Impeachment/Lawsuit is political suicide for the GOP

[djAdvocate]

if they know what is better, they will stop....NOW.  we shall see if that happens.  WaPo seems to think it already has.

www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2014/08/13/the-gop-needs-impeachment-to-go-away-along-with-its-lawsuit-against-obama/

Republicans are in a hurry to stop talking about impeachment -- so much so that even Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Tex.), who usually lines up with the most conservative Republicans on pretty much anything, is trying to change the subject.

And a new poll shows precisely why: It's because it's killing the GOP among swing voters.

The McClatchy-Marist College poll shows political moderates oppose the impeachment of Obama 79 percent to 15 percent. That's a stunning margin. And not only that, if the House GOP did initiate impeachment proceedings, moderates say it would turn them off so much that they would be pulled toward the Democrats. By 49-27, moderates say impeachment would make them more likely to vote Democratic than Republican in 2014.

But it's not just impeachment. As we've noted before, the House GOP's lawsuit against Obama's use of executive orders is turning out to be a political loser too. In fact, it's not much more popular than impeachment.

Americans say 58 percent to 34 percent that the GOP should not sue Obama, and moderates agree 67-22. Moderates also say by a 50-25 margin that the lawsuit makes them more likely to back Democrats in 2014.

[djAdvocate]

this is a product of the echo chamber.  this idea of skewering Obama and roasting him over a pit is so tantalizing to the right, so popular, that they think everyone will love it.

clue: everyone OTHER THAN YOU hates it.  mmkay?

[Peace Of Mind]

The McClatchy-Marist College poll shows political moderates oppose the impeachment of Obama 79 percent to 15 percent. That's a stunning margin. And not only that, if the House GOP did initiate impeachment proceedings, moderates say it would turn them off so much that they would be pulled toward the Democrats. By 49-27, moderates say impeachment would make them more likely to vote Democratic than Republican in 2014.

But it's not just impeachment. As we've noted before, the House GOP's lawsuit against Obama's use of executive orders is turning out to be a political loser too. In fact, it's not much more popular than impeachment.

Americans say 58 percent to 34 percent that the GOP should not sue Obama, and moderates agree 67-22. Moderates also say by a 50-25 margin that the lawsuit makes them more likely to back Democrats in 2014.

This part bothers me.  How can they know whether they will vote for a Democrat or not without even knowing who's running?  Hell, I'm a Democrat and I don't even know if I'm voting for a Democrat yet. 

I think the GOP wanting to impeach Obama is absurd but I wouldn't say who I'm voting for until I know who's running so this kind of makes me nervous that so many think that way. 

Am I missing something?

[djAdvocate]

Aug 13, 2014 15:00:30 GMT -5 Peace Of Mind said:

The McClatchy-Marist College poll shows political moderates oppose the impeachment of Obama 79 percent to 15 percent. That's a stunning margin. And not only that, if the House GOP did initiate impeachment proceedings, moderates say it would turn them off so much that they would be pulled toward the Democrats. By 49-27, moderates say impeachment would make them more likely to vote Democratic than Republican in 2014.

But it's not just impeachment. As we've noted before, the House GOP's lawsuit against Obama's use of executive orders is turning out to be a political loser too. In fact, it's not much more popular than impeachment.

Americans say 58 percent to 34 percent that the GOP should not sue Obama, and moderates agree 67-22. Moderates also say by a 50-25 margin that the lawsuit makes them more likely to back Democrats in 2014.

This part bothers me.  How can they know whether they will vote for a Democrat or not without even knowing who's running?  Hell, I'm a Democrat and I don't even know if I'm voting for a Democrat yet. 

I think the GOP wanting to impeach Obama is absurd but I wouldn't say who I'm voting for until I know who's running so this kind of makes me nervous that so many think that way. 

