Alarming drop in lifespan of poor American whites

[Deleted]

I thought there were dental screenings near me? Maybe i'm wrong. I know there are certain years, as a homeschooler, i am required to have my kids have a dental screening (no prob, they go every 6 months and i just stick it in my log every year) ... but those requirements are generally set up to mirror the in school requirements. ?

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Sept 22, 2012 11:09:48 GMT -5 GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl said:

Sept 22, 2012 10:20:37 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

This would likely raise all kinds of constitutional rights issues, but maybe there should be a consent section on the emergency contact form that requires the parent to *opt out* rather than opt in for a visit to the dental van (or any health care service the school might arrange). The school should obviously broadcast the new consent section loudly and obviously, and a few parents will still miss the news, but that way nearly every kid will get a visit to the van and no one will know which ones really needed it (financially and/or medically).

I also wonder whether legislation might help. My kids get vision, hearing, and scoliosis hearings in school by law. Why not add dental screenings to the list? As I said above, the stigma is removed if every kid is getting the same treatment, kwim?

Hmmm, I wonder if everyone goes for a pre screening and the kids that have issues are given consent forms to treat, if this would work. There would probably be a certain amount of tooth gnashing and the resources required to screen 100% at each school could be substantial. But at this point, dental pain is one of the biggest reasons for loss of school days by students in the US.

[Deleted]

Sept 22, 2012 11:05:33 GMT -5 Tiny said:

I see this with 'health' among my friends (we're rapidly approaching 50) - they seem to accept the 'reality' that they are 50 pounds or more overweight - that their bodies ache, that they don't sleep well, that they have more heartburn and more medications to take. They don't have any energy to do stuff either. It's been a slow progressive descent over years. And they seem to accept that that's the way it is. They do nothing to change their future or their present.

I know what you mean. I'm a poster child for healthy living and I'm almost 60, but I come from a family of people with very good health habits. I suppose that if you're surrounded by friends and family who retain 20 lbs. of pregnancy weight after each baby, become barrel-shaped after "the change", all have finger-stick monitors for their diabetes and know how to get "free" scooters when it's too hard to get around anymore, that's your expectation, too. My own mother had 5 kids and brags that she never wore maternity clothes home from the hospital. I bellieve her- she hated them!

[BeenThere...DoneThat...]

...I beginning to wonder if this thread would read the same if we were discussing "No Child Left Behind" issues...

[midjd]

I agree with Athena and others that people stick with what they know. If you're raised on a diet of microwaved foods, you probably don't know how to cook most of the stuff you see in the store. And you KNOW the microwaved foods are easy, so you're not going to bother with the veggie aisle.

My diet expanded a lot when we lived near several Jamaican open-air markets and I would buy random foods and then have to come home and Google to see what to do with them

Also the issue that many low-income people don't have access to the same cooking facilities many of us take for granted. A lot of people in this area live in rent-by-the-week hotels that don't permit hot plates or anything more than a mini-fridge...

[dannylion]

Sept 22, 2012 10:20:37 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Sept 21, 2012 20:20:13 GMT -5 jaya3300 said:

I've worked with the staff of a mobile dental truck before in an urban setting. What I've noticed is that parents don't access these services for the following reasons 1. they don't want to take their children out of school 2. they can't take the time off work to take their children to the dental appointments 3. the flyer, permission form, etc is in english which is not their primary language 4. they're ashamed to seek help 5. they're afraid to seek help 6. they don't believe that dental care is important 7. they're not aware that the service is offered

The mobile van sponsored by the university that I went out on went directly to the schools. The children are taken out of their free period of school for care. So kids don' miss school and parents don't miss work. Permission form is in several languages. The consent to treat form is in the package of papers that the kids take home from school, then they do a separate form a couple of weeks before the van is due to arrive. The form can be returned and no one other than the dental people would know the difference. As we are bound by HIPAA, nothing is discussed with the school, other than which students we need. As the students also sign up to receive free lunch, how ashamed could they be? The van deliberately chooses schools where >80% receives free lunch.

Oh, and we publicize quite well. There are radio spots, TV spots, there are blurbs in papers. We have staff showing at open house before school starts talking about the services.

Still, a 10% consent return rate.

