cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 0:18:01 GMT -5
BOSTON — Last November, Yvette Chappell found herself increasingly anxious that her 27-year-old son, Deshawn James Chappell, was spiraling downward into deep psychosis. He was exhibiting intense paranoia and calling late at night to complain about deafening voices in his head. Multimedia Slide Show A Schizophrenic, a Slain Worker, Troubling Questions Enlarge This Image Ryan Papazian THE VICTIM Stephanie Moulton was killed at a group home in January. More Photos » Readers' Comments Readers shared their thoughts on this article. Read All Comments (271) » For over a year, Mr. Chappell, a schizophrenic with a violent criminal record, had seemed relatively stable in a state-financed group home in Charlestown. But after a fight with another resident, Mr. Chappell was shuttled from home to home, and his mother believed that he had fallen off his medication along the way. Ms. Chappell said she had tried to communicate this concern to his caretakers, but it was not until mid-January that she found somebody who listened. The woman introduced herself as Stephanie and said she would be Mr. Chappell’s counselor at his new group home in Revere. She confirmed that Mr. Chappell had stopped getting his antipsychotic injections but made his mother a promise: “She said: ‘Don’t worry. I’m going to get Deshawn back on track.’ “I thought everything was going to be O.K. because he had somebody who cared,” Ms. Chappell said, her voice breaking. Two days after that conversation, Stephanie Moulton, a petite, street-smart 25-year-old, was dead, and Mr. Chappell was accused of murdering her. They had been alone at the Revere home, where, her family said, Ms. Moulton generally worked a solo shift. Mr. Chappell beat her, stabbed her repeatedly and then dumped her partially nude body in a church parking lot, prosecutors said. www.nytimes.com/2011/06/17/us/17MENTAL.html?pagewanted=1&_r=2&sq=sontag&st=cse&scp=3
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2011 4:59:02 GMT -5
Sorry but that stuff happens all the time. Schizophrenics are normally on & off medication all the time because they hit periods when they think that they are "well" (it's a cycle). Also unless he had been ordered by the courts, it was his right to go off his meds & nobody else has the right to make him take them.
I see nothing to justify spending billions of dollars in this story. Sorry.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 5:20:05 GMT -5
Sorry but that stuff happens all the time. Schizophrenics are normally on & off medication all the time because they hit periods when they think that they are "well" (it's a cycle). Also unless he had been ordered by the courts, it was his right to go off his meds & nobody else has the right to make him take them. I see nothing to justify spending billions of dollars in this story. Sorry. I'm thinking you missed the point entirely. It isn't about the man with mental illness. It's about the people who work with those who have mental illness, and keeping THEM safe. It's about a woman who was murdered quite possibly because she was working with someone who was very unstable...alone. She should not have been alone with this man, but budget cuts mean staffing cuts and improper/ unsafe staffing ratios.
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❤ mollymouser ❤
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Post by ❤ mollymouser ❤ on Jun 26, 2011 9:08:33 GMT -5
We could come up with a lot of "what if" type scenarios here ... there are no easy answers.
What if there had been 2 employees working in the home? Perhaps both would've been murdered.
What if the County or State funded 2 employees and, in turn, had to lay off Child Protective Services employees and some child was abused or neglected?
What if the County or State has to spend too much money on welfare or illegal immigrants or education and doesn't have the money for extra mental health staffing in group homes?
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 26, 2011 9:20:38 GMT -5
When you think about budget cuts for those in need
It's about time because the days of a free lunch by our government are over because of our enormous debt..
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:24:49 GMT -5
When you think about budget cuts for those in need It's about time because the days of a free lunch by our government are over because of our enormous debt.. So you'd be more than happy to say your little piece about free lunch to a cancer patient who is unable to work? Good to know.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:26:04 GMT -5
We could come up with a lot of "what if" type scenarios here ... there are no easy answers. What if there had been 2 employees working in the home? Perhaps both would've been murdered. What if the County or State funded 2 employees and, in turn, had to lay off Child Protective Services employees and some child was abused or neglected? What if the County or State has to spend too much money on welfare or illegal immigrants or education and doesn't have the money for extra mental health staffing in group homes? Nobody is asking for "extra" staffing. Those days are long gone by. All we ask for is adequate and safe ratios.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:31:25 GMT -5
it was his right to go off his meds & nobody else has the right to make him take them. Not necessarily true. Society has a right to enforcement when someone becomes a danger to themself or others. This is where it gets very sticky. Persons who are considered to be a danger to themselves or others by a psychiatrist can be "sectioned" to a hospital bed, providing one is available. This a short term fix, as they can only be held without a court order for 72 hours. The hospitals general treat them with anti psychotics and release them in order to have a bed for the next acute patient. There are "Rogers" guardianship which can help with med compliance, but that too is a trip through the courts, a very lengthy one.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:32:43 GMT -5
Protecting society is not a free lunch. Dealing with people who are ill or unable to care for themselves is different than giving out a freebie. Some people just don't get that until it's their daughter, son, mother, uncle or aunt who ends up drawing the schizophrenia card.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 26, 2011 9:34:08 GMT -5
So you'd be more than happy to say your little piece about free lunch to a cancer patient who is unable to work?
