Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 25, 2018 12:43:43 GMT -5
It is going well. 29 responses so far. I just checked. Yeah but.....are you counting the ones who respond just to say they aren't going to respond?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 25, 2018 12:44:18 GMT -5
You've long accused me of having a "spreadsheet", but it suffices to have a reliable memory for past conversations and the "Search" button on the menu. Tennesseer also has considerable competency in this regard. He tends to remember past conversations in some detail, he avails himself of the tools we all have access to, and he confronts members about (what he perceives to be) hypocrisy or inconsistency. Strangely, I've never seen anyone accuse him of having a spreadsheet. Almost as though you appreciate his taking conservatives to task on their double-mindedness. Or it might be he does it differently than you. I bookmark the worst of the worst.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jan 25, 2018 12:44:19 GMT -5
your judgment of "a flagrant foul" is in error.
Not really, regardless of your weak justification. It was a cheap shot especially coming from a mod. And in hoop's parlance a cheap shot is a flagrant foul.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 25, 2018 13:02:09 GMT -5
I predict bimodal distributions requiring nonparametic modeling. I don't know what that means, but I think it basically says the survey is a pile of shit. It means the responses are going to be extremely polarized (as opposed to normally-distributed about a central value).
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 25, 2018 13:02:41 GMT -5
It is going well. 29 responses so far. I just checked. Yeah but.....are you counting the ones who respond just to say they aren't going to respond? We have 129 responses if we count those.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 25, 2018 13:05:08 GMT -5
I don't know what that means, but I think it basically says the survey is a pile of shit. It means the responses are going to be extremely polarized (as opposed to normally-distributed about a central value). which means they are not going to be what they would be in a random sample. I still don't see the point of the survey other than for you to get all excited about parsing and compiling data about the posters.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 25, 2018 13:11:22 GMT -5
Yeah but.....are you counting the ones who respond just to say they aren't going to respond? We have 129 responses if we count those. LOL!! Add the conspiracy theories and you are upwards to about 150.
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Jan 25, 2018 14:01:58 GMT -5
I predict bimodal distributions requiring nonparametic modeling. I don't know what that means, but I think it basically says the survey is a pile of shit. Not exactly, but I was suggesting that the two groups would answer very differently. However, I agree that the questions as presented here are poorly constructed.
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jan 25, 2018 14:32:34 GMT -5
I think the quirk is in the rating scale. I cannot "agree" or "disagree" on any level with the statement: "I believe the investigation will turn up conclusive evidence of wrongdoing on the part of Pres. Trump, serious enough to warrant impeachment."
I make absolutely no presumptions about what the investigation--be it Mueller's, Starr's, or the local DA's--will turn up. Making such an assumption indicates that I can only seek out information in a way to feed a pre-determined opinion whereas I "seek first to understand". I've found in my maturing process that if I assume and am not open to differing opinions then I don't have an educated, informed opinion.
Therefore --assuming the statement remains the same-- I think the scale should not be linear. There are options of "I (strongly) don't believe that statement is valid." "I (strongly believe that statement is valid." "I cannot judge that statement because I'm not making assumptions until the results of the investigation are publicly released.
1. This is the same grievance Optimist has expressed. Unfortunately, there are limitations on the survey technology.
As I said to Optimist, adding a follow-up question to each primary question, asking respondents to rate their confidence in their primary response, would cause prohibitive bloating in the survey.
Reducing the question to three options is (IMO) unfeasible since the majority of respondents may not strongly believe either pro or con, and their responses should be able to reflect a spectrum of relative certainties. Furthermore, the options proposed above wouldn't address differing levels of confidence in mid-spectrum votes.
Finally, this survey tech doesn't allow the designer to explicitly attach "opt out" or "I don't know" checkboxes to scale-rated questions. The best I can do is make questions optional.
The other option would be re-working the initial question. Which of the following statements is closest to your current beliefs about the investigation: (A) I strongly believe the investigation will prove that there was collusion between Trump, his campaign, and Russia.
(B) I believe the investigation will prove that there was collusion between Trump, his campaign, and Russia.
(C) I am not even following the investigation.
(D) I know about the investigation and while I am anti-Trump, I trust Mueller will run an unbiased investigation and will respect his finding. (E) I know about the investigation and while I am pro-Trump, I trust Mueller will run an unbiased investigation and will respect his finding.
(F) I don't care about the results of the investigation, I know Trump did it.
(G) I don't care about the results of the investigation, I know Trump didn't do it. (H) I strongly believe the investigation will prove that there was no collusion between Trump, his campaign, and Russia.
(I) I believe the investigation will prove that there was no collusion between Trump, his campaign, and Russia.