This leads me to wonder whether the right media outlets are being used. Are the annoucements being made on mainstream stations and in the big newspapers, or are they being targeted to the stations and news outlets that serve the population that needs the services? Maybe they're not hearing the message because it's not being broadcast on media they use. If the announcements are targeted to outlets that serve the target communities, are the services being described in a way that will lead the target audience to take the desired action?

Another method to get buy-in by the target audience is to find the community arbiter in each community. Since the announcements are printed in several languages, it would seem that the target audience is not monolithic but rather a collection of smaller communities. Each community probably has a few members that the others look to for guidance or advice. Reaching out to those people and getting them on board and using them as conduits for information could improve communication between the providers of services and the people who need them. Are the foreign-language announcements translated from English by members of the target communities or by educated mainstream speakers of those languages? The two groups often communicate in vastly different ways, so just preparing an announcement in English and having it translated into, for example, Hmong by an educated speaker of Hmong or an English speaker who has learned Hmong is not necessarily going to convey the message in a way that the parent of a child in an impoverished Hmong family is going to understand or accept. Finding the people in the target communities that others look to for guidance and get them involved could improve participation.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Sept 22, 2012 12:28:17 GMT -5 dannylion said:

Sept 22, 2012 10:20:37 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

The mobile van sponsored by the university that I went out on went directly to the schools. The children are taken out of their free period of school for care. So kids don' miss school and parents don't miss work. Permission form is in several languages. The consent to treat form is in the package of papers that the kids take home from school, then they do a separate form a couple of weeks before the van is due to arrive. The form can be returned and no one other than the dental people would know the difference. As we are bound by HIPAA, nothing is discussed with the school, other than which students we need. As the students also sign up to receive free lunch, how ashamed could they be? The van deliberately chooses schools where >80% receives free lunch.

Oh, and we publicize quite well. There are radio spots, TV spots, there are blurbs in papers. We have staff showing at open house before school starts talking about the services.

Still, a 10% consent return rate.

This leads me to wonder whether the right media outlets are being used. Are the annoucements being made on mainstream stations and in the big newspapers, or are they being targeted to the stations and news outlets that serve the population that needs the services? Maybe they're not hearing the message because it's not being broadcast on media they use. If the announcements are targeted to outlets that serve the target communities, are the services being described in a way that will lead the target audience to take the desired action?

Another method to get buy-in by the target audience is to find the community arbiter in each community. Since the announcements are printed in several languages, it would seem that the target audience is not monolithic but rather a collection of smaller communities. Each community probably has a few members that the others look to for guidance or advice. Reaching out to those people and getting them on board and using them as conduits for information could improve communication between the providers of services and the people who need them. Are the foreign-language announcements translated from English by members of the target communities or by educated mainstream speakers of those languages? The two groups often communicate in vastly different ways, so just preparing an announcement in English and having it translated into, for example, Hmong by an educated speaker of Hmong or an English speaker who has learned Hmong is not necessarily going to convey the message in a way that the parent of a child in an impoverished Hmong family is going to understand or accept. Finding the people in the target communities that others look to for guidance and get them involved could improve participation.

Language difficulty not the problem. 90% of the population is US born and speak English. There is a smattering of Hispanic, and the problem is not there, as greater than 90% of the eligible kids participate.

The staff has tried community centers, still very poor participation. They've tried medical offices, emergency rooms, grocery stores and any place else that they can think of.

[Deleted]

Sept 22, 2012 12:17:23 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

Well, what you just said gave me chills, because my mom, also having had 5 kids, used to say the same thing to me.
Sis? Is that you? ;D

Unless you're an OB/Gyn in SC, I doubt it! There were alot of women who had 5 kids in the 1950s (my age group) and docs were ridiculously strict about weight gain. One Aunt said that her doc limited women to an 18-lb. weight gain during the entire pregnancy. Another friend said that her doc put her on diet pills because she gained too much weight The resulting baby was a real crab, she told me.

But that's another area where we may have gone way too far to the other side. They're so lax about what women gain during pregnancy these days that they end up with excess weight after delivery, and the resulting health problems decades later.

[Deleted]

Some of these posts are funny, i think.

In general i don't think there is great public education on dental health and how teeth problems can be systemic and cause whole system issues. Without that emphasis, and as someone stated, with the opinion that 'baby teeth fall out anyway' ... it probably is hard to get parents who aren't educated to know better, to worry about it...

