The "Diversity" Counterargument? It's Racist

[djAdvocate]

ever hear a Republican debating why we suck so bad at doing things?

if it not the first thing out of the bag, it comes pretty soon: diversity. ever think about what the implications of that are? I didn't. until today.

what this argument basically says is that BECAUSE we are such a diverse place, that we have difficulty building consensus, and therefore, we flap around like a loose sheet at the quilting guild.

in order to see how this is a racist argument, you need to only consider what the remedy for this is: less diversity. how do you do that? Eugenics? genocide? Shogun Era Japan? those are the only three ways I can think of.

there is another problem with the argument, and that is that we are not the most diverse place on Earth. not even close. we are 25th, according to this:

www.rickshawtravel.co.uk/blog/global-diversity-index-the-most-diverse-countries-in-the-world/

the latest version of this played out on FOX News during the Democratic campaign, where the hostess used this defense against Buttigeig.  but to drill down on this, there is a serious problem with that argument, as well.

while it is true that Belgium is more diverse than the US and did worse than us, they are the ONLY exception.  among countries more diverse than us you will find New Zealand, which was 189th on the list in terms of CV19 mortality, and South Korea, which was 150th, and Canada, which is 58th.  the US is 12th highest.

so, yeah, the argument is not only racist, but in the case of CV19, wrong.  perhaps we fail because we are racist.  that seems more plausible to me.

[Lizard Queen]

Diverse groups perform better than homogeneous groups if they are inclusive. If there is not an inclusive culture, then diverse groups perform worse than homogeneous groups.

[happyhoix]

Mar 11, 2021 15:27:04 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

ever hear a Republican debating why we suck so bad at doing things?

if it not the first thing out of the bag, it comes pretty soon: diversity. ever think about what the implications of that are? I didn't. until today.

what this argument basically says is that BECAUSE we are such a diverse place, that we have difficulty building consensus, and therefore, we flap around like a loose sheet at the quilting guild.

in order to see how this is a racist argument, you need to only consider what the remedy for this is: less diversity. how do you do that? Eugenics? genocide? Shogun Era Japan? those are the only three ways I can think of.

there is another problem with the argument, and that is that we are not the most diverse place on Earth. not even close. we are 25th, according to this:

www.rickshawtravel.co.uk/blog/global-diversity-index-the-most-diverse-countries-in-the-world/

the latest version of this played out on FOX News during the Democratic campaign, where the hostess used this defense against Buttigeig.  but to drill down on this, there is a serious problem with that argument, as well.

while it is true that Belgium is more diverse than the US and did worse than us, they are the ONLY exception.  among countries more diverse than us you will find New Zealand, which was 189th on the list in terms of CV19 mortality, and South Korea, which was 150th, and Canada, which is 58th.  the US is 12th highest.

so, yeah, the argument is not only racist, but in the case of CV19, wrong.  perhaps we fail because we are racist.  that seems more plausible to me.

Belgium is divided between the French speakers (historically the upper class) and the Flemish speakers. At one point a few years ago they had no president because they couldn’t agree on who it should be.

Maybe LQ is right, diversity without inclusivity fails.

Their beer, pommes frites and chocolate is awesome though.

[happyhoix]

Mar 11, 2021 15:27:04 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

ever hear a Republican debating why we suck so bad at doing things?

if it not the first thing out of the bag, it comes pretty soon: diversity. ever think about what the implications of that are? I didn't. until today.

what this argument basically says is that BECAUSE we are such a diverse place, that we have difficulty building consensus, and therefore, we flap around like a loose sheet at the quilting guild.

in order to see how this is a racist argument, you need to only consider what the remedy for this is: less diversity. how do you do that? Eugenics? genocide? Shogun Era Japan? those are the only three ways I can think of.

there is another problem with the argument, and that is that we are not the most diverse place on Earth. not even close. we are 25th, according to this:

www.rickshawtravel.co.uk/blog/global-diversity-index-the-most-diverse-countries-in-the-world/

the latest version of this played out on FOX News during the Democratic campaign, where the hostess used this defense against Buttigeig.  but to drill down on this, there is a serious problem with that argument, as well.

while it is true that Belgium is more diverse than the US and did worse than us, they are the ONLY exception.  among countries more diverse than us you will find New Zealand, which was 189th on the list in terms of CV19 mortality, and South Korea, which was 150th, and Canada, which is 58th.  the US is 12th highest.

so, yeah, the argument is not only racist, but in the case of CV19, wrong.  perhaps we fail because we are racist.  that seems more plausible to me.

