Should all foreign visitors to the US be required to buy...

[The Captain]

Health Insurance?

www.nbcnews.com/#/health/health-news/family-fights-block-deportation-comatose-exchange-student-n33926

"A Pakistani exchange student, in a coma since a November car accident, faces possible deportation next week as his visa expires and the Minnesota hospital caring for him seeks to send him home amid mounting, unpaid medical bills, claims the man’s family."

I saw this and my question came to mind.  Should the US require anyone entering the country to purchase health insurance so the US taxpayer is not on the hook in case they get ill or injured?

I was also surprised to see this because I know my college required all students to have health care coverage.  If your parents didn't cover you, a plan had to be purchased through the university.

Thoughts?

[sarcasticgirl]

DO you mean anyone visiting? or someone on a visa?

[Rocky Mtn Saver]

When I got injured on vacation in Rome, we got their free healthcare.  It's reciprocal, so presumably everyone would start making us do the same. 

[cronewitch]

Are we required to be covered when we travel? Even if student had insurance would it cover the cost of a long coma? Maybe a bond instead of catastrophic coverage. The car insurance would have covered a bit of the cost but even health insurance usually has a limit.

I have Medicare now and it doesn't cover long term out of country. My brother lives in Mexico has Medicare and isn't covered so he is paying for nothing. He pays because if he moves back here he would have a penalty. Not sure if he has any coverage in Mexico if he was sick or injured would they deport him?

[The Captain]

Feb 20, 2014 14:13:52 GMT -5 sarcasticgirl said:

DO you mean anyone visiting? or someone on a visa?

Well, in theory anything could happen, so I will say anyone visiting OR on a visa.  If companies could come up with rates for travel cancellation etc I'm sure the market could create something for accidents that happen to visitors.  Like maybe a policy for the length of your vacation for X number of dollars.

[sarcasticgirl]

in that case, any american traveling out of the country would have to pay for healthcare?

I had to see a Dr. while traveling in Italy 10 years ago and it didn't cost me a dime. 

[Miss Tequila]

Feb 20, 2014 14:23:29 GMT -5 sarcasticgirl said:

in that case, any american traveling out of the country would have to pay for healthcare?

I had to see a Dr. while traveling in Italy 10 years ago and it didn't cost me a dime. 

I have international insurance when I travel through Chubb...I'm not taking any chances on racking up tens of thousands of medical bills.

[sarcasticgirl]

Feb 20, 2014 14:25:47 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

Feb 20, 2014 14:23:29 GMT -5 sarcasticgirl said:

in that case, any american traveling out of the country would have to pay for healthcare?

I had to see a Dr. while traveling in Italy 10 years ago and it didn't cost me a dime. 

I have international insurance when I travel through Chubb...I'm not taking any chances on racking up tens of thousands of medical bills.

but you aren't required to do so... 

[Cookies Galore]

Feb 20, 2014 14:25:47 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

Feb 20, 2014 14:23:29 GMT -5 sarcasticgirl said:

in that case, any american traveling out of the country would have to pay for healthcare?

I had to see a Dr. while traveling in Italy 10 years ago and it didn't cost me a dime. 

I have international insurance when I travel through Chubb...I'm not taking any chances on racking up tens of thousands of medical bills.

Ooh! That's the fancy insurance!

[Rocky Mtn Saver]

Feb 20, 2014 14:28:24 GMT -5 sarcasticgirl said:

Feb 20, 2014 14:25:47 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

I have international insurance when I travel through Chubb...I'm not taking any chances on racking up tens of thousands of medical bills.

but you aren't required to do so... 

To avoid the possibility of being collectively on the hook for visitors' injuries, we'd all probably have to start purchasing such international insurance ourselves now.  I'm not sure if that'd end up being a net positive or not.  Or if it would affect the tourism economy both into and out of the country. 

[The Captain]

Feb 20, 2014 14:23:29 GMT -5 sarcasticgirl said:

in that case, any american traveling out of the country would have to pay for healthcare?

I had to see a Dr. while traveling in Italy 10 years ago and it didn't cost me a dime. 

I'm presuming Italy has a national healthcare system?  The US doesn't.

I don't think there is a reciprocity requirement for social services.

[haapai]

Wouldn't it be ironic if the guy actually did purchase the school's health insurance and it covered this but the school couldn't tell the family that he'd bought it and the family didn't know that it existed? 

[Rocky Mtn Saver]

Feb 20, 2014 14:35:53 GMT -5 The Captain said:

Feb 20, 2014 14:23:29 GMT -5 sarcasticgirl said:

in that case, any american traveling out of the country would have to pay for healthcare?

