Question about my husband's estate or lack there

[mtshastawriter]

I live in CA and my husband passed away earlier this month. I know that I have to notify SS (already did) and Medicaid. But, in our community property state, with our bank account and house held in joint with right of survivorship, do I have to do anything legal? In other words, he doesn't really have an "estate" and we are exempted from Medicaid coming after us for medical bills because we have minor children.

I hope this question makes sense. He didn't have a will, and I am still living, so do I have to file anything with the probate court or any of that if we have no debts/assets?

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

I have no idea but wanted to say I'm sorry.

[woodwand]

I'm sorry for your loss. I lost my husband three years ago & we also had our bank accounts, home & car in both of our names with right of survivorship. The only things that were in his name only were a few stocks that he had before we were married. Here in AZ, an estate worth less than $50,000 doesn't have to be probated, so I didn't have to deal with that.

Especially since you have minor children, you need to get a will done ASAP.

ETA: When my husband died, I called the county clerks office to find out what I needed to do. She told me I had to come in, give them $250 along with his death certificate and file probate papers. I almost did that before I did some investigating online and found out about the under $50,000 limitation for having to file. That was close!

[mtshastawriter]

Woodwand, that's my fear about asking the question here locally. I really don't want to end up doing anything expensive that I don't have to...

Since my DH has been ill for a very long time, I asked the question when we went through escrow on our home, when we set-up our bank account, etc.... about how to hold things in both names with the least amount of BS if something happened to one of us along the way.

I haven't notified the bank, because I am in fear that they might freeze my account or something...

[Gardening Grandma]

do I have to do anything legal?

OP, I am also sorry for your loss. I would think that at some point, you'd want to have the title to your home in your name only. I don't know what is involved, but if you were to take the death certificate down to the county office, I would think that for a filing fee, you could have that done.

When my late FIL passed, MIL waited a year or two - there wasn't a hurry because she had no plans to sell. But when she went into an adult family home, it made it easier on her sons because only her name was on the title and they had P of A.

[busymom]

shasta, check out if your credit cards were under your name or DH's. My Mom was a cosigner on all my Dad's cards, but when he died, because he was primary on the account, ALL of the credit card accounts were closed. My Mom ended up with no credit card to use.

[busymom]

P.S. So sorry about your loss of DH. It sounds like you've had a lot of work to do since then.

[mtshastawriter]

Thankfully, we don't have any credit cards.

[tskeeter]

shasta, sorry to hear about your loss.

In your position, I would consult with an attorney who knows CA estate law. Given how aggressive CA is about raising tax revenue, it is possible that your husband has an estate, and that it is large enough to require it to be probated.

Since estate and real estate law vary greatly from state to state, your husband's estate could own half of your house as well as any other real and personal property you have. That could push his estate into the probate required arena. Based on what I found on an LA Superior Court web site, it looks like estates larger than $100K are subject to probate in CA.

Also, some states have some funny reporting deadlines. You don't necessarily have 12 months or until the end of the calendar year. In dealing with my Mom's estate, we found that Oregon requires some reporting within 9 months of death. An estate attorney can help keep you from missing key deadlines.

Regardless of probate, tax, and other requirements, it is advisable to get all assets, bank accounts, credit cards, car titles, etc. changed to your name only. This will reduce the risk of identity theft associated with any credit cards and bank accounts. It will also simplify future transfers of the title of assets if a deceased party is not shown as a title holder. Imagine the complications if something should happen to you in 20 years and when your kids go to settle your estate, they find your husband is still an owner of record on the house. Cleaning that up so long after his death will likely be a time consuming and possibly expensive task that would be much easier to do today, while all of the records are readily accessible.

[oreo]

I'm so sorry for your loss as well.

I would go to your local bank where you don't have a lot invested and ask them what you need to do maybe. I always thought that anything you both had your name on, you wouldn't need to do anything (other than maybe remove his name at some point) because of the right to survivor ship but I'm not an expert. You could pay an attorney but I think you could probably get the answer for less money. If you are afraid they'll freeze an account (I don't know why they would though but I'd also be concerned just because I'm a little paranoid) you should consider taking some money out so you have a reserve.

[april47]

We didn't have a house or enough to bother with so I never filed with probate when my husband died. He had been retired for years and I was the breadwinner. Most cards were in my name and the car was in my name. The bank wanted to see his death certificate to take him off the checking account. What was funny was our Sears account we had for over 20 years was in his name since we got it before I worked and he had a job. They sent me a letter a few months later with condolences amd cancelling the account without me notifying them. I had been paying it and it was in good standing but they offered me to pay it off at 1/2. It was only a few hundred so I did. Be forwarned, he got mail for a year including a jury summons.

