djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 75,233
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Sept 18, 2013 23:37:49 GMT -5
what say you?
i am thinking stupidest thing ever. if you agree, call your congressperson.
|
|
EVT1
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 30, 2010 16:22:42 GMT -5
Posts: 8,596
|
Post by EVT1 on Sept 18, 2013 23:45:10 GMT -5
They won't do it. The fringe is begging but cooler heads will win. Heard Mark Levin on the way home- and he pretty much screamed his point that this whole debacle is on the 'imperial presidency' of Obama and how he, with his abuse of power, is holding the government hostage by threatening to shut it all down if he doesn't get his way with Obamacare.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Sept 19, 2013 1:30:35 GMT -5
what say you? i am thinking stupidest thing ever. if you agree, call your congressperson. Before you ask me to do that, you'll want to check out the senators and representatives for the state of South-damn-Carolina! There are a few who actually think now and then, but it's not something they do often, as a whole.
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Sept 19, 2013 3:40:37 GMT -5
Shutting down the government would save money.
This is the US Congress we're talking about here. There might still be somebody alive who remembers the last time they did something to save money, but he'd be in his early 100's.
More likely they'll dog-and-pony-show it until the last minute, wait for the markets to tank, load up on stocks, announce that all is well, sell off their stocks on a cool overnight 10% profit, vote themselves a pay raise, double spending, slam back a few tequilas and call it a job well done until six months from now when they do it all over again.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 19, 2013 7:50:21 GMT -5
As far as I'm concerned this is a fight to the death. ObamaCare will be the death knell for the United States, and the GOP has to take it that seriously. If they got off defense for a second, and took their argument to the American people- they'd win it. They need to make key points:
1. We have sent a bill to the Senate which funds the entire government, and even ObamaCare provided no money is borrowed to fund it. The President stated that he would not sign a healthcare bill that adds one dime to the federal deficit, and we took him at his word, and we intend to hold him to that promise.
2. The president, rather than admit that his failed healthcare law, which doesn't even have the support of the AFL-CIO, must be scrapped, intends to play political games with (insert your favorite programs here) which he thinks you are too stupid to see through. While his Democrat-led Senate sits on their hands, and he himself makes no concessions, he intends to play politics and see if he and his party can gain some political advantage from a mess they've created.
3. We intend to stand firm, to fight for America, and to fight for you to save you and our country from this monstrosity he and his party rammed down our throats in the dead of night by a procedural vote along straight party lines. This law has sold deceitfully, upheld by scheming and wordcraft of the Supreme Court, and if not stopped will swallow up not only the healthcare industry, but will destroy jobs, and entire businesses and plunge our nation further into an already unsustainable debt.
4. The law needs to go, it will go, it will not get one dime of funding that adds one dime to the deficit. It turns out this was a promise the president can't keep, and we're here to help make an honest man of him.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 19, 2013 7:54:13 GMT -5
Because the truth of the matter is this: The American People have spoken. They do not want this law. And if the GOP funds it- they own it. ObamaCare will be BoehnerCare if funded. I know the GOP doesn't get this, but I sure wish they did. The Democrats are going to screw around with this until finally ObamaCare- the most unpopular law perhaps in American history besides prohibition, will become a product of the GOP. It's a political dream come true for the Democrats- because they own this piece of shit right now.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 19, 2013 7:57:46 GMT -5
|
|
Otto the Orange
Well-Known Member
Go Orange!
Joined: Aug 23, 2012 4:20:52 GMT -5
Posts: 1,284
|
Post by Otto the Orange on Sept 19, 2013 8:03:40 GMT -5
The whole thing is stupid. Obama care is dieing on its own (or seems to be IMO anyways- with all the carve outs and exceptions and things, and people do see their health prices increasing, hours at work going down below 40 hrs or whatever the threshold is, etc.). why shut down the government over it.
Repubs, if they really do hate the law, should let it go on its path, and if it really is as bad as they think (and I think as well) that is, let it ride and they should be all set for the next pres election as they can point to this (among other things) as an example of why the repubs should ahve a pres.
Also, whatever anyone may think about it, it was passed in both the house and senate, signed by POTUS, and chalenged in court and upheld by SCOTUS
all in all I believe they will once again make a last minute deal on Sep 29, 30th or something real close to the gov shut down deadline.
I just wonder if they realize all the excess costs and trouble they generate by doing this.
|
|
PK Bucko
Junior Associate
Joined: Aug 29, 2011 9:06:37 GMT -5
Posts: 5,098
|
Post by PK Bucko on Sept 19, 2013 8:20:24 GMT -5
Genius.
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 37,512
|
Post by billisonboard on Sept 19, 2013 8:22:34 GMT -5
Because the truth of the matter is this: The American People have spoken. ... Tuesday, November 6, 2012
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 19, 2013 8:25:52 GMT -5
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 19, 2013 8:27:15 GMT -5
Because the truth of the matter is this: The American People have spoken. ... Tuesday, November 6, 2012 ON which day they told the GOP we aren't interested in a Democrat-Lite, mushy moderate who is the defacto AUTHOR OF THIS OBAMACARE LAW. HELLLOOOO!!!
