How About This For A Getaway Home!

[OldCoyote]

newatlas.com/cliff-haven-utah-auction/47172/?utm_source=Gizmag+Subscribers&utm_campaign=e360cedf93-UA-2235360-4&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_65b67362bd-e360cedf93-90390782 

Look nice to me.

[1Day@aTime]

Looks like heaven to me

[sesfw]

WOW

[Bonny]

Jan 6, 2017 8:53:33 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

newatlas.com/cliff-haven-utah-auction/47172/?utm_source=Gizmag+Subscribers&utm_campaign=e360cedf93-UA-2235360-4&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_65b67362bd-e360cedf93-90390782 

Look nice to me.You'd think there would be something like that up the road in Sedona. But it's probably so nice they won't put in vacation rental service. The guvmint might plant bugs!

[OldCoyote]

It said up for closed auction, I think it may be on the reservation,

Indian only??

[OldCoyote]

Sedona would be nice though.

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

But if it's post-apocalyptic, I'm hoping to not be here.

[OldCoyote]

It is on the Navajo Nation.

[dannylion]

Snakes. There are probably snakes. Big snakes with nasty pointed teeth.   

[Bonny]

Jan 7, 2017 15:33:47 GMT -5 dannylion said:

Snakes. There are probably snakes. Big snakes with nasty pointed teeth.   

Lol, I'd much rather deal with snakes than some of the people I might meet out there!

O-T have you ever handled a snake? They are kind of cool. Never did until we moved to AZ and one of my ranger buddies showed me how. I never realized how important they were to the eco system. If not for them and the owls AZ would be over-run by pack rats!

And no I won't handle rattlers. I'm not totally crazy!

[resolution]

If it is on a land lease from the tribe, make sure that the lease will expire at some point after your lifespan, because the tribes in AZ have been known to refuse to extend leases and take over ownership of any buildings left on the land.

[dannylion]

Jan 7, 2017 20:31:32 GMT -5 Bonny said:

Jan 7, 2017 15:33:47 GMT -5 dannylion said:

Snakes. There are probably snakes. Big snakes with nasty pointed teeth.   

Lol, I'd much rather deal with snakes than some of the people I might meet out there!

O-T have you ever handled a snake? They are kind of cool. Never did until we moved to AZ and one of my ranger buddies showed me how. I never realized how important they were to the eco system. If not for them and the owls AZ would be over-run by pack rats!

And no I won't handle rattlers. I'm not totally crazy!

Oh, I know snakes are important. I have trained myself to react calmly and in a friendly manner to the black snakes and rat snakes that occasionally visit my yard (and garage) and keep the neighborhood from being knee-deep in rats and mice, also the various garden snakes that deal with the slugs and other undesirable crawly things. I just thought that location looked like prime rattlesnake territory. I draw the line at making friends with rattlesnakes. I am happy to leave them in exclusive possession of their natural environment.  Also, the construction of the dwelling inside that cave clearly created many nooks, crannies, corners, and whatnot ideal for the concealment of scary snakes with big pointy teeth.  To my eye, the whole mise en scene was shrieking "Run Away! Run Away!"   

You do make a good point about the potential neighbors. 

[resolution]

Here is an old article about what happened to people who had land leases around Lake Hawley. www.nytimes.com/1984/06/12/us/apaches-end-leases-and-a-resort-is-fading.html

I once spent a weekend camping and fishing up at that lake, and noticed that about half the cabins in the area had been burnt to the ground. My friends that were renting the cabin with me told me that many of the homeowners destroyed their homes rather than turn them over to the tribe. I felt terrible that I had paid the rental fee for the cabin without even knowing that it had been confiscated from it's original owner by the tribe, and I never returned to that lake.

[Bonny]

Jan 7, 2017 21:16:42 GMT -5 resolution said:

Here is an old article about what happened to people who had land leases around Lake Hawley. www.nytimes.com/1984/06/12/us/apaches-end-leases-and-a-resort-is-fading.html

I once spent a weekend camping and fishing up at that lake, and noticed that about half the cabins in the area had been burnt to the ground. My friends that were renting the cabin with me told me that many of the homeowners destroyed their homes rather than turn them over to the tribe. I felt terrible that I had paid the rental fee for the cabin without even knowing that it had been confiscated from it's original owner by the tribe, and I never returned to that lake.

