doxieluvr
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Post by doxieluvr on Dec 10, 2013 15:31:04 GMT -5
I know my parents are proud of me. They aren't exactly touchy feely types so I don't expect constant accolades and hugs or anything. It's just during darker moments I wish I got as much attention as my brother does. I don't want the same type of attention but I feel left out sometimes.
I get the bind the parents in the OP are in but I hope they do something for the younger kid to acknowledge all he/she is accomplishing. Doesn't have to be money but the kid should get a shred of recognition from them.
Shit happens and I get that but from the perspective of the responsible one it's quite painful to watch your parents try to save your sibling from himself. And as it starts to add up finanically at the parents' expense you get resentful because you know it's probably not going to be irresponsible sibling that has to deal with the long term consequences.
Your brother is probably exhausted with all the attention amd would rather you be in the limelight for awhile. I know that is how I feel. My parents do not call my brother 20 times a day. They may call him 3 times a week. I on the other hand, cant check out at the grocery store with my mother calling to see what I bought and if I am going right home. I get home and ny dad calls. I always want to ask if they even speak to each other but then I remember they wint always be here to call me all the time.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Dec 10, 2013 15:33:17 GMT -5
He still has a lot of chances and opportunities ahead of him. I don't blame your parents at all for still trying to get him on track.
I'm hoping so. DH got himself back on track so I know it's not hopeless but at the same time DH admits it's a hellofalot harder to "grow up" in your 30's after f-ing up your 20's. While that road eventually lead to me and Gwen, for which he has no regrets things would be so much better for him in some areas if he'd sobered up and gotten his act together sooner.
I know logically how I feel about the whole think is pointless and it's not like I walk around punching walls or my DH over it every day. But every once and awhile it pops up. I've learned that I need to just not bring Gwen over for a visit for a couple weeks when I hear thru the grapevine he lost another job. Makes life more peaceful that way.
I've also learned keep my mouth shut, no one wants to here the obvious.
Hopefully the OTR stuff goes well but like I said I'm not holding my breath.
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kittensaver
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Post by kittensaver on Dec 10, 2013 15:33:25 GMT -5
I certainly don't know the entire story - but at this point in your life this should be fading away into the past
I'd love it to but it's still ongoing. He's 23 years old and hasn't held a job for more than a week. He still lives in my parents' house.
But you don't. It's not ongoing for you, it's done. What he and your parents do is their life, their business. I think you've lost perspective here. It only affects you if you want it to. Frankly, it sounds like you are holding on to these resentments because you are not ready to let them go. They only affect your current life as much as you want them to. I dunno - I'm on the fence about this one. YEARS later (including raising his two daughters for him!) I still feel resentment for older DB - and I'm many more years "into it" than Drama. Resentment is a valid emotion I'm allowed to feel. The difference is - I refuse to allow it to take up "space" in my brain or in my daily life. But that doesn't mean it's not there. I just don't let it drive any part of my daily life or daily functioning.
NOT to try and make this about me, because it's not . . . but I just had to jump in here and validate Drama's feelings. I think they are valid. Feelings are just feelings, they are not right or wrong - they just ARE. It is your behavior that makes the difference, not your feelings. Too many people get screwed up emotionally because they get "told" or even bullied into not being allowed to have their feelings. [kittensaver steps off her soapbox. Carry on.]
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Dec 10, 2013 15:41:45 GMT -5
I certainly don't know the entire story - but at this point in your life this should be fading away into the past
I'd love it to but it's still ongoing. He's 23 years old and hasn't held a job for more than a week. He still lives in my parents' house.