[mtshastawriter]

Our home is valued on the tax rolls at about 70K I don't think DH's "estate" would equal enough to fall within the limits. I still technically have a mortgage on the property, and our equity is only about 50K of the house.

We have no other debt, assets, accounts, etc... except our checking account. Since DH needed Medicaid coverage, we have been living very lean, for a very long time... According to the letter that I got from Medicaid, they will not come after me to pay medical bills because we have minor children and DH was under 55 years of age at his death, and because he died in a hospital not a nursing home.

I don't have the money to go see an attorney. I think I may try the free legal clinic offered by our county. I think it's once a month or something and you can ask an attorney for advice.

[sesfw]

I'm so very sorry about the loss of your precious husband. Don't forget to breathe.

Definitely seek legal advice. If there is a legal aide society close, call them. Also talk to social services at a local hospital, maybe they can direct you. Also call a family attorney and find out the charges for an hours worth of legal advice. I know around here (AZ) we needed some advice and it cost $250 for an hour. But that was a couple of years ago.

Good luck in your search.

Healing hugs to you and yours.

[Pants]

mtshasta--I know you don't want to go to a lawyer, so google "probate limits in California"
There are two definite exceptions to probate in CA:
1) If the estate is less than $100k
2) If the title to all property was jointly held with a surviving spouse with rights of survivorship. Apparently then you can just file a "spousal petition":
www.ca-trusts.com/spousalproperty.html

Here's where I found the info on probate:
www.methvenlaw.com/Practice-Areas/Estate-Planning-and-Probate/California-Probat-Information-and-Laws.html

Please note: I am not a lawyer, and this isn't meant to be legal advice. I think the legal aid clinic would be a good idea, just make an inventory of your & DH's assets before you go to make sure you can go as quick as possible. Ask about a spousal petition rather than full probate.

Best of luck!

[973beachbum]

CA appears to be big on self help legal advice which is kind of scary to me but they also have this website to contact for legal aid. I gave you both just in case.

www.lasuperiorcourt.org/probate/selfhelp.htm

www.courts.ca.gov/selfhelp/1082.htm

"Lawyer-referral services
Lawyer referral services help people find lawyers. They can tell you about free or low-cost legal services in your area for people who qualify. If you do not qualify for free help, they can give you other information to help you find legal help that does not cost you a lot of money. For example, they keep lists of lawyers who will meet with you once to discuss your case. They will not charge you very much -- usually $20 to $45. Sometimes, this initial consultation is all you need to get started on your own. The lawyer will also explain the services he or she can offer you and how much you can expect to pay. Some lawyers have lower fees for people who do not have very much money. Some lawyers will help you with key parts of your case and let you do the rest (called "limited-scope representation" or "unbundling").

Click to find a lawyer referral service in your area.
To learn more about limited-scope representation or unbundling."



I am so sorry for your loss.

[tskeeter]

Shasta, there are a few ways to get some legal advice. The first is, as you suggested, legal aid. The second would be to contact the county bar association. I have had good luck getting referrals from them when I needed some quick, special advice about 10 years ago. I think my phone consultation cost $35. Another way would be to simply ask an estate attorney if they would do a pro-bono consultation with you. Many attorneys provide free services to low income individuals as a community service activity through the bar association or on their own. I have a friend who did this when she needed legal advice while buying a house on a shoestring. She just asked.

[thyme4change]

I think if you are reasonably intelligent and everything has your name on it in one way or another, and there aren't a lot of dollars concerned, you should be able to figure this out without paying a lawyer.

Make a list of all your accounts, call those banks and ask.
Call your county recorder and ask about joint real property.
You already said your parents hold your mortgage, so no problem there.
Google stuff.

I've watched plenty of intelligent people settle more complex estates without issue and without legal intervention.

[thyme4change]

Also - I would be really careful with advice from legal aid. Lawyers are usually specialists. I wouldn't be surprised if the legal aid guy doesn't know a whole lot about probate. (S)he probably deals with family issues or employment law. Estate and probate is a totally different ball of wax. If you feel compelled to talk to legal aid - do a bunch of research before hand, and listen to their suggestion and then do a bunch of research afterwards. Make sure that it all sounds right. Don't just blindly follow their advice - as sometimes lawyers aren't exactly correct.

[woodwand]

Excellent advice, thyme.

You can do this yourself, mtshasta. Google is your friend. My bank, USAA, has a department that helps survivors & they were wonderful. I couldn't just have his name removed from the bank & credit card accounts, I had to close the existing accounts & open new ones in my name only. You're doing fine. You may want to go to the free clinic just to ease your mind. It's easy to get overwhelmed during this time.