billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Feb 22, 2023 15:04:45 GMT -5
I see transitioning and detransitioning as more than just a purely medical decision. I think psychological counseling is a critical and necessary component.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Feb 22, 2023 15:06:47 GMT -5
I see transitioning and detransitioning as more than just a purely medical decision. I think psychological counseling is a critical and necessary component. Which is medical care. The fact that we think about mental health as distinct from medical care is a problem
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Feb 22, 2023 15:22:04 GMT -5
I see transitioning and detransitioning as more than just a purely medical decision. I think psychological counseling is a critical and necessary component. It already is. Your mental health care should be a private matter between you and your shrink. In the case of transitioning you, your shrink and the designated doctor who is handling your care. If the state can't be bothered to intervene when someone is reported to be bat shit crazy and has access to guns no matter how much of a danger he is because they can't be making decisions based on people's mental health then they can butt the F out of transgender care.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Feb 22, 2023 16:06:11 GMT -5
In addition, all programs for people who are considering transitioning require counseling. People who are being considered for organ transplants also undergo counseling. Medical care/procedures that require a significant commitment all have these requirements. The idea that people can transition based on a whim is a right wing fantasy. The whole controversy is ridiculous
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Feb 23, 2023 9:43:14 GMT -5
In addition, all programs for people who are considering transitioning require counseling. People who are being considered for organ transplants also undergo counseling. Medical care/procedures that require a significant commitment all have these requirements. The idea that people can transition based on a whim is a right wing fantasy. The whole controversy is ridiculous Yeah and I’m by no means an expert but if I’m not mistaken, minor children can’t get surgery to transition. The only medical thing allowed for kids under 18 are drugs that delay puberty (if you decide to stop taking the drugs, you go through puberty, so it doesn’t make any permanent changes). There is no one scooping up kids and hauling them to surgical sites to provide free trans operations, despite what some of the dramatic hand wringers are saying. And this is how it should be. When I was a tween I wanted to be a shepherd. Your brain isn’t fully cooked until you’re probably somewhere around 25 - if the kid is really dedicated to transitioning, they can do it then. It it’s a passing fancy, they won’t. No one needs to get distraught about it.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Feb 23, 2023 9:54:27 GMT -5
Just throwing this out there: Why is it OK for kids to take adderall? Is it because it makes them "just like everyone else"? www.cnn.com/2023/02/23/health/adderall-shortage-adhd/index.html And wouldn't the experience of being 'transgendered' and NOT being able to fit in with the "group/gender" you were assigned to be some what like this (not ever fitting in, having to mask, anxiety, depression)? I'm pretty sure someone with ADHD (or any neurodivergent person) can't just decide to "be like everyone else" and fit in. So Clara gets her adderall (and some counseling/therapy ) and looks forward to a happy life. While a transgendered kid gets told to suck it up and act like whatever gender you were assigned at birth. Isn't that something we tell children? To be the best that they can be? What happens to the kids that can't be the best that they can be - because they aren't allowed to do so (but keep getting told that is the goal!")
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Feb 23, 2023 10:11:34 GMT -5
Just throwing this out there: Why is it OK for kids to take adderall? Is it because it makes them "just like everyone else"? www.cnn.com/2023/02/23/health/adderall-shortage-adhd/index.html And wouldn't the experience of being 'transgendered' and NOT being able to fit in with the "group/gender" you were assigned to be some what like this (not ever fitting in, having to mask, anxiety, depression)? I'm pretty sure someone with ADHD (or any neurodivergent person) can't just decide to "be like everyone else" and fit in. So Clara gets her adderall (and some counseling/therapy ) and looks forward to a happy life. While a transgendered kid gets told to suck it up and act like whatever gender you were assigned at birth. Isn't that something we tell children? To be the best that they can be? What happens to the kids that can't be the best that they can be - because they aren't allowed to do so (but keep getting told that is the goal!") Ding ding.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Feb 23, 2023 10:20:12 GMT -5
Just throwing this out there: Why is it OK for kids to take adderall? Is it because it makes them "just like everyone else"? www.cnn.com/2023/02/23/health/adderall-shortage-adhd/index.html And wouldn't the experience of being 'transgendered' and NOT being able to fit in with the "group/gender" you were assigned to be some what like this (not ever fitting in, having to mask, anxiety, depression)? I'm pretty sure someone with ADHD (or any neurodivergent person) can't just decide to "be like everyone else" and fit in. So Clara gets her adderall (and some counseling/therapy ) and looks forward to a happy life. While a transgendered kid gets told to suck it up and act like whatever gender you were assigned at birth. Isn't that something we tell children? To be the best that they can be? What happens to the kids that can't be the best that they can be - because they aren't allowed to do so (but keep getting told that is the goal!") So is the equivalent puberty blockers along with counseling?
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Feb 23, 2023 10:39:29 GMT -5
Puberty blockers aren't permanent. Stop them and the changes that occur with puberty restart.
There is a push to allow older teenagers with cancer to be able to decide if they want to continue with treatment if their cancer progresses and the options are not great. Stopping treatment will end in death. Many parents want to do "everything" for these children, even if the teenager believes that they are suffering unnecessarily and the burden of treatment has become too much given the likely benefit. Should the government force families that accede to their minors desire in these situations, usually with the agreement of the treating physicians, that treatment should be discontinues and palliative/hospice care should be the focus. Death is more permanent than transitioning.
