djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 12:33:48 GMT -5
I agree. And in fact the article goes on... that's nice. next time, why don't you throw some sunshine on the board instead of being the eternal pessimist, then?
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 12:35:44 GMT -5
As far as the self-employed statistic goes, I would bet that is a function of the type of work that most self-employed people do. Only a small fraction of them are the small business owners and successful entrepreneurs we think of. An awful lot of self employed people are independent consultants for various home party businesses or hobbyists selling their wares on ebay and etsy. You can only really pursue that line of work if there is another more steady income in your household. And a lot of the things those folks sell - nobody is buying in a recession. Independent housekeepers, landscapers, realtors and other service-based self-employment are probably struggling with the economy as well. Those are the services the rest of us have cut back on during unsure times. i have been thinking about this, and i am guessing that a lot of self employed are in construction, which is clearly in a major depression. those that couldn't last it out are collecting food stamps, now.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 12:38:07 GMT -5
The sooner you accept the truth, the sooner I can stop repeating it. I am still waiting for someone to explain why lending money to someone who is unqualified to borrow for a mortgage is good govt policy. for this i will bring in an authority on the subject: this helped him get re-elected. that was reason enough, right?
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 12:39:24 GMT -5
which makes perfect sense, since this is the worst recession SINCE the great depression......
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Feb 5, 2012 12:49:08 GMT -5
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Feb 5, 2012 13:00:32 GMT -5
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usaone
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Post by usaone on Feb 5, 2012 13:55:43 GMT -5
I'll take a quarter Million private sector jobs created and weekly unemployment claims at 360k in 2012 over 2008 and early 2009 any day.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 15:42:26 GMT -5
This looks like the real authority: dude. i was kidding.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 15:44:02 GMT -5
Bush basically took up the housing baton from Clinton and ran on it in 2004. and won. it sends a really bad signal to public office holders. bad policy gets votes.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 15:45:01 GMT -5
I'll take a quarter Million private sector jobs created and weekly unemployment claims at 360k in 2012 over 2008 and early 2009 any day. i don't think anyone remembers how bad it was. we were bleeding TWO MILLION JOBS A QUARTER. this is like HEAVEN by comparison.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Feb 5, 2012 16:03:10 GMT -5
I agree. And in fact the article goes on... that's nice. next time, why don't you throw some sunshine on the board instead of being the eternal pessimist, then? I'm an optimist that appreciates reality. I will say that even though things seem bad right now they will get better. I do not believe Obama has the power to destroy this country- even if he is re-elected. I don't believe any President has that power- that's the beauty of our system. I DO, however think we are in bad shape, I think that within a short period of time we are going to experience and economic collapse- a real one, a doozey, and that in spite of that belief- there will be plenty of opportunity for those who are prepared.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Feb 5, 2012 16:05:20 GMT -5
Bush basically took up the housing baton from Clinton and ran on it in 2004. and won. it sends a really bad signal to public office holders. bad policy gets votes. Bush mainly ran on the war on terror- keeping the country secure. I don't recall housing being a big issue in the 2004 election- honorable mentions, maybe, but not a big deal. Bush also tried to reign in Fannie and Freddie and he was stopped cold by Barney Frank, Chris "Countrywide" Dodd, and Kent "Countrywide" Conrad.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Feb 5, 2012 16:07:21 GMT -5
The Bush Admin and Senator McCain warned repeatedly about Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac and what thus became the 2008 financial crisis -- starting in 2002 (and actually even earlier -- in the Clinton and Carter White Houses. Democrats resisted and kept to their party line, extending loans to people who couldn't afford them -- just like you would expect of socialists.
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usaone
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Post by usaone on Feb 5, 2012 17:29:50 GMT -5
Then why didn't Bush do anything about it?
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Feb 5, 2012 17:33:38 GMT -5
Yeah, the person who runs the first 3 legs of a race deserves none of the credit; it's only the person who finishes.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Feb 5, 2012 17:35:33 GMT -5
Guess you don't know how the government works...well, before Obama started circumventing the process more than any President before...