Confiscated is a little harsh. From the article these were long term ground leases that the Tribe chose not to renew; that's their right.

I worked with ground leases for years; first for Southern Pacific and subsequently with our local Transit District. The Railroad also had cabins on their properties up in the CA Gold Country. No one is happy to lose "the family" cabin. And while that's understandable I'm always a little surprised that people seem to ignore the fact that they had a great deal for a long time but that ultimately they didn't own the underlying realty. They could have bought a cabin on land that they owned but most of them couldn't or wouldn't pay the extra money. So it's the Tribe's/Railroad's or whatever entity's "fault".

[resolution]

I don't know what any of them were thinking to build such expensive homes on leased land, but I don't want to benefit the tribe for taking them. I just thought I would mention buyer beware for this survivalist home for sale, because it would be foolish to buy a home on leased land.

[OldCoyote]

I maybe wrong, I believe if you are a member of the Navajo nation, you can own land there, No one else.

This is in Utah!

[Bonny]

Jan 7, 2017 23:09:01 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

I maybe wrong, I believe if you are a member of the Navajo nation, you can own land there, No one else.

This is in Utah!

It depends. There are at least two types of ownership of Native American property. There is tribal-owned which is effectively like a land-lease for life. Property is leased via Tribal elder decisions. Other property is allotee-owned. This is where there were land grants to individual people and those can only be deeded to decedents. One of the challenges of building the east side of 101 through the Scottsdale area was that some of those parcels had to have the agreement of 100 decedents! And the government can not use the power of eminent domain because those Tribal lands are considered a Sovereign Nation. Doing a government "taking" would be tantamount to declaring war, lol!

[Bonny]

Jan 7, 2017 23:03:00 GMT -5 resolution said:

I don't know what any of them were thinking to build such expensive homes on leased land, but I don't want to benefit the tribe for taking them. I just thought I would mention buyer beware for this survivalist home for sale, because it would be foolish to buy a home on leased land.

A lot of land in Hawaii is also on leased land.

Somehow people work it out.

[OldCoyote]

Jan 8, 2017 10:14:00 GMT -5 Bonny said:

Jan 7, 2017 23:09:01 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

I maybe wrong, I believe if you are a member of the Navajo nation, you can own land there, No one else.

This is in Utah!

It depends. There are at least two types of ownership of Native American property. There is tribal-owned which is effectively like a land-lease for life. Property is leased via Tribal elder decisions. Other property is allotee-owned. This is where there were land grants to individual people and those can only be deeded to decedents. One of the challenges of building the east side of 101 through the Scottsdale area was that some of those parcels had to have the agreement of 100 decedents! And the government can not use the power of eminent domain because those Tribal lands are considered a Sovereign Nation. Doing a government "taking" would be tantamount to declaring war, lol!

Look at the economic increase for that Nation after the 101 was built!

[Bonny]

Jan 10, 2017 8:02:15 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Jan 8, 2017 10:14:00 GMT -5 Bonny said:

It depends. There are at least two types of ownership of Native American property. There is tribal-owned which is effectively like a land-lease for life. Property is leased via Tribal elder decisions. Other property is allotee-owned. This is where there were land grants to individual people and those can only be deeded to decedents. One of the challenges of building the east side of 101 through the Scottsdale area was that some of those parcels had to have the agreement of 100 decedents! And the government can not use the power of eminent domain because those Tribal lands are considered a Sovereign Nation. Doing a government "taking" would be tantamount to declaring war, lol!

Look at the economic increase for that Nation after the 101 was built!

Lol, and I thought it was the casino!

All kidding aside, you're right. The 101 provided access to their other lands on the West side which allowed for commercial development. Those are very long term ground leases; I think they are for 99 years with various opportunities for rent increases. (This is the kind of work I was involved in working for the Transit District).

The Tribe takes a long-term view looking out for the generations to come. Very different perspective than for most of us looking for the highest return at the moment.