area public schools but I was wrong. The down state schools rely on property taxes and whatever State and Federal funding they can apply for or get. They kind of get the short end of the stick because the schools in more densely populated areas have more money and more people with the skills to go after state and federal available money.*

*about 15 years ago - a new crop of politicians ran for office with one of their platform planks being a goal to pay for a full time person who would help coordinate getting grants and other money to help fund local projects. As in "Our city is leaving a lot of available money on the table by NOT being able to take advantage (plow thru the paperwork) necessary to get that money from the State/Federal Government". Amazingly those politicians got elected and after a few years more and more city/community projects started getting funded and completed often with a large piece of State or Federal money as part of the funding.

That's kind of an example of how a city/town might be able to get some additional money (not from property taxes) to complete local projects - but someone needs to go after the State/Federal money that is available.

[NastyWoman]

Aug 17, 2022 7:12:08 GMT -5 finnime said:

I agree with daisylu , the rate is probably more reliable a measure than absolute dollars. Also, the property tax rate vs. the income SALT rate matters. My oldest niece lives in NH, so no income or sales tax, but their property tax rate is astronomical even compared with the high-tax Massachusetts or the county in Maryland I recently left. And then when it comes to income, some states tax pensions and SS and others, not so much, so that matters when you're retired. And then there's the cap on property tax increases that someone mentioned. When property values jumped by 20+% in one year the cap really saved a lot of people (including me) in Maryland. THe only way they caught up to a more real valuation was when the property was sold.

I always thought it made more sense to live in an area with excellent public schools and pay more in taxes than to live where sending them to private schools was necessary. That may be the latent yankee in me. In the northeast sending children to public schools for grade school then to private colleges is traditional. In the south, the reverse is more common.

But that is what I meant when I said it is complicated here as the rate is the same for everyone but the assessment for the homes is not. For instance my direct neighbor to the left pays about 2/3 of what I pay. The one on the right pays almost twice as much as I do. These are identical condo units. And what is or is not done inside is not part of the considerations. 

[aricia]

Indiana mostly uses income and sales tax to fund schools. The states can use their various taxes however they want.

My property taxes are about $2,000. The house’s assessed value for property tax purposes is $279,000. About $1,400 of that goes to the school system. We live out of city (town) limits or they would be closer to $4,000. We are on well and septic. No city trash pick up. No street lights, curbs, storm gutters, fire hydrants, etc. Chip and seal county roads. No library. The kids get free library cards for the town library because they are students in the school district.

[raeoflyte]

Aug 17, 2022 17:56:36 GMT -5 aricia said:

Indiana mostly uses income and sales tax to fund schools. The states can use their various taxes however they want.

My property taxes are about $2,000. The house’s assessed value for property tax purposes is $279,000. About $1,400 of that goes to the school system. We live out of city (town) limits or they would be closer to $4,000. We are on well and septic. No city trash pick up. No street lights, curbs, storm gutters, fire hydrants, etc. Chip and seal county roads. No library. The kids get free library cards for the town library because they are students in the school district.

Totally off topic - but I think you can get free library cards to (just about any) library. I have 3 different County stickers on my card. It's not my original card, but I've had it for about 30 years. 1 county was close to an old employer, the other was the county I moved to - and now I'm back in my original county.

[aricia]

Your free library cards are likely location dependent, it’s definitely not true here.

Looks like the assessed value on the house countrygirl was looking at is $104,400, which seems insanely low. Although mine is definitely lower than market value too.

[Opti]

Aug 17, 2022 18:15:12 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

Aug 17, 2022 17:56:36 GMT -5 aricia said:

Indiana mostly uses income and sales tax to fund schools. The states can use their various taxes however they want.

My property taxes are about $2,000. The house’s assessed value for property tax purposes is $279,000. About $1,400 of that goes to the school system. We live out of city (town) limits or they would be closer to $4,000. We are on well and septic. No city trash pick up. No street lights, curbs, storm gutters, fire hydrants, etc. Chip and seal county roads. No library. The kids get free library cards for the town library because they are students in the school district.

Totally off topic - but I think you can get free library cards to (just about any) library. I have 3 different County stickers on my card. It's not my original card, but I've had it for about 30 years. 1 county was close to an old employer, the other was the county I moved to - and now I'm back in my original county.

I think it totally depends on where you live and how they do their library system. My dad lives in a unincorporated area of town so no free library card for him. My current county is a patchwork of libraries; not all belong to the system plus some are very small and open limited hours. I've moved into various counties and even the two that did some sharing across their systems; I got a different card. No county stickers here.

[raeoflyte]

Aug 17, 2022 18:24:44 GMT -5 aricia said:

Your free library cards are likely location dependent, it’s definitely not true here.

Looks like the assessed value on the house countrygirl was looking at is $104,400, which seems insanely low. Although mine is definitely lower than market value too.

Do you pay to get a card? Or just no card if you don't meet their criteria?

[wvugurl26]

We pay city, county and state property taxes. City rate includes trash pickup. Water/sewer is billed separately by the city.

I think schools are funded from county/state.

City rate 0.0056%
County rate 0.01018%
State rate 0.00112%

If they increase the valuation anywhere near what some of these places have been selling for its going to hit the tax payment. The assessed value is already $30k more than DH paid in 2014. I can't remember what the appraiser put it at for the refi earlier this summer.

As a two income household, we are definitely hit by the SALT cap.

[aricia]

Aug 17, 2022 18:40:02 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

Aug 17, 2022 18:24:44 GMT -5 aricia said:

Your free library cards are likely location dependent, it’s definitely not true here.

Looks like the assessed value on the house countrygirl was looking at is $104,400, which seems insanely low. Although mine is definitely lower than market value too.

Do you pay to get a card? Or just no card if you don't meet their criteria?

Here, you can pay for a card. $100 a year for individual or $250 a year for family.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Aug 17, 2022 19:06:32 GMT -5 aricia said:

Aug 17, 2022 18:40:02 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

Do you pay to get a card? Or just no card if you don't meet their criteria?

Here, you can pay for a card. $100 a year for individual or $250 a year for family.

OMG.  Yuck.  We've never had to pay anything for the library, I had no clue paying for that was a thing some places.

[daisylu]

Aug 18, 2022 8:07:12 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Aug 17, 2022 19:06:32 GMT -5 aricia said:

Here, you can pay for a card. $100 a year for individual or $250 a year for family.

OMG.  Yuck.  We've never had to pay anything for the library, I had no clue paying for that was a thing some places.

It is like that here too (NOVA). You get a free card if you can prove that you are a resident of the county. Our county has 3 libraries, and the card is good for all. If not, you pay. The kids used their school IDs for proof. Drivers license was enough proof for me.