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 37,512
|
Post by billisonboard on Sept 19, 2013 8:28:32 GMT -5
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,345
|
Post by swamp on Sept 19, 2013 8:30:04 GMT -5
Yes, until they realize how it actually effects them, and then they'll scream about whatever being shut down when they need it.
|
|
Tennesseer
Member Emeritus
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 21:58:42 GMT -5
Posts: 63,612
|
Post by Tennesseer on Sept 19, 2013 8:33:09 GMT -5
|
|
Otto the Orange
Well-Known Member
Go Orange!
Joined: Aug 23, 2012 4:20:52 GMT -5
Posts: 1,284
|
Post by Otto the Orange on Sept 19, 2013 8:55:20 GMT -5
So because something is unpopular it should be defunded?
So I guess you would have no problems if the wars had been defunded?
|
|
usaone
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 9:10:23 GMT -5
Posts: 3,429
|
Post by usaone on Sept 19, 2013 9:41:32 GMT -5
Because the truth of the matter is this: The American People have spoken. They do not want this law. And if the GOP funds it- they own it. ObamaCare will be BoehnerCare if funded. I know the GOP doesn't get this, but I sure wish they did. The Democrats are going to screw around with this until finally ObamaCare- the most unpopular law perhaps in American history besides prohibition, will become a product of the GOP. It's a political dream come true for the Democrats- because they own this piece of shit right now. The American people spoke in 2012. The Obamacare is here to stay. Some parts of the law have already been in effect for over two years. It will be tweaked like any other bill has, but its going to be funded and continue.
|
|
sesfw
Junior Associate
Today is the first day of the rest of my life
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 15:45:17 GMT -5
Posts: 6,268
|
Post by sesfw on Sept 19, 2013 10:07:27 GMT -5
'but its going to be funded and continue.'
Only if ALL members of the three branches of government are required to participate.
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 37,512
|
Post by billisonboard on Sept 19, 2013 10:26:40 GMT -5
|
|
Deleted
Joined: May 17, 2024 23:50:29 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2013 10:31:13 GMT -5
Shutting down the government would save money. This is the US Congress we're talking about here. There might still be somebody alive who remembers the last time they did something to save money, but he'd be in his early 100's. More likely they'll dog-and-pony-show it until the last minute, wait for the markets to tank, load up on stocks, announce that all is well, sell off their stocks on a cool overnight 10% profit, vote themselves a pay raise, double spending, slam back a few tequilas and call it a job well done until six months from now when they do it all over again. Sad but true.
|
|
Angel!
Senior Associate
Politics Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 11:44:08 GMT -5
Posts: 10,722
|
Post by Angel! on Sept 19, 2013 11:02:12 GMT -5
Stupid if they follow through with the shutdown, but I don't believe they will. The GOP came out looking really bad at their last threat to shutdown an our credit rating suffered. Not sure why they believe the results this time will be different.
The law isn't going anywhere. It will be modified, but it is here to stay. GOP probably views this as their last opportunity because people won't be nearly so against the law when the exchanges are up and they find they are able to purchase affordable insurance for their families.
|
|
jkapp
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 23, 2010 12:05:08 GMT -5
Posts: 5,416
|
Post by jkapp on Sept 19, 2013 11:10:29 GMT -5
Stupid if they follow through with the shutdown, but I don't believe they will. The GOP came out looking really bad at their last threat to shutdown an our credit rating suffered. Not sure why they believe the results this time will be different. The law isn't going anywhere. It will be modified, but it is here to stay. GOP probably views this as their last opportunity because people won't be nearly so against the law when the exchanges are up and they find they are able to purchase affordable insurance for their families.I am predicting a much different outcome...the ACA will be such a mess for so many years, people won't know what the hell is going on. The exchanges will be a mess, people wil be set up incorrectly, they will find out they received too much subsidy and get pissed that they owe money back, etc, etc. Its a huge clusterfuck of a bill that bites off far more than the government (and the people) can chew. That's one thing government is always bad at - doing too much at once.
|
|
jkapp
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 23, 2010 12:05:08 GMT -5
Posts: 5,416
|
Post by jkapp on Sept 19, 2013 11:16:09 GMT -5
what say you? i am thinking stupidest thing ever. if you agree, call your congressperson. As for the OP, IMO it doesn't matter one way or the other. If it gets shut down for a day or even a week, some people will get inconvenienced, but most people's day will go by without even realizing anything had happened. If someone is seriously affected, then that just shows that sad state of affairs when people rely on government that much...