But you don't. It's not ongoing for you, it's done. What he and your parents do is their life, their business. I think you've lost perspective here. It only affects you if you want it to. Frankly, it sounds like you are holding on to these resentments because you are not ready to let them go. They only affect your current life as much as you want them to. She lives across the street from her parents so I'm guessing the close proximity to it all is a big part of the problem.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Dec 10, 2013 15:42:44 GMT -5
Too many people get screwed up because they get "told" or even bullied into not being allowed to have their feelings. That's why DH and I disagree about the whole thing. He tries to logic me out of how I feel. While he provides a different perspective as a former black sheep and that's helpful at times he'll never get my position. His brother and sister would. I don't let how I feel about it run my life. In general I think I've done a pretty good job of not letting it cloud over things, especially my parents and brother's relationship with Gwen. But that doesn't mean I'm not mentally pounding my head on the wall after my mom lists all the reasons it's not brother's fault he lost yet another job. My brother and I had it out and our relationship is still strained today. At some point we might get close again but for now he needs to stay at arm's length. Too much crap is still going on. She lives across the street from her parents so I'm guessing the close proximity to it all is a big part of the problem
Actually if I stay on "my side" of the street things are fine. DH's family drama bleeds into our house more since MIL calls us all the time. It's my brother is at their house ALL THE TIME and it seems like unless he's sleeping there is always some pot stirring. I didn't bring Gwen over for a long time because him and my dad were getting in screaming matches and I refuse to expose her to that. When he's gone, like he is right now, things are awesome. I know it's horrible to say it but life is so much better when my brother is not around. He's like a constant black cloud. It's sad because it wasn't always like this. I'm a lot more vocal about it on here, it doesn't occup much space in my head in RL for the most part. Threads like this make me want to speak up because most people get focused on the black sheep, which is understandable, but it's important to recognize the situation is affecting those around you and acknowledge those people. Don't just assume we're fine because we can "take care of ourselves".
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 10, 2013 15:57:15 GMT -5
But you don't. It's not ongoing for you, it's done. What he and your parents do is their life, their business. I think you've lost perspective here. It only affects you if you want it to. Frankly, it sounds like you are holding on to these resentments because you are not ready to let them go. They only affect your current life as much as you want them to. Not really... Anyone that can go spend time with their family and not subconsciously slip back into family 'roles' and dynamics. I tip my hat to them. The only reason I'm not voicing my feelings as much as Drama is, because I am estranged from my sister at this point and don't hear anything about her from the rest of the family. Personally, I don't know why anyone feels they can tell Drama how she should and shouldn't feel. Neither you nor Miss T know anything about it and can't begin to understand. Again no snark, but Miss T, that's great for your husband. But I would bet anything he's just better than some about keeping them to himself. Honestly, that is not it. He doesn't believe that anyone owes us anythign in life. He is not a jealous or envious kind of guy. And I'm not telling Drama how she should feel. I'm saying i don't think it is normal to hang on to such resentment over something that has no bearing on one's life. But if you all prefer to carry this resentment to your grave, have at it...certainly doesn't impact me at all.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 10, 2013 16:00:12 GMT -5
, but if my grandma's death is anything to go by then I'm in for a lot of harassing phone calls. Then there is a problem if my brother still lives in the house because I'm not going to pay for it. DH and I have already discussed that though and have a plan in place. Do what I did when I had collection agencies calling me and threatening me...well, the first few times I kept a whistle by the phone just becuase they were pissing me off. I blew it in their ear when they gave me attitude (not mature but it made me feel a LOT better!lol). AFter that, I asked for their name and agency and I wrote it down. I told them I wrote it down and that I was forwarding it to my attorney if I had one more harrassing phone call. I am not a guarantor on any of my mom's debt and I will not be harrassed. The calls stopped...I'm not sure what was more effective, the whistle or the threat :-p
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Dec 10, 2013 16:24:03 GMT -5
But if you all prefer to carry this resentment to your grave, have at it...
I'd certainly rather not. I've actually worked really hard to not let my opinion on the subject interfere for Gwen's sake. Life would have been much easier to just slam the door on communication but that isn't fair to Gwen. There is nothing that warrants cutting him out of her life.
It's really hard to fully express all that I think/feel about this. It's a culmination of 5 years worth of dysfunction and that's not going to go away over night.
My brother knows where I stand and in a less nasty way so do my parents. I've said my piece for the most part but I keep the petty stuff to myself. Some things can't be taken back and it serves no purpose to voice some of my uglier thoughts out loud.
I'm hoping he'll get his ass in gear and we can eventually mend fences. I find it depressing when I look at photos of us as kids and think about how things are now.
IMO, it'd do everyone a world of good if he moved out but I know that's not my call. With him there it cycles and the stress bleeds over into everything else. My parents are better about it since I made it clear I won't expose Gwen to the drama, but I'm not stupid. There's a lot of tension underneath the surface.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2013 17:23:13 GMT -5
He does not process social cues the way most of us do...He was going to go into law enforcement . Wanted to work for the DEA. I don't think that's going to happen. Man, a felony absolutely sucks, but at the same time, I'm not sure he would've been a great fit for handling civilian disputes. One of our gaming friends applied for local enforcement; he's tactically very smart, fit, and was in the Navy, but I think he registered as too aggressive and likely to explode situations instead of diffuse them. He got turned down after completing the training. I do agree with others, a lot of field/rig oriented work seems willing to negate a felony if the person is sober with a safe driving record. Field work can pay really well too; I know the drillers made good money, especially for the area. Our lead guy could be pretty rough around the edges, so he loved the autonomy of driving the rigs out to sites with a stable partner he got along with, and just doing stuff at his pace.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Dec 10, 2013 17:27:21 GMT -5
As one of the responsible kids, it does continue to effect your life. When my little brother used to ask my mom for money and she was tapped out, my mom would call me to tell me about youngest brothers latest drama and ask if I could help. When she talks about retirement, she doesn't talk about moving in with the screw-up siblings, you know what I'm saying? The responsible ones get it from both ends. We're assholes if we don't help bail out the younger ones, and we're going to be expected to help take care of our parents who are broke because they keep bailing out the screw-ups.
