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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:11:05 GMT -5
Stay Put Message #1539 - 07/27/10 09:09 PMWithin weeks of the January 2009 completion of the merger, the government awarded Bank of America $20 billion in bailout cash under the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) over and above the $25 billion that had been given the bank in October of 2008. The government also agreed to guarantee over $300 billion on Bank of America assets. Frank declared that he saw “no villains” in the takeover deal. On the Senate side, Chairman Dodd used his opening statement to posture as an advocate for laid off workers and families facing foreclosure, praising the progress in stabilizing the banks but complaining that the recovery was one-sided. There should be more balance, he said, so that the “other half”—namely, the broad mass of the American people—also benefitted. He took pains, however, to combine this criticism with a testimonial to Bernanke’s service to the country. “Mr. Chairman,” he said, “all of us understand the importance of the work you are doing—and that’s not just a platitude or a generous comment. And we all look forward to continuing to partner with you in this effort.” No one at either hearing raised the charges leveled Monday by the special inspector general for TARP, Neil Barofsky, that TARP funds were being misused by the banks. Nor did any congressman or senator cite his denunciation of the Obama administration for refusing to compel the banks to reveal how the bailout funds are being used. In his report, Barofsky estimated the total in government funds allocated for the various bailout programs at $23.7 trillion. This article taken from a Socialist Rag Socialist Rag
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:15:16 GMT -5
ReformedDayTrade Message #1540 - 07/27/10 09:55 PM
However, he called a second economic stimulus package “premature” and proposed no measures either to provide immediate relief for the millions hit by plant closures, layoffs, and the collapse of home values and savings, or to allocate government funds to create new jobs. Nor did he propose any measures to compel the banks, which have received more than $200 billion in taxpayer cash and trillions more in low-interest loans, subsidies and government backing for their debt, to increase their lending and make credit available to working families.
The Fed chairman forecast a slight growth in the US economy by the end of 2009 and a gradual acceleration in 2010 and 2011. But he said the central bank, which cut its key interest rate to near zero last December, would continue to hold interest rates at record lows “for an extended period.”
Bernanke acknowledged that “financial conditions remain stressed, and many households and businesses are finding credit difficult to obtain.” In response to a question about the prospects for a jobs recovery, he said, “We have a very long haul here. Unemployment is going to stay high for quite a while, and so it’s not going to feel really like a strong economy.”
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:16:21 GMT -5
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:17:01 GMT -5
fiscan Message #1542 - 07/28/10 06:56 AM
Link doesn't work Goob. That site is a good source of info though and its true the comments are great. Tyler actually posts here sometimes.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:17:39 GMT -5
Goober Steve Message #1543 - 07/28/10 08:56 AMI'll check out the bad link? but heer is another one that is just as good www.zerohedge.com/article/daily-propaganda-just-getting-painful The Illusions are getting so obvious it is rather sickening. The lies on top of lies are compounding........... or ;D not sure which? Maybe both if your trading on the swings.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:18:40 GMT -5
Goober Steve Message #1544 - 07/28/10 08:59 AM
The comments are as good as the article. The people at that site can and do actually say what they want to say, kinda like grown ups and big boys? So I spend way more time there. ;D
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:19:20 GMT -5
ReformedDayTrade Message #1545 - 07/28/10 09:06 AM
One of the most important lessons I learned in Finance 101 taught by Dr. Flumiani at BC was to admit mistakes. He always said that investing is a game of odds. Unfortunately most of us have a hard time admitting we own dogs or losing investments and cutting our losses. So instead the good Dr. suggested to capitalize on your dogs by selling them and using the losses to offset up to @$3,000.00 of ordinary income annually and an unlimited amount of future capital gains.
But the first step is to admit you own losers...
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:19:51 GMT -5
Goober Steve Message #1546 - 07/28/10 09:21 AM
That article is up at ZH on the second page of articles. I relinked it and it won't post on this site? Someone is apparently messing with my links? I have no idea why it won't work but I cannot go back into my post and do anything? Could be the mind/brain police, I've been making too much sense lately and we can't have that? There are people here in the power structure that inflict their political views by screwing with posters stuff? I've seen it happen too many times. I have reframed the questions that we all should be asking the REGRESSIVES, if you want this policy will you be responsible for the people harmed as in murder and rape of US citizens by illegal aliens? This is of course just one issue and this logic/reason can be applied to any policy or actions. We simply need to hold the backward thinkers to a higher standard of truth and reality and insist on ACCOUNTABILITY and not let them get away with their double standards. It is up to us to do that because that is where any political accountability will start is with us DEMANDING IT, INSISTING ON IT ! BY not letting them get away with it and framing the questions wrongly in the first place. The same logic can be applied to Reps that do the same thing. They are not progressive thinkers they are REGRESSIVE thinkers.................. ;D
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:20:32 GMT -5
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:21:18 GMT -5
Goober Steve Message #1548 - 07/28/10 09:28 AM
Nope. Apparently the ZH site is whacky on this one? But it is up on their site on second page of post .............ZERO HEDGE and an excellent read, By the way, Tyler Durden is not a real person, it is a pseudonym. There is a vey good reason for that but many here would not understand or believe.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:21:50 GMT -5
fiscan Message #1549 - 07/28/10 10:35 AM
No big deal Goob. I'll find it over at ZH when I get a few minutes.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 22:22:34 GMT -5
cedaredge Message #1550 - 07/28/10 01:44 PM
More importantly will Fiscan have his dining room floor fixed BEFORE the "economic collapse happens?
