weltschmerz
Community Leader
Joined: Jul 25, 2011 13:37:39 GMT -5
Posts: 38,962
|
Post by weltschmerz on Mar 16, 2015 19:03:11 GMT -5
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Sept 20, 2024 19:18:29 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2015 19:07:05 GMT -5
You can't be guaranteed allergy free and clear meals eating out at a regular restaurant unfortunately.
|
|
Artemis Windsong
Senior Associate
The love in me salutes the love in you. M. Williamson
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 19:32:12 GMT -5
Posts: 12,395
Today's Mood: Twinkling
Location: Wishing Star
Favorite Drink: Fresh, clean cold bottled water.
|
Post by Artemis Windsong on Mar 16, 2015 19:10:18 GMT -5
The family is at fault for not bringing the correct meds.
|
|
weltschmerz
Community Leader
Joined: Jul 25, 2011 13:37:39 GMT -5
Posts: 38,962
|
Post by weltschmerz on Mar 16, 2015 19:16:37 GMT -5
The family is at fault for not bringing the correct meds. I agree. And yet, they're suing the restaurant.
|
|
ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ
Community Leader
♡ ♡ BᏋՆᎥᏋᏉᏋ ♡ ♡
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 16:12:51 GMT -5
Posts: 43,130
Location: Inside POM's Head
Favorite Drink: Chilled White Zin
|
Post by ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ on Mar 16, 2015 19:18:17 GMT -5
Hmm - I'd say that responsibility to take precautions, has to fall on the family.
The boy and his family knew of his life-threatening dairy allergy. He had been dealing with it all his life. He should have had his epipen etc with him at all times -and possibly other family members having one as well for back up "just in case".
And as for the restaurant, I guess it depends if they really checked their ingredients. Not that they should have to.
The pancakes I make contain both eggs & milk. The restaurant may have been using a powdered pancake mix, but even then it would still contain powdered eggs & milk.
You'd think the family would be aware of that before ordering.
I imagine in a diner or family restaurant, the same grill that's used to make pancakes, is also used to make fried eggs or omelets, etc on.
|
|
weltschmerz
Community Leader
Joined: Jul 25, 2011 13:37:39 GMT -5
Posts: 38,962
|
Post by weltschmerz on Mar 16, 2015 19:20:02 GMT -5
Is a minimum wage worker expected to scrub the grill because they made French Toast on it previously? Are they expected to know if the pancake mix was made in a facility that has dairy? The family is firmly at fault, IMO.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Mar 16, 2015 19:20:12 GMT -5
That was a tragedy of F-ups! First, they go out to eat at a restaurant without his emergency supplies. Then, he eats and lets people know they have to go - now. I'd guess that's sorta code for "I'm not feeling so good". So what do they do? They head home!?! NO! Dammit, NO!!! You get that kid to the nearest ER and you do it NOW! I'm truly sorry for the family and the loss of this young life but ... well, stuff happens. They knew the boy had a life-threatening allergy. They knew how important it was to always be prepared. This horror was not the responsibility of the server, from what little was provided in the article. The server spoke to the cook. What else could he have done? Sad, in more ways than one.
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,185
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
Member is Online
|
Post by Opti on Mar 16, 2015 19:35:08 GMT -5
The family is at fault for not bringing the correct meds. I agree. And yet, they're suing the restaurant. Suing is something they are likely doing out of guilt. Actually winning should not happen. (I think of it akin to the McNath story actually.)
A severe dairy allergy and they think its wise to order pancakes? And assume that cleaning the grill is enough? O. M. Divine entity (or not) of your choice.
I avoid dairy for my health. Because it makes my sinus infections worse among other things. They shouldn't be so clueless how hard it is to find pancakes with no dairy in them. Most mixes will contain milk, buttermilk or whey. Its rare pancakes are made with water or something like soymilk unless you are at a special restaurant. There are more than a couple times that a smart server thought dairy wasn't in an item, but brought back whatever it was so I could read the ingredient list. Maybe once there wasn't dairy in it. Many people think eggs mean dairy(no) but will space on the fact that cheese is dairy, sour cream, etc. are.
Only someone who is clueless or likes risking death would choose an item almost guaranteed to have dairy in it without even getting to the grill issue. It may not have been the grill for all we know. All we do know is the family and the teen were very stupid. The teen died for it and I think the family does not want to acknowledge their mistakes. Hopefully the court will remind them who really is(mostly) at fault.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Mar 16, 2015 19:37:50 GMT -5
The family is grieving. The lawsuit is the upshot of the anger stage of grieving. They need to find someone to blame. It's perfectly natural but it this case, it's just plain wrong, IMO.
