jkapp
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Post by jkapp on May 28, 2018 8:50:21 GMT -5
...the black market is bigger than ever in so-called legalized marijuana states. Chalk up another liberal failure.
...The black market hasn't gone away within the state, either, because some marijuana users are deterred by the higher dispensary prices and are loyal to their long-time dealers.
Investigators say the illegal trade has flourished because the state laws around growing marijuana were overly generous in the beginning and hard to enforce. ...Paul Roach, a DEA supervisor, says his team spends about 15 per cent of its time on marijuana trafficking cases — a threefold increase from before legalization. ...The sheriff's team has raided eight houses so far this year and has seized more than $3.5 million US of marijuana. During those investigations, they arrested more than 20 cartel members with connections to Cuba and Miami.
...The results of Bolivar's Facebook survey suggested nearly 50 per cent of the respondents were not shopping at the state's licensed dispensaries. Bolivar says most are buying their pot off of friends or sticking to their regular dealers because they trust them. ... Taxes and fees on marijuana have brought in more than $250 million US to the state last year. Bolivar says those additional costs are the biggest driver toward the local black market.
"I really think a lot of it has to do with price," Bolivar says.
The tax rates vary by municipality. In Denver, for example, people buying recreational marijuana pay a tax of 23.15 per cent.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 28, 2018 10:10:54 GMT -5
I'm good with giving it more time.
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moon/Laura
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Post by moon/Laura on May 28, 2018 10:20:08 GMT -5
Then there are some of us who still haven't tried it even though we legally can. Personally, I couldn't care less.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 28, 2018 13:11:58 GMT -5
Marijuana is a tough one because it is super easy to grow. When the flow of tax money was promised, I questioned the estimates of the benefits for this reason. I still think it should be legal.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on May 28, 2018 13:42:01 GMT -5
Marijuana will wind up like cigarettes. Fully legal, and there will always be a percentage of the population toking up, but future generations will look back on it the same way we look back on cigarette smoking. "You mean people willingly baked their brains?" "Well, the science of medium- and long-term effects wasn't firmly established. It seemed pretty harmless. It was the cool thing to do." "Yeah, but you're sucking in smoke, toxins, powerful neurochemical agents, ..." "We didn't know. OK? Let it go." "You weren't at least a bit worried about mem..." "No! Shut up."  Ah well. Every generation has its ether, I guess.  |
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 30, 2018 8:55:17 GMT -5
Marijuana will wind up like cigarettes. Fully legal, and there will always be a percentage of the population toking up, but future generations will look back on it the same way we look back on cigarette smoking. "You mean people willingly baked their brains?" "Well, the science of medium- and long-term effects wasn't firmly established. It seemed pretty harmless. It was the cool thing to do." "Yeah, but you're sucking in smoke, toxins, powerful neurochemical agents, ..." "We didn't know. OK? Let it go." "You weren't at least a bit worried about mem..." "No! Shut up." Ah well. Every generation has its ether, I guess. I wonder what percentage of people smoke. It seems like most of the people advocating use for medical go with edibles. I think MJ fries your brain as much as many prescription medications hurt as much as help. |
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on May 30, 2018 9:12:17 GMT -5
Marijuana can't even be compared to cigarettes or alcohol. The THC in marijuana has medical benefits, especially for people with cancer. Please tell me the medical benefits cigarettes or alcohol have.
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jkapp
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Post by jkapp on May 30, 2018 9:17:20 GMT -5
Marijuana can't even be compared to cigarettes or alcohol. The THC in marijuana has medical benefits, especially for people with cancer. Please tell me the medical benefits cigarettes or alcohol have. Actually the THC in marijuana these days is getting to a dangerous level...it will cause serious medical issues down the road, to be sure, if it hasn't already. |
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on May 30, 2018 9:19:56 GMT -5
Marijuana can't even be compared to cigarettes or alcohol. The THC in marijuana has medical benefits, especially for people with cancer. Please tell me the medical benefits cigarettes or alcohol have. Actually the THC in marijuana these days is getting to a dangerous level...it will cause serious medical issues down the road, to be sure, if it hasn't already. that's likely to do with what's going on in the growing process. And if it's legalized, there will be a standardized growth and care process that can help to control the THC levels. More govt jobs, extra tax revenue, and people can have their weed. Problem solved. |
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on May 30, 2018 9:21:12 GMT -5
Society really doesnt' need more stoned people, so I don't think this helps us as a society. However, if adults wish to partake then that is their choice and there seems to be a groundswell of folks who wish to use this so I think ultimately it will be legal. However, it is going to lead to societal problems just like alcohol does but again, there will be those who can be responsible with it and those who can't. Those who can't will need to be policed.