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Post by stayput on Dec 28, 2010 22:54:33 GMT -5
traelin0, this has become an obsession for you my friend. I'm starting to worry.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 28, 2010 23:02:49 GMT -5
traelin0, this has become an obsession for you my friend. I'm starting to worry. Indeed. Once I hit ~500 posts, there was no turning back. I'm at 1550/1936 so all is good, I should have it completed before the New Year. It's the second most prolific thread on the MSN boards; second only to O&G's Tsunami thread, but for different reasons of course, LOL. Have you had the opportunity to go back through some of it? You should. Goob is da man.
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Post by stayput on Dec 28, 2010 23:07:44 GMT -5
No. Like most professional actors, I do not watch myself after my performances. I leave that to film historians like yourself.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 29, 2010 10:24:55 GMT -5
Um, I hate to come here and burst bubbles-- well, no I really don't. Anyway, it's gonna be a long time before any thread surpasses the glory and greatness of my "National Security IS the Economy" thread. I think that thread had 8,000 + posts the last time I saw it. It was ridiculous.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 29, 2010 10:41:42 GMT -5
ReformedDayTrade Message #1545 - 07/28/10 09:06 AMOne of the most important lessons I learned in Finance 101 taught by Dr. Flumiani at BC was to admit mistakes. He always said that investing is a game of odds. Unfortunately most of us have a hard time admitting we own dogs or losing investments and cutting our losses. So instead the good Dr. suggested to capitalize on your dogs by selling them and using the losses to offset up to @$3,000.00 of ordinary income annually and an unlimited amount of future capital gains. But the first step is to admit you own losers... Well, I'm not a stock trader- but this is true in all kinds of investing and life in general: FAIL FAST. You're going to fail. The only people that never fail are people that never attempt anything. So, WHEN you fail, because you will fail, you have to recognize it and accept it as early as possible. If you don't admit it-- because of your biases and ego (like if you expect a stock to go up, will your need to be "right", and inability to admit you were "wrong" prevent you from noticing that it's plummeting so you can sell it-- or are you going to ride it all the way down? With my own real estate investments, I always try to eat mistakes early. I've bought numerous "dogs", and I don't worry about "what I have into it" and use that as a basis to price it where "I get what I need" out of it. Sorry, but what I "need" has nothing to do with what the market will bear. If I'm wrong- I'm wrong. I sell it the best I can (or rent it), and I try to minimize the losses-- and the most important loss to stem immediately is TIME. Losing money sucks, but losing a lot of TIME in the process of an inevitable monetary loss is SO MUCH WORSE! I still have a POS property in Rockford, IL that I should have SOLD at the height of the bubble in March of 2007 when I had a huge list of buyers with credit, and was getting offers. My mistake? I wanted to make $15K on it and I couldn't get an offer that cleared $10K so I held out. STUPID, STUPID, STUPID!!! Now, in a best case scenario I could possibly sell this year at about a $20K loss- but it's more likely I'll lose $25K or $30K if I sell this year. I can keep renting it out-- which is my break even proposition. I clear about $50 a month renting it out making it not worth the trouble or the risk. And Rockford, IL is NOT going to recover- EVER. It was circling the drain for 25 years BEFORE this economic calamity-- and now it's going down the drain and the State of Illinois is BANKRUPT. When I bought the property something in the back of my mind told me that Rockford was built on a shakey economic foundation-- one of the last rust belt relics. I didn't listen to my gut because I was greedy. I wanted to believe the goofy ideas of the prophets of the "new economy", and promoters of the housing bubble. I called it being "open minded" and "realistic" telling myself that just because "economic reality" didn't line up with my own rock solid knowledge of geniune economics. And I've learned: the American economy is NOT invulnerable. It's in collapse now, and this year we're going to begin the slipping and sliding back into the maylaise of the Carter economy during this Jimmy Carter's second term. I will NOT buy the BS being promulgated out to the sheeple that we are in a recovery-- we are not. Year over year "growth" when the economy of last year was terrible is NOT indicative of growth; and rising energy prices do not bode well for a good 2011. I'm rambling. Sorry.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 11:14:50 GMT -5
Um, I hate to come here and burst bubbles-- well, no I really don't. Anyway, it's gonna be a long time before any thread surpasses the glory and greatness of my "National Security IS the Economy" thread. I think that thread had 8,000 + posts the last time I saw it. It was ridiculous. Prolific != number of posts.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:17:28 GMT -5
cedaredge Message #1551 - 07/28/10 01:49 PMThis is what happens when the state of New Jersey's DOT hires someone like Savior-Faire to handle the toilet paper ordering........................