[mrsdutt]

Has anyone traced this group back to Viet Nam and Agent Orange? The uneducated went to war, the educated got deferments.

A large proponent of the previous generation smoked and indulged in large amounts of alcohol and have lived a long life. Four years longer than this generation.

Just a thought. One I prescribe to.

[mrsdutt]

Sept 23, 2012 16:36:52 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

Sept 23, 2012 16:20:10 GMT -5 mrsdutt said:

Has anyone traced this group back to Viet Nam and Agent Orange? The uneducated went to war, the educated got deferments.

A large proponent of the previous generation smoked and indulged in large amounts of alcohol and have lived a long life. Four years longer than this generation.

Just a thought. One I prescribe to.

Being a part of the older generation I know that we didn't grow up eating all of the junk and fast foods that the next generation was born into.

Me too. There was no McDs until I was a teen. And then just one in a large city. No margarine or concentrated juice either. There's so many food items now that contain ingredients that can't be pronounced. Back then there were potatoes, and you peeled them. Rice only came in a bag and it took 20 minutes to cook. The fruit was not perfect looking, but was so sweet and delish. I can still taste what a fresh peach use to taste like. Oh, and tomatoes were red, not pink.

So, yes, you may have an additional point.

[weltschmerz]

Back then there were potatoes, and you peeled them. Rice only came in a bag and it took 20 minutes to cook.
-----------
Ick. I always make my rice and potatoes from scratch. It's not difficult, and what's 20 minutes? Concentrated fruit juice, I have no issue with. It's just juice with much of the water removed for ease of storage and shipping. I live in a cold climate where we cannot grow oranges. The costs of transportation would be astronomical, otherwise. Naturally, fresh-squeezed tastes best.

[Deleted]

Good rice takes more than 20 minutes to cook. Actually a lot of convenience foods were invented in the late 1940s-1950s... and have continued obviously... but i doubt most people here grew up totally without them.

[Phoenix84]

I think a lot of it is depression and lack of hope. Like almost40 said, when your life sucks you take gratification where you can get it, which is usually cigarettes, beer, and fast food.

[Deleted]

Sept 21, 2012 20:40:17 GMT -5 oped said:

I also had foster kids in my class sometimes who couldn't go on a field trip, for instance, without a permision slip signed by their biological parent, which could be difficult to track down... not sure if that is every an issue?

I also didn't realize the parent needed to be there for the appointment... that can be a challenge of its own.

Don't permission slips say Parent OR Guardian? Their foster parent should have been able to sign the form.

[CarolinaKat]

Sept 21, 2012 15:38:56 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Sept 21, 2012 13:56:01 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

That's what Mich said her dental school is trying to figure out and that's what the medical center I work for is trying to figure out. If all you have to do is sign a form or show up WHY aren't people taking advantage of it?

There are lots of variables to it, the problem is getting all of them to fit together so you can come up with a solution.

Drama....this has got a whole bunch of highly educated people befuddled. If you go into the literature, about 30% of Medicaid recipients utilize their FREE dental Medicaid benefits....and mostly when they're driven to a dentist in pain. The literature also gives a bunch of reasons why, but the dental van eliminates most of those reasons.

I've been out in the van on occasion and helped out. I really feel for those kids, some of them come in with mouths that are in desperate need of a LOT of restorative work, and these kids are only about 7 years old. And I suspect that the only reason why we see the kids we do is because the kids are in pain.

All that the dental van requires is a signed permission slip, we request no information about the family whatsoever. The dental van is not sponsored by the government, but a bunch of charities.....and McDonalds is a major one, and the staff is the university's dental staff.

Actually, I have an idea as to why these services are not utilized....but you are going to have to wait for the publication, as it is my thesis.

Mich..... FINISH YOUR THESIS!

[wvugurl26]

I know the van going to the school takes away this argument, but the most common excuse we hear is that it is very hard to find a dentist that takes Medicaid. And to top it off, I am sure cases like the Small Smiles chain do not help encourage people to go to the dentist.

If you are born to parents who didn't regularly visit a dentist growing up, your parents will not be likely to take you. And then when you see stories splashed all over the news about those dentists who do accept Medicaid performing unnecessary procedures, it just feeds into that mistrust.

And again the van visiting the school eliminates this but I would also guess the parents would have a hard time getting off work to get the child to a dentist when they found one that accepted Medicaid.

