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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 20:43:01 GMT -5
 Jon Huntsman, who’s expected to announce his presidential candidacy before the end of May, apparently failed to receive the memo informing him that he’s disqualified from winning the GOP nomination because of his Mormon faith. In fact, the new contender and his most ardent admirers seem to believe that when it comes to overcoming one of the nation’s most stubborn forms of religious bigotry, two Mormon candidates may be better than one. Mitt Romney, of course, is the first member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints to launch a 2012 drive for the nation’s highest office, reprising his ill-fated race of four years before. During that frustrating campaign, the press focused obsessive attention on the issue of Romney’s faith, forcing the candidate to make a major address on religion and politics at the George H. W. Bush Library at Texas A&M—a well-received speech that only partially defused concerns about the religious commitments of the former Massachusetts governor. According to conventional wisdom, anti-Mormon sentiments (particularly among self-described evangelical Christians) destroyed Romney’s prospects in the Iowa caucuses and the South Carolina primary, thereby crippling his lavishly financed campaign. If hostility to the LDS church helped scuttle the hopes of a polished figure like Mitt Romney, how could the little-known Jon Huntsman ever hope to overcome that prejudice? After all, his Mormon commitment plays an unmistakable role in his biography, with youthful service as a missionary in Taiwan and adult service as a two-term governor of Utah. His mother’s father, David B. Haight, served as a member of the church’s highest leadership body (The Quorum of the Twelve Apostles). The skeptical view of Hunstman’s prospects suggests that anti-Mormon sentiment hasn’t focused on him yet only because most people outside the state of Utah (where he won election to his second term with an astonishing 78 percent of the vote) have never even heard of him. More: www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2011-05-11/jon-huntsman-mitt-romney-2012-presidential-bids-mormon-faith-not-an-issue/?cid=hp:mainpromo2 |
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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 20:43:58 GMT -5
Imagine that I tell you the following story: I was in my room one night. Suddenly, my room became exceedingly bright. Next thing I know there is an angel in my room. He tells me an amazing story. He says that there is a set of ancient golden plates buried in the side of a hill in New York. On them are the books of a lost race of Jewish people who inhabited North America. These plates bear inscriptions in the foreign language of these people. Eventually the angel leads me to the plates and lets me take them home. Even though the plates are in a foreign language, the angel helps me to decipher and translate them. Then the plates are taken up into heaven, never to be seen again. I have the book that I translated from the plates. It tells of amazing things -- an entire civilization of Jewish people living here in the United States 2,000 years ago. And the resurrected Jesus came and visited these people! I also showed the golden plates to a number of real people who are my eye witnesses, and I have their signed attestations that they did, in fact, see and touch the plates before the plates were taken up into heaven. Now, what would you say to me about this story? Even though I do have a book, in English, that tells the story of this lost Jewish civilization, and even though I do have the signed attestations, what do you think? This story sounds nutty, doesn't it? You would ask some obvious questions. For example, at the very simplest level, you might ask, "Where are the ruins and artifacts from this Jewish civilization in America?" The book transcribed from the plates talks about millions of Jewish people doing all kinds of things in America. They have horses and oxen and chariots and armor and large cities. What happened to all of this? I answer simply: it is all out there, but we have not found it yet. "Not one city? Not one chariot wheel? Not one helmet?" you ask. No, we haven't found a single bit of evidence, but it is out there somewhere. You ask me dozens of questions like this, and I have answers for them all. Most people would assume that I am delusional if I told them this story. They would assume that there were no plates and no angel, and that I had written the book myself. Most people would ignore the attestations -- having people attest to it means nothing, really. I could have paid the attesters off, or I could have fabricated them. Most people would reject my story without question. What's interesting is that there are millions of people who actually do believe this story of the angel and the plates and the book and the Jewish people living in North America 2,000 years ago. Those millions of people are members of the Mormon Church, headquartered in Salt Lake City, Utah. The person who told this incredible story was a man named Joseph Smith, and he lived in the United States in the early 1800s. He told his story, and recorded what he "translated from the plates", in the Book of Mormon. If you meet a Mormon and ask them about this story, they can spend hours talking to you about it. They can answer every question you have. Yet the 5.99 billion of us who are not Mormons can see with total clarity that the Mormons are delusional. It is as simple as that. You and I both know with 100% certainty that the Mormon story is no different from the story of Santa. And we are correct in our assessment. The invalidating evidence is voluminous. godisimaginary.com/i7.htmen.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormons |
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 12, 2011 20:57:40 GMT -5
Any particular reason you started the title with the man's religion?
