McConnell Plan is Weakness- Voters Ready to Bolt

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

I'm going to encourage my liberal friends here and tell them something everyone on the right knows, but doesn't want to admit or talk about: Republicans are scared to death right now that Obama is going to pull a Clinton (ala the budget battle of 1995) and force a gov't shutdown / default for which Republicans will get the blame. This is their fear- and in their fear, they are very, very likely to cave in on this critical budget battle in hopes that by caving in they will avoid a shutdown or default and thus avoid the blame and the perception of voter backlash.

Now that I've described their fear as best I can- let me describe the reality:

In 2010 a huge majority of the electorate went to the polls FURIOUS over the arrogance, obstinance and irresponsibility of a Democratic Party out-of-control. THE issues were spending and ObamaCare. The voters want spending reigned in, and ObamaCare repealed.

The voters were furious with BOTH parties, but they decided to give the GOP a shot to put up or shut up about being the party of individual liberty, fiscal responsibility, and small government. One shot.

If the GOP blows this opportunity to force the government to live within its means (Voters OPPOSE and increase in the debt limit by 42% to 22% - www.gallup.com/poll/148454/Debt-Ceiling-Increase-Remains-Unpopular-Americans.aspx ) then the voters will throw the GOP out in 2012.

A GOP cave now will propel a third party / TEA Party / Conservative candidate free-for-all in virtually every district in the country and the mainstream / conservative division will mean victory for the far left Democratic Party, and that will mean that there will be no stopping the economic and political collapse of the United States.

This ain't 1995. The stakes are much, much higher. The country is on the line, and sadly-- the GOP is our only hope.

God save us all.

[Bluerobin]

The pubs have already blown it. The 2011 election was backlash from voters over a democratic majority in both houses and a president, who argued so much amongst themselves that they could not get much done. Don't forget 60% of the population favors Obamacare.
The pubs are only appealing to the lunatic fringe of their own party. Duhhhhhhhhhhhhh! They never thought about the other 85% of the electorate, who are pretty disgusted with their approach.
This is interesting. I hope Barry has the stones to do a Clinton. He should also remind the pubs that he is the pres and it is not his job to propose legislation - it's theirs and it better be acceptable to both parties. I do wish there was a viable 3rd party.

[billisonboard]

Jul 14, 2011 8:34:07 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

...-- the GOP is our only hope.

God save us all.

Which is the typo?

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Jul 14, 2011 8:42:08 GMT -5 Bluerobin said:

The pubs have already blown it. The 2011 election was backlash from voters over a democratic majority in both houses and a president, who argued so much amongst themselves that they could not get much done. Don't forget 60% of the population favors Obamacare.
The pubs are only appealing to the lunatic fringe of their own party. Duhhhhhhhhhhhhh! They never thought about the other 85% of the electorate, who are pretty disgusted with their approach.
This is interesting. I hope Barry has the stones to do a Clinton. He should also remind the pubs that he is the pres and it is not his job to propose legislation - it's theirs and it better be acceptable to both parties. I do wish there was a viable 3rd party.

Since ObamaCare was passed, it only enjoyed majority support ONE week. Since then it has always been a majority that favor repeal. You're nuts if you think 60% of voters favor that thing. If that were the case, how do you explain the fact they went to the polls and overwhelmingly elected the Party that opposed it and rejected the party that passed it in a straight party-line vote?

There is no viable 3rd Party. IF Republicans don't hold the line on spending, we're all f***ed. I wish we had a third party, too-- but we don't. The GOP will either provide a clear alternative to the tax raising, government expanding, out of control spending Democrats- or they will fail, and the nation will fail.

IF the GOP provides a clear alternative, then the 2012 choice will be clear: The United States of America, or Obama and the Democrats.

[privateinvestor]

Obama told Cantor yesterday he will not let our government default and his presidency is on the line so what will he do?? The only choice he has is to raise the debt celing by an Exec Order and let the chips fall where they may..IM (very)HO

[Bluerobin]

PBP, the election was backlash against a "do nothing" congress. Wait until you see the backlash against the pubs, who are scaring the heck outta everyone. I have heard and read a lot about Obamacare, and most feel it didn't go far enough. My only problem is that unlike car insurance, it does not allow you to be self insured.
Obama will get a 2nd term thanks to the pubs. Get ready for it. Maybe the Dems learned their lesson, but I doubt it - they will continue to argue amongst themselves, preparing the way for another pub "mandate" in 2014 (I say that facetiously, because there are no mandates, just indicators of disgust).

