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Post by marshabar1 on Jun 18, 2011 10:24:14 GMT -5
Fareed Zakaria, the man our president turns to for "wisdom and advise," told Jon Stewart on The Daily Show last night that little wars don't do the economy any good, it takes a World War where enemies are destroyed and good education so that a country can begin to build things that the destroyed nations need. Short of that he recommended that Americans need to be more like Germans who are friendly toward their government. Sure, he says, government messes up and taxes in Germany are high but apparently the good outweighs the bad in his view. He seems to see no way out of the fact that corporations are prospering by using slave or near slave labor and middle class America is dying. Shrug shrug, heh heh heh, smirk smirk. . . only World War hahaha.Listen to the conversation that follows: www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/political-economy/post/fareed-zakaria-on-the-daily-show-what-germanys-doing-right/2011/06/08/AGV8a2LH_blog.html
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handyman2
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Post by handyman2 on Jun 18, 2011 10:35:53 GMT -5
Not advocating a world war but when you look at history most major advances came after a major nation incompasing war. Not to mention it reduces the burden of providing for millions killed in a major war. I know it sounds crazy but history has proven him correct. But it is a terrable way to solve the problem of over population which drives most of our economic issues.
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Post by marshabar1 on Jun 18, 2011 10:39:32 GMT -5
Not advocating a world war but when you look at history most major advances came after a major nation incompasing war. Not to mention it reduces the burden of providing for millions killed in a major war. I know it sounds crazy but history has proven him correct. But it is a terrable way to solve the problem of over population which drives most of our economic issues. I know that, handy, but this man who advises the president has only two potential solutions to the dying American middle class: be a command control, overtaxed country like Germany or World War. He discounts entirely the idea of cutting back, he goes immediately to the liberal scare tactic naming school teachers and fire fighters at the mere thought of cut backs.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 10:39:35 GMT -5
...oh, joy... another reference to benchmark Germany for us in the USA... <<< “The measure should be a country like Germany,” he said. “...Because they view government in a positive way, which is government invests in technology, in science, in technical institutes and apprenticeship programs. It tries to figure out what is it you can do positively to grow the economy.” >>> ...and does their "constitution" list this as an enumerated power?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 10:45:29 GMT -5
Zakaria is a Bilderberg, too. Let's just hope the power people have not decided to kill half of us off, drug and subjugate 3/4 of the ones left standing, and carry on their evil plans from their lofty positions up above it all..
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deziloooooo
Senior Associate
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Post by deziloooooo on Jun 18, 2011 10:55:02 GMT -5
Not advocating a world war but when you look at history most major advances came after a major nation incompasing war. Not to mention it reduces the burden of providing for millions killed in a major war. I know it sounds crazy but history has proven him correct. But it is a terrable way to solve the problem of over population which drives most of our economic issues. I know that, handy, but this man who advises the president has only two potential solutions to the dying American middle class: be a command control, overtaxed country like Germany or World War. He discounts entirely the idea of cutting back, he goes immediately to the liberal scare tactic naming school teachers and fire fighters at the mere thought of cut backs. your mis labeling his thoughts Marsha..he does believe that to stay the power we are..not militarily, the country we are in innovation, leadership, and to benefit from that leadership, be the first with the most, we have to invest in for our future . If not we risk, actually will be left behind as other nations, our rivals ARE investing, BILLIONS....China, S Korea, yes the Japanese , up to their disaster, have no idea know, Indonesia, India, Germany, Israel and on and on..yet because of our financial woes any expenditures are out of the question today. He is asking the Republicans to get back into the game with the ideas that made them who they are, they are not today..with their ideas. Not saying go along with all his ideas but just to criticize , dismiss him and his thoughts out of hand, because you don't care for his ideas, not examine them and think about them, just dismiss them because he is ONE of MANY who have possible advised the POTUS who you have made clear under no circumstance like, no matter what he might do. Even to how much cuff he showed at a State Dinner , who he sat next to, dissed his possible be at fault because his limo got caught and stuck in a driveway, how he gave a toast..to me is just another type of doing , similar to the 'Obama sucks because I said so " going on here and elsewhere. IMHO of course.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 18, 2011 10:59:45 GMT -5
Fareed Zakaria:Education & World War Heals Economy
Well so far our lack of more technical education and billions wasted on our World Wars hasn't done much for our Economy...Rather these two items mentioned by Zakaria could sink our economy in a few weeks if we don't have a compromise on the Federal Budget for 2011 and 2012....IMHO
Hope Joe Biden who is leading this effort for Obama is not asleep at the switch again...or the Dems and Repubs may just exit these meeting chaired by Old Joe
I understand the stumbling blocks are Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and Defense Spending...and both sides are still mlles apart.. Maybe progrees will be made today on the Golf Course with Obama and Boehner playing a few rounds and Joe Biden as Obama's caddy..
