Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2011 0:01:54 GMT -5
Let's see........ I have a shed. I admit I've griped to friends about my kids getting on my nerves and I said I was going to make them live in the shed, but it had never occurred to me to actually do it. If I tell someone they can stay here, that would mean they could stay in the house. If they preferred the shed, I'd think something was wrong with them and they probably shouldn't be around me period.
frugal, I understand your concern about your friend. I'd also have a hard time denying a pregnant woman food, even if I didn't know her. But a friend that's always expecting me to do things for her that she should be trying to figure out would get on my nerves and the friendship would go downhill pretty fast.
Unfortunately, you really can't help her. You can listen when she wants to talk and offer advice if she asks for it, but that's pretty much it. I've had people I love make bad choices that I could clearly see were bad, but everybody has to live their own lives and learn their own lessons.
My BFF was highly upset (with reason) with her husband-to-be just before their wedding. I told her "I'm with you, whatever you want to do. I can go in the sanctuary now and apologize to the guests because the wedding's not happening, then get you outta here, or I can go in and be a happy bridesmaid when it's time. It's on you". I secretly hoped she'd call it off, but I try not to tell my friends what to do so I just let her know I would support her decision either way. A couple years later I was helping her move her stuff out of their house and encouraging her while she tried to figure out how to pick up the pieces.
If you truly value her friendship, just be her friend. You can't make her live up to her potential, make the choices you think are best, or be who you think she should. Some of us have to learn things the hard way and there's nothing anybody can do about that. If the friendship starts to require more from you than you have to give, you have to step back to protect yourself and there's nothing wrong with that.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2011 0:20:38 GMT -5
I didn't mean to offend the posters that said they'd prefer the privacy of the shed. I've slept on the floor of 2BR apartments that had more than 10 people in it. Around here, we double up in beds if necessary, or there's always blankets and the floor if nothing else. It's never come up, but I think it would be an insult to offer anybody the shed to sleep in. And I wouldn't spend money trying to make my shed comfortable for somebody to live in.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 29, 2011 9:10:45 GMT -5
She can get help but chooses not to. There's welfare, section 8 housing, and all the rest including food stamps. She is looking for a pity party and handouts from family but I am sure she (and her parents) know she will get back with the EX that didn't want her to begin with.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 30, 2011 10:33:54 GMT -5
I know how moochers milk the system and other people.
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seriousthistime
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Post by seriousthistime on Sept 3, 2011 8:11:37 GMT -5
But zib, the woman is technically married. Wouldn't any benefits be based on her and her husband's income? She might not be eligible for as much as we think.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 3, 2011 8:36:09 GMT -5
She'd have to involve him legally and that would piss him off. Like that even matters because she is hoping that he will come after her and the baby, both of which he has made very clear that he is not interested in. I realize her family is the reason she has zero self esteem but trapping some man with an unwanted pregnancy is the oldest trick in the book and it never works. She needs to learn from this mistake, get the free aid she is eligible for, get back to work asap, keep her legs together, and get on with her life. Stop the cycle NOW. Not go from man to man getting knocked up again hoping this one will "love her." It doesn't work that way. Never has and never will.
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regina24601
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Post by regina24601 on Sept 3, 2011 10:23:52 GMT -5
My BFF was highly upset (with reason) with her husband-to-be just before their wedding. I told her "I'm with you, whatever you want to do. I can go in the sanctuary now and apologize to the guests because the wedding's not happening, then get you outta here, or I can go in and be a happy bridesmaid when it's time. It's on you". I secretly hoped she'd call it off, but I try not to tell my friends what to do so I just let her know I would support her decision either way. A couple years later I was helping her move her stuff out of their house and encouraging her while she tried to figure out how to pick up the pieces. If you truly value her friendship, just be her friend. You can't make her live up to her potential, make the choices you think are best, or be who you think she should. Some of us have to learn things the hard way and there's nothing anybody can do about that. If the friendship starts to require more from you than you have to give, you have to step back to protect yourself and there's nothing wrong with that. frugal - I've followed this thread but haven't posted on it. FINALLY, someone is making 100% sense here. Pink summed it up better than I ever could (I have an almost identical story about my sister), so I'll just let her words sink in. I know you have a big heart (well, I guess I don't *know* that - I can just tell from your posts ) and you'll figure out what to do that brings you peace. Good luck, and take care of yourself!