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 16, 2015 19:42:09 GMT -5
Yea the not going directly to the ER has me scratching my head. I think I'd be a little more sympathetic if they had and tragedy still struck. If you know it's life threatening I don't know why they wouldn't have driven straight there or called 911 that second. Furthermore if you didn't have your epipen you should have picked something that would not be even close to what causes you to react.
Not sure why they would trust the cooks to clean the griddle enough if even a trace amount causes a reaction.
|
|
ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ
Community Leader
♡ ♡ BᏋՆᎥᏋᏉᏋ ♡ ♡
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 16:12:51 GMT -5
Posts: 43,130
Location: Inside POM's Head
Favorite Drink: Chilled White Zin
|
Post by ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ on Mar 16, 2015 19:55:38 GMT -5
I doubt there's many restaurants in the country (or world) who thoroughly clean/sanitize their grills after EVERY use.
The family restaurant we sometimes go to for breakfast or lunch has more than a dozen orders going at once on the grill - especially during breakfast serving times.
On Saturday/Sunday mornings, the place is packed. The servers are often bringing out prepared orders at the same time - so the line-cooks are constantly getting one order done and starting on the next.
There's no time in between each individual order to clean the grill thoroughly.
It gets scraped clean for the next batch of orders so they can get hustled out of the kitchen.
|
|
Malarky
Junior Associate
Truth and snark are equal opportunity here.
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 21:00:51 GMT -5
Posts: 5,313
|
Post by Malarky on Mar 16, 2015 20:00:22 GMT -5
I've mentioned this in other threads.
There is no way to guarantee no cross contamination. Chances are that every know allergen is in that kitchen, and despite their best efforts humans touch one thing and then another. And how thoroughly could a grill be cleaned in the middle of a breakfast shift?
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Sept 20, 2024 19:18:29 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2015 20:12:15 GMT -5
There are restaurants that leave a piece of their grill clear of certain allergens. I've eaten at an Asian chain... out west, cant think of the name, that uses your own individual wok that is always pre scrubbed if you have any allergen issues.
But I STILL would not expect them to guarantee me an allergen free meal. We all do the best we can, but ultimately...
Now for me that means if I get contaminated, I have a stomach ache, puffiness, ear fluid and potty issues... nothing going to kill me short term. If I had a deathly allergy, I wouldn't eat out, or I certainly wouldn't eat out without my epi... and I would go right to a doctor if something like this happened (which it really shouldn't because it should have been predictable...).
|
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Mar 16, 2015 20:23:55 GMT -5
The family. Sorry if u have a potentially lethal condition, why are you trusting that a minimum wage worker understands your medical conditions?
|
|
ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ
Community Leader
♡ ♡ BᏋՆᎥᏋᏉᏋ ♡ ♡
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 16:12:51 GMT -5
Posts: 43,130
Location: Inside POM's Head
Favorite Drink: Chilled White Zin
|
Post by ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ on Mar 16, 2015 20:32:57 GMT -5
Why do you assume they're minimum-wage? And it isn't the restaurant's responsibility to make such extreme exceptions for every patron who dines at their establishment.
The boy was a teenager - he should have known by now to ALWAYS have his Epipen (and nebulizer if he was in need of one) with him at ALL times - even at school - let alone eating out due to his allergies. He (and his family) should also have known than pancakes prepared at a restaurant or diner would more than likely contain dairy.
His family should also have been carrying a spare "just in case" he forgot his. They also should have taken him DIRECTLY to the nearest hospital for treatment or called for an ambulance - instead of heading for home.
A restaurant is in the business of preparing and serving food to its patrons. It's up to those patrons to take precautions when it comes to allergies, or special dietary needs - not the restaurant's - or their staff.
|
|
Cass
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 0:43:29 GMT -5
Posts: 2,451
|
Post by Cass on Mar 16, 2015 20:37:40 GMT -5
I've worked in a kitchen. It is hard, hot, heavy work and the workers are usually badly paid and treated. The main focus is getting the food out. Fast. Turnover is high, and communication (due to stress, noise, people new to working together...) low.