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 11:04:02 GMT -5
<<< your mis labeling his thoughts Marsha..he does believe that Io stay the power we are..not militarily, the country we are in innovation, we have to invest in for our future or be left behind as other nations, our rivals ARE investing,..China, S Korea, yes the Japanese , up to their disaster, have no idea know, Indonesia, India, Germany, Israel and on and on..yet because of our financial woes any expenditures are out of the question today. >>> ...but dez... we must not compare the US and some of these developing countries at face value on a "well, it's working for them" approach... there are too many variables, too many consequences... India and China are building their economies at a staggering rate, but that, argueably, is well overdue... the US just doesn't have the same need to "get back into the game" that "made us who we are," like the developing world... ...imo...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 11:05:31 GMT -5
I love your cliff hangers, PI..... ;D
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 11:08:16 GMT -5
I love your cliff hangers, PI..... ;D
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 11:10:11 GMT -5
<<< I understand the stumbling blocks are Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and Defense Spending...and both sides are still mlles apart.. Maybe progrees will be made today on the Golf Course with Obama and Boehner playing a few rouns and Joe Biden as Obama's caddy.. >>>
...go, go, go, stay... there, that wasn't hard... we should totally put me in charge... ;D
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 18, 2011 11:10:12 GMT -5
I love your cliff hangers, PI..... ;D Hey Krickitt just living up to my reputation here as a "Troll" who demeans and degrades the lovely and intelligent ladies who are a threat to me...I guess? ??...I have to uphold my reputation before someone else steals it..
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deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
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Post by deziloooooo on Jun 18, 2011 11:15:56 GMT -5
<<< your mis labeling his thoughts Marsha..he does believe that Io stay the power we are..not militarily, the country we are in innovation, we have to invest in for our future or be left behind as other nations, our rivals ARE investing,..China, S Korea, yes the Japanese , up to their disaster, have no idea know, Indonesia, India, Germany, Israel and on and on..yet because of our financial woes any expenditures are out of the question today. >>> ...but dez... we must not compare the US and some of these developing countries at face value on a "well, it's working for them" approach... there are too many variables, too many consequences... India and China are building their economies at a staggering rate, but that, argueably, is well overdue... the US just doesn't have the same need to "get back into the game" that "made us who we are," like the developing world... ...imo... Granted , building there economies, over due, but I suggest the beginning building there, don't forget South Korea too, have been done, and they are now on the next rung of the ladder Actually many steps up that ladder and are moving higher, and we are where we are on the ladder and inching down as they pass us going up. To dimiss his ideas, Zakaria, out of hand..as many do, here too, also the POTUS too as he has spouted the same concerns and put forward suggestions for such investments by the country, but just because, both are being dismissed , is , IMHO, not the brightest of moves on our part. imo ;D
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Post by marshabar1 on Jun 18, 2011 11:17:27 GMT -5
What if we just get into a whole bunch of little wars simultaneously, like say Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Yemen...maybe all of them added up could become an economic boon like a "world war?"