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jkapp
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Post by jkapp on May 30, 2018 9:26:27 GMT -5
Actually the THC in marijuana these days is getting to a dangerous level...it will cause serious medical issues down the road, to be sure, if it hasn't already. that's likely to do with what's going on in the growing process. And if it's legalized, there will be a standardized growth and care process that can help to control the THC levels. More govt jobs, extra tax revenue, and people can have their weed. Problem solved. Which will just exacerbate the illegal trade...serious stoners will not want to pay premium prices for weak weed. They will go to the black market to get the stronger stuff at a cheaper price. |
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on May 30, 2018 9:48:44 GMT -5
Marijuana can't even be compared to cigarettes or alcohol. The THC in marijuana has medical benefits, especially for people with cancer. Please tell me the medical benefits cigarettes or alcohol have. The battle over legalization (at least here in Canada) concerns marijuana for recreational use. It's been approved for medicinal use for almost a decade. Incidentally, alcohol, consumed in moderation, does have a number of health benefits. Smoking not so much.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on May 30, 2018 10:13:27 GMT -5
Marijuana can't even be compared to cigarettes or alcohol. The THC in marijuana has medical benefits, especially for people with cancer. Please tell me the medical benefits cigarettes or alcohol have. The battle over legalization (at least here in Canada) concerns marijuana for recreational use. It's been approved for medicinal use for almost a decade. Incidentally, alcohol, consumed in moderation, does have a number of health benefits. Smoking not so much.
With all the histrionics over cigarrette smoking, it's quite odd that those same people are so enthusiastic about marijuana smoking. Go figure. |
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retread
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Post by retread on May 30, 2018 12:01:41 GMT -5
I'm good with giving it more time. isn't going to change anything as long as there continues to be a disparity between state laws. If that remains the same, the problem will get worse not better, as time goes on. The DEA has a vested interest in magnifying the problems in Colorado as justification for their own existence. That said, there is a growing problem. (pun intended)
We're less than a century removed from Prohibition and it's astounding how little the general public and our assclown lawmakers learned from that experience. The reality is, drug laws don't work. They only drain our economy through government expenditures and make criminals rich. The slightly lower number of users caused by drugs being illegal is far outweighed by the violent crime as a result of drugs being illegal. It's all about the Benjamins. |
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 30, 2018 12:13:42 GMT -5
I'm good with giving it more time. isn't going to change anything as long as there continues to be a disparity between state laws. If that remains the same, the problem will get worse not better, as time goes on. The DEA has a vested interest in magnifying the problems in Colorado as justification for their own existence. That said, there is a growing problem. (pun intended) ... From link in the OP: Investigators say the illegal trade has flourished because the state laws around growing marijuana were overly generous in the beginning and hard to enforce.
...
More restrictive laws were introduced earlier this year, ... So laws are being fine tuned. Also your "If ..." is one thing that won't necessarily stay the same over time. And that will weaken the DEA.  |
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retread
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Post by retread on May 30, 2018 12:19:52 GMT -5
From your link in the OP: You're obviously confusing me with someone else. I posted no link. |
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 30, 2018 12:39:26 GMT -5
From your link in the OP: You're obviously confusing me with someone else. I posted no link. Sorry about that. Fixed it. |
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on May 30, 2018 12:53:03 GMT -5
that's likely to do with what's going on in the growing process. And if it's legalized, there will be a standardized growth and care process that can help to control the THC levels. More govt jobs, extra tax revenue, and people can have their weed. Problem solved. Which will just exacerbate the illegal trade...serious stoners will not want to pay premium prices for weak weed. They will go to the black market to get the stronger stuff at a cheaper price. How is this different from moonshiners who make unregulated shine and sell it at cheap prices?