There was a lady who was always asking if she could eat something due to her gluten intolerance. Honestly, I have sweat running down my back, am holding a tray that weighs about 40 pounds and have about three hours of dishes waiting for me in the back. Can you?! I don't know, I'm not in your body. And the chef might, but he's still working on all the other dairy free, I want a salad but can't eat any vegetables with seeds, don't use peanut oil near my food etc.
While a tragedy, the family is completely at fault.
If it is life threatening don't eat out. If you take the risk, at least bring your medication.
|
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Mar 16, 2015 20:40:07 GMT -5
What medical training do wait staff have? None. So the family can lay blame but so waht? Hes still dead. If your child is at risk of Dying then you cannot drop your guard. Lay people dont necessarily know what it means to be allergic to something. It can mean anything from a stomach ache to anaphylaxis and death. No I would not trust some waitress to know.
|
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Mar 16, 2015 20:41:28 GMT -5
Then they will sue for not being allowed to eat there.
|
|
chiver78
Administrator
Current Events Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:04:45 GMT -5
Posts: 39,400
|
Post by chiver78 on Mar 16, 2015 20:46:40 GMT -5
The family is at fault for not bringing the correct meds. absolutely not. if the restaurant cannot serve someone who clearly declares their allergies, they are obliged to make that clear. state law determines what should and shouldn't be possible to accommodate, unfortunately, and varies by state. from the link posted, it seems as though the family has a presence at the restaurant in question. since I do not, I can't and won't decide fault one way or another. that said, as someone with an anaphylactic allergy of my own, I don't leave my own life in the hands of anyone else. I travel with meds, always.
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,185
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
Member is Online
|
Post by Opti on Mar 16, 2015 20:59:34 GMT -5
I thought it would be hard to find a pancake mix with no listed milk ingredients, but I found one quickly. When looking at it I remember a poster telling us in a thread that manufacturers are not required to list milk on the label if it is 1% or less of the product. Depending on the product I know labeling laws allow not listing certain ingredients because they are expected or considered common enough they do not have to be on the label. Add in artificial colors and flavors can be made from almost anything, cross contamination, if I had a epi-pen level dairy allergy I wouldn't trust anything that did not explicitly say dairy free and made in a dairy free facility.
And just because I did find it-
INGREDIENTS: Enriched bleached flour (wheat flour, niacin, reduced iron, thiamin mononitrate, riboflavin, folic acid, may contain malted barley flour), imitation blueberry pieces (dextrose, fractionated palm kernel oil, enriched flour [wheat flour, niacin, reduced iron, thiamin mononitrate, riboflavin, folic acid], citric acid, cellulose gum, maltodextrin, artificial flavor, red 40, blue 1, blue 2), soy flour, sugar, dextrose, leavening (sodium bicarbonate, monocalcium phosphate, sodium aluminum sulfate), canola or soybean oil, salt, mono-diglycerides, food starch-modified, artificial flavor.
CONTAINS: Wheat and soy.
Made on equipment that makes products containing milk, eggs and tree nuts.
Refer to the package for the most current ingredient information.
www.krusteaz.com/pancake-and-waffle-mixes-products-46/blueberry-pancake-mix-846#!ingredientstab
|
|
MarleyKeezy78
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 22, 2011 13:20:34 GMT -5
Posts: 3,226
Location: Sittin in the mitten
|
Post by MarleyKeezy78 on Mar 16, 2015 21:33:41 GMT -5
People with food allergies are never truly safe. We travel with DS meds all the time and go to places where we know the food. Still good to ask in case they change something. I don't even trust family, you can't, always be prepared! There are even recalles on things like Ortega spice mixes and paprika, contaminated with peanuts There are so many foods that get recalled you really have to be careful! An ice cream brand was recalled last week because of nut contamination! I feel sorry for this family, but a allergy that bad why would you order pancakes off a griddle that cooks all the other food! Of course you will have contamination! Always, always bring your meds! And straight to the ER if something happens, WTF!!!
|
|
weltschmerz
Community Leader
Joined: Jul 25, 2011 13:37:39 GMT -5
Posts: 38,962
|
Post by weltschmerz on Mar 16, 2015 21:37:33 GMT -5
If my son was so allergic to dairy that a mere trace could kill him, we'd be going to a vegan restaurant. That's one place that's more than likely to be completely dairy-free. I've had buckwheat pancakes at a vegan place that were absolutely to die for delicious!