[Deleted]

Each state is different, but no, not all foster parents are allowed to sign permission slips... Some states allow it, PA does not. From the below, I think that it is because the foster parent is Custodian, not Guardian.

"Only the child’s parent or legal guardian has the authority and the right to give
consent for routine medical care, participation in school activities, including field
trips and sports, obtaining a drivers permit or license and travel out-of-state. The
legal custodian may authorize only emergency medical care.

Foster parents are NOT to sign permission slips for a child in foster care to participate
in extracurricular activities such as field trips and sports. Contact the child’s social
worker to have such slips signed.

When you are asked to give written permission or consent for an activity, contact
your child’s DHS social worker to request the necessary signature from the parent or
guardian or to obtain permission from the court. The foster parent is NEVER to sign
as the parent or guardian.

famguardian.org/Subjects/Parenting/FosterParenting/FosterParentHandbook.pdf

[happyhoix]

Sept 21, 2012 13:53:33 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

Sept 21, 2012 13:47:30 GMT -5 swamp said:

The County funds a travelling dental clinic that will treat the kids for free at their school. Again, less than 10% of the parents send in the permission slip.

That problem exists with the free health clinic here. A lot of people are either too scared to go or are in denial. One woman showed up with breast cancer so advanced that half her breasts were eaten away. She thought she would get better on her own. She died 5 weeks later in hospice care. Education level might have a lot to do with it.

We had a temp working at our office a few years back. She was one of the working poor. She had a heart problem. She wasn't overweight and as far as I could tell had a fairly healthy lifestyle but inherited a tendency to high blood pressure and heart problems. She was working for us as a temp, with no health benefits, and wasn't poor enough to be elgible for government health benefits. She was trying to work off past medical debts, but missed a lot of work when her heart acted up, so she couldn't hold down a full time job. She did qualify for section 8 housing. Once, at work, she started having an irregular heart beat and got very weak. We thought she was having a heart attack and wanted to call an ambulance. She insisted she couldn't afford to pay for the ambulance ride - so I ended up flying down the highway, this poor woman panting and groaning next to me, trying to get her to the hospital ASAP.

The working poor don't usually qualify for health insurance. They have to pay back what they owe, or declare bankruptcy. I think this makes them very reluctant to seek medical or dental care, even if the medical care is supposedly free.

[michelyn8]

The consent to treat form is in the package of papers that the kids take home from school, then they do a separate form a couple of weeks before the van is due to arrive. The form can be returned and no one other than the dental people would know the difference. As we are bound by HIPAA, nothing is discussed with the school, other than which students we need.

I think that is the main issue right there - the forms are being sent home with the kids. I know from my own experiences that just because the package is given to the kids to bring home doesn't mean it will make it home. Even after I made it a habit to go through my children's bookbags each night to see what they may have "forgotten" to give me, I didn't always receive all announcements or notes from the teacher.

I'm also curious as to whether or not the consent and informational forms are turned back in to the school or have to be mailed. If mailed, it could be simple oversight due to day to day stress that can come from being lower income. If the school, it could be the fear that their income and other information is going to be seen by others they don't trust. Not all school staff understand what keeping things to themselves mean. I've overheard more than one conversation about this or that student or parent and their situation while waiting in the office for my own children. No way in this world would I have trusted those busybodies with any more information than I was required to provide for my children's education.

[michelyn8]

Sept 22, 2012 11:04:38 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Sept 22, 2012 10:49:27 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

So, no one here thinks it's a brain malfunction? The fact that they really just don't get it, makes me think it is.

No. Claiming it is a brain malfunction is a cop out.

I think years of being raised like this and not being taught any different assumes that this is the norm.

If your parents lost their teeth at 30, why should you be any different? If your parents had a 'feast or famine' mentality, what have you learned? Years and years of ingrained behavior cannot be discarded by a few training sessions.

All I can say is Thank God for my mother's vanity. Both of my parents grew up in the Depression and WWII era. Both in very poor families. My mother dropped out of high school because her two front teeth broke and she was ashamed to go to school like that. She has had caps on her bottom teeth and dentures for her uppers as long as I can remember. Daddy was able to keep most of his teeth but wore bridges to replace those he lost - top and bottom. I was blessed with good strong teeth. I'm a sugar junkie, hated brushing my teeth as a child and have only had 5 cavities my entire life - 4 as a child and one pin cavity in my 30's. I was expected to brush my teeth every day, Mom tried to limit my sugar to no avail and our water had fluoride.

