Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 18, 2011 16:18:46 GMT -5
If the stagger system I outlined works, then we'd each get one "day to ourselves" one week, and have a 3-day weekend the second week which would be ideal for weekend trips.
THAT would be awesome. Currently we never have time off together unless we plan for it way in advance. For example, we are both taking off tomorrow in order to move - a fun date if there ever was one ;D
But he needs about a month's notice to get a weekend day off right now. Double or triple that for *gasp* a full weekend. It really blows. We haven't even been able to go camping together yet.
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on May 18, 2011 16:21:42 GMT -5
...:::"But he needs about a month's notice to get a weekend day off right now. Double or triple that for *gasp* a full weekend. It really blows. We haven't even been able to go camping together yet.":::...
I worked at a place that was open 7 days/week and never wanted to do it again for precisely this reason. I never saw my friends, and it is indeed tough to get a full weekend.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 18, 2011 16:25:44 GMT -5
Most people are posting large salaries that are way over the median household income of 50k. A lot of us live in more expensive areas. The median household income in my city is $67,479 and the average is $79,133. This is in a cheaper area outside the city and a little way from the coast. These are numbers from the 2010 census by the way, so during the recession, not before. The whole greater metro area is not the kind of place you're going to have much luck supporting a family on $35 - 40k.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2011 19:55:27 GMT -5
For the country and the economy, it is a waste if skilled people stay out of the work force. Hiring a dog walker, maid service, lawn service, etc because the spouse enters the workforce means the most efficient person is doing the required task.
For unskilled people, they might as well stay at home with the children and use down time to work on becoming skilled through a home businesses or college classes.
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Post by illinicheme on May 18, 2011 19:58:10 GMT -5
At the risk of being flamed, I have to say that I do not agree with the concept of making plans "in case we get a divorce." If you think you might, then you shouldn't have kids, and perhaps shouldn't have married either. Part of life is about making adjustments based on circumstances. Work the plan based on how you think it will turn out (the 80% likelihood), and adjust on the fly if something changes (the 20%). If you think it will turn out in divorce, then work in a pre-nup or walk away. Easy for the man (i.e. still usually the working outside the home spouse) to say.
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DVM gone riding
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Post by DVM gone riding on May 18, 2011 22:08:33 GMT -5
Well BF and I aren't together now so I don't know if I will ever have to figure out logistics, but I had been thinking WWBG plan was the way to go, or something close to it. I was more thinking weekends off and alternating days off during the week so kids only had to be in daycare three days a week. I am high earning for our area and don't imagine I will find a man to support me "in the style to which I have become accustomed" without me working, plus I think I would be bored. But I would be very very happy with a four day 32+ work week. Otherwise I think at 100k if we were reasonable careful that could support a family of 4 in our area comfortable while still meeting savings/retirement goals, it could be done on less of course but you would have to want to.
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on May 19, 2011 7:39:40 GMT -5
Right now, DF and I usually leave our home at 7:30am and walk back in the door at about 6:20pm. That leaves roughly 3.5 hours to do anything and everything that can't be put off. On gym nights... forget about it! So things get pushed to the weekend, so then its Saturday and I want to relax and there is a large list of things that need to be done.
Sounds like my life with a few evenings per week and maybe a weekend day of doing things for my dad or taking care of my grandson. Doing it when I had 2 kids at home during the week and 4 kids at home on the weekends was torture.
If the stagger system I outlined works, then we'd each get one "day to ourselves" one week, and have a 3-day weekend the second week which would be ideal for weekend trips. Your house may be different, but neither DF nor I currently lack time with one another. A compressed schedule might make that a bit different, but if we each went PT and did 32 hours a week, that would be nice.
Sounds ideal, but where do you get the kind of jobs that will let you work 32 hours/week? I have 2 weeks of the month where I'm really busy at work and 2 weeks where things are slow. I could easily do the job in 16 business days instead of 20, but any time I've tried to go to less than full time I get crap about how if they let me do it then other people would want to also. I did a big cost analysis proposal one year about how they could save 20% in salary costs with a loss of efficiency of less than 5% (occasionally someone might need something on a day I was out of the office), but they wouldn't even consider it. 2 days/week of this job is stimulating, interesting, rewarding, all of the stuff a career is supposed to be. 5 days/week of dragging myself to the office and neglecting the things I want to be doing is depressing.
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on May 19, 2011 7:54:56 GMT -5
That used to be us too. Now I leave at 530 and get back at 430. DH leaves at 8 and gets back at 6-630. My mom watches DS from 8-430. I get home and need to get stuff ready for the next day, do laundry, cook, clean, make lunches etc. Stuff is hectic. Weekends are spent doing errands, groceries and stuff around the house. I don't go to the gym anymore , DH does twice a week after work. This is our new life. The difference is, we were ready for it and went in with our eyes open. Kids are still never the way you pictured it before they arrived though. Some things are worse than you pictured, and some are better. I miss my pre-baby life sometimes but even with how hectic things are now, I wouldn't trade DS for anything.