[dothedd]

Jul 14, 2011 8:34:07 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

I'm going to encourage my liberal friends here and tell them something everyone on the right knows, but doesn't want to admit or talk about: Republicans are scared to death right now that Obama is going to pull a Clinton (ala the budget battle of 1995) and force a gov't shutdown / default for which Republicans will get the blame. This is their fear- and in their fear, they are very, very likely to cave in on this critical budget battle in hopes that by caving in they will avoid a shutdown or default and thus avoid the blame and the perception of voter backlash.

Now that I've described their fear as best I can- let me describe the reality:

In 2010 a huge majority of the electorate went to the polls FURIOUS over the arrogance, obstinance and irresponsibility of a Democratic Party out-of-control. THE issues were spending and ObamaCare. The voters want spending reigned in, and ObamaCare repealed.

The voters were furious with BOTH parties, but they decided to give the GOP a shot to put up or shut up about being the party of individual liberty, fiscal responsibility, and small government. One shot.

If the GOP blows this opportunity to force the government to live within its means (Voters OPPOSE and increase in the debt limit by 42% to 22% - www.gallup.com/poll/148454/Debt-Ceiling-Increase-Remains-Unpopular-Americans.aspx ) then the voters will throw the GOP out in 2012.

A GOP cave now will propel a third party / TEA Party / Conservative candidate free-for-all in virtually every district in the country and the mainstream / conservative division will mean victory for the far left Democratic Party, and that will mean that there will be no stopping the economic and political collapse of the United States.

This ain't 1995. The stakes are much, much higher. The country is on the line, and sadly-- the GOP is our only hope.

God save us all.

I AGREE!

K4U

[mmhmm]

The problem with most polls I've seen is they don't take into account the "in-between", or moderate voter. It's not a simple black and white issue of whether to accept "ObamaCare", or reject "ObamaCare". There's the matter of amending "ObamaCare" to allow for changes that will allow those with mixed feelings to say "yea" or "nay". That's never a part of the polls. They're always "do we" or "don't we".

I'm not against a national healthcare program; however, the one extant now doesn't properly address some important issues, and leaves some out entirely. Funding is a problem and must be addressed. There's a great deal of ambivalence on who'll be covered, in what manner they'll be covered, how the more complex issues of chronic and (at this point in our technology) terminal conditions will be handled ... and that's just the beginning. Unlike some, I have read the entire "ObamaCare" missive. It falls short in some areas, and goes beyond in others. If they can get it right, and complete, it could be a good thing. So far, I haven't seen that.

[mmhmm]

Jul 14, 2011 9:01:41 GMT -5 Bluerobin said:

PBP, the election was backlash against a "do nothing" congress. Wait until you see the backlash against the pubs, who are scaring the heck outta everyone. I have heard and read a lot about Obamacare, and most feel it didn't go far enough. My only problem is that unlike car insurance, it does not allow you to be self insured.
Obama will get a 2nd term thanks to the pubs. Get ready for it. Maybe the Dems learned their lesson, but I doubt it - they will continue to argue amongst themselves, preparing the way for another pub "mandate" in 2014 (I say that facetiously, because there are no mandates, just indicators of disgust).

Well said, Bluerobin. For the most part, I agree with you.

[mmhmm]

Jul 14, 2011 8:56:09 GMT -5 @privateinvestor said:

Obama told Cantor yesterday he will not let our government default and his presidency is on the line so what will he do?? The only choice he has is to raise the debt celing by an Exec Order and let the chips fall where they may..IM (very)HO

I agree with you, P.I. The parties have pushed each other to the wall with their infighting. I've always felt most of these yahoos are in it to paper their pockets and nothing else is more important. This congress isn't doing anything to change my mind. The debt ceiling is something that MUST be addressed. There are no ifs, no ands, and no buts. It has to be dealt with and partisan politics have no place in seeing that happen.

[Deleted]

PBP, the election was backlash against a "do nothing" congress. Wait until you see the backlash against the pubs, who are scaring the heck outta everyone. I have heard and read a lot about Obamacare, and most feel it didn't go far enough. My only problem is that unlike car insurance, it does not allow you to be self insured.

Now I don't know about elsewhere in the country (it may have been different) but around here the ONLY thing talked about before the last election was Obamacare. I kind of doubt that it ever really had 60% of the country behind it & am sure that only a minority of people like it now.

PBP, the election was backlash against a "do nothing" congress.

If that happened then it's the first time. If a person likes their congressman they tend to view him as not part of the do nothing crowd & they re elect him. The massive amount of people that voted against the Democrats in the last election shows that they were unhappy with the way they were going. The fact that some Republicans were elected (or the election was close) in states that were always democratic states should have convinced anyone of that.