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 3, 2011 10:34:06 GMT -5
You are trapping a man when you know he doesn't want to marry you anyway but somehow you get him to do it then pretend you are on BC so as to "keep him" by having an unwanted child. Sorry, BC doesn't "fail" as often as some people "claim" it does. I blame him as well, for NOT telling her "goodbye" WAY before marriage. But she was an easy lay for him and now she is reaping what she sowed. But not content with that, she plans on sucking others into her drama. I'm sure we all know that the OP is giving her handouts left and right now along with probably whoever else she could "suck" in. But I'll bet the "husband/daddy is still not involved or interested. Sad thing is that this woman would not do the RIGHT thing for her child, which would be to give it to a loving family, but will continue to use it and whatever others as a means to an end.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 4, 2011 8:27:02 GMT -5
Uh, she KNEW he was a cheater before she married him. No one is blindsided by that just like no one is "blindsided" by a pregnancy. It was deliberate and the only one that will suffer is, of course, the innocent child.
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Plain Old Petunia
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Post by Plain Old Petunia on Sept 7, 2011 11:30:25 GMT -5
<< You are trapping a man when you know he doesn't want to marry you anyway but somehow you get him to do it then pretend you are on BC so as to "keep him" by having an unwanted child. >>
He's a grown man. If he didn't want to get married but did anyway, that's on him. And just because he cheats, that doesn't mean he didn't want to get married. Some people like to have multiple relationships at the same time.
I'm not suggesting she made a good decision, I'm just saying she is not responsible for his choices. She is only responsible for her own.
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on Sept 11, 2011 12:56:23 GMT -5
I just thought I'd post an update, it has been awhile since I've logged in and posted anything (new job has kept me super busy). Anyhow, the shower was a big wake up call for me. I shelled out somewhere in the ballpark of $500 for her shower (that does include the gift I got her though- it was $100). I made a big to-do of it, beautiful table settings, fresh flower arrangements on the tables, home-made favors (I spent HOURS making those stupid favors). I wore a nice dress. She and her family show up 5 minutes late (who doesn't show up early to their own shower?), wearing jean shorts and old t-shirts. After the shower, her family kept asking if they could keep things for the next shower (the one for her "church family"). They proceeded to bitch that the flowers were real, because they wouldn't keep until the next shower. They even had the audacity to ask me if I would come and help them throw the next shower (luckily I'm working that day and used that as an excuse). It has been a week and I have yet to get a thank you card or even a text message from this girl.
When I got home from the shower and told DH how nice it was, he reminded me that she would never do something like that for me. It had never crossed my mind that I was putting way more into this friendship than I was getting out of it, but now I see his point. I could have done a whole lot with that $500, but instead I threw it into a party for a friend whom I was trying to make feel special.
This isn't the first time I have gotten suckered like this. Last year, I threw a bridal shower for a friend whose fiance abused her, and she knew how I felt about the marriage, but I threw the shower anyway, because I like to make others feel loved. I spent $1000 freaking dollars on that shower. DH reminded me that she didn't even come to our wedding. So I guess I just need to be like everyone else and only worry about me, not about trying to brighten the lives of others.
A little more background on my friend, btw, since there seems to be some confusion:
The guy was cheating before the marriage, she married him anyway. He claims he thought she was still on the pill, she claims they were trying. He is giving her some money on a regular basis to pay for her Dr. appts and such, and they still hang out "as friends". I think she's going to run right back to him once the baby is born. I think this has all been a game to her, to get some excitement in her life. I will maintain the friendship, but I will also maintain my distance.
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reeneejune
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Post by reeneejune on Sept 11, 2011 13:31:14 GMT -5
frugal - friendship is about balance. You've heard of the "fair weather friend" who splits the minute things get tough. I seem to be the "foul weather friend"... the one that people go to when things are tough, or complicated, or whatever...then when their life gets on track, they no longer have time for me. As an example, one of my best friends from college spent tons of time with me leading up to her wedding and the two years following her wedding. I made multiple trips (400+ miles) to her home town to help with wedding planning. Then twice I made trips of 2000+ miles to help her move. While she did help to pay for my travel about 50% of the time, she only visited me in my hometown once. After her cross country move back to her hometown (ironically, closer than she had been after her wedding) the friendship just died. Because I finally realized that I was putting far FAR more time, effort, and money into the friendship.