I don't really see this sustainable for the long haul or with 2 kids which I hope to have eventually. We both have very demanding jobs. Like others have stated, I don't want a career, I just want to do my job well and go home. I'm hoping that if/when we have #2, I can go down to part time (25-32 hours).
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on May 19, 2011 8:35:02 GMT -5
I don't really see this sustainable for the long haul or with 2 kids which I hope to have eventually.
It's hard to live like that for the long term. My memories of when my kids were little are just a sleepless blur except for holidays & vacations. Getting up before 5AM to get them fed & dressed and out the door by 6AM to be settled in daycare and back on the road by 6:30 to be at work by 7:30, then work until 4:30-5 get home around 6, cook, clean, laundry, baths, bed & get up & do it all over again. My first DH was working a $5/hr job (back when minimum wage was $4.25) and after paying for daycare and his gas & lunches at work there was nothing left of his paycheck, so we decided that he should stay home and get a PT job a couple of evenings per week (I was making about $24K/yr). But he was a crappy SAHP and he never did bother to find the PT job. He did entertain the kids during the day and the point of him staying home was to make their lives more pleasant, not mine, but I still had to cook dinner, grocery shop, do the housework, etc. and I really resented getting home and finding him & the kids still in their pajamas watching TV asking what's for dinner. I totally get what WWBG is saying that if there's nothing in it for him, why should he support DF staying home.
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on May 19, 2011 8:46:53 GMT -5
Yes, I get that too. If I was home full time, I think it would make things less stressful as everything would be clean, dinner would be cooked, groceries done, etc. DH would still do some things like mowing the lawn and snow removal but I would take up 90-95% of the household work (with pleasure!). I think we could swing it, but things would be a little tight and I'd actually feel bad leaving all the responsibility of earning the money on him. That is why I think part-time for me is ideal. I'd have more time to do the housework (neatfreak here) and we'd still have a cash cushion.
So to answer the original question, for us it isn't really the $, we'd need a guarantee that DH would have his job forever before I'd make the SAH plunge.
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on May 19, 2011 9:06:58 GMT -5
One more thing ... I think income of the person that wants to SAH can play a big role. DH and I are in the same field and earn the same $. If he was making 100k and I was making 20k, I think he'd probably say, yeah, why don't you just stay home. That is a lot less of a hit than losing 50% of your income. It also means that me working PT still is a large chunk of our income. Of couse PT means being mommy trakced for the years I do it and receiving small raises but hopefully it also allows him to be the opposite at his job. I can take care of all the sick days, appts, etc.. and he can focus more on getting the big raises
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CarolinaKat
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Post by CarolinaKat on May 19, 2011 9:45:56 GMT -5
This thread had me thinking and I was talking to DBF about having a stay at home partner/parent. We both agreed that if someone stayed home, they would be responsible for cooking, cleaning, minor house repairs, dishes, laundry, pet care, grocery/regular household shopping, running errands, basic car maintence and the lion's share of the yardwork. Since we both work, it's split pretty evenly (whoever gets home first responsible for dinner..etc) ETA: I'm not sure that we could manage to swing a SAHP if/when kids enter the picture, I bring home 2.4-ish times his income (before my bonuses and profit sharing and retirement matching), and his profession isn't one you can just leave when a kid is born. Plus I'd be the WORST SAH anything ever, I'm sure. Happy mommys are good for children, so do what's right for your family
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on May 19, 2011 9:54:43 GMT -5
Carolina - It is still good to have that type of discussion before kids though. Kids are exhausting, and when DS was <6 months nearly all of my time was spent attending to him (severe colic). It was nice that my DH really stepped up at that time and was doing nearly all cooking, and some cleaning even during the periods that I was on maternity leave. Now we both work the same hours and I would say we're also about 50/50 with household jobs as well. There is no way DH would tolerate me being a SAH and sitting around all day long, and he shouldn't be expected to either. If he was a SAH, I would expect the same from him
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CarolinaKat
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Post by CarolinaKat on May 19, 2011 10:01:58 GMT -5
There is no way DH would tolerate me being a SAH and sitting around all day long, and he shouldn't be expected to either. If he was a SAH, I would expect the same from him That's kind of how we feel. Currently, our only kids have four paws and purr. It's great that your husband stepped up when you were out on maternity leave. DBF is good about helping more when I'm sick, which makes me hope that if we're ever in your situation with a sick baby, that he would be as helpful as your husband was.
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jeffreymo
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Post by jeffreymo on May 19, 2011 10:06:01 GMT -5
I think it would take $250k for us to pull the trigger. We have been conditioned to be a dual income family, so all future aspirations and desires need to be attainable before we'd want to consider it.