|
|
Deleted
Joined: May 17, 2024 23:50:29 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2013 11:16:13 GMT -5
this battle is going to be interesting WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Republicans in the House of Representatives set in motion on Wednesday a plan that ultimately could avert a federal government shutdown on October 1, turning a later battle over the debt ceiling into the main event in the conservative struggle against President Barack Obama's healthcare program. Obama accused Republicans of engaging in extortion by demanding a delay in "Obamacare" as the price of avoiding default that, were it to happen, would smash the U.S. economy. "You have never seen in the history of the United States the debt ceiling or the threat of not raising the debt ceiling being used to extort a President or a governing party," Obama told a group of business leaders. Undaunted, Republicans said Wednesday they would add other demands to their list, including approval of the Keystone oil pipeline. The action on the two separate measures, to continue funding the government and increase the government's borrowing authority by raising the debt ceiling, may begin as early as this week in the House, starting with the funding measure on Thursday or Friday. The debt ceiling, which could come up next week, is far more consequential because it could rattle world markets and lead to a downgrade of the government's credit rating or to default. Without Congress' approval, the government will be unable to borrow money to pay its debts sometime in mid-October, according to the Treasury Department. "A government shutdown, and perhaps even more so a failure to raise the debt limit, could have very serious consequences for the financial markets and for the economy," Fed chairman Ben Bernanke warned at a news conference. In an ominous move, Republicans said they will include in their temporary spending plan a provision they claim will prevent a debt default if Congress does not raise the debt limit on time. news.yahoo.com/republicans-pressure-boehner-vote-delay-defund-obamacare-001129407--business.htmlwhat i heard yesterday is that the normal shutdown wont happen....it basically will be a FULL shutdown anyone else heard anything similar.....normally essential stuff continues no matter what military, social security, fbi, homeland security, etc IF that is the plan as i heard.....then this one will be different......
|
|
Angel!
Senior Associate
Politics Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 11:44:08 GMT -5
Posts: 10,722
|
Post by Angel! on Sept 19, 2013 11:20:51 GMT -5
Stupid if they follow through with the shutdown, but I don't believe they will. The GOP came out looking really bad at their last threat to shutdown an our credit rating suffered. Not sure why they believe the results this time will be different. The law isn't going anywhere. It will be modified, but it is here to stay. GOP probably views this as their last opportunity because people won't be nearly so against the law when the exchanges are up and they find they are able to purchase affordable insurance for their families.I am predicting a much different outcome...the ACA will be such a mess for so many years, people won't know what the hell is going on. The exchanges will be a mess, people wil be set up incorrectly, they will find out they received too much subsidy and get pissed that they owe money back, etc, etc. Its a huge clusterfuck of a bill that bites off far more than the government (and the people) can chew. That's one thing government is always bad at - doing too much at once. I guess we will see soon. 12 more days until the exchanges open.
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Sept 19, 2013 11:33:50 GMT -5
I am predicting a much different outcome...the ACA will be such a mess for so many years, people won't know what the hell is going on. The exchanges will be a mess, people wil be set up incorrectly, they will find out they received too much subsidy and get pissed that they owe money back, etc, etc. Its a huge clusterfuck of a bill that bites off far more than the government (and the people) can chew. That's one thing government is always bad at - doing too much at once. I guess we will see soon. 12 more days until the exchanges open. My guess is you'll have anybody sick and dying racing to sign up and everybody else knocking back a cold one.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 75,233
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Sept 19, 2013 12:04:14 GMT -5
As far as I'm concerned this is a fight to the death. ObamaCare will be the death knell for the United States, and the GOP has to take it that seriously. . as far as i am concerned, that is an insane idea. shutting down the government and defaulting on our obligations would, however, be the fiscal death knell, indeed.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 75,233
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Sept 19, 2013 12:07:31 GMT -5
Stupid if they follow through with the shutdown, but I don't believe they will. i don't see any indication that they WON'T.
|
|
Angel!
Senior Associate
Politics Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 11:44:08 GMT -5
Posts: 10,722
|
Post by Angel! on Sept 19, 2013 12:58:34 GMT -5
Stupid if they follow through with the shutdown, but I don't believe they will. i don't see any indication that they WON'T. Is this time different than the previous times they threatened to shutdown? I figures it was more of the same song and dance, but maybe I am missing information.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 75,233
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Sept 19, 2013 13:09:16 GMT -5
i don't see any indication that they WON'T. Is this time different than the previous times they threatened to shutdown? I figures it was more of the same song and dance, but maybe I am missing information. yes. the loud long moaning about repealing Obamacare is a major factor this time. here is how i view it: Said Ornstein: “The bizarreness of this monomaniacal focus on Obamacare, given that it is fundamentally a Republican program from the 1990s mixed in with Romneycare,” says it all. “Obamacare relies on the private sector; there is no public option. That you are willing to bring the country to its knees to sabotage it … just shows this is a party that has gone off the rails.”Ornstein wrote a book on how extremist politics is killing our political system.
|
|