These issues are difficult, and the legal system is not well equipped to deal with them. Government interference usually makes it worse. But we will interfere in the care of transgender individuals, but leave the one I outlines alone. How does that make sense?
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grumpyhermit
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Post by grumpyhermit on Feb 23, 2023 12:20:16 GMT -5
Are there other medications that require, by law, counseling before they will be prescribed? If not, then no.
As I'm not a doctor, and I don't have the training or experience, I don't think it's my place to weigh in on treatment plans. Those types of decisions personal, and are best left between a patient and their doctor.
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ripvanwinkle
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Post by ripvanwinkle on Feb 23, 2023 12:32:05 GMT -5
Florida is a state to avoid at all costs. Ron DeSantis requested the medical records of trans students who sought care at Florida's public universities. Now students are planning a statewide walkout.Students across Florida are planning a statewide walkout after Gov. Ron DeSantis requested all public universities comply in delivering data from student health services on transgender students who sought gender-affirming care at the institutions. DeSantis asked to see the records of any student who has experienced gender dysphoria in the past five years. In addition, he wants their ages and the dates they received gender-affirming care. The deadline to submit those records was February 10. Insider has confirmed that University of Florida, Florida State University, University of Central Florida, Florida A&M University, Florida International University, and the University of North Florida have complied with the request, but has yet to hear back from the rest. Students at these universities are now planning rallies for next week along with the statewide walkout on February 23. Ben Braver, a junior at the University of South Florida and the outreach officer for the school's College Democrats chapter, is leading the initiative, known as the Stand for Freedom Florida Walkout. "Hate is spread when it's innocuous, when it seems silly, and when it seems like taking a stand is an overreaction," Braver told Insider. "We, just like any generation, need to stand for the civil rights that have already been fought for, the ones that have been won, and those which are at stake right now." Andy Pham, a senior and long-standing member of the University of South Florida's Trans+ Student Union, said he sees the state's move as a direct attack on trans rights. "They want to legislate us out of existence," Pham said. "That starts with attacking our healthcare, attacking our right to exist in public spaces, attempting surveillance — all of that." In January, 20 students at the University of South Florida held a rally protesting DeSantis' request. They then started an online petition asking the school's administration not to submit the medical records. The petition received over 2,600 signatures, but officials at the school said they plan to send over the records anyway. Insider hasn't been able to confirm whether the University of South Florida sent over the data. "As a state university, USF has an obligation to be responsive to requests from our elected officials," the university said in a statement, according to WUSF. "However, the university will not provide information that identifies an individual patient or violates patient privacy laws." Among those signing on to support the walkout are the Dream Defenders, Florida College Democrats, state lawmaker Anna Eskamani, and 26-year-old Congressman Maxwell Frost. "The governor's abusing his power," Frost told Insider. "He's targeting folks that disagree with him — people who might not see eye to eye with him, marginalized communities." When Insider asked why the state has requested the health data of transgender college students, the state's deputy press secretary referred to DeSantis' second inaugural address, in which the governor stated: "We are committed to fully understanding the amount of public funding that is going toward such nonacademic pursuits to best assess how to get our colleges and universities refocused on education and truth."The American Civil Liberties Union reports that during this legislative session, Florida lawmakers have introduced 85 bills restricting gender-affirming healthcare, up from 43 bills last year. Eskamani said DeSantis should prepare for student backlash. "When students see the visual representation of their peers around them standing up and walking out, they're going to get plugged in and help us fight back," she said. "That will happen." Ron DeSantis requested the medical records of trans students who sought care at Florida's public universities. Now students are planning a statewide walkout. This doesn't seem a like a unusual request. Seeing just what the states education money is going for and if its being used wisely or wasted. And if they just use the statistics and not the students names whats the harm. Data gathering is done all the time. The state should not be in the business of paying for gender changing. Let that be the cost of the person.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Feb 23, 2023 12:41:57 GMT -5
Florida is a state to avoid at all costs. Ron DeSantis requested the medical records of trans students who sought care at Florida's public universities. Now students are planning a statewide walkout.Students across Florida are planning a statewide walkout after Gov. Ron DeSantis requested all public universities comply in delivering data from student health services on transgender students who sought gender-affirming care at the institutions. DeSantis asked to see the records of any student who has experienced gender dysphoria in the past five years. In addition, he wants their ages and the dates they received gender-affirming care. The deadline to submit those records was February 10. Insider has confirmed that University of Florida, Florida State University, University of Central Florida, Florida A&M University, Florida International University, and the University of North Florida have complied with the request, but has yet to hear back from the rest. Students at these universities are now planning rallies for next week along with the statewide walkout on February 23. Ben Braver, a junior at the University of South Florida and the outreach officer for the school's College Democrats chapter, is leading the initiative, known as the Stand for Freedom Florida Walkout. "Hate is spread when it's innocuous, when it seems silly, and when it seems like taking a stand is an overreaction," Braver told Insider. "We, just like any generation, need to stand for the civil rights that have already been fought for, the ones that have been won, and those which are at stake right now." Andy Pham, a senior and long-standing member of the University of South Florida's Trans+ Student Union, said he sees the state's move as a direct attack on trans rights. "They want to legislate us out of existence," Pham said. "That starts with attacking our healthcare, attacking our right