Look At All the Destruction Caused By the Hurricanes!

[OldCoyote]

Which brings me to this question,, if you built a home on the beach, in hurricane country,, Why should I feel sorry for you when it gets removed by Natural Causes??

[OldCoyote]

If you bought a house in a Flood Plain You get flooded ,, what did you expect,

[milee]

Oct 13, 2018 9:36:54 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Which brings me to this question,, if you built a home on the beach, in hurricane country,, Why should I feel sorry for you when it gets removed by Natural Causes??

I actually agree with this for the most part as long as the same standard is applied nationally.  People in Arizona shouldn't pay more taxes to rebuild my house on the coast that is flattened by a hurricane, but I also shouldn't pay more taxes to rebuild their house that burns down in a wildfire.  People in Kansas shouldn't pay more taxes to repair NY's subway that flooded during Sandy, but then people in NY shouldn't pay more taxes to repair homes in Kansas that tornadoes destroy.

I'd be OK with the national government getting out of the business of "insuring" private homes and businesses for natural disasters.  It would take a little while to change people's mindset and give warning of the impending change so people could make appropriate arrangements (move, get insurance, whatever) but as long as we're applying the concept equally - no government funding for private homes or business in any region - then it's a reasonable approach.

[Tennesseer]

Oct 13, 2018 12:11:16 GMT -5 milee said:

Oct 13, 2018 9:36:54 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Which brings me to this question,, if you built a home on the beach, in hurricane country,, Why should I feel sorry for you when it gets removed by Natural Causes??

I actually agree with this for the most part as long as the same standard is applied nationally.  People in Arizona shouldn't pay more taxes to rebuild my house on the coast that is flattened by a hurricane, but I also shouldn't pay more taxes to rebuild their house that burns down in a wildfire.  People in Kansas shouldn't pay more taxes to repair NY's subway that flooded during Sandy, but then people in NY shouldn't pay more taxes to repair homes in Kanasas that tornadoes destroy.

I'd be OK with the national government getting out of the business of "insuring" private homes and businesses for natural disasters.  It would take a little while to change people's mindset and give warning of the impending change so people could make appropriate arrangements (move, get insurance, whatever) but as long as we're applying the concept equally - no government funding for private homes or business in any region - then it's a reasonable approach.

How about those earthquake prone areas!

[NoNamePerson]

Point me the piece of land in the US or the world for that matter that is PERFECT and no natural disasters and I will fucking move there with everyone else. Well, I might have to kill off a few assholes to maintain my place but I'm not above that. Wait, will it still be perfect or a killing field?? Killing isn't a natural disaster so I guess that's OK

[Tennesseer]

Oct 13, 2018 12:56:18 GMT -5 NoNamePerson said:

Point me the piece of land in the US or the world for that matter that is PERFECT and no natural disasters and I will fucking move there with everyone else. Well, I might have to kill off a few assholes to maintain my place but I'm not above that. Wait, will it still be perfect or a killing field?? Killing isn't a natural disaster so I guess that's OK

Read this article years ago. Some may disagree with the conclusion but it's a start.

Where To Hide From Mother Nature
Wyoming? Nope. West Virginia? Think again.

Human beings are self-absorbed creatures, so the response to Hurricane Katrina has naturally included some hand-wringing over the question: “Could this happen to my hometown?” Depending on the worrywart’s location, the theoretical catastrophe could be a flash flood, a wildfire, or an earthquake rather than a hurricane; no corner of the United States is immune to lethal natural disasters.

Still, some corners are safer than others. If an American wants to minimize his chances of dying at Mother Nature’s hands, where should he set up house? Slate crunched the numbers—and did some educated guesswork—to find the U.S. city where the odds of perishing in a natural disaster are closest to nil.

We started by taking a look at every presidential disaster declaration from 1965 through 2004. As this color-coded map reveals, the Eastern half of the nation has had the most officially declared disasters, although North Dakota, Washington, and California have endured more than their share of woe. Going by presidential decrees alone, then, Western states such as Nevada or Wyoming appear safest.

Rest pf article here: Where To Hide From Mother Nature

[weltschmerz]

Oct 13, 2018 22:03:54 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Oct 13, 2018 12:56:18 GMT -5 NoNamePerson said:

Point me the piece of land in the US or the world for that matter that is PERFECT and no natural disasters and I will fucking move there with everyone else. Well, I might have to kill off a few assholes to maintain my place but I'm not above that. Wait, will it still be perfect or a killing field?? Killing isn't a natural disaster so I guess that's OK

Read this article years ago. Some may disagree with the conclusion but it's a start.