We are fully accustomed to all of the perks as well as the hassles that pertain to having both parents working. There was a point early on where SAHP looked attractive, but now that we've adapted, we wouldn't want to make any financial sacrifices.
We are working towards outsourcing household duties. We have a cleaner, and next season we will probably hire a lawn crew. My wife and I hope to have time/financial flexibility by the time our child/ren are older so that we can participate and be active with their extra-curricular activities.
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gooddecisions
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Post by gooddecisions on May 19, 2011 10:26:51 GMT -5
We have very high incomes and very low expenses, so we could easily make the switch but I don't think it makes much sense to do so. Day care is only $205/week and we would leave a lot of rainy day funds on the table if we made the switch for either of us to quit working. Plus, I know it would create extra pressure on the working parent during times when jobs aren't so secure. I work exclusively from home and he works from home most of the time, so we get to see each other plenty and are able to easily keep up with the chores without farming them out. Earlier on in my career, I was only making 23K a year and might have been convinced, but now I know it takes staying in the field to get the experience, move up and obtain the higher paying jobs.
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on May 19, 2011 10:49:15 GMT -5
I work exclusively from home and he works from home most of the time, so we get to see each other plenty and are able to easily keep up with the chores without farming them out.
That's really the best of both worlds. I love the days I'm able to work at home. Going into the office requires 8+hours at the desk, + 1 hr lunch break + 1/2 hour commute before & after. Working at home gives me an additional 2+ hrs/day free time at home. If you add that to the current 3.5 hours, that's 5.5 hours or a 57% increase in available free time at home.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on May 19, 2011 10:52:26 GMT -5
We are working towards outsourcing household duties. We have a cleaner, and next season we will probably hire a lawn crew. My wife and I hope to have time/financial flexibility by the time our child/ren are older so that we can participate and be active with their extra-curricular activities. See, this is what I wonder about..how families with two career oriented people participate in school/ extra curricular activities.. My day job is not a career job, but I have a ton of flexibility. So, I can volunteer in my kid's school and attend daytime events where parents are expected. Frankly, I look like a SAHP at times, even though I work between 50 and 70 hours a week between several jobs. I also can't tell you the number of times I asked other parents to help, and was told "No, I work outside the home." For us, it works better that I handle all the school volunteering needs, and my husband (the primary care giver) handles all the extra curricular things.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on May 19, 2011 11:20:05 GMT -5
We have very high incomes and very low expenses, so we could easily make the switch but I don't think it makes much sense to do so. Day care is only $205/week and we would leave a lot of rainy day funds on the table if we made the switch for either of us to quit working. Plus, I know it would create extra pressure on the working parent during times when jobs aren't so secure. I work exclusively from home and he works from home most of the time, so we get to see each other plenty and are able to easily keep up with the chores without farming them out. Earlier on in my career, I was only making 23K a year and might have been convinced, but now I know it takes staying in the field to get the experience, move up and obtain the higher paying jobs. With DS I had been planning on working at home while I was transitioning back to full time when he was a newborn. It really was not possible even with my DH at home. DS wasn't a collicky newborn, but he was one that required constant attention and had difficulties sleeping (you could call him high needs by Dr. Sears definition). When there were two of us at home it took both of us not to be overwelmed with just life in general. So, I had to go into the office if I wanted to get any work done. A lot of people told me that working from home after the first couple weeks shouldn't be a problem, it turned out, that it was a problem. As a toddler, he goes to bed early enough that I can get a couple of hours of work done at home during the week, but somehow not on the weekends. My point is don't think that it is an easy transition from workaholic to working parent. It is very difficult. IME
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swasat
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Post by swasat on May 19, 2011 11:21:53 GMT -5
giramomma, it highly depends on the field you are in too. I am into IT software. Think tons of flexibility. I don't HAVE to work the 9-5 hours every single day. Usually I work 8 - 4. But if the school has an activity that requires my presence, I either 1) take the time off work or 2) change my schedule for that day to work around the school program. I can work earlier in the day, later in the day, as I want.
Since I am a part of a team, I am required to be generally available during core office hours. But that doesn't mean that the company won't work with me on some days when I require flexibility. Of course it helps that my employer is a very family friendly company.
I am kinda in the same boat as gooddecisions. With a +200K income we just cannot ignore the financial contribution I make. Even after daycare and taxes are taken out, I still net a lot.
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on May 19, 2011 11:48:28 GMT -5
Nothing to add regarding the topic, just wanted to thank everyone because this thread made me smile.
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gooddecisions
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Post by gooddecisions on May 19, 2011 11:49:03 GMT -5
"With DS I had been planning on working at home while I was transitioning back to full time when he was a newborn."