to exist in public spaces, attempting surveillance — all of that." In January, 20 students at the University of South Florida held a rally protesting DeSantis' request. They then started an online petition asking the school's administration not to submit the medical records. The petition received over 2,600 signatures, but officials at the school said they plan to send over the records anyway. Insider hasn't been able to confirm whether the University of South Florida sent over the data. "As a state university, USF has an obligation to be responsive to requests from our elected officials," the university said in a statement, according to WUSF. "However, the university will not provide information that identifies an individual patient or violates patient privacy laws." Among those signing on to support the walkout are the Dream Defenders, Florida College Democrats, state lawmaker Anna Eskamani, and 26-year-old Congressman Maxwell Frost. "The governor's abusing his power," Frost told Insider. "He's targeting folks that disagree with him — people who might not see eye to eye with him, marginalized communities." When Insider asked why the state has requested the health data of transgender college students, the state's deputy press secretary referred to DeSantis' second inaugural address, in which the governor stated: "We are committed to fully understanding the amount of public funding that is going toward such nonacademic pursuits to best assess how to get our colleges and universities refocused on education and truth."The American Civil Liberties Union reports that during this legislative session, Florida lawmakers have introduced 85 bills restricting gender-affirming healthcare, up from 43 bills last year. Eskamani said DeSantis should prepare for student backlash. "When students see the visual representation of their peers around them standing up and walking out, they're going to get plugged in and help us fight back," she said. "That will happen." Ron DeSantis requested the medical records of trans students who sought care at Florida's public universities. Now students are planning a statewide walkout. This doesn't seem a like a unusual request. Seeing just what the states education money is going for and if its being used wisely or wasted. And if they just use the statistics and not the students names whats the harm. Data gathering is done all the time. The state should not be in the business of paying for gender changing. Let that be the cost of the person. You're not very forward thinking when it comes to DeSantis, are you.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Feb 23, 2023 13:16:25 GMT -5
Florida is a state to avoid at all costs. Ron DeSantis requested the medical records of trans students who sought care at Florida's public universities. Now students are planning a statewide walkout.Students across Florida are planning a statewide walkout after Gov. Ron DeSantis requested all public universities comply in delivering data from student health services on transgender students who sought gender-affirming care at the institutions. DeSantis asked to see the records of any student who has experienced gender dysphoria in the past five years. In addition, he wants their ages and the dates they received gender-affirming care. The deadline to submit those records was February 10. Insider has confirmed that University of Florida, Florida State University, University of Central Florida, Florida A&M University, Florida International University, and the University of North Florida have complied with the request, but has yet to hear back from the rest. Students at these universities are now planning rallies for next week along with the statewide walkout on February 23. Ben Braver, a junior at the University of South Florida and the outreach officer for the school's College Democrats chapter, is leading the initiative, known as the Stand for Freedom Florida Walkout. "Hate is spread when it's innocuous, when it seems silly, and when it seems like taking a stand is an overreaction," Braver told Insider. "We, just like any generation, need to stand for the civil rights that have already been fought for, the ones that have been won, and those which are at stake right now." Andy Pham, a senior and long-standing member of the University of South Florida's Trans+ Student Union, said he sees the state's move as a direct attack on trans rights. "They want to legislate us out of existence," Pham said. "That starts with attacking our healthcare, attacking our right to exist in public spaces, attempting surveillance — all of that." In January, 20 students at the University of South Florida held a rally protesting DeSantis' request. They then started an online petition asking the school's administration not to submit the medical records. The petition received over 2,600 signatures, but officials at the school said they plan to send over the records anyway. Insider hasn't been able to confirm whether the University of South Florida sent over the data. "As a state university, USF has an obligation to be responsive to requests from our elected officials," the university said in a statement, according to WUSF. "However, the university will not provide information that identifies an individual patient or violates patient privacy laws." Among those signing on to support the walkout are the Dream Defenders, Florida College Democrats, state lawmaker Anna Eskamani, and 26-year-old Congressman Maxwell Frost. "The governor's abusing his power," Frost told Insider. "He's targeting folks that disagree with him — people who might not see eye to eye with him, marginalized communities." When Insider asked why the state has requested the health data of transgender college students, the state's deputy press secretary referred to DeSantis' second inaugural address, in which the governor stated: "We are committed to fully understanding the amount of public funding that is going toward such nonacademic pursuits to best assess how to get our colleges and universities refocused on education and truth."The American Civil Liberties Union reports that during this legislative session, Florida lawmakers have introduced 85 bills restricting gender-affirming healthcare, up from 43 bills last year. Eskamani said DeSantis should prepare for student backlash. "When students see the visual representation of their peers around them standing up and walking out, they're going to get plugged in and help us fight back," she said. "That will happen." Ron DeSantis requested the medical records of trans students who sought care at Florida's public universities. Now students are planning a statewide walkout. This doesn't seem a like a unusual request. Seeing just what the states education money is going for and if its being used wisely or wasted. And if they just use the statistics and not the students names whats the harm. Data gathering is done all the time. The state should not be in the business of paying for gender changing. Let that be the cost of the person. Answer 1 simple questions. How is DeSantis going to know which students have experienced gender dysphoria? They aren't asking in general. They are asking for specific students records based on what is in bold above. Does he magically just know?