One thing that has not been mentioned is that the general conditon of our teeth is genetic. I took after my father in that I had strong teeth that are 95% straight so no braces. My son is like me and his teeth are even straighter (dentist pushed for braces when he was 8 or 9 but I said not until he was older and his teeth straighted on their own). My daughters on the other hand take after their father with softer teeth that have to be brushed often because eating anything means a film will develop soon after. DD1 has it worse than DD2. I understood the differences in my children and tried to teach each of them according to their own need.

Maybe part of the problem is a lack of understanding as some of said of the need for good care. If its the norm and acceptable to have bad teeth, you could face some ridicule for trying to be "better" or if you have naturally good teeth despite the amount of care or your diet, you may think more than brushing isn't needed. Just a thought.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Sept 24, 2012 9:05:21 GMT -5 michelyn8 said:

The consent to treat form is in the package of papers that the kids take home from school, then they do a separate form a couple of weeks before the van is due to arrive. The form can be returned and no one other than the dental people would know the difference. As we are bound by HIPAA, nothing is discussed with the school, other than which students we need.

I think that is the main issue right there - the forms are being sent home with the kids. I know from my own experiences that just because the package is given to the kids to bring home doesn't mean it will make it home. Even after I made it a habit to go through my children's bookbags each night to see what they may have "forgotten" to give me, I didn't always receive all announcements or notes from the teacher.

I'm also curious as to whether or not the consent and informational forms are turned back in to the school or have to be mailed. If mailed, it could be simple oversight due to day to day stress that can come from being lower income. If the school, it could be the fear that their income and other information is going to be seen by others they don't trust. Not all school staff understand what keeping things to themselves mean. I've overheard more than one conversation about this or that student or parent and their situation while waiting in the office for my own children. No way in this world would I have trusted those busybodies with any more information than I was required to provide for my children's education.

The form is returned to the school, along with all the others that need to get filled out at the beginning of the school year. I know a couple of years ago, they changed the color and texture of the forms, to make them stand out in the packet the kids receive. They also get them a couple of weeks before the van is due to arrive, so there are at least 2 opportunities.

As it is a signed consent form and the vast majority of the students already receive free lunches, I don't see what there is to gossip about. Once we receive the consent forms, the schools know nothing other than which students they need to pull for treatment. We can't tell them as the staff in the dental van is required to comply with HIPAA, and believe me, we do!

[milee]

Sept 24, 2012 8:15:31 GMT -5 oped said:

Each state is different, but no, not all foster parents are allowed to sign permission slips... Some states allow it, PA does not. From the below, I think that it is because the foster parent is Custodian, not Guardian.

"Only the child’s parent or legal guardian has the authority and the right to give
consent for routine medical care, participation in school activities, including field
trips and sports, obtaining a drivers permit or license and travel out-of-state. The
legal custodian may authorize only emergency medical care.

Foster parents are NOT to sign permission slips for a child in foster care to participate
in extracurricular activities such as field trips and sports. Contact the child’s social
worker to have such slips signed.

When you are asked to give written permission or consent for an activity, contact
your child’s DHS social worker to request the necessary signature from the parent or
guardian or to obtain permission from the court. The foster parent is NEVER to sign
as the parent or guardian.

famguardian.org/Subjects/Parenting/FosterParenting/FosterParentHandbook.pdf

Wow, what an awful regulation. While I can see not allowing foster parents to authorize the children traveling out of state or anything extreme like that, the idea that a foster parent can't sign a permission slip for a normal field trip or for a child to join the debate team is ridiculous. These kids already feel isolated and different, making it tough or impossible to do the basic things other kids do only makes their situation worse. In so many ways, DCF is just so screwed up.

Again, I urge anyone who wants greater government involvement in healthcare to look closely at how the government manages the touchy feely tasks it now has, such as foster care. It's a good look at how efficient, effective and compassionate government care will be.

[Deleted]

And I would urge anyone who wants to get rid of social programming that keeps kids in their family of origin, to examine just how screwed up DCF is in this country before advocating for change...

It was difficult. Hard to have a kid sit out a field trip because of the permission slip issue. We were allowed to go to blanket permission slips for field trips and school activities... but not for medical permission, and so i'm guessing there are times when that could play a role.