Am I missing something?

this "more likely" question is quite common.  it is how they do CONGRESSIONAL STRAW POLLS.  it is a way of WEIGHING SENTIMENT.  and yes, it is a very highly correlative piece of data. 

in other words, if the D/R congressional poll is +5%, it skews the races roughly 5%.

[happyhoix]

I think the GOP wanting to impeach Obama is absurd but I wouldn't say who I'm voting for until I know who's running so this kind of makes me nervous that so many think that way.

I think this means, all things being equal, they would be more likely to vote Democratic.

I'm confused, though, wasn't  Boehner on TV not long ago claiming the impeachment threat was a democratic plot?

Oh, wait, I googled it, and he did say that. Also Bachman said she was wanting to impeach Obama, until she also said impeachment was a democratic plot.

I get it now - the republicans WANTED to impeach him until they saw that poll, and now they claim all that impeachment talk was just some kind of gag, or devious plot, or something... Got it! 


Seems like some of them can read poll results, too.

[djAdvocate]

Aug 13, 2014 16:22:35 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

I think the GOP wanting to impeach Obama is absurd but I wouldn't say who I'm voting for until I know who's running so this kind of makes me nervous that so many think that way.

I think this means, all things being equal, they would be more likely to vote Democratic.

I'm confused, though, wasn't  Boehner on TV not long ago claiming the impeachment threat was a democratic plot?

Oh, wait, I googled it, and he did say that. Also Bachman said she was wanting to impeach Obama, until she also said impeachment was a democratic plot.

I get it now - the republicans WANTED to impeach him until they saw that poll, and now they claim all that impeachment talk was just some kind of gag, or devious plot, or something... Got it! 


Seems like some of them can read poll results, too.

it HAD to be a Democratic plot, because it worked out for Democrats.  if it had worked out for the GOP, on the other hand, it would have been their idea.

[dondub]

I get it now - the republicans WANTED to impeach him until they saw that poll, and now they claim all that impeachment talk was just some kind of gag, or devious plot, or something... Got it!


 That's why a poster here started a case for Obama's impeachment thread and then 2 months later started a thread that the demos are hyping the impeachment of Obama. During this time a non-spokeswoman for the TeaParty conservatives touts his impeachment to shill her new TV channel and then every repo there is crawls out from under a rock to say she speaks for no one infiliated with anyone even though they have made her rich paying to see her talk. Gotta love it!

[djAdvocate]

i am kinda proud of this board.  as politically tone deaf as people sometimes are, i didn't see a whole lot of threads about suing or impeaching Obama, here.  kudos to everyone for either their good sense or restraint.

[dondub]

 Only three that have been active in the last couple weeks!

[Deleted]

Aug 13, 2014 18:38:59 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i am kinda proud of this board.  as politically tone deaf as people sometimes are, i didn't see a whole lot of threads about suing or impeaching Obama, here.  kudos to everyone for either their good sense or restraint.

I agree that it qualifies as restraint... but... I must ask: How is not wanting someone impeached that deserves it "good sense"?

Or are you strictly referring to the good sense to not post a thread of that nature, even though the impeachment is deserved?

[EVT1]

Do we really want to go down this road? People wanted Bush impeached- and that witch from CA said it was off the table

Impeachment should not be used as some political sword- I thought the Clinton thing proved that.

[Deleted]

Aug 13, 2014 21:26:30 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

Do we really want to go down this road? People wanted Bush impeached- and that witch from CA said it was off the table

Impeachment should not be used as some political sword- I thought the Clinton thing proved that.

It's not about use "as a political sword". It's about what should happen when a President is in violation of the Constitution. That doesn't just go for Obama either.

[busymom]

The people I talk with think we've got bigger problems: Russia, the Middle East, illegal immigration, etc.

Why waste time on impeachment when there's so much chaos in the world right now?  If we try to hogtie a sitting president, we might be shooting ourselves in the foot in the long run, no matter which political party you prefer.