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Feb 23, 2023 14:08:55 GMT -5
Florida is a state to avoid at all costs. Ron DeSantis requested the medical records of trans students who sought care at Florida's public universities. Now students are planning a statewide walkout.Students across Florida are planning a statewide walkout after Gov. Ron DeSantis requested all public universities comply in delivering data from student health services on transgender students who sought gender-affirming care at the institutions. DeSantis asked to see the records of any student who has experienced gender dysphoria in the past five years. In addition, he wants their ages and the dates they received gender-affirming care. The deadline to submit those records was February 10. Insider has confirmed that University of Florida, Florida State University, University of Central Florida, Florida A&M University, Florida International University, and the University of North Florida have complied with the request, but has yet to hear back from the rest. Students at these universities are now planning rallies for next week along with the statewide walkout on February 23. Ben Braver, a junior at the University of South Florida and the outreach officer for the school's College Democrats chapter, is leading the initiative, known as the Stand for Freedom Florida Walkout. "Hate is spread when it's innocuous, when it seems silly, and when it seems like taking a stand is an overreaction," Braver told Insider. "We, just like any generation, need to stand for the civil rights that have already been fought for, the ones that have been won, and those which are at stake right now." Andy Pham, a senior and long-standing member of the University of South Florida's Trans+ Student Union, said he sees the state's move as a direct attack on trans rights. "They want to legislate us out of existence," Pham said. "That starts with attacking our healthcare, attacking our right to exist in public spaces, attempting surveillance — all of that." In January, 20 students at the University of South Florida held a rally protesting DeSantis' request. They then started an online petition asking the school's administration not to submit the medical records. The petition received over 2,600 signatures, but officials at the school said they plan to send over the records anyway. Insider hasn't been able to confirm whether the University of South Florida sent over the data. "As a state university, USF has an obligation to be responsive to requests from our elected officials," the university said in a statement, according to WUSF. "However, the university will not provide information that identifies an individual patient or violates patient privacy laws." Among those signing on to support the walkout are the Dream Defenders, Florida College Democrats, state lawmaker Anna Eskamani, and 26-year-old Congressman Maxwell Frost. "The governor's abusing his power," Frost told Insider. "He's targeting folks that disagree with him — people who might not see eye to eye with him, marginalized communities." When Insider asked why the state has requested the health data of transgender college students, the state's deputy press secretary referred to DeSantis' second inaugural address, in which the governor stated: "We are committed to fully understanding the amount of public funding that is going toward such nonacademic pursuits to best assess how to get our colleges and universities refocused on education and truth."The American Civil Liberties Union reports that during this legislative session, Florida lawmakers have introduced 85 bills restricting gender-affirming healthcare, up from 43 bills last year. Eskamani said DeSantis should prepare for student backlash. "When students see the visual representation of their peers around them standing up and walking out, they're going to get plugged in and help us fight back," she said. "That will happen." Ron DeSantis requested the medical records of trans students who sought care at Florida's public universities. Now students are planning a statewide walkout. This doesn't seem a like an unusual request. Seeing just what the states education money is going for and if it’s being used wisely or wasted. And if they just use the statistics and not the students names whats the harm. Data gathering is done all the time. The state should not be in the business of paying for gender changing. Let that be the cost of the person. How would state money be going towards transgendered students health care? When I was in college, and when my son was in college, you had to be covered by your parent’s insurance, or your own work insurance. I think they offered students the ability to buy an inexpensive insurance through the university, but that was paid by the students. I can’t imagine a state university is footing the very expensive bill for transitioning surgery. Maybe DeSantis is trying to determine how many kids come into the clinic to discuss things like birth control, sexual identity, homosexuality - you know, all the things that send the GOP into a frenzy.
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ripvanwinkle
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Post by ripvanwinkle on Feb 23, 2023 14:16:45 GMT -5
This doesn't seem a like a unusual request. Seeing just what the states education money is going for and if its being used wisely or wasted. And if they just use the statistics and not the students names whats the harm. Data gathering is done all the time. The state should not be in the business of paying for gender changing. Let that be the cost of the person. You're not very forward thinking when it comes to DeSantis, are you. You're right. I don't know a thing about him except he is the Gov of Florida.