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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 20:59:53 GMT -5
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 12, 2011 21:07:28 GMT -5
My thought is if you want to discuss Huntsman's candidacy, talk about that. If you want to discuss religion, go to a message board that is about religion. |
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cme1201
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Post by cme1201 on May 12, 2011 21:07:57 GMT -5
I had never heard of the man until you posted his name. He was a governor for 4 years quit in 09 to become an ambassador to China.
I would need to know a lot more about him before I made up my mind.
His religion doesn't matter unless your pushing an agenda, which of course you are.
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burnsattornincan
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Post by burnsattornincan on May 12, 2011 21:08:18 GMT -5
Is he for a flat tax like Ron Paul?
Is he for abolishing the FED like Ron Paul?
Is he for expulsion of all illegal immigrants and shutting off immigration from third world countries completely... like Burns?
Sounds like a contender to me.
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Post by pilgrim on May 12, 2011 21:22:05 GMT -5
Many believe Jesus came to America to teach native Americans the gospel... And they passed it along to the Europeans who eventually settled here
The origin of the LDS religion
Trust me
Huntsman would be as good as any
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burnsattornincan
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Post by burnsattornincan on May 12, 2011 21:25:34 GMT -5
I have no doubts. How could you do any worse than the Muslim.
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Post by marshabar1 on May 12, 2011 21:28:33 GMT -5
His first name is Mormon? Odd.
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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 21:29:34 GMT -5
Yes it is, ain't it...
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Post by pilgrim on May 12, 2011 21:31:57 GMT -5
"His first name is Mormon? Odd. "
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His old man had quite a sense of humor
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cme1201
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Post by cme1201 on May 12, 2011 21:35:14 GMT -5
I wonder if it gets tiring bashing religion? how do you pace yourself? start one-handed with the bat slowly drawing back or just dive right in, swing for the fences as they say in baseball?
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Post by pilgrim on May 12, 2011 21:35:49 GMT -5
Surely you don't believe we would elect a Muslim.. Do you?
Did we?
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Post by pilgrim on May 12, 2011 21:36:55 GMT -5
"Swing Away"
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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 21:46:52 GMT -5
I have no doubts. How could you do any worse than the Muslim. It is irrelevant to me whether President Obama is Christian or Muslim or some combination thereof. What is relevant to me is that he is not a religious zealot like Bush was. |
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Mad Dawg Wiccan
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Post by Mad Dawg Wiccan on May 12, 2011 21:49:15 GMT -5
I have no doubts. How could you do any worse than the Muslim. It is irrelevant to me whether President Obama is Christian or Muslim or some combination thereof. What is relevant to me is that he is not a religious zealot like Bush was. But it's OK for you to bash Huntsman in the thread title for being a Mormon? |
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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 21:57:36 GMT -5
I find it interesting that you consider the word Mormon in front of his name as bashing... I must ponder that...
I have yet to "bash" the man, but that may come later...
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burnsattornincan
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Post by burnsattornincan on May 12, 2011 22:08:11 GMT -5
"Swing Away"
That seems to be the main attraction. Do I think he's Muslim? Well he certainly isn't a devout one... drinking and probably doesn't pray for 20 minutes 5 times a day (a real productive practice by the way). But it would be a good bet that he is a rather passive Muslim. Still an incredible notion given the mood just under 10 years ago.
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Mad Dawg Wiccan
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Post by Mad Dawg Wiccan on May 12, 2011 22:14:57 GMT -5
I find it interesting that you consider the word Mormon in front of his name as bashing... I must ponder that... I have yet to "bash" the man, but that may come later... You are the one who posted his religion, not I. Which makes me believe that has impact on you. |
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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 22:35:07 GMT -5
Yes, it does have impact on me for three reasons:
1. It's the same religious obstacle Mitt Romney faces.
2. That what the OP is about.
3. Do you know what Mormonism is based on?
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Post by pilgrim on May 12, 2011 22:49:55 GMT -5
3. Do you know what Mormonism is based on?
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I would like to hear another opinion... What is Mormonism based on?
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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 23:01:39 GMT -5
Please refer to Reply #1 above.
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Post by pilgrim on May 12, 2011 23:08:06 GMT -5
I see nothing stating your opinion as to what Mormonism is based on... So again I ask. What is Mormonism based on?
