America must negotiate with the Taliban

[henryclay]

Stephen Biddle is the Robert Hertog senior fellow for defense policy at the Council on Foreign Relations. The following is a transcript of our discussion

How important is negotiating with the Taliban?
I think it’s very important. At some level, any imaginable, acceptable end to this war will be through some sort of negotiation. The war is not going to end successfully because the last Taliban guerilla dies of arterial sclerosis in a cave somewhere.

Somehow or another there is going to be some sort of agreement in which the Taliban lays down its arms in exchange for something. What the war is really about is what the something is. What are the terms of whatever agreement produces an end to the fighting?

In a sense, what those who advocate a forceful conduct of the war are saying is they want the terms of the eventually settlement to be extremely favorable to us and involve very few concessions to them - something so close that the settlement looks more like a surrender instrument rather than a compromise.

I have a question. How can you compromise with an ideology that wants you dead?

The entire article, (plus a related video), can be seen at: globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2011/06/22/america-must-negotiate-with-the-taliban/

[marshabar1]

Somehow or another there is going to be some sort of agreement in which the Taliban lays down its arms in exchange for something.

IN EXCHANGE FOR WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! My God, those people are insane. All they want is their backward ideology and dead enemies.

They MIGHT exchange for peace if we slit our slit own throats. MIGHT.

They might insist on doing it themselves for virgins to rape in paradise.

pm henry.

[Deleted]

Great. Create more Husseins and Bin Laden. Just what we need. How far has dealing with bad guys gotten us so far?

[billisonboard]

Here is a good article that describes who the Taliban are:

www.institute-for-afghan-studies.org/AFGHAN%20CONFLICT/TALIBAN/intro_kakar.htm

[henryclay]

bills, that's an awfluly long article just to make one point. I'll paraphrase it:

They have also banned kite flying, chicken fights, keeping pigeons and gambling, , , , celebration of new years and playing or listening to music

[handyman2]

How do you make a deal with the devil? They have no reason to negotiate. If they were not fighting us they would be fighting some other group. It is part of the history of the region. They just were not called the Taliban then just war lords.

[henryclay]

They have no reason to negotiate

.

Oh, I think they have every reason to "negotiate". I believe history tells us about a negotiation that resulted in a gift horse once doesn't it? And didn't Hitler and Stalin negotiate in more recent times? Seems I recall the United States was negotiating as late as 7:55 on the morinng of December 7, 1941. Even more recent still, didn't we negotiate a set of peace terms in Paris in the early 70's with the NVA over South VietNam that guranteed the NVA would stay north of the Ben Hai river?

I don't think it's a question of "them" having a reason to negotiate. What I'm wondering about is what is OUR reason to negotiate "with" them?

[billisonboard]

Jun 22, 2011 18:44:37 GMT -5 henryclay said:

bills, that's an awfluly long article just to make one point. I'll paraphrase it:

They have also banned kite flying, chicken fights, keeping pigeons and gambling, , , , celebration of new years and playing or listening to music

What I took away from it was the focus that the Taliban had on dealing with internal Afghan issues and the lack of international focus.

[hello fromWarsaw]

A large majority of Taliban are in it because they needed a job. Plenty can be siphoned off from the most radical. Or, look at it simplistically and create more enemies.

[swamp]

If the Taliban runs, or is at least incredibly influential in, Afghanistan, how exactly does the US withdraw troops and hand over power to whatever government is there, without dealing with the Taliban?

Do we just pack up and leave? I'm not sure that would be better. Or the other option is to stay there indefinitely and run the place.

[marshabar1]

Great they outlaw kite flying and make women dress in tents and then they force boys to dress up like girls and dance before they rape them. Wonderful culture.

[swamp]

Jun 22, 2011 20:02:40 GMT -5 @marshabar1 said:

Great they outlaw kite flying and make women dress in tents and then they force boys to dress up like girls and dance before they rape them. Wonderful culture.

I agree, they suck. But what else are we supposed to do?

[marshabar1]

Leave them and kill them if they come out and bother us. It's insane to keep doing the same thing expecting a different result. We have a president who doesn't like to use the word victory. Why the hell is sending our troops anywhere if he doesn't want to vanquish an enemy?

[deziloooooo]

So Marsha you don't want to negotiate with them, neither do you Krickett..henry too doesn't seem to want to negotiate with them..YET , from past comments, you three want us out of there, Afganistan..mmmm, duhh..

Swamp, seems to have it right and the ones who are goping to be involved , Kharzi and his government seems to be the ones who are going to have to do it..because in time , we will be gone...but besides that, your comments are kind of funny , at least to me, all thse negatives on the negotiating yet you can't wait for us to just say we won and pull out..and again , duuu.