I haven't seen my mom in a while. She was going to come out here and see her grandkids. Had to cancel at the last minute to help my older sister get her car fixed. My sister is 32 for crying out loud, but my mom gave up her time with her out of state grandchildren to bail her out again.
Yeah, yeah, I'm choosing to be resentful, I'm an adult, blah, blah, blah. It still sucks that my own kids barely know their grandmother because she can't afford to see them and bail out her 25-32 year old kids all the time.
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Dec 10, 2013 17:38:29 GMT -5
He does not process social cues the way most of us do...He was going to go into law enforcement . Wanted to work for the DEA. I don't think that's going to happen. Man, a felony absolutely sucks, but at the same time, I'm not sure he would've been a great fit for handling civilian disputes. One of our gaming friends applied for local enforcement; he's tactically very smart, fit, and was in the Navy, but I think he registered as too aggressive and likely to explode situations instead of diffuse them. He got turned down after completing the training. I do agree with others, a lot of field/rig oriented work seems willing to negate a felony if the person is sober with a safe driving record. Field work can pay really well too; I know the drillers made good money, especially for the area. Our lead guy could be pretty rough around the edges, so he loved the autonomy of driving the rigs out to sites with a stable partner he got along with, and just doing stuff at his pace. ( Truth be told DH and I have said this may be a blessing in disguise. We had faith in the screening procedures but were afraid the kid would somehow end up in undercover work and react to something in an incorrect/inconsistent manner).
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kittensaver
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We cannot do great things. We can only do small things with great love. - Mother Teresa
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Post by kittensaver on Dec 10, 2013 17:56:02 GMT -5
As one of the responsible kids, it does continue to effect your life. When my little brother used to ask my mom for money and she was tapped out, my mom would call me to tell me about youngest brothers latest drama and ask if I could help. When she talks about retirement, she doesn't talk about moving in with the screw-up siblings, you know what I'm saying? The responsible ones get it from both ends. We're assholes if we don't help bail out the younger ones, and we're going to be expected to help take care of our parents who are broke because they keep bailing out the screw-ups.
I haven't seen my mom in a while. She was going to come out here and see her grandkids. Had to cancel at the last minute to help my older sister get her car fixed. My sister is 32 for crying out loud, but my mom gave up her time with her out of state grandchildren to bail her out again. Yeah, yeah, I'm choosing to be resentful, I'm an adult, blah, blah, blah. It still sucks that my own kids barely know their grandmother because she can't afford to see them and bail out her 25-32 year old kids all the time. OMG you sound like my family!
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Dec 10, 2013 18:41:54 GMT -5
I disagree that drama shouldn't tell her parents. I told my mom before she died a LOT of the stuff that had been bugging me including how she treated her stepson like he was god incarnate and me like shit. She TRIED to spin it but I wouldn't let her. Very rewarding for me to get it off my chest.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Dec 10, 2013 18:58:22 GMT -5
Why? Why would she get to "get away" with all the shit she did to me while I was under her roof and even once I escaped? She thought and presented herself as such a great person and a great mom. Family knew the truth. If she had died with me having all the unresolved feelings, I'm the one stuck with those feelings. Telling her how I felt was very freeing. Her memorial service was amazing at how many people she buffaloed that got up and said all these nice things about her. The family just looked at each other in amazement. She always was able to con people. At least once.