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Feb 5, 2012 18:07:17 GMT -5
...well, before Obama started circumventing the process more than any President before... wow
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usaone
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Post by usaone on Feb 5, 2012 18:30:09 GMT -5
Guess you don't know how the government works...well, before Obama started circumventing the process more than any President before... If Bush wanted to fix it he could have. He chose not to.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Feb 5, 2012 19:35:25 GMT -5
Guess you don't know how the government works...well, before Obama started circumventing the process more than any President before... If Bush wanted to fix it he could have. He chose not to. Incorrect. I already explained that all attempts at reform were met by Chuckie, Barney, Kent, and Chris with "Relax, everything's fine"...
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handyman2
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Post by handyman2 on Feb 5, 2012 20:19:52 GMT -5
There would be a lot more hires if industry could find people with expertise in the tech areas. The biggest shortage in hiring is there has been little training in the new computer related manufacturing positions. They don't need college grads they are looking for those who have training in design and operation of the new industry technologies. One problem is that schools have not caught up with the new technologies to train adequate workers. Modern manufactering systems are on the fast track.
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Don Perignon
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Post by Don Perignon on Feb 5, 2012 20:48:31 GMT -5
The pursuit of maximum profit and the high cost of modern manufacturing technology make it imperative to locate factories where companies pay minimal property tax on their infrastructure... in other words, foreign places. It's not that the companies can't afford to pay the taxes, it's that they prefer to evade them.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Feb 5, 2012 20:53:00 GMT -5
The pursuit of maximum profit and the high cost of modern manufacturing technology make it imperative to locate factories where companies pay minimal property tax on their infrastructure... in other words, foreign places. It's not that the companies can't afford to pay the taxes, it's that they prefer to evade them. Again, we lost. The battle to see who will do the manufacturing on this planet is over, and America isn't even in the running. It's time to get over it, and move on. We still have a whole lot going for us- natural resources, brain-power, we don't nee manual labor power. Nobody here is raising their kid to work in a factory. Let the unskilled labor go. Who cares?
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 21:36:39 GMT -5
that's nice. next time, why don't you throw some sunshine on the board instead of being the eternal pessimist, then? I'm an optimist that appreciates reality. i am an optimist that appreciates an OCCASIONAL does of optimism.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 21:37:36 GMT -5
Bush basically took up the housing baton from Clinton and ran on it in 2004. and won. it sends a really bad signal to public office holders. bad policy gets votes. Bush mainly ran on the war on terror- keeping the country secure. I don't recall housing being a big issue in the 2004 election- honorable mentions, maybe, but not a big deal. Bush also tried to reign in Fannie and Freddie and he was stopped cold by Barney Frank, Chris "Countrywide" Dodd, and Kent "Countrywide" Conrad. i take it you didn't watch the video?
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 21:38:50 GMT -5
Then why didn't Bush do anything about it? he did. he campaigned on how great the housing market was. and won:
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 21:39:53 GMT -5
Yeah, the person who runs the first 3 legs of a race deserves none of the credit; it's only the person who finishes. huh? i was blaming Clinton, too, fep. did you think i was ONLY blaming Bush? yfk!
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 21:41:43 GMT -5
Guess you don't know how the government works...well, before Obama started circumventing the process more than any President before... If Bush wanted to fix it he could have. He chose not to. precisely. and there were powerful economic and political reasons for him doing so. do i blame him for succumbing to them? of course not. but that doesn't make him blameless.
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usaone
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Post by usaone on Feb 5, 2012 22:27:35 GMT -5
We made NO attempt to stop the housing bubble.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2012 22:39:14 GMT -5
We made NO attempt to stop the housing bubble. GOD no. we encouraged it. that is because it was very profitable, and scored political points. Laffer and his minions thought everyone who was crying alarm was engaging in scare tactics. they were ALL wrong.
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handyman2
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Post by handyman2 on Feb 5, 2012 23:07:58 GMT -5
Greed wears a blindfold. Millions were made through greed and now the price tag is going to haunt our economy for a long time.
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