Where To Hide From Mother Nature
Wyoming? Nope. West Virginia? Think again.

Human beings are self-absorbed creatures, so the response to Hurricane Katrina has naturally included some hand-wringing over the question: “Could this happen to my hometown?” Depending on the worrywart’s location, the theoretical catastrophe could be a flash flood, a wildfire, or an earthquake rather than a hurricane; no corner of the United States is immune to lethal natural disasters.

Still, some corners are safer than others. If an American wants to minimize his chances of dying at Mother Nature’s hands, where should he set up house? Slate crunched the numbers—and did some educated guesswork—to find the U.S. city where the odds of perishing in a natural disaster are closest to nil.

We started by taking a look at every presidential disaster declaration from 1965 through 2004. As this color-coded map reveals, the Eastern half of the nation has had the most officially declared disasters, although North Dakota, Washington, and California have endured more than their share of woe. Going by presidential decrees alone, then, Western states such as Nevada or Wyoming appear safest.

Rest pf article here: Where To Hide From Mother Nature

International Space Station.

[Ryan]

Oct 13, 2018 12:56:18 GMT -5 NoNamePerson said:

Point me the piece of land in the US or the world for that matter that is PERFECT and no natural disasters and I will fucking move there with everyone else. Well, I might have to kill off a few assholes to maintain my place but I'm not above that. Wait, will it still be perfect or a killing field?? Killing isn't a natural disaster so I guess that's OK

Aren't there tons of places where you could put your house where are a natural disaster wouldn't strike?  I live in IL and about the only threat we might have here is a tornado, but it's extremely rare that you hear about any houses destroyed by a tornado. None of the towns I ever lived in were ever impacted by a tornado, not to say it can't happen.

[Lizard Queen]

Even though there was an F0 tornado here back in the 70's, my town is pretty damn safe from natural disasters. I think the reasoning here ib thus article is flawed, as they lump in the danger of driving in winter into natural disaster. What's natural about driving? There is almost no danger to sitting your ass at home during a blizzard. We don't get snowed in but for maybe 12 hours at the most here. Grocery shelves aren't stripped in preparation for a blizzard here. People don't have to evacuate. There isn't mass destruction or loss of life. You might lose cable for a while. Definitely lose satellite tv, as that takes hardly any kind of storm to knock that out. 😡

[Tennesseer]

Oct 13, 2018 22:25:29 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

Oct 13, 2018 22:03:54 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Read this article years ago. Some may disagree with the conclusion but it's a start.

Where To Hide From Mother Nature
Wyoming? Nope. West Virginia? Think again.

Human beings are self-absorbed creatures, so the response to Hurricane Katrina has naturally included some hand-wringing over the question: “Could this happen to my hometown?” Depending on the worrywart’s location, the theoretical catastrophe could be a flash flood, a wildfire, or an earthquake rather than a hurricane; no corner of the United States is immune to lethal natural disasters.

Still, some corners are safer than others. If an American wants to minimize his chances of dying at Mother Nature’s hands, where should he set up house? Slate crunched the numbers—and did some educated guesswork—to find the U.S. city where the odds of perishing in a natural disaster are closest to nil.

We started by taking a look at every presidential disaster declaration from 1965 through 2004. As this color-coded map reveals, the Eastern half of the nation has had the most officially declared disasters, although North Dakota, Washington, and California have endured more than their share of woe. Going by presidential decrees alone, then, Western states such as Nevada or Wyoming appear safest.

Rest pf article here: Where To Hide From Mother Nature

International Space Station.

Takeoff and re-entry can be a killer.

[giramomma]

Oct 13, 2018 22:40:57 GMT -5 Ryan said:

Aren't there tons of places where you could put your house where are a natural disaster wouldn't strike?  I live in IL and about the only threat we might have here is a tornado, but it's extremely rare that you hear about any houses destroyed by a tornado. None of the towns I ever lived in were ever impacted by a tornado, not to say it can't happen.

I live north of you urban area. We just had once every hundred year flooding. There's normally no flooding issues where I live. Some folks couldn't even get into their basement there was so much water.

A few years ago, a tornado touched down a mile or so from my house. We've had funnel clouds go over our house once every 3-4 years. No. Houses were not destroyed, but pretty damaged.

So, it just depends.

[NoNamePerson]

But no one has come up with the perfect place with NO natural disasters. Lots of "we don't have many or chances are" replies.