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:18:13 GMT -5
Stay Put Message #1552 - 07/29/10 03:55 PM
Actually, this is what happens when states across this entire nation, who have been trying to hide their inevitable collapse start having this fact oozing out in various areas. In my opinion, with the all of the $h17 that every American is going to be forced to face, for many years to come, you would think that toilet paper would be the last service to disappear.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:19:47 GMT -5
ReformedDayTrade Message #1553 - 07/30/10 07:48 AMReal gross domestic product -- the output of goods and services produced by labor and property located in the United States -- increased at an annual rate of 2.4 percent in the second quarter of 2010, (that is, from the first quarter to the second quarter), according to the "advance" estimate released by the Bureau of Economic Analysis. In the first quarter, real GDP increased 3.7 percent. The Bureau emphasized that the second-quarter advance estimate released today is based on source data that are incomplete or subject to further revision by the source agency (see the box on page 3). The "second" estimate for the second quarter, based on more complete data, will be released on August 27, 2010. www.bea.gov/newsreleases/national/gdp/2010/gdp2q10_adv.htm
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:20:48 GMT -5
Stay Put Message #1554 - 07/30/10 02:23 PM
Brought to you by the very same people that tell us that the jobs are not coming back, unemployment isn't stopping but out of the nearly half a million a month lost jobs, 16,000 more people kept their jobs this month than last month. The same people that keep telling us that we are supposedly in a recovery, but we have to keep spending trillions in stimulus or the economy will crash. The same people who want us to believe their "money saved is money earned" mantra, by trying to sell the American people that corporations are making profits, when in fact these supposed profits directly equate to the money no longer being spent on the same people who have been laid off in the form of wages, salaries, benefits, taxes, etc. and the list of total distortions across the board too numerous to reiterate.................................
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:21:27 GMT -5
deziloooooo Message #1555 - 07/30/10 03:20 PM
I am a baseball nut, watch a lot of it and had a thought just last night.
Was watching the four game series from California, Marlins/ Giants. Every game had over 38, 000, Last night a sell out of 41 thousand, all those people spending all that money they don't have, Beer at $7 per, Hotdogs at $6 pls all the other fun stuff, in the bankrupt state of California, I know not definitive but where is all the $ coming from?
{ No I do't think they were mostly all Illegals spending their ill gained $}
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:22:26 GMT -5
traelin0 Message #1556 - 07/30/10 03:23 PM
Good question, I asked myself this plenty of times until it struck me a couple years ago. Do you know what the highest box office grossing film of all time is, when adjusted for inflation (even the gimmicked CPI), and when it was released?
When times are horrible, humans like to bury their heads in the sand and escape, to the point of total denial of the obvious. A la upbeat music, good movie flicks, and sporting events. On the one hand it's great for the culture of a nation. On the other hand, per your example, perhaps those Floridians with record foreclosure levels, short sales, stagnating salaries, double-digit unemployment and BKs should be saving that baseball money for a U-Haul and a one-way ticket to a location with jobs.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:23:01 GMT -5
deziloooooo Message #1557 - 07/30/10 05:08 PM
Actually , possible why we have so few people come to the Marlins games , might not be the lousy venue, {Football Stadium}, no cover, rain showers every day and the heat. We'll have to wait till 2012 when new AC conditioned stadium with moving roof opens to see if more show up if any one is left here, be interesting to see.
Actually, I think as bad as it is for many people , many , majority are still doing pretty well and all the nay sayers are here and other sites like it moaning and groaning waiting for the revolution.
Something i have found out in my life, we are a pretty large, powerful and well off country , with all the faults we have, most people are enjoying their life unlike so many found here with their thoughts of doom and gloom.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:24:29 GMT -5
traelin0 Message #1558 - 07/30/10 06:48 PM
Obviously even during depressions worse than this one, more people are employed than not. The crippling issue this time is that there would be more unemployed if we didn't have a socialist backstop, but with the caveat that a less expansive govt. would not have been there to prolong the pain. And the problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.
We have run out of all our money, and nearly run out of other people's money.