I had to see a Dr. while traveling in Italy 10 years ago and it didn't cost me a dime. 

I'm presuming Italy has a national healthcare system?  The US doesn't.

I don't think there is a reciprocity requirement for social services.

Our healthcare system in this case requires that ER cases receive treatment no matter what.  I went to an ER in Italy and was treated regardless of my citizenship as well.  In both cases, presumably, ultimately the taxpayers must cover the cost of my care.  I didn't get a bill from the taxpayers in Italy, although in the reverse case, the Italian tourist would probably get one from us. 

If we started requiring separate health insurance from foreigners applying for a visa because we don't want to have to pay for their injuries, you don't really think that foreign governments would start doing the same to us? 

[Tiny]

I don't think visitors should be required to purchase insurance. Of course, if they are here and the reason they are here requires insurance (like a student) then yes, they should have to have insurance.

The thing with foreigners who rack up huge health care bills - is that their visa/whatever eventually runs out and then we send them back to where ever they came from. Which can be very sad when their family/country cannot care for them.

I suspect the family in the OP would go for the 'moral victory' and attempt to keep the kid here in America... especially if he may not get the necessary care he needs in his homeland. It may become a case of do we send him home to die sooner or do we keep him here until he dies later. Versus being about the actual cost of the care here.


I'm sure there's a precedence set for how we deal with very ill non-us citizens when their visas/whatever runs out and I'm sure it's not pretty. 

[The Captain]

In that case I would think he wouldn't have mounting upaid bills, but I could be wrong

[saveinla]

Students who come here to study from out of the country need to have insurance. That is a requirement at the colleges and they cannot waive it. For my son's college it's part of their bill. Only residents and citizens who show the proof of insurance can get the health insurance part of the bill waived.

Not sure how good the insurance coverage is, but they should have insurance.

[Rocky Mtn Saver]

Do you check people's health insurance before you invite them to your house for dinner?  And do they check your insurance before you step on their property?  You might be on the hook for the cost if they fall and hit their head. 

[justme]

It's a Visa issue, mostly. The problem is the hospital doesn't want to convert it to a medial visa because they would eat all the costs.

He did have emergency insurance, but it was capped at $100k and his bills are over $350k. Wondering where the car insurance is on it?

I'm not too happy about their statement of we should keep him here and pay for him because his home country can't provide him the treatments we have. I feel a little heartless about it.

I'm wondering whether his student visa didn't expire until say July whether they would be pushing sending him back or not? Without the excuse of his visa expiring.

[Rocky Mtn Saver]

Feb 20, 2014 14:57:01 GMT -5 justme said:

I'm not too happy about their statement of we should keep him here and pay for him because his home country can't provide him the treatments we have. I feel a little heartless about it.

That's an interesting debate.  How much responsibility should we take for the guest in our country if there's a large possibility that he could die if we send him home to subpar facilities?  Interesting, I don't know the answer either. 

[Deleted]

When I visit your country I make sure to have my own coverage.
If you are asking that visitors should prove they have coverage, perhaps yes if in fact you are simply wishing not to have people visit to take advantage of the system you have.

[Rocky Mtn Saver]

Feb 20, 2014 15:07:19 GMT -5 @joey said:

When I visit your country I make sure to have my own coverage.
If you are asking that visitors should prove they have coverage, perhaps yes if in fact you are simply wishing not to have people visit to take advantage of the system you have.

I'm guessing most visitors aren't coming here with the intent of ending up in the ER or in a traffic accident. 

[The Captain]

Feb 20, 2014 14:52:54 GMT -5 Rocky Mtn Saver said:

Do you check people's health insurance before you invite them to your house for dinner?  And do they check your insurance before you step on their property?  You might be on the hook for the cost if they fall and hit their head. 

That's what umbrella insurance is for, and yes - I have had umbrella insurance for as long as I had any assets worth sueing over.

[Rocky Mtn Saver]

Right, so you pay for and accept a certain risk in order to have people on your property.  That's normal, responsible, and hospitable behavior.  As a country, we collectively kind of self-insure.  We all pay into taxes for many reasons, including accepting some risk that some of those taxes may be used to cover a guest's accident. FWIW, Italy did the same in covering my risk when I was a guest of their country. 

[bobosensei]

Part of getting a visa in Europe is proof of healthcare.  I am in Germany with the US military so my experience is a little different than that of a general tourist, but if I sponsor a friend of family member for a visa part of what I am required to do is sign papers saying that I may be held financially responsible for them to include healthcare costs.