It took me a long time to learn that my care-giving nature leaves me open to these sorts of one sided friendships. I have a feeling that you're the same way. Does that mean that we have to be selfish from now on in our friendships? No. It just means that we need to be clear eyed about whether the friendship is a two way street.
As an aside, you spent $1,000 on a bridal shower?! And $400 for a baby shower (just the party, not the present)?! I've thrown some nice baby showers, but I don't think I've ever spent more than $75 total for food and decor (there's always been a convenient church or home to use for free).
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on Sept 11, 2011 13:44:27 GMT -5
Renee- I had a long response typed out to you, but I somehow accidentally made the browser go back, and I lost my post! I am too lazy to re-write it all. Anyhow, I throw expensive parties. I tend to go overboard on the cutesy customized favors and decor, and I love to have tons of flowers everywhere. I like a project and will spend hours making flower arrangements, making custom favors, custom water bottles, delicious food, etc.
It sounds like you are right about the foul-weather friend thing. Both DH and I have several friends who only seem to come around when they need a little help fixing their lives. On one hand, it makes me proud that people see me as the responsible one who knows how to live a decent life, but on the other hand, fixing everyone else's problems is going to wear us out!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2011 13:50:34 GMT -5
Aw, frugal, I'm sorry that you got used. Sounds like you should change "friend" to "friendly acquaintance"...somebody you acknowledge and are pleasant to. Period.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 11, 2011 14:29:44 GMT -5
You and your DH need to be the "bad guys" for each other. Both DF and I are WAY TOO SOFT when it comes to our kids. Casual co-workers are not on the list, though.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Sept 11, 2011 16:00:22 GMT -5
I'm sorry, FN. I know how it feels to be the "foul-weather friend" (thanks Renee for the new phrase!) I had to dial down a good friendship after I realized that I was the first person my friend called when she needed something, but much farther down the list when she didn't. She also had a very dramatic life (largely of her own creation) and didn't seem to understand that I don't have 2+ hours a day to spend on the phone dissecting her latest relationship...
Sounds as though your friend is the same way, so limiting contact is probably best.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 11, 2011 17:53:21 GMT -5
You can't help but have a kind heart which is why you get hurt/taken like you do. Remember this and other lessons the next time this situation or something like it occurs. There are two kind of people in the world, USERS and those that get USED. Make your choice. It isn't being a USER to put yourself and your family FIRST.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 12, 2011 7:35:09 GMT -5
She would never give the baby up. It's a weapon as well as money for her.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Sept 12, 2011 8:36:14 GMT -5
This isn't the first time I have gotten suckered like this
Take the steps to make it the LAST time. You shouldn't have to bend over backwards and take it up the ass to be friends with someone. Like your DH said, if they wouldn't do something that nice for you then they aren't a friend.
I really recommend you read the book Co-dependent No More to figure out WHY you feel you need these types of people as friends and why you continue to allow yourself to be a doormat. It'll also give you tips to stop.
Trust me when I say once you recognize your behavior and put a stop to it before you even start life gets SO MUCH better and you'll have so much better people entering into your life because the moochers will know they can't hit you up anymore.
I will admit I don't have a lot of friends, but the friends I DO have are friends that would bend over backwards to help me just as I would bend over backwards to help them. Having a small friend circle is worth it when the friends are quality friends.
I'll also admit there have been times when I've been called a cold hearted bitch, but like zib said it's really not cold hearted or selfish to put yourself first. It's actually very smart and that's the problem I am thinking logical rather than emotional. The people that call me names are bleeding hearts.
Logical is how you should approach people like your "friend" because she's counting on your bleeding heart so she can suck you dry. If you think with your head instead she's going to move on to her next target and leave you alone.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Sept 12, 2011 8:42:32 GMT -5
I guess i don't "" my friends during hard times or difficult periods of their lives. To each their own.
I don't my FRIENDS either, but I have dumped drama kings/queens out of my life.
I ended up stalked and came very close to have the pulp beat out of me because I refused to "" a friend who was in an extremly abusive relationship but refused to leave.
In the end I had to him as a friend because it dawned on me that he was doing the same thing to me that his boyfriend was doing to him sans the physical abuse.