Belgium is divided between the French speakers (historically the upper class) and the Flemish speakers. At one point a few years ago they had no president because they couldn’t agree on who it should be.

Maybe LQ is right, diversity without inclusivity fails.

Their beer, pommes frites and chocolate is awesome though.

[Lizard Queen]

This is from a study cited by the prof doing the coursera course that i'm taking:

www.coursera.org/learn/leading-diverse-teams-and-organizations

[djAdvocate]

Mar 11, 2021 19:23:14 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Mar 11, 2021 15:27:04 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

ever hear a Republican debating why we suck so bad at doing things?

if it not the first thing out of the bag, it comes pretty soon: diversity. ever think about what the implications of that are? I didn't. until today.

what this argument basically says is that BECAUSE we are such a diverse place, that we have difficulty building consensus, and therefore, we flap around like a loose sheet at the quilting guild.

in order to see how this is a racist argument, you need to only consider what the remedy for this is: less diversity. how do you do that? Eugenics? genocide? Shogun Era Japan? those are the only three ways I can think of.

there is another problem with the argument, and that is that we are not the most diverse place on Earth. not even close. we are 25th, according to this:

www.rickshawtravel.co.uk/blog/global-diversity-index-the-most-diverse-countries-in-the-world/

the latest version of this played out on FOX News during the Democratic campaign, where the hostess used this defense against Buttigeig.  but to drill down on this, there is a serious problem with that argument, as well.

while it is true that Belgium is more diverse than the US and did worse than us, they are the ONLY exception.  among countries more diverse than us you will find New Zealand, which was 189th on the list in terms of CV19 mortality, and South Korea, which was 150th, and Canada, which is 58th.  the US is 12th highest.

so, yeah, the argument is not only racist, but in the case of CV19, wrong.  perhaps we fail because we are racist.  that seems more plausible to me.

Belgium is divided between the French speakers (historically the upper class) and the Flemish speakers. At one point a few years ago they had no president because they couldn’t agree on who it should be.

Maybe LQ is right, diversity without inclusivity fails.

Their beer, pommes frites and chocolate is awesome though.

Brugge is also an international treasure.  highly recommend it to anyone who has never been.

[djAdvocate]

Mar 11, 2021 19:55:20 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

This is from a study cited by the prof doing the coursera course that i'm taking:

www.coursera.org/learn/leading-diverse-teams-and-organizations

brilliant work, and offers a WHY behind my observations.

greatly appreciated.

[dondub]

Mar 11, 2021 19:23:14 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Mar 11, 2021 15:27:04 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

ever hear a Republican debating why we suck so bad at doing things?

if it not the first thing out of the bag, it comes pretty soon: diversity. ever think about what the implications of that are? I didn't. until today.

what this argument basically says is that BECAUSE we are such a diverse place, that we have difficulty building consensus, and therefore, we flap around like a loose sheet at the quilting guild.

in order to see how this is a racist argument, you need to only consider what the remedy for this is: less diversity. how do you do that? Eugenics? genocide? Shogun Era Japan? those are the only three ways I can think of.

there is another problem with the argument, and that is that we are not the most diverse place on Earth. not even close. we are 25th, according to this:

www.rickshawtravel.co.uk/blog/global-diversity-index-the-most-diverse-countries-in-the-world/

the latest version of this played out on FOX News during the Democratic campaign, where the hostess used this defense against Buttigeig.  but to drill down on this, there is a serious problem with that argument, as well.

while it is true that Belgium is more diverse than the US and did worse than us, they are the ONLY exception.  among countries more diverse than us you will find New Zealand, which was 189th on the list in terms of CV19 mortality, and South Korea, which was 150th, and Canada, which is 58th.  the US is 12th highest.

so, yeah, the argument is not only racist, but in the case of CV19, wrong.  perhaps we fail because we are racist.  that seems more plausible to me.

Belgium is divided between the French speakers (historically the upper class) and the Flemish speakers. At one point a few years ago they had no president because they couldn’t agree on who it should be.

Maybe LQ is right, diversity without inclusivity fails.

Their beer, pommes frites and chocolate is awesome though.

I’m not so sure about beers. A friend loves them and we had an exclusive Belgian beer pub he we crawled too. I find them too yeasty or some other taste factor that was not desirable,

Of course the Belgians would probably cringe at our Westcoast IPA’s.