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ripvanwinkle
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Post by ripvanwinkle on Feb 23, 2023 14:47:37 GMT -5
This doesn't seem a like a unusual request. Seeing just what the states education money is going for and if its being used wisely or wasted. And if they just use the statistics and not the students names whats the harm. Data gathering is done all the time. The state should not be in the business of paying for gender changing. Let that be the cost of the person. Answer 1 simple questions. How is DeSantis going to know which students have experienced gender dysphoria? They aren't asking in general. They are asking for specific students records based on what is in bold above. Does he magically just know? I dont think he wants to know the names of the students just the number of them. The names I assume would be redacted from the survey.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Feb 23, 2023 14:58:39 GMT -5
Just throwing this out there: Why is it OK for kids to take adderall? Is it because it makes them "just like everyone else"? www.cnn.com/2023/02/23/health/adderall-shortage-adhd/index.html And wouldn't the experience of being 'transgendered' and NOT being able to fit in with the "group/gender" you were assigned to be some what like this (not ever fitting in, having to mask, anxiety, depression)? I'm pretty sure someone with ADHD (or any neurodivergent person) can't just decide to "be like everyone else" and fit in. So Clara gets her adderall (and some counseling/therapy ) and looks forward to a happy life. While a transgendered kid gets told to suck it up and act like whatever gender you were assigned at birth. Isn't that something we tell children? To be the best that they can be? What happens to the kids that can't be the best that they can be - because they aren't allowed to do so (but keep getting told that is the goal!") So is the equivalent puberty blockers along with counseling? Sure. The neurodivergent kids have a path there's counseling/therapy and the possibility of using medication(s). Why shouldn't there be a similar path of transgendered kids? I suspect if it's "just a phase" it won't take years and years for a "run of the mill" kid to figure out it was just a "phase". "run of the mill" kids figure out that lots of things turn out to be nothing more than a "phase" and we happily let them do those "phases". Just to be clear I know this isn't cut and dry, black/white, True or False. I know that people want this to be a one or the other - no variations no nothing kind of thing. (which I find weird because people WANT a seemingly endless number of colors to choose from when painting a room or when decorating - how many shades of white or green or blue do we all really need Maybe we should start limiting the number of colors to JUST the primary colors and white and black.... NO MIXING ALLOWED. And there are other things people seem to want an endless number of choices for - fried chicken, beers, whisky, wine, bedsheets, towels, cars, etc but when it comes to our fellow humans - everyone MUST look, act, talk, think the same or they are "bad".)
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Feb 23, 2023 15:03:57 GMT -5
Answer 1 simple questions. How is DeSantis going to know which students have experienced gender dysphoria? They aren't asking in general. They are asking for specific students records based on what is in bold above. Does he magically just know? I dont think he wants to know the names of the students just the number of them. The names I assume would be redacted from the survey. And how do you find out the number? Do you think they just know? Gender dysphoria is a medical diagnosis. The bolded paragraph asked for information related to specific individuals. If he wants to know globally how much was spent, he can get that information. Given the numbers, it won't be too difficult for someone to figure out who is who. Given his policies, he does not get the benefit of the doubt. He is trying to weaponize this information, like he has with everything surrounding this. You seem to be too gullible in regards to this
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grumpyhermit
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Post by grumpyhermit on Feb 23, 2023 15:10:38 GMT -5
I don't trust any Republican as far as I could throw them with my Gumby arms when it comes to anything related to transgender issues.
They have made their agenda perfectly clear in this regard, and any data request should be viewed with the utmost suspicion. They have earned it.
And again, is Florida some healthcare utopia where the state pays for medical care? How is this not an insurance issue. If the issues is what state subsidized health plans cover, how is it relevant to pull student data?
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Feb 23, 2023 15:15:14 GMT -5
Answer 1 simple questions. How is DeSantis going to know which students have experienced gender dysphoria? They aren't asking in general. They are asking for specific students records based on what is in bold above. Does he magically just know? I dont think he wants to know the names of the students just the number of them. The names I assume would be redacted from the survey. Are you sure? Just for fun - i googled; in 2020 there were 1,662,185 kids between 5 and 11 in Florida in 2020 there were 1,705,940 kids between 12 and 18 in Florida. There going number is that 5% of kids today identify as transgendered OR non-binary. Not all of them will opt to transition. so 3,368,125 kids - 5% is 168,406 POTENTIALLY transgendered or non-binary kids potentially in the State of Florida. That's 5 kids out of every 100 identify as transgendered or non-binary. Seems like a lot of fuss at the political level for something that effects so very few people in the State of Florida. and couldn't DeSantis get the statistics he needs from his OWN government officials? Would they have a compilation of the information he needs?? Not to mention this: rrtampa.com/substance-abuse-statistics-in-florida/He's got a state where 1.5 million Floridians are using illicit drugs at any giving point in time. I guess that's not a big problem I guess it's better to spend time and money on a much smaller issue (it's not even a problem). You can look up Poverty numbers and school rankings in Florida on your own. Why is the transgender thing such a hot topic - when there are far better actual problems that need solutions (or money thrown at them) sitting there in plain view When DeSantis is done with the transgendered - will he be coming after the Aces? (Asexuals) ?
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Feb 23, 2023 15:27:32 GMT -5
I doubt asexuals would be a target. They aren't pretending to be another sex they just don't like sex which is what the Republicans seem to think is normal especially if you are a woman. Cause remember according to Ben Shapiro if you have a WAP during sex that is a serious medical issue that needs addressing.