[EVT1]

Aug 13, 2014 21:31:53 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Aug 13, 2014 21:26:30 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

Do we really want to go down this road? People wanted Bush impeached- and that witch from CA said it was off the table

Impeachment should not be used as some political sword- I thought the Clinton thing proved that.

It's not about use "as a political sword". It's about what should happen when a President is in violation of the Constitution. That doesn't just go for Obama either.

Going to have to state your claim then.  What law did he break?  Bush shit on the Constitution as well- what law did he break?

[Deleted]

Aug 13, 2014 22:45:43 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

Aug 13, 2014 21:31:53 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

It's not about use "as a political sword". It's about what should happen when a President is in violation of the Constitution. That doesn't just go for Obama either.

Going to have to state your claim then.  What law did he break?  Bush shit on the Constitution as well- what law did he break?

His multiple changes to Obamacare broke the Constitution every time he modified the law.

His release of the 5 Guantanamo Bay prisoners violated the law and qualifies as a "high crime".

His failure to enforce/defend D.O.M.A. (even though I disagree with D.O.M.A., the President is required to "support and defend the laws of the United States"... well... UNTIL it is struck down by the Supreme Court... it's still a "law of the United States")

That's 3 off the top of my head for Obama.

I know there were ones with Bush, but they were 6 to 14 years ago and honestly, I've dropped them from my worry for impeachment since he's already out of office... but he should have been impeached for his violations as well.

[djAdvocate]

Aug 13, 2014 21:13:08 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Aug 13, 2014 18:38:59 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i am kinda proud of this board.  as politically tone deaf as people sometimes are, i didn't see a whole lot of threads about suing or impeaching Obama, here.  kudos to everyone for either their good sense or restraint.

I agree that it qualifies as restraint... but... I must ask: How is not wanting someone impeached that deserves it "good sense"?

i think you misread me.  i was talking politics, not "legality".

Or are you strictly referring to the good sense to not post a thread of that nature, even though the impeachment is deserved?

i am talking the good sense to understand that it is a bad idea POLITICALLY to impeach a standing president over things that other presidents have done for 50 years, and overlook the far greater crimes of those presidents.

[djAdvocate]

Aug 13, 2014 22:57:54 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Aug 13, 2014 22:45:43 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

Going to have to state your claim then.  What law did he break?  Bush shit on the Constitution as well- what law did he break?

His multiple changes to Obamacare broke the Constitution every time he modified the law.

His release of the 5 Guantanamo Bay prisoners violated the law and qualifies as a "high crime".

His failure to enforce/defend D.O.M.A. (even though I disagree with D.O.M.A., the President is required to "support and defend the laws of the United States"... well... UNTIL it is struck down by the Supreme Court... it's still a "law of the United States")

That's 3 off the top of my head for Obama.

I know there were ones with Bush, but they were 6 to 14 years ago and honestly, I've dropped them from my worry for impeachment since he's already out of office... but he should have been impeached for his violations as well.

he could still be charged criminally.  we should do that. 

edit: Carter, Clinton and Poppy, too- btw.  they are all guilty of high crimes, imo.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Aug 13, 2014 18:38:59 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i am kinda proud of this board.  as politically tone deaf as people sometimes are, i didn't see a whole lot of threads about suing or impeaching Obama, here.  kudos to everyone for either their good sense or restraint.

It's a waste of time, because no matter what the GOP won't follow through.  The people that don't have the balls to defund ObamaCare aren't going to impeach and remove from office the first (second?) black President.

Obama's political strategy is somewhat risky, but probably a good bet- which is to taunt the GOP and continue to behave as lawlessly as he wishes.  Nobody is going to stop him, and he knows it- and they know it.

[Shooby]

I love how Dems are oh so worried about "political suicide" for the GOP! lol

[djAdvocate]

Aug 14, 2014 13:52:38 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

Aug 13, 2014 18:38:59 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i am kinda proud of this board.  as politically tone deaf as people sometimes are, i didn't see a whole lot of threads about suing or impeaching Obama, here.  kudos to everyone for either their good sense or restraint.

