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Jun 20, 2011 23:27:36 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2011 23:27:36 GMT -5
Abortion was legal until the mid 1800s.
You say you don't have to say the words... but the whole thread is an outrage that someone would leave them out...
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henryclay
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Jun 20, 2011 23:54:23 GMT -5
Post by henryclay on Jun 20, 2011 23:54:23 GMT -5
Chiver, you said: the soldier in the background clearly said "under god" in the clip.
May I suggest you watch the video again. See if you can follow what the " the soldier in the background" is saying. Look for him to follow the script. It goes like this: At his command "Present Arms" the flag is hoisted and the hand salute is rendered. The salute is held,and when the flag gets to the top he hesitates just a moment and calls out "Order Arms" for the salute to end. I think you will see the soldier in the foreground follow those calls.
But my hearing is bad, and I'm just going on memory, so maybe I am wrong after all.
oped. I didn't think you'd understand. But I hope you know you are in good company and I trust you enjoy the relationship. Michelle Obama seems to have also had an intense dislike for this country, too. But I notice both you and her are not reluctant to take advantage of what it offers.
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Jun 21, 2011 0:06:31 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 0:06:31 GMT -5
lol... i love it when people say i hate my country because i'm not a big believer in the corelation between liberty and forcing people to pledge...
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henryclay
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Jun 21, 2011 0:20:29 GMT -5
Post by henryclay on Jun 21, 2011 0:20:29 GMT -5
Is it okay if, on account of your words being so loosely put together that they can be misconstrued, , , that someone does in fact misconstrue them? I'll re-post them for you: >>>>And if i think forcing people to say a pledge, especially one that includes the word under god, smacks of communism..... then i think this is a terrible country? ... <<<<
I wasn't aware that anyone was forcing anyone to say anything. All I see worthy of note is that based on a false premise you think this is a terrible country.
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cereb
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Jun 21, 2011 0:41:13 GMT -5
Post by cereb on Jun 21, 2011 0:41:13 GMT -5
"And Tennesseer, the pictures are just what a progressive press would publish. The old Pledge called for starting with the hand over the heart and at the words "the flag" extending the arm PALM UP to indicate THIS flag.
The pictures you posted are an example of ignorance and one of the reasons the gesture was dropped during WWII"
The pictures Tenn posted are a historical reference and have nothing to do with 'progressive" issues. Don't be such a hysterical ninny. BTW you have it wrong. Look up Bellamy salute.
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henryclay
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Jun 21, 2011 1:50:42 GMT -5
Post by henryclay on Jun 21, 2011 1:50:42 GMT -5
On more than just one reference I believe my description of the Pledge will stand up to scrutiny. Here is one of those references. You may be interested in the source date. After Columbus Day became a nationally recognized holiday on July 21, 1892, Francis Bellamy and others involved in the Nationalist movement helped to put together a national school program for the celebration of the event.
National School Celebration of Columbus Day - The Official Programme, was published in the September 8, 1892 issue of The Youth's Companion. As there was no real national means to distribute information to all the schools in the country at the time, this publication served as the means to organize the official events. The subtext of the article title read:
Let every pupil and friend of the Schools who reads The Companion, at once present personally the following programme to the Teachers, Superintendents, School Boards, and Newspapers in the towns and cities in which they reside. Not one School in America should be left out in this Celebration.
The program for the National Celebration of Columbus Day was to be the first unified national celebration in the country's history, with every single school taking part in the ceremony according to a time table in perfect unison. The address, also written by Francis Bellamy, which was to be given at a certain part of the ceremony, started out:
The spectacle America presents this day is without precedent in history. From ocean to ocean, in city, village, and country-side, the children of the States are marshaled and marching under the banner of the nation: and with them the people are gathering around the schoolhouse. . . . . At a signal from the Principal the pupils, in ordered ranks, hands to the side, face the Flag. Another signal is given; every pupil gives the flag the military salute -- right hand lifted, palm downward, to a line with the forehead and close to it. Standing thus, all repeat together, slowly, "I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands; one Nation indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for all." At the words, "to my Flag," the right hand is extended gracefully, palm upward, toward the Flag, and remains in this gesture till the end of the affirmation; whereupon all hands immediately drop to the side. Then, still standing, as the instruments strike a chord, all will sing AMERICA- "My Country, tis of Thee."
Source: The Youth's Companion, 65 (1892): 446-447 For easy access it is reprinted as part of an interesting article on the misunderstanding of how the extended arm was to be done at: www.rationalrevolution.net/articles/rise_of_american_fascism.htm
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cereb
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Jun 21, 2011 2:21:48 GMT -5
Post by cereb on Jun 21, 2011 2:21:48 GMT -5
On more than just one reference I believe my description of the Pledge will stand up to scrutiny. Here is one of those references. You may be interested in the source date. After Columbus Day became a nationally recognized holiday on July 21, 1892, Francis Bellamy and others involved in the Nationalist movement helped to put together a national school program for the celebration of the event.
National School Celebration of Columbus Day - The Official Programme, was published in the September 1892 issue of The Youth's Companion. As there was no real national means to distribute information to all the schools in the country at the time, this publication served as the means to organize the official events. The subtext of the article title read:
Let every pupil and friend of the Schools who reads The Companion, at once present personally the following programme to the Teachers, Superintendents, School Boards, and Newspapers in the towns and cities in which they reside. Not one School in America should be left out in this Celebration.
The program for the National Celebration of Columbus Day was to be the first unified national celebration in the country's history, with every single school taking part in the ceremony according to a time table in perfect unison. The address, also written by Francis Bellamy, which was to be given at a certain part of the ceremony, started out:
The spectacle America presents this day is without precedent in history. From ocean to ocean, in city, village, and country-side, the children of the States are marshaled and marching under the banner of the nation: and with them the people are gathering around the schoolhouse. . . . . At a signal from the Principal the pupils, in ordered ranks, hands to the side, face the Flag. Another signal is given; every pupil gives the flag the military salute -- right hand lifted, palm downward, to a line with the forehead and close to it. Standing thus, all repeat together, slowly, "I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands; one Nation indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for all." At the words, "to my Flag," the right hand is extended gracefully, palm upward, toward the Flag, and remains in this gesture till the end of the affirmation; whereupon all hands immediately drop to the side. Then, still standing, as the instruments strike a chord, all will sing AMERICA- "My Country, tis of Thee."
Source: The Youth's Companion, 65 (1892): 446-447 For easy access it is reprinted as part of an interesting article on the misunderstanding of how the extended arm was to be done at: www.rationalrevolution.net/articles/rise_of_american_fascism.htmI should have been more specific. You stated that the salute began with the hand over the heart. It did not. Your own source cites the salute began with the hand at the forehead.
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henryclay
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Jun 21, 2011 7:05:22 GMT -5
Post by henryclay on Jun 21, 2011 7:05:22 GMT -5
You are absolutely correct, you should have been more specific. But to demonstrate that chivalry is not dead, I will eat my humble pie in public. However may I have a side order of whipped cream for my humble pie please, or does that cost extra? Or I'll just settle for having squashed your imbedded inference that, by your reference to the historical significance of Tenneseer's attached photos, you were saying the old Pledge included a Nazi salute.
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