People who buy moonshine know it may or may not be adulterated with toxic crap, and know they have no idea of how potent it is. People concerned about quality and potency don't mind going to the liquor store to get a legal brand.
People who want to enjoy legal pot will continue to purchase it through the legal dispensaries, and will get a product that is verifiably clean and at a specific potency, and they are fine with paying a little more for it.
You'll always have a subset of moonshiners and illegal pot growers, but their buyers will be limited by the number of people willing to commit a crime by purchasing their product when they can get a legal version of it for a little more money.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on May 30, 2018 12:56:43 GMT -5
Marijuana can't even be compared to cigarettes or alcohol. The THC in marijuana has medical benefits, especially for people with cancer. Please tell me the medical benefits cigarettes or alcohol have. The battle over legalization (at least here in Canada) concerns marijuana for recreational use. It's been approved for medicinal use for almost a decade. Incidentally, alcohol, consumed in moderation, does have a number of health benefits. Smoking not so much.
Edibles don't have the negative health effects from smoking, and it helps people who have illnesses (or take drugs) that make them lose their appetite. It also is apparently so useful in helping elderly people with aches and pains that there's quite a market for it in places with a lot of retirees.
If I ever get cancer and have to do chemo, I would certainly try a pot brownie to see if it helps.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on May 30, 2018 13:00:24 GMT -5
The big negative for pot was that it was a 'gateway' drug - people who used it always move on to hard drugs. That's been proven to be untrue, plenty of people stick to using pot and never try anything harder.
To me one of the best benefits from legalizing pot is to stop locking up so many people for having small quantities of pot on their person. So many people (disproportionately people of color or poor people who can't afford a decent lawyer) end up with criminal records because they had some pot when they were stopped by police.
Meanwhile, the white suburban kids are the ones most likely to be smoking pot, but they aren't as likely to be stopped and frisked by cops, so they manage to avoid a criminal record. Meanwhile, we have more people in prison than any other 1st world country in the world....
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retread
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Post by retread on May 30, 2018 13:10:30 GMT -5
You're obviously confusing me with someone else. I posted no link. Sorry about that. Fixed it. Great. Now that we have that misconception out of the way, let's address the next. From link in the OP: Investigators say the illegal trade has flourished because the state laws around growing marijuana were overly generous in the beginning and hard to enforce.
...
More restrictive laws were introduced earlier this year, ... So laws are being fine tuned. Also your "If ..." is one thing that won't necessarily stay the same over time. And that will weaken the DEA. The part you truncated in the first part I highlighted in bold is rather important. While that does change the dynamics of this issue to some extent, it doesn't eradicate the underlying problem. And it certainly doesn't 'weaken' the DEA. |
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 30, 2018 14:09:30 GMT -5
The battle over legalization (at least here in Canada) concerns marijuana for recreational use. It's been approved for medicinal use for almost a decade. Incidentally, alcohol, consumed in moderation, does have a number of health benefits. Smoking not so much.
Edibles don't have the negative health effects from smoking, and it helps people who have illnesses (or take drugs) that make them lose their appetite. It also is apparently so useful in helping elderly people with aches and pains that there's quite a market for it in places with a lot of retirees.
If I ever get cancer and have to do chemo, I would certainly try a pot brownie to see if it helps.
I'd go with the Rice Crispie treat myself. I've considered it for my chronic tension headaches, but am too worried about the effects on clinical depression. |
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on May 30, 2018 14:31:19 GMT -5
Edibles don't have the negative health effects from smoking, and it helps people who have illnesses (or take drugs) that make them lose their appetite. It also is apparently so useful in helping elderly people with aches and pains that there's quite a market for it in places with a lot of retirees.
If I ever get cancer and have to do chemo, I would certainly try a pot brownie to see if it helps.
I'd go with the Rice Crispie treat myself. I've considered it for my chronic tension headaches, but am too worried about the effects on clinical depression. Are your headaches migraines? They just released a new drug that might help prevent those. DH is checking it out, he has migraines a lot.
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