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Rocky Mtn Saver
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Post by Rocky Mtn Saver on Dec 10, 2013 19:05:59 GMT -5
There are ways to work out one's unresolved feelings without being cruel. Drama clearly wants to maintain a good relationship with her parents and be a healthy individual. Responding to (perceived or real) slights with an act of cruelty toward her parents would not help with either.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 10, 2013 19:24:38 GMT -5
As one of the responsible kids, it does continue to effect your life. When my little brother used to ask my mom for money and she was tapped out, my mom would call me to tell me about youngest brothers latest drama and ask if I could help. When she talks about retirement, she doesn't talk about moving in with the screw-up siblings, you know what I'm saying? The responsible ones get it from both ends. We're assholes if we don't help bail out the younger ones, and we're going to be expected to help take care of our parents who are broke because they keep bailing out the screw-ups. I haven't seen my mom in a while. She was going to come out here and see her grandkids. Had to cancel at the last minute to help my older sister get her car fixed. My sister is 32 for crying out loud, but my mom gave up her time with her out of state grandchildren to bail her out again. Yeah, yeah, I'm choosing to be resentful, I'm an adult, blah, blah, blah. It still sucks that my own kids barely know their grandmother because she can't afford to see them and bail out her 25-32 year old kids all the time. Why don't you take the kids and go visit her?
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kittensaver
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We cannot do great things. We can only do small things with great love. - Mother Teresa
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Post by kittensaver on Dec 10, 2013 19:26:45 GMT -5
As one of the responsible kids, it does continue to effect your life. When my little brother used to ask my mom for money and she was tapped out, my mom would call me to tell me about youngest brothers latest drama and ask if I could help. When she talks about retirement, she doesn't talk about moving in with the screw-up siblings, you know what I'm saying? The responsible ones get it from both ends. We're assholes if we don't help bail out the younger ones, and we're going to be expected to help take care of our parents who are broke because they keep bailing out the screw-ups. I haven't seen my mom in a while. She was going to come out here and see her grandkids. Had to cancel at the last minute to help my older sister get her car fixed. My sister is 32 for crying out loud, but my mom gave up her time with her out of state grandchildren to bail her out again. Yeah, yeah, I'm choosing to be resentful, I'm an adult, blah, blah, blah. It still sucks that my own kids barely know their grandmother because she can't afford to see them and bail out her 25-32 year old kids all the time. Why don't you take the kids and go visit her? Or Skype once a week?
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geenamercile
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Post by geenamercile on Dec 10, 2013 19:28:44 GMT -5
Drama I'm going to step in and say I think your mom uses you as a sounding board when it comes to your brother. Stop engaging in conversations about him. If he comes up change the subject to something else. Let them know that you are not discussing him anymore, and then bean dip if they keep bringing it up. If they still keep bringing it up, tell them sorry you know I'm not going to talk about this, and leave.
Trust me my aunt and grandma use to do the same with me when it comes to my mom. It annoyed me and caused resentment because it wasn't over, it was ongoing. But once I stopped engaging with the conversations it got better. When they started to talk about her, I would just reply you know how she is..... So what about ____________. It took some time, but our relationships got a lot better.
If your parents know how you feel about it, and they still keep trying to push the issues of you talking about, agreeing with him, and trying to change how you feel about him. And my guess is by telling you all these things he is doing that is what they are trying to do, change the way you feel about him, then the issue isn't so much your brother, what he is doing, or what they are doing but because your parents are not respecting you and your want to stay out of it.
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Rocky Mtn Saver
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Post by Rocky Mtn Saver on Dec 10, 2013 19:32:21 GMT -5
As one of the responsible kids, it does continue to effect your life. When my little brother used to ask my mom for money and she was tapped out, my mom would call me to tell me about youngest brothers latest drama and ask if I could help. When she talks about retirement, she doesn't talk about moving in with the screw-up siblings, you know what I'm saying? The responsible ones get it from both ends. We're assholes if we don't help bail out the younger ones, and we're going to be expected to help take care of our parents who are broke because they keep bailing out the screw-ups. I haven't seen my mom in a while. She was going to come out here and see her grandkids. Had to cancel at the last minute to help my older sister get her car fixed. My sister is 32 for crying out loud, but my mom gave up her time with her out of state grandchildren to bail her out again. Yeah, yeah, I'm choosing to be resentful, I'm an adult, blah, blah, blah. It still sucks that my own kids barely know their grandmother because she can't afford to see them and bail out her 25-32 year old kids all the time. Why don't you take the kids and go visit her? I'd think the new business would be the first problem with that, as well as the lack of funds due to said new business. But the other suggestion might help. It's not the same as being with people in person, but it can help.