Good to know. [/quote][/color]
That is not what I said Ma'am..not even close but nice try again..
Social Welfare and Pension costs have caused CA to make some drastic budget cuts. However our legislators are now at an impasse because they are not getting paid by the Controller John Chiang..
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:40:55 GMT -5
"hat is not what I said Ma'am..not even close but nice try again.."
Maybe you are unaware of it, but that is exactly what you said.
Schizophrenia is an extremely debilitating mental illness, much like Cancer can be a debilitating physical disease. The end result particularly during initial treatment phases leaves a person unable to function. Actually, the cancer patient has a better shot at it. Many cancers are curable. Schizophrenia is treatable in some cases, but not curable.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:41:58 GMT -5
"Social Welfare and Pension costs have caused CA to make some drastic budget cuts. However our legislators are now at an impasse because they are not getting paid by the Controller John Chiang.."
Well, that isn't quite what we are talking about here is it.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 26, 2011 9:42:05 GMT -5
Maybe you are unaware of it, but that is exactly what you said.
I know what I said....so deal with it...
It's about time because the days of a free lunch by our government are over because of our enormous debt..
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:42:53 GMT -5
It does get sticky. It certainly isn't an exact science and nobody has a crystal ball (other than Dr. Pig). There are always judgments made. That is why medicine is an art. Science is applied but there is the judgment and art from a human being who has to make those decisions. And, sometimes they are going to be wrong. And, 99.99% of schizophrenics are not harmful. However, the nature of the illness is unpredictable. Having only one staff member in attendance for someone who supposedly needs monitoring and group living seems like a bad setup. It is a bad setup in the reverse. There have also been staff people who abuse the mentally ill. Having 2 people is a good idea just for that reason. Not that it can't happen with any number but it would reduce the likelihood. True.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:44:16 GMT -5
Maybe you are unaware of it, but that is exactly what you said. I know what I said....so deal with it... It's about time because the days of a free lunch by our government are over because of our enormous debt.. I see, so you are just trolling on a Sunday morning eh?
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 26, 2011 9:44:23 GMT -5
Well, that isn't quite what we are talking about here is it.
You admit they you don't know what you are talking about once again??
We will have to see budget cuts probably across the board in some states who are tittering on bankruptcy ie California for one
I see, so you are just trolling on a Sunday morning eh?
Is that the best you can come up with?? You usually are much better at cheap shots Ma'am..go for it I have seen all of your insults before so get some new ones..
But back to the OP....drastic and draconian budget cuts are going to be a way of life and once again "the days of the free lunch are over" so deal with it or get out of the way and let the government make the tough choices and then deal with them...spare us your bleeding hear liberalism or socialism BS
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:48:33 GMT -5
"You admit they you don't know what you are talking about once again??"
Why would I "admit" to something that isn't true?
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:49:58 GMT -5
"Is that the best you can come up with?? You usually are much better at cheap shots Ma'am..go for it I have seen all of your insults before so get some new ones.. " I was trying to be gentle. After all, you seem a bit slow and befuddled, perhaps you haven't had your coffee yet. Besides, others here who know me well can vouch for the fact the you haven't seen them all just yet. I'm trying to be on my best behavior.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 26, 2011 9:51:42 GMT -5
I gave you me honest opinion about your OP....if you want to just toss out cheap shots find somebody else
When you think about budget cuts for those in need (
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:54:05 GMT -5
".spare us your bleeding hear liberalism or socialism BS " You won't feel that way when an understaffed group home comes to a neighborhood near you, or your children, or your grandchildren. Matter of fact...awww never mind . I'm trying to be good here...
