djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Mar 20, 2016 12:47:21 GMT -5
The GOP establishment continues to eat itself from within, as officials scramble to make sense of it all. You might call it an identity crisis of sorts. Longtime Republicans are now questioning the party’s broader strategy. Here’s Bret Stephens, a conservative columnist for the Wall Street Journal: Quote: “Liberals may have been fond of claiming that Republicans were all closet bigots and that tax cuts were a form of racial prejudice, but the accusation rang hollow because the evidence for it was so tendentious. Not anymore. The candidacy of Donald Trump is the open sewer of American conservatism…It would be terrible to think that the left was right about the right all these years.” www.salon.com/2016/03/17/the_rights_shocking_admission_stunned_by_trumps_dominance_some_gop_pundits_concede_that_dems_have_been_right_about_republicans_all_along/comments? i think Stephens is spot on. and THIS is why i want Trump to fail.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Mar 20, 2016 15:26:18 GMT -5
"open sewer of American conservatism"..... wow!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2016 15:51:28 GMT -5
Terrible indeed, but no less true. Here’s a similar Tweet by Max Boot, a neoconservative hawk and prominent Republican intellectual: “I’m a lifelong Republican but Trump surge proves that every bad Democrats have ever said about GOP is basically true.” Welcome to the club, Max. Happy to have you.
Republicans are not neoconservative. No one abandoned that. The Republican party abandoned small government ideas. The Republican party used to stop wars not start wars. F(*& the Republican party. It deserves to die. Tallking values isnt enough, you have to live them. The GOP gave up on even talking many values and embraced cronyism and war.
Not that the Democrats are any better.
I would take Trump breaking things over more of Bush / Cheney breaking things.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Mar 20, 2016 17:41:39 GMT -5
Repos use to "stop wars". Sure they did.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 20, 2016 17:43:48 GMT -5
Terrible indeed, but no less true. Here’s a similar Tweet by Max Boot, a neoconservative hawk and prominent Republican intellectual: “I’m a lifelong Republican but Trump surge proves that every bad Democrats have ever said about GOP is basically true.” Welcome to the club, Max. Happy to have you.Republicans are not neoconservative. No one abandoned that. The Republican party abandoned small government ideas. The Republican party used to stop wars not start wars. F(*& the Republican party. It deserves to die. Tallking values isnt enough, you have to live them. The GOP gave up on even talking many values and embraced cronyism and war. Not that the Democrats are any better. I would take Trump breaking things over more of Bush / Cheney breaking things. As Trump has never held public office at local let alone national, level, you/we really have no idea what Trump is capable of doing. I am in no way backing up Bush/Chaney, but Trump really is an unknown entity when it comes to nationaland international policy implementation.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2016 17:48:19 GMT -5
Nixon and Vietnam. Eisenhower and Korea. Reagan and Bush 1 had short wars that they both started and ended.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2016 17:49:32 GMT -5
Terrible indeed, but no less true. Here’s a similar Tweet by Max Boot, a neoconservative hawk and prominent Republican intellectual: “I’m a lifelong Republican but Trump surge proves that every bad Democrats have ever said about GOP is basically true.” Welcome to the club, Max. Happy to have you.Republicans are not neoconservative. No one abandoned that. The Republican party abandoned small government ideas. The Republican party used to stop wars not start wars. F(*& the Republican party. It deserves to die. Tallking values isnt enough, you have to live them. The GOP gave up on even talking many values and embraced cronyism and war. Not that the Democrats are any better. I would take Trump breaking things over more of Bush / Cheney breaking things. As Trump has never held public office at local let alone national, level, you/we really have no idea what Trump is capable of doing. I am in no way backing up Bush/Chaney, but Trump really is an unknown entity when it comes to nationaland international policy implementation. Bush Cheney are known. They both should stand trial for war crimes.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 20, 2016 17:54:28 GMT -5
As Trump has never held public office at local let alone national, level, you/we really have no idea what Trump is capable of doing. I am in no way backing up Bush/Chaney, but Trump really is an unknown entity when it comes to nationaland international policy implementation. Bush Cheney are known. They both should stand trial for war crimes. Maybe they should be tried for war crimes. For those that wish them tried should persue it. But we have no idea what Trump, if he were elected, is capable of. Hopefully, we won't have to worry about him being elected. Ever.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Mar 20, 2016 17:59:46 GMT -5
Nixon and Vietnam. Eisenhower and Korea. Reagan and Bush 1 had short wars that they both started and ended.