Nah, Ratchets, that's just a slow bleed. Just the way they want it. Population hardly notices they're dying.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 11:19:13 GMT -5
I just noticed yesterday that I am having a posting problem. Most of what I write I end up deleting before I post it....... that's ONE way to not get in trouble here. Just read, write, delete, then do it again...I have imaginary posts all over the board... ;D
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 18, 2011 11:20:31 GMT -5
Once again, Zakaria shreds the conservative side of an issue and moves on without providing a substantial rebuttal. Then he says Republicans "don't bother to study existing health care systems anywhere in the world," in a rather hasty accusation. "They resemble the old Marxists," he adds, "who refused to look around at actual experience." He also hits conservatives for not embracing the findings of the bi-partisan Bowles-Simpson debt commission -- "because those ideas are too deeply rooted in, well, reality." Once again he sets up a straw-man argument by hailing the debt commission's findings as "reality" without explaining why, and condeming conservatives for running from it. Does Zakaria know that President Obama has also been running from ideas proposed by the debt commission? Would he like to criticize him as well? Or is he too busy having foreign policy conversations with the president to hit him as "out-of-touch" with America? Is it because he voted for a "steady and reasoned" Barack Obama in 2008? If Zakaria provided evidence and quotes to back up his barbs against Republicans, his argument would prove much more credible than it does. Instead, it appears he is content with accusations bordering on ad hominem attacks. TO READ MORE GO TO #18 Source:-- Matt Hadro is a News Analyst at the Media Research Center. www.mrc.org/biasalert/2011/20110617071752.aspx
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 11:20:38 GMT -5
PLUS-- these little wars are costly. We have to give all this aid and stuff... best to just vaporize people, maybe?? We'll see..
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 18, 2011 11:23:41 GMT -5
Of course, if Zakaria is to paint with broad strokes and dismiss the modern conservative movement as entirely lost and ineffective, the reader would expect him to expound upon his point in detail and provide plenty of facts and evidence to support his thesis. His argument is largely devoid of substantial evidence and filled with debatable historical assumptions. Zakaria mourns for the days of traditional conservatism "rooted in reality," but doesn't help his cause by distancing himself from this traditional conservatism in the first graph. "'Conservatism is true.' That's what George Will told me when I interviewed him as an eager student many years ago," Zakaria writes. "His formulation might have been a touch arrogant, but Will's basic point was intelligent." This is certainly not a dismissal of conservatism, but neither is it a full embrace of conservatism. A friend of conservatism might have more authority to criticize today's movement than someone like Zakaria who keeps a safe distance. Then he attacks the notion that lower taxes and spending will lead to economic growth, a favorite talking point of liberals today. "What is the evidence that tax cuts are the best path to revive the U.S. economy?" he asks. Reaganomics would be a good starting point, although Zakaria makes no effort to address that conservative argument. He instead credits the economic growth of the 80's and 90's to government investing in education and infrastructure. He also claims that Republicans are MIA when it comes to providing substantial ideas for improving health care in America. "When considering health care, for example, Republicans confidently assert that their ideas will lower costs, when we simply do not have much evidence for this."