And perhaps this time is NOT different than any other historical comparison. After all, human beings haven't changed. Let's just assume for the sake of argument that people who think as I do have done absolutely no research and don't know what they're talking about. What makes you think, even if we are completely off our rockers, that this time is different than every other imperial collapse spawned by byzantine/socialist (pun intended) govt.? Where is the productive capacity going to come from, since it is impossible for a govt. that is not (yet) completely fascist to produce anything? There is limited capital and finite resources, and we have used up all our productive capacity seizing everyone else's resources. What makes you think the rest of the world (read: China) is going to continue funding it? Clearly if this were sustainable, we wouldn't need to tap the rest of the world to fund half our debt, right?
Maybe, just maybe, it's a matter of common sense and not doom and gloom. At least not for all of us. Here's a question that's been bothering me recently. Let's just say a miracle of miracles occurs and we do have a currency crisis. Should I feel sorry for those who didn't listen to my advice? And if so, why?
Here's another question. Since America has been successful in the past, does that mean the party will never end?
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:25:08 GMT -5
Value-Buy Message #1559 - 07/30/10 09:02 PM
Well, the economic collapse did not happen.
Came close, but did not happen.
This year, I have made more dollars getting in and out of the market than I made in the previous 10 years with the buy and hold strategy.
Never did buy any corn futures either.......
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:26:05 GMT -5
Stay Put Message #1560 - 07/30/10 09:52 PM
Focusing on the profits, as opposed to the volatility that created those profits is extremely short sighted. When was the last time in the markets history, did the markets look anything like they have over the past year and a half? Over all I mean. Let me see. Oh, here's one. 1929 -31. Again in the 1870's. Now, what was it that followed those market patterns, back then, and exactly what outside of stimulus, and the complete lack of any real industry left in America (today) is different between past patterns and today.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:30:32 GMT -5
ReformedDayTrade Message #1561 - 07/31/10 05:46 AM2009 Decline Widespread Across Industries Advance GDP by Industry Statistics for 2009 and Revised Statistics for 1998-2008 Downturns in durable-goods manufacturing and finance and insurance and a continued contraction in construction were the leading contributors to the downturn in U.S. economic growth in 2009, according to preliminary statistics on the breakout of real gross domestic product (GDP) by industry from the Bureau of Economic Analysis. The economic downturn was widespread: 15 of 22 industry groups contributed to the decline in real GDP growth. - Manufacturing value added—a measure of an industry’s contribution to GDP—fell 5.9 percent in 2009, a sharper decline than the 3.6 percent drop in 2008. Durable-goods manufacturing turned down for the first time since 2001, decreasing 7.5 percent after growing 0.3 percent in 2008. Nondurable-goods manufacturing fell 3.8 percent, a slower decline than the 8.2 percent drop in 2008.
- Construction value added fell 9.9 percent in 2009, reflecting declines in residential and nonresidential activity. Construction contracted for the fifth consecutive year.
- Finance and insurance value added dropped 2.7 percent in 2009, after increasing 3.2 percent in 2008.
Prices:Declines in value added prices for mining and agriculture and a sharp deceleration in prices for nondurable-goods manufacturing were the largest contributors to the slowdown in the GDP price index for 2009. Value added prices measure changes in an industry’s labor and capital input prices, including profit margins. - Value added prices for mining fell sharply in 2009, decreasing 27.4 percent after increasing 26.4 percent in 2008, primarily reflecting decreases in prices for petroleum.
- Value added prices for agriculture industries fell 20.1 percent in 2009, after increasing 1.4 percent in 2008, primarily reflecting decreases in prices for crops and livestock.
- Growth in value added prices for finance and insurance and real estate partially offset the sharp declines in prices for mining and agriculture.
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Post by traelin0 on Dec 29, 2010 21:31:15 GMT -5
Veteran_Lender Message #1562 - 07/31/10 07:31 AM
Talking Head News displayed some charts and graphs on last night's show. While ALL THREE markets grew an interesting 7% in July, the glaring piece was less obvious... people buying things has trailed off to nothing. It should occur to most that it has come down to: JOBS or DEPRESSION. Summer is always an interesting time because people have a weather advantage to thwart commercial reliance with. In 20 days, there will be the push for "back to school" but nearly 100% of schools are reporting reduced fall enrollments. Churches did not have good VBS attendance. The variables are narrowing. Before we see recovery, we will need to see a lot of retro-fitting in big business or their collapse. We don't have the wealth of small to mid-sized businesses in place to sustain a trickle-up replacement mechanism.
I've been saying for quite some time now... your money in the markets, bonds, funds and all other stagnant vessels... is in danger. It is worthless without an equivalency in use and flowing through society. Somebody will absolutely lose here. Society won't, it can change currencies if it needs to. Wealth has no choice and no voice when the scales tips too far. Figure it out-- you lived well. Now it's time to put it back so others can.
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