[tractor]

Oct 14, 2018 6:02:52 GMT -5 NoNamePerson said:

But no one has come up with the perfect place with NO natural disasters. Lots of "we don't have many or chances are" replies.

Come to northern Michigan..on another thought, actually stay away, it’s a terrible place full of snowstorms, mosquitoes, and bear attacks 🙂

[giramomma]

Oct 14, 2018 6:02:52 GMT -5 NoNamePerson said:

But no one has come up with the perfect place with NO natural disasters. Lots of "we don't have many or chances are" replies.

Right. And if it's one thing I've learned, there's a difference between having a very, tiny chance and absolutely no chance. And sometimes, that very tiny chance is just enough for something to happen.

[giramomma]

Then there's the issue of, well, how does one predict the weather with 100% accuracy for hundreds of years. Or even 50. Or 25.

Our normal average of snow in the winter is 50 inches. In the past 7-8 years, we've gone from winters with 100" of snow to a couple of winters now with 25" of snow. I could count the number of storms on one hand.

Why do we get to pick and choose which randomness the gov't will support? I mean, weather is only one random thing we have to deal with.

Death is a for sure thing for us all, but yet, the timing is absolutely random. If a parent dies and leaves minor kids behind...there's a good chunk of money to be had. I've looked it up, and if I go today, actually, my household income would likely stay the same simply from what my kids would get from Social security. 

Perhaps at church and as many other places I can find, I should start lobbying to get rid of grief support groups, funeral lunches and the like. Perhaps I should run for office on the platform that we shouldn't waste gov't money supporting families where a parent dies and leaves minor children behind.

People know loved ones are going to die. That's more of a "for sure" thing than 100 year weather events, or even getting hit by a hurricane. Why should I feel sorry for those that are living  and why should there be any support for the living when that happens?

Indeed, why have sympathy/empathy at all?

[Lizard Queen]

There's also a chance that anyone of us could die from a meteor falling on our head. However, if I live on a riverbank, I think I should be more worried. And if you live in a place that has enough of a chance to be hit by something that you need to worry about it, then it should be on you to take steps to prevent it from destroying your home and/or endangering your life.

[giramomma]

Oct 14, 2018 8:12:35 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

There's also a chance that anyone of us could die from a meteor falling on our head. However, if I live on a riverbank, I think I should be more worried. And if you live in a place that has enough of a chance to be hit by something that you need to worry about it, then it should be on you to take steps to prevent it from destroying your home and/or endangering your life.

Did you note how quickly this last hurricane grew strength?

On another money board I was on, some woman posted about her vacation..she took her family to the Florida beach and was concerned about their safety when it was a Tropical storm and catagory 1 hurricane.

Really, smart, rich folks that have better careers, than us, etc were telling her to stay. That a Category 1 hurricane was no big deal.

She didn't listen to them and got out. She was pretty happy she did.

[giramomma]

Well, now this is interesting..

www.tripsavvy.com/how-often-do-hurricanes-hit-florida-3266726

According to this site 37 hurricanes have hit Florida since 1851.

With those numbers, who assumes that there's a huge risk? I mean, that's not even a guaranteed 1 year. Why should people assume they are living in city that will fall to ruins?

Let's compare that with tornadoes in my state, which is 1500+ in the same time frame.

In IL, since Nov of 2013, there's been 295 tornadoes, and there's been over 10 deaths from those.

So, why is the Midwest perceived as being better, even though there's more bad weather than Florida?

[OldCoyote]

I don't mean there are perfect places free from Natural Occurring Conditions.

If you build or buy in a known Flood Plain expect to get floods.

If you build or buy something close to the beach in Hurricane Country, you can expect damage.

If you do build or buy in these areas, you or build accordingly. 

If I lived in tornado Country,, I most certainly would have a storm shelter.

Here in AZ we now survived two Ex Hurricane s in the last month.

First one, some wind, lots of rain,, Yesterday rain!.

Here we get Summer storms from the monsoon,, which can be 15 minute Hurricanes!

[TheOtherMe]

I'm in the midwest, tornado country.  I lived here growing up and returned 10 years ago.  No storm shelter growing up but we had a basement.  Same now.  No storm cellar but I have a basement.  

I survived a tornado as a kid that took every building on my uncle's farm but the house.  We were in the house.  This was in the early 1950's so no warning at the farm.  There was a root cellar on the farm, but no time to get there.

The new schools here have storm shelters.  