I probably wouldn't be here right now if I had not dumped him as a friend. That psycho boyfriend was not the last one, and each one has been progessively worse.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Sept 12, 2011 9:17:23 GMT -5
Admittedly we only have FN's side of the story, but from what she's written, this person isn't a friend. It has to be at least a semi-equal partnership. Of course there are always going to be times when one person is giving more or putting more into the relationship - but in a true friendship, it should equal out in the end. If one person in the relationship is always giving, and the other is always taking, that's an emotional vampire, not a friend.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Sept 12, 2011 9:27:36 GMT -5
I admit, I've found it much easier to say NO to friends/family/work after having toddlers. Once you get in the habit of saying "No." 1,254,157,125 times a day, it follows though, at least for me. ETA - I had a guy at work call me about getting additional rights for the software I'm responsible for. He WAS supposed to have different rights than he did, so I upgraded him. He immediately started asking for even HIGHER rights. Which I said. He asked 3 or 4 more times and I continued to say No. Eventually, I told him "I have toddlers, I can keep this up all day." And he stopped then.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Sept 12, 2011 9:46:09 GMT -5
Of course there are always going to be times when one person is giving more or putting more into the relationship - but in a true friendship, it should equal out in the end I joke I owe my best friend one of my kidneys if she ever needs it after the drama she put up with concerning my wedding.
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on Sept 12, 2011 11:00:05 GMT -5
I guess i don't "" my friends during hard times or difficult periods of their lives. To each their own. Was this aimed at me? I don't my friends either. I believe I stated I would maintain the friendship, but also maintain my distance. I will be there if she truly ,truly needs me, but I am not going to be treated like an ATM / therapist/ doormat.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Sept 12, 2011 11:09:38 GMT -5
I think it was directed at everyone who told you to boot her. That works if your friend isn't having a crisis every five minutes and expects you to rush to his/her rescue.
Personally I'd have cut this chick out by now considering the rest of your posts, the whole food thing would have been the last straw for me.
BUT, it seems like you are making progress and keep it up, don't backslide because you start feeling sorry for her as a "pregnant woman" down on her luck. Again think with your HEAD when it comes to this friend, not your heart.
You may eventually find she drifts out of your life as it becomes clear you are no longer going to be her doormat. If that happens I wouldn't work hard to try to bring her back into your life, just let sleeping dogs lie.
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mourningcloak
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Post by mourningcloak on Sept 12, 2011 11:57:22 GMT -5
Last year, I threw a bridal shower for a friend whose fiance abused her, and she knew how I felt about the marriage, but I threw the shower anyway, because I like to make others feel loved. This thought process needs to be rethought. Throwing a shower for someone prolonging an abusive relationship is not helping them feel loved. Yes showers themselves do, but you need to think big picture here. And listen to your DH more! My fiancee has to constantly remind me of which friends are worth my time I, much like you seem to be, would do anything for anyone in their time of need. But sometimes they create their own times of need. And someone else, like my fiancee and your DH, a little further away from the emotions of the relationship can see what is happening a little clearer. And can remember with a clearer lens who actually cares about you as much as you care about them. I can't begin to tell you how difficult it was a couple years back to completely avoid buying a huge baby shower gift for a friend who kept saying she was going to leave her deadly abusive and cheating husband. I waited til the baby came and only bought necessities for her. She knew I was there to support her, but that I would not encourage or approve of her behavior, that I was positive that a third child would not change his behavior and that taking the chance of sleeping with a man that had been with other women was risking her own health. And finally she has left him and moved out of state so it's more likely that she is going to be able to sustain that separation. But I honestly believe that if the handful of us that did kept supporting her emotionally had not shown her some hard love in the process that she might still be with him today if she was even still alive. Sometimes tough love is the best love to give, even when it hurts us as much as it hurts them.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Sept 12, 2011 12:04:04 GMT -5
Gee - I wonder which type of person I am, since you have to be either a user or a usee. I didn't think I was much of either. I must be a user, because I never feel that anyone takes advantage of me. Not that I do much to take advantage of others, but since I have a choice, I guess I'll go ahead and use others. Maybe I'm a usee, I just haven't caught on yet. hmmm. I really think there is at least a third type of person in the world.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Sept 12, 2011 12:41:48 GMT -5
Boozers? Hey, it rhymes...
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 12, 2011 12:50:25 GMT -5
Works for me!!! ;D
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Sept 12, 2011 15:32:40 GMT -5
Nobody said it did. It's all the OTHER things (like complaining that the flowers your friend BOUGHT you are real instead of fake, like asking her to throw yet another shower, like being completely unappreciative that a friend would spend quite a bit of time/money to make you feel special) that make her, IMO, a foolish person and a bad friend.
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