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,185
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
Member is Online
|
Post by Opti on Mar 16, 2015 21:40:41 GMT -5
Marley, I wonder if Ortega spices are made where Badia are. I saw a level one recall alert on a grocery website concerning Badia cumin. I was , but it was what you said - contamination with peanuts.
I try to be aware, but honestly who would expect that? (level one recall - may result in death!)
|
|
MarleyKeezy78
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 22, 2011 13:20:34 GMT -5
Posts: 3,226
Location: Sittin in the mitten
|
Post by MarleyKeezy78 on Mar 16, 2015 22:08:56 GMT -5
Marley, I wonder if Ortega spices are made where Badia are. I saw a level one recall alert on a grocery website concerning Badia cumin. I was , but it was what you said - contamination with peanuts.
I try to be aware, but honestly who would expect that? (level one recall - may result in death!) Yes, the cumin is contamniated too! I have tried to make sure DS doesn't have anything other than salt and pepper mostly in his foods lately I cook with cumin a ton and we love mexican so it has been fun
|
|
MarleyKeezy78
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 22, 2011 13:20:34 GMT -5
Posts: 3,226
Location: Sittin in the mitten
|
Post by MarleyKeezy78 on Mar 16, 2015 22:12:20 GMT -5
I follow a site on facebook called the No Nut Travler and it has helped me navigate through tons of peanut and tree nut allergy recalles, just a FYI for those who it could be of use!
|
|
weltschmerz
Community Leader
Joined: Jul 25, 2011 13:37:39 GMT -5
Posts: 38,962
|
Post by weltschmerz on Mar 16, 2015 22:14:01 GMT -5
If my son was so allergic to dairy that a mere trace could kill him, we'd be going to a vegan restaurant. That's one place that's more than likely to be completely dairy-free. I've had buckwheat pancakes at a vegan place that were absolutely to die for delicious!
|
|
Ryan
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 16, 2014 13:40:36 GMT -5
Posts: 2,217
|
Post by Ryan on Mar 16, 2015 22:42:51 GMT -5
Eh, I blame the restaurant as much as the parents. If I was the server or cook and someone told me that someone had a severe allergy, then I would tell them to play it safe and order a salad or something. Why would you tell them it's ok if you're unsure?
That said, I wouldn't leave it up to chance like the parents did in this case. If we forgot the medication and were about to order food in a restaurant, I'd skip the meal.
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Mar 16, 2015 23:14:49 GMT -5
I'm going to be the voice of dissent and claim the restaurant is fully at fault.
The family was provided with an explicit assurance from the management, which they accepted in good fait... Ehhh screw it. Sorry. Can't do it.
Caveat emptor.
|
|
Green Eyed Lady
Senior Associate
Look inna eye! Always look inna eye!
Joined: Jan 23, 2012 11:23:55 GMT -5
Posts: 19,629
|
Post by Green Eyed Lady on Mar 16, 2015 23:18:22 GMT -5
I've mentioned this in other threads. There is no way to guarantee no cross contamination. Chances are that every know allergen is in that kitchen, and despite their best efforts humans touch one thing and then another. And how thoroughly could a grill be cleaned in the middle of a breakfast shift? It can't....if it's like the grill I used to cook on. You have to let the grill cool, pour on the special grill cleaning solution, scrub it thoroughly, rinse it like 5 times and then reheat it. Total time? A pretty good estimate is 20-25 minutes on an industrial sized grill. People just aren't going to do that between orders. They may make a quick wipe down but that won't be sufficient to get rid of all traces of everything.
|
|
ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ
Community Leader
♡ ♡ BᏋՆᎥᏋᏉᏋ ♡ ♡
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 16:12:51 GMT -5
Posts: 43,130
Location: Inside POM's Head
Favorite Drink: Chilled White Zin
|
Post by ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ on Mar 16, 2015 23:22:19 GMT -5
According to information provided in the OP link, the server asked the cook if the gluten-free pancakes were also dairy-free and was told they were.
What the family next asked is a pretty high request for a busy family restaurant - and probably impossible to do during peak breakfast service. The boy had also forgotten his Epipen and nebulizer - how is that in any way the fault of the restaurant? While it's tragic he died, was up to the teen and family to take precautions when dining out - not the restaurant's.
ETA: And why rush to get the boy home? Why wasn't he immediately rushed to Emergency - or paramedics/ambulance called? It would have saved time and possibly his life.
|
|