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:55:31 GMT -5
This is why we can never have a real discussion on these kinds of issues. It becomes an all or nothing thing. We cannot really discuss health care because if you place any limits on anything, someone is going to go ape. So, we just continue to pretend that govt can do everything for everyone whenever, whereever, and however. And, instead, there will be subversive ways to cut costs and deprive people without anyone actually standing up and saying we can afford this and not that. Also true.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jun 26, 2011 9:56:45 GMT -5
HOw is the treatment of the violently mentally ill considered part of the government free lunch? This is a public safety issue.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:57:03 GMT -5
I gave you me honest opinion about your OP....if you want to just toss out cheap shots find somebody else When you think about budget cuts for those in need ( C-ya! ;D
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 9:58:58 GMT -5
HOw is the treatment of the violently mentally ill considered part of the government free lunch? This is a public safety issue. Some people just wanna cry about somebody getting something for nothing. They really are not interested in anything else but whining about those who they perceive as "sucking the system dry"
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jun 26, 2011 10:00:01 GMT -5
It's beyond reason that there would be only one staff member on duty in a group home the residents of which include the mentally ill. That endangers the staff member and the residents. There's no way to know when mental illness will erupt into violence. Personally, even at night, I don't believe two staff members to be enough since those afflicted are easily upset by what goes on around them. I must wonder if this particular group home was following its own policies and procedures. It just doesn't sound right, to me, that only one staff member in a place like this would be legal.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 10:05:04 GMT -5
It's beyond reason that there would be only one staff member on duty in a group home the residents of which include the mentally ill. That endangers the staff member and the residents. There's no way to know when mental illness will erupt into violence. Personally, even at night, I don't believe two staff members to be enough since those afflicted are easily upset by what goes on around them. I must wonder if this particular group home was following its own policies and procedures. It just doesn't sound right, to me, that only one staff member in a place like this would be legal. Unfortunately mmhmm, it's the norm. Juvenile programs are the exception because DCF and DYS have more funding and better staffing mandates. Some of the private drug treatment group homes have better staffing, but be prepared to pay 20 grand a month for care. DMR, ( mass dept of mental retardation) has more money as well, and if necessary they staff much more appropriately to the needs of the clients.
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ameiko
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Post by ameiko on Jun 26, 2011 10:07:03 GMT -5
Sorry but that stuff happens all the time. Schizophrenics are normally on & off medication all the time because they hit periods when they think that they are "well" (it's a cycle). Also unless he had been ordered by the courts, it was his right to go off his meds & nobody else has the right to make him take them. I see nothing to justify spending billions of dollars in this story. Sorry. I'm thinking you missed the point entirely. It isn't about the man with mental illness. It's about the people who work with those who have mental illness, and keeping THEM safe. It's about a woman who was murdered quite possibly because she was working with someone who was very unstable...alone. She should not have been alone with this man, but budget cuts mean staffing cuts and improper/ unsafe staffing ratios. Ahh... but she was streetsmart, remember? Apparently not. You are assuming that she was alone because of budget cuts but there is nothing in that article to prove it. Also, having another person there could have only meant a second victim or she could have been isolated and murdered while the second person was oblivious. In the end, she made a choice and it left her vulnerable. Is society to be held accountable for either her choices or his actions?
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 26, 2011 10:09:45 GMT -5
...I'm saddened that families must deal with these tragic health challenges...I'm also saddened that public systems are being sucked dry beginning where families leave off of in their care to their loved ones... but budget cuts must be made, because we are bleeding to death from endless paper cuts...
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ameiko
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Post by ameiko on Jun 26, 2011 10:12:12 GMT -5
Protecting society is not a free lunch. Dealing with people who are ill or unable to care for themselves is different than giving out a freebie. There are multiple ways to protect society. Some are pretty cheap- the price of a bullet. Can we go there? We used to keep people like this locked up but that was considered inhumane so we started these group homes. Well, she paid the price for this arrogance and to ignore that in favor of whining about funding is truly missing the point. They talk about the burden of society to provide high quality care but what about the right of society to protect itself? People like this are very difficult to keep on their meds and are dangerous. Barring some sort of permanent medications, do we just lock them up or put them down?
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 26, 2011 10:14:07 GMT -5
I'm thinking you missed the point entirely. It isn't about the man with mental illness. It's about the people who work with those who have mental illness, and keeping THEM safe. It's about a woman who was murdered quite possibly because she was working with someone who was very unstable...alone. She should not have been alone with this man, but budget cuts mean staffing cuts and improper/ unsafe staffing ratios. Ahh... but she was streetsmart, remember? Apparently not. You are assuming that she was alone because of budget cuts but there is nothing in that article to prove it. Also, having another person there could have only meant a second victim or she could have been isolated and murdered while the second person was oblivious. In the end, she made a choice and it left her vulnerable. Is society to be held accountable for either her choices or his actions? Actually, I am not assuming anything. I am in the field of residential mental health. It's been my field of expertise for 25 years. I also work in MA in the Boston area. All of the MH clients are served by sister vendors non-profits. There are protocols in place for a two or more staffing ratio. It's likely this young woman would still have been attacked, however, the second staff had there been one would have been able to access help for her quickly by following the protocol.
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