Like gira said, the weather has seen extremes since I moved back here.  No summer or winter has been average.  Either way over/under on rain/snow.  

There have been two 100 year flood events close to me in the 9 years since I moved here.  That means there is a risk of 1/100 every year for flooding.  I don't live in a flood plain but I've had water in my basement.

[Tennesseer]

Oct 14, 2018 10:51:39 GMT -5 TheOtherMe said:

I'm in the midwest, tornado country.  I lived here growing up and returned 10 years ago.  No storm shelter growing up but we had a basement.  Same now.  No storm cellar but I have a basement.  

I survived a tornado as a kid that took every building on my uncle's farm but the house.  We were in the house.  This was in the early 1950's so no warning at the farm.  There was a root cellar on the farm, but no time to get there.

The new schools here have storm shelters.  

Like gira said, the weather has seen extremes since I moved back here.  No summer or winter has been average.  Either way over/under on rain/snow.  

There have been two 100 year flood events close to me in the 9 years since I moved here.  That means there is a risk of 1/100 every year for flooding.  I don't live in a flood plain but I've had water in my basement.

TOM-do you know if the new schools are built with smaller room windows? Here, the new schools are built with smaller windows. Should there be a tornado, smaller openings for the wind to break through and do damage inside the building(s).

Back in 2011, a rare EF3 tornado struck Springfield (my home town) and other areas of western MA. The tornado struck my high school and it was determined by its insurance company to be a total loss.

One problem with the high school was it had many large hallway and classoom windows which most were broken on the west side of the school. The winds now in the building cause all the damage.

Hopefully, the new school being built on the old school's site will have smaller and fewer windows.

[Lizard Queen]

Oct 14, 2018 9:18:04 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Oct 14, 2018 8:12:35 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

There's also a chance that anyone of us could die from a meteor falling on our head. However, if I live on a riverbank, I think I should be more worried. And if you live in a place that has enough of a chance to be hit by something that you need to worry about it, then it should be on you to take steps to prevent it from destroying your home and/or endangering your life.

Did you note how quickly this last hurricane grew strength?

On another money board I was on, some woman posted about her vacation..she took her family to the Florida beach and was concerned about their safety when it was a Tropical storm and catagory 1 hurricane.

Really, smart, rich folks that have better careers, than us, etc were telling her to stay. That a Category 1 hurricane was no big deal.

She didn't listen to them and got out. She was pretty happy she did.

I think that a tropical storm is enough to cancel a vacation. Why stay, if you don't even live there? My sympathies are with those without much choice, due to finances. Rich people who keep rebuilding on the same waterfront spot, not so much.

[Cheesy FL-Vol]

Oct 14, 2018 9:44:39 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

I don't mean there are perfect places free from Natural Occurring Conditions.

If you build or buy in a known Flood Plain expect to get floods.

If you build or buy something close to the beach in Hurricane Country, you can expect damage.

If you do build or buy in these areas, you or build accordingly. 

If I lived in tornado Country,, I most certainly would have a storm shelter.

Here in AZ we now survived two Ex Hurricane s in the last month.

First one, some wind, lots of rain,, Yesterday rain!.

Here we get Summer storms from the monsoon,, which can be 15 minute Hurricanes!

Which brings me to this question,, if you built a home on the beach, in hurricane country,, Why should I feel sorry for you when it gets removed by Natural Causes??

Your storm shelter wouldn't do anything for your property, so I wouldn't feel sorry for you if you bought or built in Tornado country and your house was removed by natural causes. 

[TheOtherMe]

Tennesseer  New schools are being built with smaller windows but that is mostly due to school shootings more than tornadoes.  

There are a lot of poor people who never have the means to move from where they are born.  I have all the sympathy in the world for them, but not for rich people who rebuild in flood plains, hurricane county, wildfire country, hurricane country.  

People living in poverty can't leave when natural disasters occur because of lack of money.  That means they suffer even more if the worst happens where they live.  

My sister was on the playground with her students last week when a tornado warning was put in to effect very suddenly.  At her elementary school, she is not allowed to carry her cellphone with her, which would have alerted her to the tornado warning.  She had a walkie talkie with her but nobody inside the building let her know about the warning.  Suddenly a teacher opened the door and told her to get the kids inside but didn't tell her why.  She was trying to figure out if there was a shooter because she didn't know if the kids should go inside or try to run.  Luckily, the teacher saw her face and yelled it was a tornado warning.  