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geenamercile
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Post by geenamercile on Dec 10, 2013 19:48:21 GMT -5
I have been on both sides of this coin. For awhile I did hold resentment to my parents, and my brother for everything they got from my grandmother. Sure I had to finish college before I got the money she had set aside for it, and then turn around use that money for the loans I had to take out to finish it. My brother just had to give a sob story how for the 5th time he left his wallet in the car and it got stolen so he couldn't make his insurance payment. My brother was also the golden child for my mom, and as screwed up as she was I still wanted her approval.
Several things changed, one was having my daughter and realizing I was defective as a daughter, but my mother was defective as a mother and that is why I would never get her approval. Two that my grandmother kept telling me all the things she was doing for them for two reasons, she wanted me to say it was okay. She knew that her treatment was unequal, and she felt bad for it, if she could I think she would have given me just as much just to make it equal but it wasn't there and she couldn't let them fall flat. In a way she was wanting my approval. The second reason was she didn't like how they were living anymore, she, or at least as she saw, had a choice between evils and letting them face the consequences was the worse evil. But she still need someone to vent too.
So I ended up doing two things, one I did let her know that I didn't care what she did with her money, and no she didn't owe me anything, she she stopped trying to earn that approval. And two I let her know that I couldn't be her sounding board for venting about them anymore. I just didn't want to hear about them anymore, I didn't want to deal with them in anyway, and really I didn't care. That took a bit more time but once she respected that we had some wonderful conversations about everything. And some of those things I did want to hear, like how much she loved the girls. How happy she was for the life I had, how she did approve of what I have done, I got to hear because we were no longer focused on the other stuff.
Hopefully that made some type of sense.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2013 19:56:00 GMT -5
I'm one of the "responsible" kids and I get it. My brother is the black sheep in our family. He and I had a big blowout a few years ago and I haven't had much to say to him since then. I'm cordial when I see him, mostly because I don't want to ruin family gatherings. His trifling ways still affect me and my life though, because of my Mom. He pissed me off enough that I don't feel all that bad about refusing to deal with him. I can't cut my Mom off completely though, so I hear about the problems and have to decide if I'm going to help her or not. The decisions would be a lot easier if I didn't have to consider how much I'll be enabling an enabler. Sometimes it just gets to be too much and I just stop answering my phone for a while.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Dec 10, 2013 20:05:29 GMT -5
Nope, this happened after my last attempt to win her love and approval and she proceeded to bad mouth my kids. Now if she had any contact with them, I could see it but she had zero except for criticism. Not like they bothered her in any way. Then she fawned all over the little asswipes that her golden step child spewed out. I fumed and then let her have it with both barrels FINALLY. She lived several months after that and I actually felt better. Don't give a damn whether she did or not. Knowing her, it went in one ear and out the other but I sure as hell felt better. Time for it to be ALL ABOUT ME instead of all about her. I live in peace now. Not only because she's dead but because before she died, I let go and realized she was the asswipe who missed out on a good relationship with her daughter and grandchildren.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2013 20:11:47 GMT -5
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Dec 10, 2013 20:19:42 GMT -5
We do visit as often as possible but it's four round trip plane tickets for us to go there and only one for her to come here. Now that I have the store my vacation time has been seriously curtailed.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Dec 10, 2013 20:21:01 GMT -5
And people are saying Drama needs therapy?!
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 10, 2013 20:26:55 GMT -5
And people are saying Drama needs therapy?! Lol! I'm pretty sure we can get a group discount with all the mommy/parent/sibling issues going around:-p
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2013 20:33:18 GMT -5
And people are saying Drama needs therapy?! Aren't you glad she's over it and lives in peace now. It warms the cockles of your heart.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2013 20:37:52 GMT -5
And people are saying Drama needs therapy?! Lol! I'm pretty sure we can get a group discount with all the mommy/parent/sibling issues going around:-p I admit to having my share of issues, but.......... my goodness. I do have a bit of resentment, and maybe I should work on it because I don't want to turn into a bitter, hateful woman.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Dec 10, 2013 20:42:03 GMT -5
Just saying that Drama shouldn't have to suck it up because her parents choose her brother over her. Getting it out is much better than having it fester. Most counselors will tell you to confront your abuser and if unable to, to at least write down your feelings. Confronting my abuser was cathartic. If she had died and I still had unresolved issues, it would be my problem and not hers. This way, it is no ones problem, not mine because I got it out and not hers because she could have cared less anyway. Win-win.
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Ombud
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Post by Ombud on Dec 10, 2013 21:51:02 GMT -5
We do visit as often as possible but it's four round trip plane tickets for us to go there and only one for her to come here. Now that I have the store my vacation time has been seriously curtailed. Bet she'd love to see the store anyway.
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