[milee]

Sept 24, 2012 10:43:47 GMT -5 oped said:

And I would urge anyone who wants to get rid of social programming that keeps kids in their family of origin, to examine just how screwed up DCF is in this country before advocating for change...

Help me understand this. I have no idea if I agree with you or not because I don't understand what you're getting at.

[Deleted]

Most welfare programs in this country are aimed at keeping kids in their family of origin. Ie. paying their parents to care for them when they are too poor to do so on their own, rather than have the kids abandoned to orphanages or other foster care. We give the family WIC, food stamps and hud, etc. Because ultimately it becomes a societal problem to house, feed, edcuate, etc. children who are not cared for by their parents. We have to pay for it some way. Now, i am not saying that all children are better off in their family of origin. However, I would be more interested in programing changes that might move more children into public supported care situations, if the programs we have now were much, much better than the alternative.

Society can't just not pay for poor children. We will pay for them. Its how that is the question. If we cut food stamps, HUD, etc. more children would end up in our foster care system. We would still pay for them.

[milee]

Gotcha. I agree with that premise as well as the premise that if we had better alternatives, it would make sense to stop some of the lengths that the current systems go to to keep kids with their own crappy families. You're also right, though, that the current system is so awful it's not like there are better alternatives in most cases. The system stinks. As awful as most of the families in question are, the system is even worse.

But that kinda supports my point that government doesn't do a good job with this stuff. It's pretty sad when even meth moms make a better family unit than what is offered and managed by our government. My whole point is that government doesn't do this stuff well. I don't want them expanding into any more areas.

[Deleted]

They still ARE doing it though. They are doing it by supporting families of origin. They have found that system to be prefereable to orphanages and extended foster care, except for extreme situations.

I think its a factor that gets lost in the general discussion of 'welfare' programs.

[973beachbum]

Sept 24, 2012 10:39:35 GMT -5 milee said:

Sept 24, 2012 8:15:31 GMT -5 oped said:

Each state is different, but no, not all foster parents are allowed to sign permission slips... Some states allow it, PA does not. From the below, I think that it is because the foster parent is Custodian, not Guardian.

"Only the child’s parent or legal guardian has the authority and the right to give
consent for routine medical care, participation in school activities, including field
trips and sports, obtaining a drivers permit or license and travel out-of-state. The
legal custodian may authorize only emergency medical care.

Foster parents are NOT to sign permission slips for a child in foster care to participate
in extracurricular activities such as field trips and sports. Contact the child’s social
worker to have such slips signed.

When you are asked to give written permission or consent for an activity, contact
your child’s DHS social worker to request the necessary signature from the parent or
guardian or to obtain permission from the court. The foster parent is NEVER to sign
as the parent or guardian.

famguardian.org/Subjects/Parenting/FosterParenting/FosterParentHandbook.pdf

Wow, what an awful regulation. While I can see not allowing foster parents to authorize the children traveling out of state or anything extreme like that, the idea that a foster parent can't sign a permission slip for a normal field trip or for a child to join the debate team is ridiculous. These kids already feel isolated and different, making it tough or impossible to do the basic things other kids do only makes their situation worse. In so many ways, DCF is just so screwed up.

Again, I urge anyone who wants greater government involvement in healthcare to look closely at how the government manages the touchy feely tasks it now has, such as foster care. It's a good look at how efficient, effective and compassionate government care will be.

But by definition a foster child is a ward of the state. The only way the Foster parent could be the child's legal guardian would be for them to adopt the child. That may not even be possible a lot of the time. they can't be adopted until the parents have had their rights terminated which can take years.

I know two people who are foster parents. They do try and get the papers signed. Sometimes they have even taken time off from work to try and force them to sign them only to get there to find the person they need not there. One person said it is like trying to push a rock uphill with your nose. It sounded so easy until she was the person trying to do it.

[weltschmerz]

Sept 23, 2012 19:06:31 GMT -5 oped said:

Good rice takes more than 20 minutes to cook. Actually a lot of convenience foods were invented in the late 1940s-1950s... and have continued obviously... but i doubt most people here grew up totally without them.

I don't know what kind of rice you're using, but I always use basmati. 15 minutes to cook on low heat, then 5 minutes to "rest". Perfect every time.