It's a waste of time, because no matter what the GOP won't follow through.  The people that don't have the balls to defund ObamaCare aren't going to impeach and remove from office the first (second?) black President.

Obama's political strategy is somewhat risky, but probably a good bet- which is to taunt the GOP and continue to behave as lawlessly as he wishes.  Nobody is going to stop him, and he knows it- and they know it.

i don't think he is being very strategic at all.

but i think he knows that the stuff he is doing is not unusual.  if they go after him, then it will open the door to going after the next GOP president who pulls similar stuff.  when it comes right down to it, Congress loves the Imperial Presidency (despite lip service to the opposite).  it absolves them of their many, and grave, sins.

[djAdvocate]

Aug 14, 2014 15:21:39 GMT -5 Shooby said:

I love how Dems are oh so worried about "political suicide" for the GOP! lol

i am not a Dem, Shooby.  i have not been a Dem since 1996.

and i am not WORRIED.  i am stating a fact.  if we keep this up, we will lose the House AND the Senate.

[Virgil Showlion]

Have they at long last been able to find somebody in the GOP that's endorsing impeachment, or is it still one of those "Bigfoot" deals?

[djAdvocate]

if they are still following the Hastert Rule, they will never have the votes, imo.

[happyhoix]

Aug 13, 2014 21:46:24 GMT -5 busymom said:

The people I talk with think we've got bigger problems: Russia, the Middle East, illegal immigration, etc.

Why waste time on impeachment when there's so much chaos in the world right now?  If we try to hogtie a sitting president, we might be shooting ourselves in the foot in the long run, no matter which political party you prefer.

You're right.

An impeachment hearing would be a major distraction and would only increase the bickering and name calling across the aisle. Kind of like getting in a fist fight over the seating arrangements while the ocean liner is veering into the iceberg.

Personally I would like to put every one of them in the time out chair until they can promise to play nice and cooperate. There's too much serious shit going on to be sidelined by all this foolishness.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Aug 14, 2014 15:35:23 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Aug 14, 2014 13:52:38 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

It's a waste of time, because no matter what the GOP won't follow through.  The people that don't have the balls to defund ObamaCare aren't going to impeach and remove from office the first (second?) black President.

Obama's political strategy is somewhat risky, but probably a good bet- which is to taunt the GOP and continue to behave as lawlessly as he wishes.  Nobody is going to stop him, and he knows it- and they know it.

i don't think he is being very strategic at all.

but i think he knows that the stuff he is doing is not unusual.  if they go after him, then it will open the door to going after the next GOP president who pulls similar stuff.  when it comes right down to it, Congress loves the Imperial Presidency (despite lip service to the opposite).  it absolves them of their many, and grave, sins.

I actually agree with you on this.  I think Congress does like it.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Aug 14, 2014 16:02:15 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

Have they at long last been able to find somebody in the GOP that's endorsing impeachment, or is it still one of those "Bigfoot" deals?

It's more of a Democrat red-herring than anything else.  It would be a distraction, and nobody could use a distraction more than Democrats.  I think that's why Obama has basically been daring the GOP to do it.  It's a rope-a-dope; but signs are that the GOP is onto him.

thehill.com/homenews/house/214553-dems-talk-about-impeachment-20-times-as-much-as-gop

Congressional Democrats have talked about the impeachment of President Obama 20 times more than Republicans have on the House and Senate floors.

Since the start of the 113th Congress last year, Democrats have used the word “impeach” or “impeachment” regarding Obama 86 times, according to a review of the Congressional Record by The Hill.

Utterances on the floor from Republicans about impeaching Obama, in contrast, have been relatively rare. Only three Republicans in this Congress have raised the subject on the House floor, and the words have been used a total of four times by GOP members.
Most of the talk has come from House Democrats, with Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee (Texas) alone using the words 18 times in two separate speeches late last month.