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busymom
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Post by busymom on Feb 23, 2023 22:10:16 GMT -5
I don't trust any Republican as far as I could throw them with my Gumby arms when it comes to anything related to transgender issues. They have made their agenda perfectly clear in this regard, and any data request should be viewed with the utmost suspicion. They have earned it. And again, is Florida some healthcare utopia where the state pays for medical care? How is this not an insurance issue. If the issues is what state subsidized health plans cover, how is it relevant to pull student data? Healthcare utopia? Hardly. That state doesn't participate in ACA. If you don't have insurance, good luck getting help in that state. When I lived there, I constantly saw people begging online for money for needed surgery that required cash upfront. (Even I, with health insurance, had to give my surgeon some money upfront before having minor surgery, and I waited months to get my overpayment refunded by the surgeon's office.) DH and I had an inside dark joke of moving from the United States to some third world country when we lived there. This is NOT an insurance issue. They want to know your "business", which frankly is none of their business.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Feb 23, 2023 23:25:01 GMT -5
ripvanwinkle -what do you think of this proposed Florida law suggested by Governor Ron DeSantis: Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes
A Florida Republican introduced a bill that would make it easier for religious people to sue those who call them out as homophobic or transphobic, a bill built on a suggestion from Gov. Ron DeSantis (R). State Rep. Alex Andrade (R) filed H.B. 991 on Tuesday. The bill would make it easier to sue journalists, publications, or social media users for defamation if they accuse someone of racism, sexism, homophobia, or transphobia. The bill specifically says that publications can’t use truth as a defense when it comes to reporting on people’s anti-LGBTQ+ sentiments by citing the person’s “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs” or “a plaintiff’s scientific beliefs.” And the bill isn’t limited to professional journalists in scope – it affects anyone in public, including people on social media. Transgender Harvard Law School’s Cyberlaw Clinic instructor Alejandra Caraballo called the bill “absolutely chilling.” “If someone calls you a fa***t or tra**y and you say they discriminated against you, they can now sue you for at least $35k and cite their religious beliefs,” she noted on Twitter. “This would apply to the internet as well. This would empower bigots to target the LGBTQ community with impunity.” “This applies to the internet as well so if the person is in Florida, you could be liable even if you have never stepped foot in Florida.” Others noted that the bill violates federal free speech protections and would be struck down if passed. “If it’s not struck down, my wife and I are moving to Portugal,” First Amendment lawyer Barry Chase told the Tampa Bay Times to illustrate how confident he is that the attack on free speech won’t be upheld in court. The bill makes several changes to how defamation lawsuits work to make it easier for someone to win a lawsuit if they are accused of discriminatory statements or actions. Under current law, someone suing for defamation has to prove that the defamation hurt their reputation, but H.B. 991 would make it so that statements “that the plaintiff has discriminated against another person or group because of their race, sex, sexual orientation, or gender identity constitutes defamation per se.” That is, if someone calls DeSantis transphobic for, say, holding a ceremony at a Christian school on the first day of Pride Month to sign a bill banning transgender girls and women from participating in school sports, he wouldn’t have to show that the accusation hurt his reputation anymore in order to win his suit. Being accused of transphobia would be considered damaging in and of itself. In other words, it’s the legal version of conservatives’ belief that accusing someone of racism is worse than being racist. Moreover, the bill would lower the “actual malice” standard when it comes to reporting about public figures. Currently, public figures suing for defamation can’t just prove that statements made about them are false. They have to prove that a news organization acted with a “reckless disregard” for the truth as well, which is hard to prove. The rule doesn’t apply to private figures who sue for defamation. The bill would limit who counts as a public figure to only applying “when the allegation does not relate to the reason for his or her public status.” H.B. 991 would make it so that the plaintiff in a case automatically wins attorney’s fees if they win their trial, no matter how little money they’re awarded by a jury. This is to encourage more lawsuits to be filed. The bill also says that statements from an anonymous source must be presumed false when it comes to defamation cases, making it harder for media outlets to publish statements from whistleblowers. Last, the bill says that a plaintiff’s religious or “scientific” beliefs can’t be used to prove that they’re anti-LGBTQ+. Normally, the truth is the best defense against defamation; if a journalist can prove that what they wrote is true, then it doesn’t matter how damaging it is to someone’s reputation. The law would change that when it comes to anti-LGBTQ+ statements. If a magazine reports that, for example, Pastor Jonathan Shelley is anti-LGBTQ+ because he said he would be supportive “if someone walks into a homo bar and shoots ’em all, shoots a bunch of homos and kills all of them,” Shelley could sue the magazine. The magazine could be blocked from citing his statements as proof of anti-LGBTQ+ sentiment because they’re a part of his “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs.” “Journalists are seeing this as something that only applies to them, but this applies across the board,” Andrade – the bill’s author – said earlier this week, explaining that it applies to social media users as well. When asked for a comment on the bill, DeSantis’s office pointed to a February 7 roundtable discussion he participated in where defamation lawyers complained about how hard it is to bring defamation lawsuits. “A guy like me who’s an elected official, I have an ability to press my case,” he responded. “Some of these other citizens just simply do not.” DeSantis has long had a combative relationship with the press, with his press secretary even attacking an LGBTQ Nation journalist on Twitter for asking her to explain statements her boss made. Earlier today, his office announced that he will be “boycotting” MSNBC and NBC because Andrea Mitchell commented on DeSantis’s attacks on teaching Black history in schools. Donald Trump is another major Republican who supports making it easier for people to sue if they don’t like what is said about them in the media. When running for president in 2016, he said that he would “open up our libel laws” to make it easier to sue. Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes
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ripvanwinkle
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Post by ripvanwinkle on Feb 24, 2023 2:05:21 GMT -5
ripvanwinkle -what do you think of this proposed Florida law suggested by Governor Ron DeSantis: Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes
A Florida Republican introduced a bill that would make it easier for religious people to sue those who call them out as homophobic or transphobic, a bill built on a suggestion from Gov. Ron DeSantis (R). State Rep. Alex Andrade (R) filed H.B. 991 on Tuesday. The bill would make it easier to sue journalists, publications, or social media users for defamation if they accuse someone of racism, sexism, homophobia, or transphobia. The bill specifically says that publications can’t use truth as a defense when it comes to reporting on people’s anti-LGBTQ+ sentiments by citing the person’s “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs” or “a plaintiff’s scientific beliefs.” And the bill isn’t limited to professional journalists in scope – it affects anyone in public, including people on social media. Transgender Harvard Law School’s Cyberlaw Clinic instructor Alejandra Caraballo called the bill “absolutely chilling.” “If someone calls you a fa***t or tra**y and you say they discriminated against you, they can now sue you for at least $35k and cite their religious beliefs,” she noted on Twitter. “This would apply to the internet as well. This would empower bigots to target the LGBTQ community with impunity.” “This applies to the internet as well so if the person is in Florida, you could be liable even if you have never stepped foot in Florida.” Others noted that the bill violates federal free speech protections and would be struck down if passed. “If it’s not struck down, my wife and I are moving to Portugal,” First Amendment lawyer Barry Chase told the Tampa Bay Times to illustrate how confident he is that the attack on free speech won’t be upheld in court. The bill makes several changes to how defamation lawsuits work to make it easier for someone to win a lawsuit if they are accused of discriminatory statements or actions. Under current law, someone suing for defamation has to prove that the defamation hurt their reputation, but H.B. 991 would make it so that statements “that the plaintiff has discriminated against another person or group because of their race, sex, sexual orientation, or gender identity constitutes defamation per se.” That is, if someone calls DeSantis transphobic for, say, holding a ceremony at a Christian school on the first day of Pride Month to sign a bill banning transgender girls and women from participating in school sports, he wouldn’t have to show that the accusation hurt his reputation anymore in order to win his suit. Being accused of transphobia would be considered damaging in and of itself. In other words, it’s the legal version of conservatives’ belief that accusing someone of racism is worse than being racist. Moreover, the bill would lower the “actual malice” standard when it comes to reporting about public figures. Currently, public figures suing for defamation can’t just prove that statements made about them are false. They have to prove that a news organization acted with a “reckless disregard” for the truth as well, which is hard to prove. The rule doesn’t apply to private figures who sue for defamation. The bill would limit who counts as a public figure to only applying “when the allegation does not relate to the reason for his or her public status.” H.B. 991 would make it so that the plaintiff in a case automatically wins attorney’s fees if they win their trial, no matter how little money they’re awarded by a jury. This is to encourage more lawsuits to be filed. The bill also says that statements from an anonymous source must be presumed false when it comes to defamation cases, making it harder for media outlets to publish statements from whistleblowers. Last, the bill says that a plaintiff’s religious or “scientific” beliefs can’t be used to prove that they’re anti-LGBTQ+. Normally, the truth is the best defense against defamation; if a journalist can prove that what they wrote is true, then it doesn’t matter how damaging it is to someone’s reputation. The law would change that when it comes to anti-LGBTQ+ statements. If a magazine reports that, for example, Pastor Jonathan Shelley is anti-LGBTQ+ because he said he would be supportive “if someone walks into a homo bar and shoots ’em all, shoots a bunch of homos and kills all of them,” Shelley could sue the magazine. The magazine could be blocked from citing his statements as proof of anti-LGBTQ+ sentiment because they’re a part of his “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs.” “Journalists are seeing this as something that only applies to them, but this applies across the board,” Andrade – the bill’s author – said earlier this week, explaining that it applies to social media users as well. When asked for a comment on the bill, DeSantis’s office pointed to a February 7 roundtable discussion he participated in where defamation lawyers complained about how hard it is to bring defamation lawsuits. “A guy like me who’s an elected official, I have an ability to press my case,” he responded. “Some of these other citizens just simply do not.” DeSantis has long had a combative relationship with the press, with his press secretary even attacking an LGBTQ Nation journalist on Twitter for asking her to explain statements her boss made. Earlier today, his office announced that he will be “boycotting” MSNBC and NBC because Andrea Mitchell commented on DeSantis’s attacks on teaching Black history in schools. Donald Trump is another major Republican who supports making it easier for people to sue if they don’t like what is said about them in the media. When running for president in 2016, he said that he would “open up our libel laws” to make it easier to sue. Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes That sounds stupid.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Feb 24, 2023 7:34:19 GMT -5