As to what is going on with the voters I HOPE that the Democratic party has the same view as the liberal posters here. If they are that out of touch with the voters then there is no way that President Obama will be re elected.

As for problems within the Democratic party, those were bound to happen. Both moderate & conservative democrats see President Obama for what he is...A far left leaning liberal who's socialistic agenda scares the hell out of them. It also scares the hell out of a lot of voters, make that Democratic voters. I would look for a lot of the Democrats running for office next election to distance themselves from him as much as they can.

[Bluerobin]

mmhmm, Your point see #8 was also on target. I plan on my own end of life proceedures (DNR). I will be getting a big DNR tattoo on my chest, as soon as I get the nerve - I hate needles. I can't see any point in prolonging suffering. Hospice and lots of drugs will suit me fine!

I am still rooting for a default. Then maybe the voters will see that both parties are outta touch.

[privateinvestor]

A default even for a few days could be disaster so you have to know the Big Three, Obama, Bernanke, and Geithner have some contingency plans just in case...they don't want to see a panic on Wall or Main St

[billisonboard]

Jul 14, 2011 9:40:09 GMT -5 @privateinvestor said:

A default even for a few days could be disaster so you have to know the Big Three, Obama, Bernanke, and Geithner have some contingency plans just in case...they don't want to see a panic on Wall or Main St

I agree with you. Competent leadership always plans for contingencies.

[Wisconsin Beth]

I don't want to vote Republican. Or Tea Party. Or Democrat. I want to vote for someone sane and responsible who's able to work with all the idiots already in office. I guess I need to go find a unicorn first...

[Deleted]

I agree with you. Competent leadership always plans for contingencies.

So Billisonboard your saying that President Obama doesn't have a contingency plan?

[billisonboard]

Jul 14, 2011 9:51:18 GMT -5 @oldtex said:

I agree with you. Competent leadership always plans for contingencies.

So Billisonboard your saying that President Obama doesn't have a contingency plan?

No. I was agreeing with P.I. that he does.

[privateinvestor]

Jul 14, 2011 9:56:03 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Jul 14, 2011 9:51:18 GMT -5 @oldtex said:

I agree with you. Competent leadership always plans for contingencies.

So Billisonboard your saying that President Obama doesn't have a contingency plan?

No. I was agreeing with P.I. that he does.

PLS STOP ageeing with me so much lately or people may begin to talk. ...

[djAdvocate]

Jul 14, 2011 8:48:40 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

Jul 14, 2011 8:42:08 GMT -5 Bluerobin said:

The pubs have already blown it. The 2011 election was backlash from voters over a democratic majority in both houses and a president, who argued so much amongst themselves that they could not get much done. Don't forget 60% of the population favors Obamacare.
The pubs are only appealing to the lunatic fringe of their own party. Duhhhhhhhhhhhhh! They never thought about the other 85% of the electorate, who are pretty disgusted with their approach.
This is interesting. I hope Barry has the stones to do a Clinton. He should also remind the pubs that he is the pres and it is not his job to propose legislation - it's theirs and it better be acceptable to both parties. I do wish there was a viable 3rd party.

Since ObamaCare was passed, it only enjoyed majority support ONE week. Since then it has always been a majority that favor repeal. You're nuts if you think 60% of voters favor that thing.

you're nuts if you think that 60% favor repeal because it goes too far. 30% favor repeal because it goes too far, 30% because it does not go far enough. if you strengthen the bill, it would indeed get 60% support.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Jul 14, 2011 9:01:41 GMT -5 Bluerobin said:

PBP, the election was backlash against a "do nothing" congress. Wait until you see the backlash against the pubs, who are scaring the heck outta everyone. I have heard and read a lot about Obamacare, and most feel it didn't go far enough. My only problem is that unlike car insurance, it does not allow you to be self insured.
Obama will get a 2nd term thanks to the pubs. Get ready for it. Maybe the Dems learned their lesson, but I doubt it - they will continue to argue amongst themselves, preparing the way for another pub "mandate" in 2014 (I say that facetiously, because there are no mandates, just indicators of disgust).

No, the backlash was very clearly mostly over the spending issue. Obama and the Dem's spending scared the shit out of voters who were already upset with the GOP for failing to control spending.

The only thing that scares voters is the GOP failing to do what it was elected to do: stop this run-away train.