In the Senate, where the GOP hopes to retake a majority this fall, not a single Republican has mentioned impeachment on the floor over the last couple of years.

The figures highlight how impeachment has been a hot topic for Democrats, and one most Republicans want to avoid.

[Deleted]

Aug 14, 2014 13:04:45 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Aug 13, 2014 22:57:54 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

His multiple changes to Obamacare broke the Constitution every time he modified the law.

His release of the 5 Guantanamo Bay prisoners violated the law and qualifies as a "high crime".

His failure to enforce/defend D.O.M.A. (even though I disagree with D.O.M.A., the President is required to "support and defend the laws of the United States"... well... UNTIL it is struck down by the Supreme Court... it's still a "law of the United States")

That's 3 off the top of my head for Obama.

I know there were ones with Bush, but they were 6 to 14 years ago and honestly, I've dropped them from my worry for impeachment since he's already out of office... but he should have been impeached for his violations as well.

he could still be charged criminally.  we should do that. 

edit: Carter, Clinton and Poppy, too- btw.  they are all guilty of high crimes, imo.

Agreed... and they should have been impeached and removed from office when they violated the conditions of their office too.

Presidents violate the conditions of their office BECAUSE there's not enough impeachment AND removal (historically speaking). If presidents had a "one crime or unconstitutional act... and out" record, There would likely be less presidents violating the rules/conditions of their office.

And sorry, but the "well... they didn't get punished" defense doesn't work for me. That's like being pulled over for speeding and saying "But officer, they didn't get a ticket!". Just because some get away with it doesn't mean everyone should get a pass.

[Tennesseer]

Aug 14, 2014 17:19:39 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

Aug 14, 2014 16:02:15 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

Have they at long last been able to find somebody in the GOP that's endorsing impeachment, or is it still one of those "Bigfoot" deals?

It's more of a Democrat red-herring than anything else.  It would be a distraction, and nobody could use a distraction more than Democrats.  I think that's why Obama has basically been daring the GOP to do it.  It's a rope-a-dope; but signs are that the GOP is onto him.

thehill.com/homenews/house/214553-dems-talk-about-impeachment-20-times-as-much-as-gop

Congressional Democrats have talked about the impeachment of President Obama 20 times more than Republicans have on the House and Senate floors.

Since the start of the 113th Congress last year, Democrats have used the word “impeach” or “impeachment” regarding Obama 86 times, according to a review of the Congressional Record by The Hill.

Utterances on the floor from Republicans about impeaching Obama, in contrast, have been relatively rare. Only three Republicans in this Congress have raised the subject on the House floor, and the words have been used a total of four times by GOP members.
Most of the talk has come from House Democrats, with Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee (Texas) alone using the words 18 times in two separate speeches late last month.

In the Senate, where the GOP hopes to retake a majority this fall, not a single Republican has mentioned impeachment on the floor over the last couple of years.

The figures highlight how impeachment has been a hot topic for Democrats, and one most Republicans want to avoid.

According to paul' link, 'Big Foot' exists.

[happyhoix]

Only three Republicans in this Congress have raised the subject on the House floor, and the words have been used a total of four times by GOP members.

This is what they've said on the House floor.

How many times lately have conservative political talking heads spouted off about impeaching Obama in the media?

I personally listened to both Palin and Bachman rant about it in their crazy ways.

[Tennesseer]

Aug 15, 2014 7:07:10 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Only three Republicans in this Congress have raised the subject on the House floor, and the words have been used a total of four times by GOP members.

This is what they've said on the House floor.

How many times lately have conservative political talking heads spouted off about impeaching Obama in the media?

I personally listened to both Palin and Bachman rant about it in their crazy ways.

 We all know Republican HoR members and senators never, ever hold town hall meetings or meet with their constituents where the subject of impeachment could and would be raised and discussed.