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Post by lakhota on May 12, 2011 23:23:12 GMT -5
I see nothing stating your opinion as to what Mormonism is based on... So again I ask. What is Mormonism based on? Well, if you've read both links in Reply #1 and still don't get it, I don't know what else to say. Some might say it's based on fiction. Oh, how about this - Glenn Beck is a Mormon! Solomon Spalding (1761 – October 20, 1816) was the author of the Manuscript Story,[1] a work of fiction about the lost civilization of the mound builders of North America. After Spalding's death, a number of individuals suggested that Manuscript Story was identical or similar to portions of the Book of Mormon, a scripture in the Latter Day Saint movement. Spalding was born in Ashford, Connecticut. He was a member of the Continental Army during the American Revolutionary War. In 1782, he entered Dartmouth College in Hanover, New Hampshire, graduating with the class of 1785.[2] In October 1787, he became an ordained Congregationalist preacher in Windham, Connecticut. In 1795, Spalding married Matilda Sabin and opened a store with his brother Josiah in Cherry Valley, New York. In 1799, they moved the store to Richfield, New York. Around this time, Spalding bought a tract of land in and relocated to Conneaut, Ohio. While in Conneaut, Spalding began writing Manuscript Found. In 1812, due to the disruptions of the War of 1812, Spalding moved to Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. In 1814, he moved to Amity, Washington County, Pennsylvania, where he died two years later. In 1832, Latter Day Saint missionaries Samuel H. Smith and Orson Hyde visited Conneaut, Ohio, and preached from the Book of Mormon. Nehemiah King, a resident of Conneaut who knew Spalding when he lived there, felt that the Mormon text resembled the story written by Spalding years before. In 1833, Spalding's brother John and seven other residents of Conneaut signed affidavits stating that Spalding had written a manuscript, portions of which were identical to the Book of Mormon. These statements were published in E. D. Howe's 1834 book Mormonism Unvailed, in which the theory was presented that the Book of Mormon was plagiarized from this manuscript. Several years later, Spalding's widow and daughter, other residents of Conneaut, and residents of Amity, Pennsylvania also signed statements indicating that Spalding had authored a manuscript that was similar to the Book of Mormon. Doctor Philastus Hurlbut obtained a manuscript through Spalding's widow, and showed it in public presentations in Kirtland, Ohio, in December 1833.[citation needed] Hurlbut then became embroiled in a legal dispute with Joseph Smith. Subsequently, Hurlbut delivered the documents he had collected to Howe. Howe was unable to find the alleged similarities with the Book of Mormon that were described in the statements and instead argued in Mormonism Unvailed (1834) that there must exist a second Spalding manuscript which was now lost. Howe concluded that Joseph Smith and Sidney Ridgon used the Spalding manuscript to produce the Book of Mormon for the purpose of making money.[3] The text of "Manuscript Story" was published by the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in 1885, and by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in 1886 and 1910. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solomon_Spalding |
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burnsattornincan
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Post by burnsattornincan on May 12, 2011 23:25:37 GMT -5
He says that there is a set of ancient golden plates buried in the side of a hill in New York.
I had a couple of nice looking younger chaps come around one day and they told me of these stories. They seemed to get a chuckle out of the fact how interested I was in these golden plates and that their supposed location was so close to my location, relatively speaking.
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Post by marshabar1 on May 12, 2011 23:34:06 GMT -5
He says that there is a set of ancient golden plates buried in the side of a hill in New York.I had a couple of nice looking younger chaps come around one day and they told me of these stories. They seemed to get a chuckle out of the fact how interested I was in these golden plates and that their supposed location was so close to my location, relatively speaking. I'd love to have heard that conversation. Hmmm now ![]() blocked due to malware/_Y12b95xTaAw/SMGywCJBQxI/AAAAAAAAAN8/dFeq75oHTW8/s1600/emoticon.png[/img] . . . Golden tablets you say?  Tell me more. . . .  |
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cme1201
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Post by cme1201 on May 13, 2011 5:19:38 GMT -5
Please refer to Reply #1 above. I'm guessing you don't know what you posted Lakhota so I'll help everyone out, the bashing of the mormon religion is in post 2 not 1 |
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Post by Cookies Galore on May 13, 2011 8:09:15 GMT -5
It is irrelevant to me whether President Obama is Christian or Muslim or some combination thereof. What is relevant to me is that he is not a religious zealot like Bush was. But it's OK for you to bash Huntsman in the thread title for being a Mormon? Gotta call you out on your hypocrisy, laks. If Obama's religion is irrelevant then why isn't Huntsman's as well? Now, I am not a religious person at all, so I don't care if my future president is one of those snake handlers or a voodoo priest, all I want is the best leader for my country. Bringing up someone's religious "unelectability" is just dumb. |
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Post by chiver78 on May 13, 2011 8:48:40 GMT -5
Please refer to Reply #1 above. I'm guessing you don't know what you posted Lakhota so I'll help everyone out, the bashing of the mormon religion is in post 2 not 1 semantics, but reply #1 is post #2. I have a question, and I have a feeling I'm just missing the tongue-in-cheek tone from the content. Jon Huntsman, who’s expected to announce his presidential candidacy before the end of May, apparently failed to receive the memo informing him that he’s disqualified from winning the GOP nomination because of his Mormon faith. is that like the supposed black mark of being Catholic, until Kennedy was elected? clearly I need more caffeine.  |
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