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Post by marshabar1 on Jun 18, 2011 11:24:43 GMT -5
Once again, Zakaria shreds the conservative side of an issue and moves on without providing a substantial rebuttal. Then he says Republicans "don't bother to study existing health care systems anywhere in the world," in a rather hasty accusation. "They resemble the old Marxists," he adds, "who refused to look around at actual experience." He also hits conservatives for not embracing the findings of the bi-partisan Bowles-Simpson debt commission -- "because those ideas are too deeply rooted in, well, reality." Once again he sets up a straw-man argument by hailing the debt commission's findings as "reality" without explaining why, and condeming conservatives for running from it. Does Zakaria know that President Obama has also been running from ideas proposed by the debt commission? Would he like to criticize him as well? Or is he too busy having foreign policy conversations with the president to hit him as "out-of-touch" with America? Is it because he voted for a "steady and reasoned" Barack Obama in 2008? If Zakaria provided evidence and quotes to back up his barbs against Republicans, his argument would prove much more credible than it does. Instead, it appears he is content with accusations bordering on ad hominem attacks. Source:-- Matt Hadro is a News Analyst at the Media Research Center. www.mrc.org/biasalert/2011/20110617071752.aspxNo kidding. Seems to me he's a showboat rather than an actual scholar. Pop economics. He can shove his "Post American World" where the sun don't shine because that appears to be its original home.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 18, 2011 11:27:51 GMT -5
PLUS-- these little wars are costly. We have to give all this aid and stuff... best to just vaporize people, maybe?? We'll see.. I for one would like to see Obama move to exit Afghanistan by bringing home @50,000 troops ASAP....let the Afghans provide for their own construction projects and national security...ten years is enough IMHO.... Obama is in a bad place for Afghanistan...his liberal base wants out ASAP and his military wants to keep a larger force in the region....so Obama is looking for advice again ..but I think Public Opinion is changing about the Afghan since the Navy Seals took out Osama bin Laden and are on the hunt for the other el Qaeda leaders in the Afghan and Pakistan with drones and "hit' teams..
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 11:28:03 GMT -5
I just noticed yesterday that I am having a posting problem. Most of what I write I end up deleting before I post it....... that's ONE way to not get in trouble here. Just read, write, delete, then do it again...I have imaginary posts all over the board... ;D ...aww... I thought I'd been feeling good vibrations for no apparent reason...
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 11:30:10 GMT -5
<<< your mis labeling his thoughts Marsha..he does believe that Io stay the power we are..not militarily, the country we are in innovation, we have to invest in for our future or be left behind as other nations, our rivals ARE investing,..China, S Korea, yes the Japanese , up to their disaster, have no idea know, Indonesia, India, Germany, Israel and on and on..yet because of our financial woes any expenditures are out of the question today. >>> ...but dez... we must not compare the US and some of these developing countries at face value on a "well, it's working for them" approach... there are too many variables, too many consequences... India and China are building their economies at a staggering rate, but that, argueably, is well overdue... the US just doesn't have the same need to "get back into the game" that "made us who we are," like the developing world... ...imo... Granted , building there economies, over due, but I suggest the beginning building there, don't forget South Korea too, have been done, and they are now on the next rung of the ladder Actually many steps up that ladder and are moving higher, and we are where we are on the ladder and inching down as they pass us going up. To dimiss his ideas, Zakaria, out of hand..as many do, here too, also the POTUS too as he has spouted the same concerns and put forward suggestions for such investments by the country, but just because, both are being dismissed , is , IMHO, not the brightest of moves on our part. imo ;D ...well, fwiw, I, for one, am not dismissing his ideas out of hand... I'm just deciding that they're not bright ideas in the first place... ;D
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Post by marshabar1 on Jun 18, 2011 11:30:50 GMT -5
Congrats on reading. I couldn't. What'd he say?
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 18, 2011 11:34:42 GMT -5
Congrats on reading. I couldn't. What'd he say? Don't ask us Trolls??? Don't have a clue Ma'am...just saying ;D
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handyman2
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Post by handyman2 on Jun 18, 2011 11:40:35 GMT -5
Some serious facts we must address. First is we in all countries are fast facing a major liability of over population. The worlds resources is a bank just like the one where you go to withdraw your money. There are just so many resources that the world can provide. We are at the point where the bank balance is getting short. So we turn to increased tecnologies to solve our problem. Yet technology is a two edged sword. The more technology we have the less people are required to supply our needs from jobs to food. Medical tecnologies let us live longer but that just makes the over population problem worse. The question I have is the current economic problems a sign that the way we measure things becoming obsolete. The real challange is how do we solve these issues and get off this merry-go round? Just cutting expenditures or raising taxes is not going to get it. The problems with the world economy is already way beyound that solution.