It is possible to be charged for care over here for visitors (those not on a visa) that have an emergency, but I think it typically doesn't happen because the system isn't set up for it.

I recently watched something on BBC news about the UK looking at what they can do to recoup costs due to tourist care.  I can't find anything online, but the below link which is an article a few years old has some info.

www.eturbonews.com/31549/foreign-health-tourists-bleed-uk-health-care-white

[Deleted]

Feb 20, 2014 15:09:57 GMT -5 Rocky Mtn Saver said:

Feb 20, 2014 15:07:19 GMT -5 @joey said:

When I visit your country I make sure to have my own coverage.
If you are asking that visitors should prove they have coverage, perhaps yes if in fact you are simply wishing not to have people visit to take advantage of the system you have.

I'm guessing most visitors aren't coming here with the intent of ending up in the ER or in a traffic accident. 

I'm guessing you are correct. However believe it or not it has been said that some people come to another country to get the medical attention they cannot get in their own country.
If a person shows up very ill at a hospital, can they or will they, be turned away if they have no insurance and are visiting?

[justme]

The whole visa vs visitors is complex.

Like in the US citizens of Canada don't need a visa to come into our country, but there's other countries where they need a travel visa if they want to come here. I'm not even sure what countries I need a visa to enter. I know China and Australia requires them, no idea about the countries in Europe. The Caribbean islands don't, that I know of, nor Mexico - not sure about the rest of Central America or South America.

[nogooddeed]

Per a Minneappolis paper, his visa has been extended and the exchange program's insurance has agreed to cover him in a rehab facility for "a period of time".  The family is on the hook after that.

[Sunnyday]

I think that this is a special circumstance. I have never had medical insurance except when I was obligated to as college student. It always came with being a student.

As a child, my parents self-insured, and as an adult, I haven't insured. myself.

I am now insured because I live in Canada, but otherwise, I think it makes good sense to have some sort of insurance when you travel.

But most people don't need to buy extra insurance, most credit cards come with some sort insurance where they will take care of your bills and/or pay for repatriation. I think they might even pay for family members to come out and see you.

This is why whenever I pay for travel, I always put it on a credit card that offers the best benefits.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Like in the US citizens of Canada don't need a visa to come into our country, but there's other countries where they need a travel visa if they want to come here. I'm not even sure what countries I need a visa to enter. I know China and Australia requires them, no idea about the countries in Europe. The Caribbean islands don't, that I know of, nor Mexico - not sure about the rest of Central America or South America.

This is not quite correct. No, you do not need a visa if you come for a short visit but any stay after a certain period of time DOES require a visa. Not only that, if you regularly stay up to the amount of time allowed in the US while you do not have a visa, the US can and will deny re-entrance.

A friend of mine's family is from South America and his mom came regularly and maxed out her legal stay in the US several times. She is no longer allowed legally in the US, despite the fact that her all of her financial resources are in her home country because the US is presuming that she is wanting to stay permanently. The last couple of years, friend has had to take/send his kids to see their grandmother. Last time I talked to him was in June and she still was not allowed in the US, so this has been going on for about 3 years now.

[justme]

Feb 20, 2014 15:47:01 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Like in the US citizens of Canada don't need a visa to come into our country, but there's other countries where they need a travel visa if they want to come here. I'm not even sure what countries I need a visa to enter. I know China and Australia requires them, no idea about the countries in Europe. The Caribbean islands don't, that I know of, nor Mexico - not sure about the rest of Central America or South America.

This is not quite correct. No, you do not need a visa if you come for a short visit but any stay after a certain period of time DOES require a visa. Not only that, if you regularly stay up to the amount of time allowed in the US while you do not have a visa, the US can and will deny re-entrance.

A friend of mine's family is from South America and his mom came regularly and maxed out her legal stay in the US several times. She is no longer allowed legally in the US, despite the fact that her all of her financial resources are in her home country because the US is presuming that she is wanting to stay permanently. The last couple of years, friend has had to take/send his kids to see their grandmother. Last time I talked to him was in June and she still was not allowed in the US, so this has been going on for about 3 years now.

Ah, I forgot that there's a time limit to not needing the visa. Also, just googled and apparently only Canada has the somewhat unrestricted access, another handful of countries still need to file electronic authorization that the are coming. Oh and one country in South America, I guess that's where your friend's family is.

I'm honestly just familiar with Canada - and very glad to find out that their limit is 6 months for US citizens so no one in my family will break that anytime soon.