(J) What investigation? Why aren't we talking about snow leopards?2. It's an interesting alternative, although I'd be worried about the criticisms:
- (C) and (J) are too similar
- (D) and (E) heavily overlap with other responses; for example, it's possible for either statement to be completely true at the same time as (A), (B), (H) or (I); respondents might have a difficult time determining which of two true statement is truer
- there are no options that express distrust (i.e. the expectation of bias) in the Mueller investigation, and several members have expressed having this viewpoint in the past
- "collusion" is ill-defined (i.e. nebulous, too general a charge) and can realistically refer to charges that have no meaningful impact and/or are directed at people nobody cares about
- (F) and (G) heavily overlap with other responses (in particular, (A), (B), (C), (H) and (I))
In any case, I can't change the format now. I do appreciate the feedback and suggestion, however. Live and learn.0 Would I answer if the questions/answers allowed for un-boxed in choices. It's a higher possibility for me. If you changed nothing except for the choice to skip questions, yes I probably would. Keep in mind, I didn't read the survey past the first page.
3. I shall do so now.
Responses inline and numbered. Can we vote "Present" or would that be interpreted as either zero, five, or ten depending on the question?
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 25, 2018 16:35:32 GMT -5
You've long accused me of having a "spreadsheet", but it suffices to have a reliable memory for past conversations and the "Search" button on the menu. Tennesseer also has considerable competency in this regard. He tends to remember past conversations in some detail, he avails himself of the tools we all have access to, and he confronts members about (what he perceives to be) hypocrisy or inconsistency. Strangely, I've never seen anyone accuse him of having a spreadsheet. Almost as though you appreciate his taking conservatives to task on their double-mindedness. *Post removed because post quoted has been removed. - mmhmm Run a search for "Posts by Weltz; limit to last 30 days" (1 minute) Search turns up 75 results. Skim posts, keeping mental tally of which posts talk about religion. Of these, keep tally of how many are derogatory. (8 minutes) Compute percentages. (30 seconds) Write post presenting data from 30-day sample; state conclusions. (5 minutes) Witness hysterics, "How dare you prove me wrong!", accusations of obsession, mental instability, etc. (ongoing)
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 25, 2018 17:04:59 GMT -5
Posts opining on a person's mental stability are not allowed so I'm certain you are wrong about that. Unless things have changed since I've been on hiatus.
(hopehopehope)
PS: I'm just here to respond that I'm not going to respond, say that I'm afraid you'll use the results to blackball me from the world and spit a little.
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Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Jan 25, 2018 17:09:05 GMT -5
And that's exactly why they shouldn't do this survey. Not true. Members who don't supply identifying info or who supply it but opt out of labeling have my public guarantee I won't bring up their responses and/or use them as a basis to critique their positions in future. Yes it is true, leave the peeps of YMAM outta your head. Stop bullying them online, cause I know you're better than that.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 25, 2018 19:28:47 GMT -5
Posts opining on a person's mental stability are not allowed so I'm certain you are wrong about that. Unless things have changed since I've been on hiatus.
(hopehopehope)
PS: I'm just here to respond that I'm not going to respond, say that I'm afraid you'll use the results to blackball me from the world and spit a little. Submit your responses with boldness, citizen! (See below.) Not true. Members who don't supply identifying info or who supply it but opt out of labeling have my public guarantee I won't bring up their responses and/or use them as a basis to critique their positions in future. Yes it is true, leave the peeps of YMAM outta your head. Stop bullying them online, cause I know you're better than that. Critiquing members' positions is not bullying. Confronting hypocrisy and double standards, even if only the reasonable perception of these things, is not bullying. If our society was half as concerned about people expressing myopic, goal-seeking opinions as it is about not hurting those poor people's feelings by not flushing their statements down the memory hole, our governments wouldn't be stacked to the rafters with sleazeball politicians whose sole competencies are talking in circles and telling anyone and everyone exactly what they want to hear. I've said that these survey results are off-limits to members who opt out, and I'll hold to this. But if there was any justice in the world, anyone who dared express a political opinion would do so with fearful concern over whether it was consistent with every other opinion they'd expressed, and if not, whether their rationale could withstand scrutiny.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 25, 2018 19:37:08 GMT -5
I was just kidding. I fully intend to participate in your survey. Do what you will with me!
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jan 25, 2018 19:40:22 GMT -5
Kind of a waste to tell Virgil that. He's married.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 25, 2018 20:03:13 GMT -5
Kind of a waste to tell Virgil that. He's married. Two engineers are talking. The first recounts, "The other day a gorgeous young woman rode up to me on a bicycle. She stripped naked, threw up her arms, and cried, 'Take from me what you will!'" "Wow!" Says the second. "What did you do?" "I took her bike. It's in great condition." The second engineer considers this for a moment and then nods. "Good choice. Her clothes probably wouldn't have fit you anyway."
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 25, 2018 20:19:04 GMT -5
What would a male engineer want with a woman's bicycle? Aren't they missing a necessary bar?