Especially chuckling over your third sentence. And Nixxon sure had a funny way of stopping 'Nam.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2016 18:00:23 GMT -5
Bush Cheney are known. They both should stand trial for war crimes. Maybe they should be tried for war crimes. For those that wish them tried should persue it. But we have no idea what Trump, if he were elected, is capable of. Hopefully, we won't have to worry about him being elected. Ever. We know what Clinton is capable of. Has there ever been a war she was against? i think if she is elected there will be more of the same last 16 years. Not that I am for Trump. I think he is a dangerous clown. The only hope I have about him is that he will fail. There are no good choices. Sanders is the closest thing to an anti-war candidate. And he comes with all the big government baggage. I think he is probably the best choice of the 2 parties though, only because of anti-war. There are no good choice, just levels of really bad to really, really bad.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 20, 2016 18:04:45 GMT -5
Maybe they should be tried for war crimes. For those that wish them tried should persue it. But we have no idea what Trump, if he were elected, is capable of. Hopefully, we won't have to worry about him being elected. Ever. We know what Clinton is capable of. Has there ever been a war she was against? i think if she is elected there will be more of the same last 16 years. Not that I am for Trump. I think he is a dangerous clown. The only hope I have about him is that he will fail. There are no good choices. Fail as in fail to be elected or fail as in being president. The former would not harm the country. The latter would.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2016 18:08:09 GMT -5
We know what Clinton is capable of. Has there ever been a war she was against? i think if she is elected there will be more of the same last 16 years. Not that I am for Trump. I think he is a dangerous clown. The only hope I have about him is that he will fail. There are no good choices. Fail as in fail to be elected or fail as in being president. The former would not harm the country. The latter would. I think he would fail as president. I think failure is better then he achieves some/ most of what he says he wants. Whether he fails to be elected, I haven't a clue. I am still a bit stunned that anyone takes him seriously.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Mar 20, 2016 18:44:12 GMT -5
Terrible indeed, but no less true. Here’s a similar Tweet by Max Boot, a neoconservative hawk and prominent Republican intellectual: “I’m a lifelong Republican but Trump surge proves that every bad Democrats have ever said about GOP is basically true.” Welcome to the club, Max. Happy to have you.Republicans are not neoconservative. No one abandoned that. The Republican party abandoned small government ideas. The Republican party used to stop wars not start wars. F(*& the Republican party. It deserves to die. Tallking values isnt enough, you have to live them. The GOP gave up on even talking many values and embraced cronyism and war. Not that the Democrats are any better. I would take Trump breaking things over more of Bush / Cheney breaking things. i mostly agree with you, except for the first sentence. many Republicans ARE neoconservative, unfortunately for the rest of us.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Mar 21, 2016 7:38:04 GMT -5
That's an interesting question. I don't think the majority of republicans are bigots, but I think the GOP party is more attractive to bigots that the Dems are.
However - the comment about tax cuts being a form of racial prejudice might be a little more accurate, although I don't think the GOP has been deliberately using tax law against minorities, but I do think they favor tax laws that benefit the rich at the expense of the poor. I would call it more a fiscal prejudice rather than racial.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 21, 2016 8:42:44 GMT -5
Somewhere along the way the Repo party decided it was more important to cater to and attract the fringe elements to get votes.
I think Trump is the culmination of it all. His rhetoric is dragging out and appealing to the last bits of the fringe in America that didn't feel they had a voice in American politics.
I don't see how the Repo party will recover unless they break themselves up into two parties.
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Mar 21, 2016 9:06:23 GMT -5
Let see here Trump is running along with about 40% Of repo voters.
Hillary while ahead in delegates, did not take in as much money in Feb as Bernie.
I take in account that Bernie Supporters are individuals as compared to Hillary's large corps. and large political action groups.
Which tells me there a lot of people unhappy with the establishment on both sides of the fence.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2016 9:08:59 GMT -5
Honestly, while I like Bernie, the math is hard to beat right now. His hard core supporters are making last ditch efforts right now, Hillary's are saving it for the general.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Mar 21, 2016 9:18:30 GMT -5
Trump missed an amazing opportunity this weekend in Idaho. He asked whether Romney was a Mormon. Really bad form.
What he should have said, or asked, Is Romney a good, true, Republican? All Trump had to say, if Romney put up this good of a fight with President Obama and he would have won the election, but he didn't, and he lost. Now he is attacking me harder than he ever did the President, but I am no President Obama, and he will not take me down either. Plain. Simple. End of the Romney coalition of Republican hierarchy and a new day for the Republican party.
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Mar 21, 2016 10:00:15 GMT -5
Somewhere along the way the Repo party decided it was more important to cater to and attract the fringe elements to get votes. I think Trump is the culmination of it all. His rhetoric is dragging out and appealing to the last bits of the fringe in America that didn't feel they had a voice in American politics. I don't see how the Repo party will recover unless they break themselves up into two parties. I don't think Donald Trump is appealing to the fringes, I think he's appealing to the middle group of people that want to put the old GOP ideas (gay marriage, abortion, tax cuts) to rest and focus on things people think are more pressing like immigration, china, jobs, etc. Marco Rubio was well received back when he came on the scene, but that tea party movement is LONG GONE. Nobody wants to hear him talk about tax cuts and gay marriage and all that. Gay marriage helped get GWB the election in 2004, but that ain't gonna work in 2016 so stop talking about it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2016 10:02:13 GMT -5
None of them are talking about Gay Marriage anymore. The current phrase is Religious Freedom...