Did you have him in daycare or were you trying to work from home while attending to him? Mine will be in daycare the hours I'm working, so I'm hoping it won't be too difficult and I have 3 months off before I have to go back to work.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 19, 2011 12:12:26 GMT -5
I can only speak for my family. When the kids were little we tried to go to school activities that were during the day as much as we could. The honest truth is that I don't really care to be in the school during regular school hours. I am not good with mass amounts of kids. Even being in the class with 25 kids just freaks me out. I am no help to the teacher, and it isn't very fun for me. So, I use "work" as an excuse - even if I was a SAHM with a household staff, I would really hate being at school.
But, once the kids got into elementary school, all of their extra-ciricular stuff started at 4:30 or after. We decided to live close to downtown so our commute is short (and believe me - we gave up a lot of house to live down here.) My boss is flexible, so I can work 7 - 4, and still be able to pick up the kids and get them to their activities. Most of them don't start until 5, or even 6. Neither of us work Saturdays or Sundays.
Also, our school is really awesome about working parents. They have a great on-site after school care program, plus they attract activites that will come to the school and parents aren't needed at a specific time. So, for example, once a week there is a spanish class. You sign the kids up, the spanish teacher gathers the kids from the meeting place and gives them the class on-campus, and after the class is over, the spanish teacher drops the kids off at the after-school program. If you are a SAHM, you pick the kids up at the end of Spanish.
I'm also fortunate enough that my husband has some variability in his schedule, so he is able to cover for me if something big is going on at work. If I'm behind at work and he is unable to cover it, I either bring work home and do it after the kids go to bed, or ask friends to carpool, or my Mom will take them over, or my kid misses their extra that day.
It all works out. The biggest reason is the lack of commute. I really don't know how people with long commutes do it.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on May 19, 2011 12:27:08 GMT -5
::I really don't know how people with long commutes do it. ::
I commute about 35-40 minutes each way, so I don't know if that's long or not, but DH, my MIL, and my parents pick up a lot of the slack. My parents take the kids to swim lessons in the summer, DD to nursery school during the school year, and to t-ball when necessary. MIL picks the kids up from school/daycare. I couldn't do it without them.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 19, 2011 12:30:50 GMT -5
I felt a little bad using my Mom to pick up the kids and she gave me two answers - the first was that she loved seeing the kids. The second was that when my sisters were little, they LIVED with her mother and her Mom did all kinds of stuff for them. So, she sees it as a great generational thing that she gets to be so close to her grandkids.
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on May 19, 2011 12:54:27 GMT -5
My mom takes care of my son during the day and I hope that one day I will be able to do the same for my children
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CarolinaKat
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Post by CarolinaKat on May 19, 2011 12:59:27 GMT -5
My grandmother and grandad took care of me as a child. Kept me when Mom and Dad worked, then picked me up from school until I started HS. My Mom likes to joke with me that I should have a kid before she gets 'bored' of retirement so she can play with them. She's retiring this year, so I figure I have plenty of time
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on May 19, 2011 13:26:15 GMT -5
"With DS I had been planning on working at home while I was transitioning back to full time when he was a newborn." Did you have him in daycare or were you trying to work from home while attending to him? Mine will be in daycare the hours I'm working, so I'm hoping it won't be too difficult and I have 3 months off before I have to go back to work. My husband was home with him as he is a SAHD. But no matter the situation, I know many of the woman on here agree with me, it is not an easy transition to a working mom even with the easiest of babies. Even in the ideal situation (for me) with my DH staying home with DS, it still isn't easy.
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Post by soon2bmomof3 on May 19, 2011 14:00:34 GMT -5
Thank goodness for my in-laws! They live about 2 miles from us.
Right now DH and work about 3 miles apart from each other, so we commute to work to take advantage of the HOV lanes to and from home and work. Technically my schedule is supposed to be 7-5 and DH's is 8-5, but my boss is really flexible and understanding and as long as I get my work done, he's cool with it. MIL is retired and FIL works 3-4 days a week from home, so they usually pick the kids up from daycare and MIL makes dinner every night. We usually buy take out once a week to give her a break.
Since DS is only 3 (almost 4), he is only signed up for swim class once a week (on Sat) and spring soccer (just finished the season). His daycare provides 30 min classes once a week for different things and he's signed up for yoga and tumbling. DD is 1 and we haven't signed her up for anything yet.
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wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on May 19, 2011 19:28:58 GMT -5
I'm not WWBG but I'm assuming they would be working 4 10 hour days. Supposedly its a flex option with the federal government. Not in my agency but that's another story and we are getting a new assistant inspector general in my group so a whole lot may get shook up and I may not like it I need to be in car pulling out of apartment complex gate by 7am. On a good night I can be home around 5:30. I do only work 9 out of every 10 weekdays in a two week time frame with every other Friday off.
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