[djAdvocate]

Mar 11, 2021 21:57:14 GMT -5 dondub said:

Mar 11, 2021 19:23:14 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Belgium is divided between the French speakers (historically the upper class) and the Flemish speakers. At one point a few years ago they had no president because they couldn’t agree on who it should be.

Maybe LQ is right, diversity without inclusivity fails.

Their beer, pommes frites and chocolate is awesome though.

I’m not so sure about beers. A friend loves them and we had an exclusive Belgian beer pub he we crawled too. I find them too yeasty or some other taste factor that was not desirable,

Of course the Belgians would probably cringe at our Westcoast IPA’s.

I am not a big fan of Kreiks (sic) myself.  but the gothic architecture and the canals in the aforementioned town are much to wonder.

[happyhoix]

Mar 11, 2021 21:57:14 GMT -5 dondub said:

Mar 11, 2021 19:23:14 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Belgium is divided between the French speakers (historically the upper class) and the Flemish speakers. At one point a few years ago they had no president because they couldn’t agree on who it should be.

Maybe LQ is right, diversity without inclusivity fails.

Their beer, pommes frites and chocolate is awesome though.

I’m not so sure about beers. A friend loves them and we had an exclusive Belgian beer pub he we crawled too. I find them too yeasty or some other taste factor that was not desirable,

Of course the Belgians would probably cringe at our Westcoast IPA’s.

Do you like hoppier beers? I’m a fan of the less hoppy type, so I like the Belgian whites and the hefeweizens.  DH used to be a big stout and porter fan but has lately started more to the IPA side because the darker beers sometimes trigger his migraines. 

When we visited Bruges we got to visit a 400 year old brewery (still working, but they had to build an underground beer pipeline to a building a few blocks away where the beer is packaged, since trying to navigate the narrow Brugge streets crammed with tourists in a beer tanker truck was a nightmare). Wish you could get their Brugge Zot at more places in the US. 

[dondub]

Mar 12, 2021 10:35:15 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Mar 11, 2021 21:57:14 GMT -5 dondub said:

I’m not so sure about beers. A friend loves them and we had an exclusive Belgian beer pub he we crawled too. I find them too yeasty or some other taste factor that was not desirable,

Of course the Belgians would probably cringe at our Westcoast IPA’s.

Do you like hoppier beers? I’m a fan of the less hoppy type, so I like the Belgian whites and the hefeweizens.  DH used to be a big stout and porter fan but has lately started more to the IPA side because the darker beers sometimes trigger his migraines. 

When we visited Bruges we got to visit a 400 year old brewery (still working, but they had to build an underground beer pipeline to a building a few blocks away where the beer is packaged, since trying to navigate the narrow Brugge streets crammed with tourists in a beer tanker truck was a nightmare). Wish you could get their Brugge Zot at more places in the US. 

Yes and also enjoy the stouts and porters. Black Butte Porter...yum.

I read about that beer pipeline once. Nothing like some human ingenuity to deliver the brew!

[djAdvocate]

Mar 12, 2021 12:09:24 GMT -5 dondub said:

Mar 12, 2021 10:35:15 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Do you like hoppier beers? I’m a fan of the less hoppy type, so I like the Belgian whites and the hefeweizens.  DH used to be a big stout and porter fan but has lately started more to the IPA side because the darker beers sometimes trigger his migraines. 

When we visited Bruges we got to visit a 400 year old brewery (still working, but they had to build an underground beer pipeline to a building a few blocks away where the beer is packaged, since trying to navigate the narrow Brugge streets crammed with tourists in a beer tanker truck was a nightmare). Wish you could get their Brugge Zot at more places in the US. 

Yes and also enjoy the stouts and porters. Black Butte Porter...yum.

I read about that beer pipeline once. Nothing like some human ingenuity to deliver the brew!

i am a dark beer guy myself.

so, what do you think of the racist argument, don?  oversimplifying?