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 21, 2016 10:19:21 GMT -5
Somewhere along the way the Repo party decided it was more important to cater to and attract the fringe elements to get votes. I think Trump is the culmination of it all. His rhetoric is dragging out and appealing to the last bits of the fringe in America that didn't feel they had a voice in American politics. I don't see how the Repo party will recover unless they break themselves up into two parties. I don't think Donald Trump is appealing to the fringes, I think he's appealing to the middle group of people that want to put the old GOP ideas (gay marriage, abortion, tax cuts) to rest and focus on things people think are more pressing like immigration, china, jobs, etc. Marco Rubio was well received back when he came on the scene, but that tea party movement is LONG GONE. Nobody wants to hear him talk about tax cuts and gay marriage and all that. Gay marriage helped get GWB the election in 2004, but that ain't gonna work in 2016 so stop talking about it. When did white supremacists become the "middle group"? Former KKK Grand Dragon Explains Why Racists Like Trump
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 21, 2016 10:46:29 GMT -5
I don't think Donald Trump is appealing to the fringes, I think he's appealing to the middle group of people that want to put the old GOP ideas (gay marriage, abortion, tax cuts) to rest and focus on things people think are more pressing like immigration, china, jobs, etc.
Some of them maybe even a large chunk maybe.
However there is this very loud cuckoo fringe that likes what he says too.
DH says I am overly judgemental but for me it's a HUGE turn off to hear the former leader of the KKK openly announce to the world he supports a presidential candidate.
I don't associate the entire Republican party with racists, I am well aware they exist in both parties, but this certainly feeds into that stereotype. I don't see how the Republican party will recover from it unless they split into two parties.
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mroped
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Post by mroped on Mar 21, 2016 11:03:17 GMT -5
"Whether he fails to be elected, I haven't a clue. I am still a bit stunned that anyone takes him seriously"
Join the crowd hickle! I believe that aside from his ardent supporters, everybody else in this country is confused about him. And most of the rest of the world for that matter!
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Mar 21, 2016 11:06:51 GMT -5
I don't think Donald Trump is appealing to the fringes, I think he's appealing to the middle group of people that want to put the old GOP ideas (gay marriage, abortion, tax cuts) to rest and focus on things people think are more pressing like immigration, china, jobs, etc. Marco Rubio was well received back when he came on the scene, but that tea party movement is LONG GONE. Nobody wants to hear him talk about tax cuts and gay marriage and all that. Gay marriage helped get GWB the election in 2004, but that ain't gonna work in 2016 so stop talking about it. When did white supremacists become the "middle group"? Former KKK Grand Dragon Explains Why Racists Like Trump You telling me that the left doesn't have its own fringes? Those guys were voting GOP with or without Trump. That's what happens when you divide 400M people into 2 groups.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Mar 21, 2016 11:23:29 GMT -5
What leftist fringe group is the equivalent of the KKK? Interested in a comparative analysis.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 21, 2016 11:24:13 GMT -5
You telling me that the left doesn't have its own fringes? Those guys were voting GOP with or without Trump. That's what happens when you divide 400M people into 2 groups. You are the one who brought up "middle" Republicans and not me.
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Mar 21, 2016 11:29:28 GMT -5
You telling me that the left doesn't have its own fringes? Those guys were voting GOP with or without Trump. That's what happens when you divide 400M people into 2 groups. You are the one who brought up "middle" Republicans and not me. You are the one that brought up the KKK and not me. What's your point?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 21, 2016 11:38:52 GMT -5
You are the one who brought up "middle" Republicans and not me. You are the one that brought up the KKK and not me. What's your point? That no one can or should consider the KKK as being in the "middle" of GOP voters. Yet white nationalists are backing Donald Trump based upon his political positions and do/will vote vote him during the primaries along with the general election if Trump is the Republican candidate.
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Mar 21, 2016 11:44:16 GMT -5
You are the one that brought up the KKK and not me. What's your point? That no one can or should consider the KKK as being in the "middle" of GOP voters. Yet white nationalists are backing Donald Trump based upon his political positions and do/will vote vote him during the primaries along with the general election if Trump is the Republican candidate. Who said they were the middle?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 21, 2016 11:55:49 GMT -5
That no one can or should consider the KKK as being in the "middle" of GOP voters. Yet white nationalists are backing Donald Trump based upon his political positions and do/will vote vote him during the primaries along with the general election if Trump is the Republican candidate. Who said they were the middle? You did say Trump is appealing to the middle, didn't you? "I don't think Donald Trump is appealing to the fringes, I think he's appealing to the middle group of people that want to put the old GOP ideas (gay marriage, abortion, tax cuts) to rest and focus on things people think are more pressing like immigration, china, jobs, etc." Donald Trump is appealing to more than just the middle.
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