Assuming, of course, that your engineers are both male.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jan 25, 2018 20:42:46 GMT -5
What would a male engineer want with a woman's bicycle? Aren't they missing a necessary bar?
Assuming, of course, that your engineers are both male. many bikes lack the top bar these days, including dude's ones.
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ken a.k.a OMK
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They killed Kenny, the bastards.
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Post by ken a.k.a OMK on Jan 25, 2018 20:51:03 GMT -5
What would a male engineer want with a woman's bicycle? Aren't they missing a necessary bar?
Assuming, of course, that your engineers are both male. That's the riddle.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 25, 2018 20:53:11 GMT -5
I hope not, ken! I don't have a punch line handy!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2018 21:47:15 GMT -5
I took the survey, but I don't appreciate that a Moderator feels it appropriate to do anything specifically to fulfill a need to "bug" a certain member... (from the final page of the survey: " virgil thanks you your responses will be used to make cool charts and tables also, to bug richard " ) ... and yes, it would still bother me even if his BS intention was to "bug" someone else. ETA: Virgil should be "Cosby'd" just like I was and thrown out of the Moderators group for this, as it shows intent to have bias against members (well... one at least). Just the one question. But who knows? Maybe the results will confirm your view of things and I'll wind up with egg on my face. LOL... even if everyone else believed in reality (not something that I expect, by the way), you'd still turn it around and re-word it so it says what you want it to say anyway... so you'd take those eggs and make a sandwich... and then eat it.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 25, 2018 22:02:18 GMT -5
Just the one question. But who knows? Maybe the results will confirm your view of things and I'll wind up with egg on my face. LOL... even if everyone else believed in reality (not something that I expect, by the way), you'd still turn it around and re-word it so it says what you want it to say anyway... so you'd take those eggs and make a sandwich... and then eat it. I guess that's the bottom line, isn't it?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2018 22:04:35 GMT -5
What would a male engineer want with a woman's bicycle? Aren't they missing a necessary bar?
Assuming, of course, that your engineers are both male. It could be a gift for a female acquaintance... And, from an engineering standpoint, the "top/horizontal" bar is no more necessary on a "male" bike than a properly designed "female" bike. Plus... she could have been riding a men's bicycle in the first place...
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 25, 2018 22:08:35 GMT -5
What would a male engineer want with a woman's bicycle? Aren't they missing a necessary bar?
Assuming, of course, that your engineers are both male. Is there such thing as a "woman's bicycle" (as opposed to a "girl's bicycle")? My wife got rid of her last bike when we moved to Toronto. I realize the seats are (sometimes, not always) designed differently, for obvious reasons. But I've also never seen an adult bike where the seat wasn't easily interchangeable. We might as well discuss it so that the thread stays in the MRT list for at least another day. Not that differences between men's and women's bicycles doesn't fascinate me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2018 22:17:44 GMT -5
Women's/girl's bicycles were designed without an upper bar so that a woman could ride one while wearing a medium length dress or skirt. The secondary (upper) bar is to prevent (or at least greatly reduce) torsional flexing of the single bottom bar. Any two bars in any location can accomplish this goal.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jan 25, 2018 22:41:35 GMT -5
Religion is bullshit.
100% of my posts today disparage religion.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2018 23:58:23 GMT -5
Religion is bullshit. 100% of my posts today disparage religion. While I did like the post... I believe that that's an insult to bullshit.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 26, 2018 8:47:38 GMT -5
Religion is bullshit. 100% of my posts today disparage religion. The same poster who says "Religion is bullshit." (in all earnestness, no doubt) is the one who first worries aloud that I might use her survey responses to critique her express opinions in future. I guess if you go around beating stray dogs all day, you're awfully cautious when somebody asks you to pet one.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 26, 2018 8:59:07 GMT -5
You mean if they choose a different bandwagon next week to jump on after jumping off the one they are on today, you might call them on it? How rude!
My bike has no bar. The bar never made sense to me. No matter if you are male or female, it will hurt if you hit that bar.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jan 26, 2018 9:52:17 GMT -5
You mean if they choose a different bandwagon next week to jump on after jumping off the one they are on today, you might call them on it? How rude! It apparently isn't rude when Tenn does it. He puts the whammy on Paul et al. with all the tenderness of a gorilla suplexing the Queen Mum, 'likes' and lulz showering down from the rafters, but since members' approval couldn't possibly reflect their delight in watching Paul flattened like a pancake, there must be some other factor I'm missing. I'm going to have to ask Tenn what the real secret is to confronting hypocrisy un-rude-ly. Six months from now Pres. Trump will say something like "Islam is BS." and I tell you now it will be the cohort who gave "Religion is BS." a big, fat thumbs up today screaming loudest and crying the biggest crocodile tears when Trump does the same thing tomorrow. If you dare not flush today down the memory hole and you confront them, you're in for some wailing and gashing of teeth, let me tell you.
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