[Bob Ross]

Mar 11, 2021 19:23:14 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Mar 11, 2021 15:27:04 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

ever hear a Republican debating why we suck so bad at doing things?

if it not the first thing out of the bag, it comes pretty soon: diversity. ever think about what the implications of that are? I didn't. until today.

what this argument basically says is that BECAUSE we are such a diverse place, that we have difficulty building consensus, and therefore, we flap around like a loose sheet at the quilting guild.

in order to see how this is a racist argument, you need to only consider what the remedy for this is: less diversity. how do you do that? Eugenics? genocide? Shogun Era Japan? those are the only three ways I can think of.

there is another problem with the argument, and that is that we are not the most diverse place on Earth. not even close. we are 25th, according to this:

www.rickshawtravel.co.uk/blog/global-diversity-index-the-most-diverse-countries-in-the-world/

the latest version of this played out on FOX News during the Democratic campaign, where the hostess used this defense against Buttigeig.  but to drill down on this, there is a serious problem with that argument, as well.

while it is true that Belgium is more diverse than the US and did worse than us, they are the ONLY exception.  among countries more diverse than us you will find New Zealand, which was 189th on the list in terms of CV19 mortality, and South Korea, which was 150th, and Canada, which is 58th.  the US is 12th highest.

so, yeah, the argument is not only racist, but in the case of CV19, wrong.  perhaps we fail because we are racist.  that seems more plausible to me.

Belgium is divided between the French speakers (historically the upper class) and the Flemish speakers. At one point a few years ago they had no president because they couldn’t agree on who it should be.

Maybe LQ is right, diversity without inclusivity fails.

Their beer, pommes frites and chocolate is awesome though.

Plus, there's this.

[dondub]

Mar 12, 2021 13:06:53 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Mar 12, 2021 12:09:24 GMT -5 dondub said:

Yes and also enjoy the stouts and porters. Black Butte Porter...yum.

I read about that beer pipeline once. Nothing like some human ingenuity to deliver the brew!

i am a dark beer guy myself.

so, what do you think of the racist argument, don?  oversimplifying?

I don’t think so. After many years of believing we had made progress in that arena, Trump awoke a more overt racism than I thought possible. Now we see a blatant New Jim Crow on voting and a continued assault on the border while employers remain protected and a majority of eventual illegals fly in.

Diversity means Repo/Cons will lose elections, be forced to associate at work, schools, play with folks that make them uncomfortable. I’m assuming they would just prefer segregation.

[Tiny]

what this argument basically says is that BECAUSE we are such a diverse place, that we have difficulty building consensus, and therefore, we flap around like a loose sheet at the quilting guild.

You can see how it's racist (and sexist) in an easier way...
Just look at how "diversity" is defined in America:
White women, people of color, and Naturalized Americans (ie they are citizens but they weren't born here).

The argument is saying that people who do not look like, act like, or talk like the White People Traditionally in Charge (aka White Men) do NOT have the same priorities as the White People Traditionally in Charge (aka White Men).

And trying to get people with different priorities to agree is difficult.

I'll let you think about what kinds of priority differences there are between White Men and then White women, people of color, and Naturalized Americans....

There are other sub groups in the "diversity" category - LGBTQ White Men and White Men who aren't a "Christian" religion for example. I'm sure you can identify more.

It may not all be "racism" - but it's definitely discrimination.

in order to see how this is a racist argument, you need to only consider what the remedy for this is: less diversity. how do you do that? Eugenics? genocide? Shogun Era Japan? those are the only three ways I can think of

.

Japan still has strong "nationalism" and isn't really all that much about diversity - I could be wrong. There are "equality" or "equity" issues when it comes to women's rights and standards of conduct. 

I get the feeling Republicans would idolize Japan, China, Singapore, and even North Korea (I'm not all that familiar with government styles outside Asia Pacific) and would approve of the way their governments are handled and their social cultures.
These countries have strong forms of nationalism and are almost Theistic and a few very powerful people/families or groups run the country.

[laterbloomer]

I have found you have to translate what they say. "Diversity makes it hard to build consensus" means "we can't convince diverse groups to voluntarily keep doing stuff that benefits us and penalizes themselves". It's just like how "we must work on unifying our country" means "you have to do everything our way".

[Tiny]

Mar 12, 2021 13:54:26 GMT -5 Bob Ross said:

Plus, there's this.

Jean-Claude was mighty easy on the eyes back then... sigh.

Thanks for reminding me a fun "movie going" time in my life.

[djAdvocate]

Mar 12, 2021 15:07:21 GMT -5 laterbloomer said:

I have found you have to translate what they say. "Diversity makes it hard to build consensus" means "we can't convince diverse groups to voluntarily keep doing stuff that benefits us and penalizes themselves". It's just like how "we must work on unifying our country" means "you have to do everything our way".

good observation.

diversity is a threat to hegemony.