The storm was actually to the north of her school but she didn't know that.  She says she is going to carry her phone with her as she would have heard it even if it was in her pocket.  She does agree that phone use is abused by her co-workers but if she isn't going to be told by walkie talkie, what is she supposed to do to protect herself and the students (pre-K age kids)

[alabamagal]

Oct 14, 2018 11:56:32 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

Oct 14, 2018 9:18:04 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Did you note how quickly this last hurricane grew strength?

On another money board I was on, some woman posted about her vacation..she took her family to the Florida beach and was concerned about their safety when it was a Tropical storm and catagory 1 hurricane.

Really, smart, rich folks that have better careers, than us, etc were telling her to stay. That a Category 1 hurricane was no big deal.

She didn't listen to them and got out. She was pretty happy she did.

I think that a tropical storm is enough to cancel a vacation. Why stay, if you don't even live there? My sympathies are with those without much choice, due to finances. Rich people who keep rebuilding on the same waterfront spot, not so much.

I had 2 vacations in FL cut short several years ago due to Hurricanes. If you are there to do outdoor activities, why stay there and be stuck inside for 3 days of bad weather? Even the “no refund” resort refunded my money.

[Lizard Queen]

Oct 14, 2018 14:22:20 GMT -5 alabamagal said:

Oct 14, 2018 11:56:32 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

I think that a tropical storm is enough to cancel a vacation. Why stay, if you don't even live there? My sympathies are with those without much choice, due to finances. Rich people who keep rebuilding on the same waterfront spot, not so much.

I had 2 vacations in FL cut short several years ago due to Hurricanes. If you are there to do outdoor activities, why stay there and be stuck inside for 3 days of bad weather? Even the “no refund” resort refunded my money.

I know, right? How fun could it be to hunker down in hotel room, and possibly lose power? The only reasons to stay would be to save money, do a job, and keep an eye on your stuff. None of that is the case in vacation.

[weltschmerz]

The weather is getting more and more extreme due to climate change.
People who laid down roots in certain places years ago didn't expect these changes.
We're getting "once in a lifetime" rainstorms where we get a years worth of rain in one day, on a regular basis. Terrible flooding.
Hurricanes are intensifying because the ocean temperature is warmer.
Warmer weather is also intensifying horrific large-scale wildfires.
Just last month, we had six tornadoes touch down in Ottawa/Gatineau in the same time period and cause massive destruction.
There's no place to go.
We did this and now we're reaping the results.

[zibazinski]

Oct 14, 2018 14:22:20 GMT -5 alabamagal said:

Oct 14, 2018 11:56:32 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

I think that a tropical storm is enough to cancel a vacation. Why stay, if you don't even live there? My sympathies are with those without much choice, due to finances. Rich people who keep rebuilding on the same waterfront spot, not so much.

I had 2 vacations in FL cut short several years ago due to Hurricanes. If you are there to do outdoor activities, why stay there and be stuck inside for 3 days of bad weather? Even the “no refund” resort refunded my money.

Time those vacations. I took a cruise during hurricane season. Cheap but dicey.

[CCL]

Oct 14, 2018 14:04:03 GMT -5 TheOtherMe said:

Tennesseer  New schools are being built with smaller windows but that is mostly due to school shootings more than tornadoes.  

There are a lot of poor people who never have the means to move from where they are born.  I have all the sympathy in the world for them, but not for rich people who rebuild in flood plains, hurricane county, wildfire country, hurricane country.  

People living in poverty can't leave when natural disasters occur because of lack of money.  That means they suffer even more if the worst happens where they live.  

My sister was on the playground with her students last week when a tornado warning was put in to effect very suddenly.  At her elementary school, she is not allowed to carry her cellphone with her, which would have alerted her to the tornado warning.  She had a walkie talkie with her but nobody inside the building let her know about the warning.  Suddenly a teacher opened the door and told her to get the kids inside but didn't tell her why.  She was trying to figure out if there was a shooter because she didn't know if the kids should go inside or try to run.  Luckily, the teacher saw her face and yelled it was a tornado warning.  

The storm was actually to the north of her school but she didn't know that.  She says she is going to carry her phone with her as she would have heard it even if it was in her pocket.  She does agree that phone use is abused by her co-workers but if she isn't going to be told by walkie talkie, what is she supposed to do to protect herself and the students (pre-K age kids)

They don't have sirens?

[TheOtherMe]

Small town.  Didn't go off.  Didn't go off in my small town, one town over.  My phone and weather radio went off or I would not have known about it.