[Bluerobin]

PBP, we view the reasons differently, but the results and causes the same. I think both parties are shameful. The dems didn't start the spending on two unnecessary wars, the pubs did. However, the dems failed to reign in the spending, and then had the idiocy to bail out the banks, etc. They should have let them fail. That is what free enterprise is all about.
Either way, the pubs are playing a game of chicken that they cannot win. Too bad some loon like Perot won't get a major 3rd party effort going this year. I am embarrassed by my party and the way they are acting.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

I agree failing banks should have been permitted to fail. In fact every measure since TARP designed to re-inflate the housing bubble is just making the situation worse and prolonging the inevitable. We can't privatize profits and socialize risk.

The Republicans CAN win the game of "chicken" if they're serious, and they don't view it as a game. Because it's not. This is life or death for our country. If they let Obama win, America loses.

[handyman2]

If we default it will cause temporary chaos but it very well may be that we may see a lot of new faces in Washington after 2012. People will wake up and be inclined to look at who represents them much more closely and that could be a good thing. In my view.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Well, well, well...S&P is joining Moody's now in performing a review of the credit rating of the United States. Says they're not as interested in a short term deal to raise the debt ceiling as they are a long term plan for fiscal sustainability. Who'd have ever thought that?

[ungenteel]

rightie politicians are disgustingly lily livered ... they are doing everything they can to avoid casting a vote to raise the debt limit ... any numbskull with half a wit understands that the limit must be increased ... but repubs in congress are cowed by Tea Party crackpots and right wing talk show dingbats who are wallowing in their ability to rabble rouse the kneejerks

[formerexpat]

-- the GOP is our only hope.

God save us all.

I don't believe in God and right now, the GOP looks like a deer in headlights.

S&P is joining Moody's now in performing a review of the credit rating of the United States.

They may really be our only hope to end reckless spending.

There are going to be some mad, old people when the gov't starts making massive changes to the social programs.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Jul 15, 2011 20:31:55 GMT -5 formerexpat said:

-- the GOP is our only hope.

God save us all.

I don't believe in God and right now, the GOP looks like a deer in headlights.

S&P is joining Moody's now in performing a review of the credit rating of the United States.

They may really be our only hope to end reckless spending.

There are going to be some mad, old people when the gov't starts making massive changes to the social programs.

The GOP is definitely scared right now, but I cannot for the life of me figure out why. Perhaps it's a collective lack of serious negotiating experience? I've been a part of some very tough negotiations-- nothing on this scale of course, but it was big to me. And I can tell you from experience that Obama is 100% for sure cracking up.

If the GOP stands firm, Obama loses, and America wins. Obama has all but lost, and he knows it. It's just sad the GOP can't see that they've won this. Nothing more needs to be said, nothing more to be done, just stare this asshole down.

Obama's press conference today was a classic loser move-- to keep talking when he's lost the argument, to ramble on when the sale is hopeless, is to cement the defeat.

All that's left for the GOP at this point is to sit tight and wait for their inevitable victory-- or, more likely-- to f*** it up. I'm still about 70% - 30% that they'll eff it up. You can basically take a poll, and if 30% of the voters are opposed to what the GOP is doing, and 70% agree, the GOP will do anything possible to please the 30%. This is such an issue.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/8636645/Barack-No-Drama-Obama-makes-a-stand-on-debt-and-finally-loses-his-cool.html

The party that loses their cool during a discussion automatically loses in a negotiation. Period. Unless they're negotiating with the GOP.

The GOP needs to quit worrying about who will get the blame for an alleged default and start thinking ahead to the days of total economic and political collapse and how posteriety will view the one group of people who could have done something to stop it.

[SweetVirginia]

Jul 14, 2011 19:56:59 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

I agree failing banks should have been permitted to fail. In fact every measure since TARP designed to re-inflate the housing bubble is just making the situation worse and prolonging the inevitable. We can't privatize profits and socialize risk.

The Republicans CAN win the game of "chicken" if they're serious, and they don't view it as a game. Because it's not. This is life or death for our country. If they let Obama win, America loses.

Do you even understand that the so called "republicans" which you are putting all of your faith on, helped to enact TARP, and part of the gigantic deficit that we have today?

[cereb]

Jul 15, 2011 22:33:15 GMT -5 SweetVirginia said:

Jul 14, 2011 19:56:59 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

I agree failing banks should have been permitted to fail. In fact every measure since TARP designed to re-inflate the housing bubble is just making the situation worse and prolonging the inevitable. We can't privatize profits and socialize risk.

The Republicans CAN win the game of "chicken" if they're serious, and they don't view it as a game. Because it's not. This is life or death for our country. If they let Obama win, America loses.

Do you even understand that the so called "republicans" which you are putting all of your faith on, helped to enact TARP, and part of the gigantic deficit that we have today?

Ahhhhhhhhhh. And for that nugget of wisdom, you get