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Post by marshabar1 on Jun 18, 2011 11:49:59 GMT -5
Some serious facts we must address. First is we in all countries are fast facing a major liability of over population. The worlds resources is a bank just like the one where you go to withdraw your money. There are just so many resources that the world can provide. We are at the point where the bank balance is getting short. So we turn to increased tecnologies to solve our problem. Yet technology is a two edged sword. The more technology we have the less people are required to supply our needs from jobs to food. Medical tecnologies let us live longer but that just makes the over population problem worse. The question I have is the current economic problems a sign that the way we measure things becoming obsolete. The real challange is how do we solve these issues and get off this merry-go round? Just cutting expenditures or raising taxes is not going to get it. The problems with the world economy is already way beyound that solution. True, handy. But it seems that the more the megalomaniacs try to hammer the world into the form they want it to be the worse things get. We have nature to wrestle against and we learn about our humanity in the natural order of things. The one worlders want to take that away entirely and fundamentally transform humankind into controllable automatons. Read about Bretton Woods and the Fabian Socialists. Their IMF and World Bank call the shots. If they need a world war there will be a world war. And it seems like they do need one since they've effed things up so badly with their bad banking. They pushed their scheme too far this time and nobody is big enough to manipulate it back by the regular methods.
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 11:53:27 GMT -5
I think Zakaria is wrong. I think more cuts is what we need, especially in Medicare. I think Republicans should be out there campaigning to make sure that everybody knows that they will not stand for a tax and spend economy like Germany which has lower unemployment and higher growth, that Republicans stand for cutting taxes for the rich and spending for the poor and the middle class even if that leads to higher unemployment. It's a principled stance. If Republicans are not the spearhead to gut Medicare, no one will. I am counting on them.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Jun 18, 2011 11:54:54 GMT -5
Granted , building there economies, over due, but I suggest the beginning building there, don't forget South Korea too, have been done, and they are now on the next rung of the ladder Actually many steps up that ladder and are moving higher, and we are where we are on the ladder and inching down as they pass us going up. To dismiss his ideas, Zakaria, out of hand..as many do, here too, also the POTUS too as he has spouted the same concerns and put forward suggestions for such investments by the country, but just because, both are being dismissed , is , IMHO, not the brightest of moves on our part. imo ;D ...well, fwiw, I, for one, am not dismissing his ideas out of hand... I'm just deciding that they're not bright ideas in the first place... ;D As long as you are not dismissing out of hand, it's all I ask. I on the other hand feel he has some good thoughts and on some are right on, but whether politically they would fly is another story. However he isn't a political , not beholden to the political reality of the times. Possible as one above who criticized the POTUS from not embracing the Bi Partison report on finance reforms didn't catch it, the POTUS is a political and IS beholden to the political realities and being a astute Political, has to be a political realest thus to jump on such ideas put forth by the Bi Partisan committee yet know no way in hell would it fly politically, to just embrace and go with it would be futile..that is the reality of it..thus he possible takes some parts of it that might find acceptance by enough to get considered and spens his capital on that part of the commissions suggestions That's what Politicals do, they are realist, know when to play em so to speak, know when to [have to] fold them. Professionals.. By the way, the same person stated that no discussion or in depth analyst is given by Zakaria on his thoughts and that is not true. Regarding the argument of just cutting taxes guarantees growth, he gave real life examples of Nations who are not low taxers of business and individuals yet their economies are growing, gave examples showing that the US is a low taxer of businesses, and that a Republican President had extraordinary taxes on business during his reign in office, approaching 70 % of what it is today, so he just does not throw things out there and moves on. Either one is unable to read adequately or is just purposely ignoring the whole story..and since I don't believe it is the reading comprehension that is the problem, I have to think more the latter.
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 11:55:25 GMT -5
No kidding. Seems to me he's a showboat rather than an actual scholar. Pop economics. He can shove his "Post American World" where the sun don't shine because that appears to be its original home.
I think we should have a law against the concept of post-American world.
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 11:57:28 GMT -5
This is certainly not a dismissal of conservatism, but neither is it a full embrace of conservatism. A friend of conservatism might have more authority to criticize today's movement than someone like Zakaria who keeps a safe distance.
I agree. You are either with us or against us.
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