[Deleted]

America must negotiate with the Taliban

That might be a workable solution. How's this:

1. Tell me all of the people in your organization & you can die fast

or

2. Your going to die sloooooow.

[billisonboard]

Jun 22, 2011 20:44:46 GMT -5 @oldtex said:

America must negotiate with the Taliban

That might be a workable solution. How's this:

1. Tell me all of the people in your organization & you can die fast

or

2. Your going to die sloooooow.

Will this be our military or civilians who execute people, either before or after torturing them?

[privateinvestor]

Written by Bill Roggio on June 19, 2011 8:53 PM to 4 Threat Matrix

Available online at: www.longwarjournal.org/threat-matrix/archives/2011/06/is_the_us_really_negotiating_w.php


According to outgoing US Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, the US is currently in talks with the Afghan Taliban. At least he thinks so.... From The New York Times:

In an appearance on CNN's "State of the Union," Mr. Gates cautioned that the talks were in such early stages -- having begun a few weeks ago -- that officials were still not certain the Taliban participants were genuine representatives of the Taliban leader Mullah Omar. He said the effort was being carried out by American diplomats but did not directly involve the Secretary of State, Hillary Rodham Clinton. And he said several other countries were participating, though he did not specify which ones.
"We have said all along that a political outcome is the way most of the wars end," Mr. Gates said. "The question is when and if they are ready to talk seriously."


We don't write about talks about talks with the Taliban any longer, because it always turns out that the US/ISAF, etc. are talking to wannabe Taliban officials who have long since been denounced by the Taliban, or to individuals who claim they are close to the Taliban leadership, or even with impostors.

On that last point, Gates admits he's not even sure the US is speaking to "genuine representatives of the Taliban leader Mullah Omar." Here's hoping they aren't like the "Mullah Akhtar Mohammed Mansour" impostor who fooled US and British officials last year into thinking he was the real deal.

Or perhaps they're again talking to Mutawakil, Zaeef, and company, who always seem to resurface at times like this. (For more about past follies with negotiations with the Taliban, see Threat Matrix report, Taliban talks and Groundhog Day.)

Regardless, it is curious that top US and NATO leaders believe that they can carry out high-level talks with the likes of Mullah Omar, as if the setbacks they have experienced the past year have been far worse that what the Taliban experienced during the US invasion in 2001-2002. The Taliban survived that onslaught, fled to Pakistan, regrouped and refitted, and pushed back into Afghanistan with a vengeance.

The US and NATO have already signaled that they want out of Afghanistan, and will begin the drawdown over the next several years. Even with the US pressure in Helmand and Kandahar the past year, the Taliban still control vast areas of the east and north, as well as pockets in the south. The Afghan security forces are far from ready to take control. The Taliban still have safe haven and state support in Pakistan. Regardless of the Taliban's losses in the past year, they are still in a far better position than they were in late 2002.

[billisonboard]

P.I.,
What do you think of oldtex's idea? Something that Marines should be doing?

Jun 22, 2011 20:44:46 GMT -5 @oldtex said:

America must negotiate with the Taliban

That might be a workable solution. How's this:

1. Tell me all of the people in your organization & you can die fast

or

2. Your going to die sloooooow.

[marshabar1]

On that last point, Gates admits he's not even sure the US is speaking to "genuine representatives of the Taliban leader Mullah Omar." Here's hoping they aren't like the "Mullah Akhtar Mohammed Mansour" impostor who fooled US and British officials last year into thinking he was the real deal.

Exactly he said the same thing in a Chris Wallace interview on Sunday.

The Talibs are legion and they are crazy. Their yes doesn't mean yes and their no doesn't mean no. They are shifty. And they are liars. Might as well negotiate with a mud puddle.

[privateinvestor]

I watched General Wesley Clark today and he said his sources in the Pentagon told him that they have been negotiating peace with the Taliban though Karzai's government ..but the hangup is determining what they will give to the Taliban based on what they want which to date has been very vague.. So it seems that not much has been accomplished and we will continue to waste billions of our tax dollars in Afghanistan for rebuilding that country with projects that the Afghans cannot afford to maintain or use...or build schools that the Taliban destroy as soon as they are completed..

[marshabar1]

Oh how silly of us. I know what they want.

Just give every jihad bearded warlord in Afghanistan 72 virgins. They'll think they died and went to paradise.

[fairlycrazy23]

To borrow a quote on negotiating with terrorists:

The best diplomat that I know is a fully-loaded phaser bank