I dont think he wants to know the names of the students just the number of them. The names I assume would be redacted from the survey. Are you sure? Just for fun - i googled; in 2020 there were 1,662,185 kids between 5 and 11 in Florida in 2020 there were 1,705,940 kids between 12 and 18 in Florida. There going number is that 5% of kids today identify as transgendered OR non-binary. Not all of them will opt to transition. so 3,368,125 kids - 5% is 168,406 POTENTIALLY transgendered or non-binary kids potentially in the State of Florida. That's 5 kids out of every 100 identify as transgendered or non-binary. Seems like a lot of fuss at the political level for something that effects so very few people in the State of Florida. and couldn't DeSantis get the statistics he needs from his OWN government officials? Would they have a compilation of the information he needs?? Not to mention this: rrtampa.com/substance-abuse-statistics-in-florida/He's got a state where 1.5 million Floridians are using illicit drugs at any giving point in time. I guess that's not a big problem I guess it's better to spend time and money on a much smaller issue (it's not even a problem). You can look up Poverty numbers and school rankings in Florida on your own. Why is the transgender thing such a hot topic - when there are far better actual problems that need solutions (or money thrown at them) sitting there in plain view When DeSantis is done with the transgendered - will he be coming after the Aces? (Asexuals) ? He's already targeted minors in his state. He's going after college age students now which should be mostly 17 and older. I think the 5% is high. williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/publications/trans-adults-united-states/In this study, we use data from the 2017 and 2019 YRBS and the 2017- 2020 BRFSS to find that: Over 1.6 million adults (ages 18 and older) and youth (ages 13 to 17) identify as transgender in the United States, or 0.6% of those ages 13 and older. Among U.S. adults, 0.5% (about 1.3 million adults) identify as transgender. Among youth ages 13 to 17 in the U.S., 1.4% (about 300,000 youth) identify as transgender. Of the 1.3 million adults who identify as transgender, 38.5% (515,200) are transgender women, 35.9% (480,000) are transgender men, and 25.6% (341,800) reported they are gender nonconforming. Americans' estimate of the proportion of gay people in the U.S. is more than five times Gallup's more encompassing 2017 estimate that 4.5% of Americans are LGBT, based on respondents' self-identification as being lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender. news.gallup.com/poll/259571/americans-greatly-overestimate-gay-population.aspx
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grumpyhermit
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Post by grumpyhermit on Feb 24, 2023 10:25:31 GMT -5
I don't trust any Republican as far as I could throw them with my Gumby arms when it comes to anything related to transgender issues. They have made their agenda perfectly clear in this regard, and any data request should be viewed with the utmost suspicion. They have earned it. And again, is Florida some healthcare utopia where the state pays for medical care? How is this not an insurance issue. If the issues is what state subsidized health plans cover, how is it relevant to pull student data? Healthcare utopia? Hardly. That state doesn't participate in ACA. If you don't have insurance, good luck getting help in that state. When I lived there, I constantly saw people begging online for money for needed surgery that required cash upfront. (Even I, with health insurance, had to give my surgeon some money upfront before having minor surgery, and I waited months to get my overpayment refunded by the surgeon's office.) DH and I had an inside dark joke of moving from the United States to some third world country when we lived there. This is NOT an insurance issue. They want to know your "business", which frankly is none of their business. Which is why any defense of "oh he's just worried about the budget" is ridiculous on the face. Like...the state isn't paying for this in the first place! He's targeting trans people, it's disgusting, and he isn't really trying to hide it.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Feb 24, 2023 11:15:24 GMT -5
ripvanwinkle -what do you think of this proposed Florida law suggested by Governor Ron DeSantis: Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes
A Florida Republican introduced a bill that would make it easier for religious people to sue those who call them out as homophobic or transphobic, a bill built on a suggestion from Gov. Ron DeSantis (R). State Rep. Alex Andrade (R) filed H.B. 991 on Tuesday. The bill would make it easier to sue journalists, publications, or social media users for defamation if they accuse someone of racism, sexism, homophobia, or transphobia. The bill specifically says that publications can’t use truth as a defense when it comes to reporting on people’s anti-LGBTQ+ sentiments by citing the person’s “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs” or “a plaintiff’s scientific beliefs.” And the bill isn’t limited to professional journalists in scope – it affects anyone in public, including people on social media. Transgender Harvard Law School’s Cyberlaw Clinic instructor Alejandra Caraballo called the bill “absolutely chilling.” “If someone calls you a fa***t or tra**y and you say they discriminated against you, they can now sue you for at least $35k and cite their religious beliefs,” she noted on Twitter. “This would apply to the internet as well. This would empower bigots to target the LGBTQ community with impunity.” “This applies to the internet as well so if the person is in Florida, you could be liable even if you have never stepped foot in Florida.” Others noted that the bill violates federal free speech protections and would be struck down if passed. “If it’s not struck down, my wife and I are moving to Portugal,” First Amendment lawyer Barry Chase told the Tampa Bay Times to illustrate how confident he is that the attack on free speech won’t be upheld in court. The bill makes several changes to how defamation lawsuits work to make it easier for someone to win a lawsuit if they are accused of discriminatory statements or actions. Under current law, someone suing for defamation has to prove that the defamation hurt their reputation, but H.B. 991 would make it so that statements “that the plaintiff has discriminated against another person or group because of their race, sex, sexual orientation, or gender identity constitutes defamation per se.” That is, if someone calls DeSantis transphobic for, say, holding a ceremony at a Christian school on the first day of Pride Month to sign a bill banning transgender girls and women from participating in school sports, he wouldn’t have to show that the accusation hurt his reputation anymore in order to win his suit. Being accused of transphobia would be considered damaging in and of itself. In other words, it’s the legal version of conservatives’ belief that accusing someone of racism is worse than being racist. Moreover, the bill would lower the “actual malice” standard when it comes to reporting about public figures. Currently, public figures suing for defamation can’t just prove that statements made about them are false. They have to prove that a news organization acted with a “reckless disregard” for the truth as well, which is hard to prove. The rule doesn’t apply to private figures who sue for defamation. The bill would limit who counts as a public figure to only applying “when the allegation does not relate to the reason for his or her public status.” H.B. 991 would make it so that the plaintiff in a case automatically wins attorney’s fees if they win their trial, no matter how little money they’re awarded by a jury. This is to encourage more lawsuits to be filed. The bill also says that statements from an anonymous source must be presumed false when it comes to defamation cases, making it harder for media outlets to publish statements from whistleblowers. Last, the bill says that a plaintiff’s religious or “scientific” beliefs can’t be used to prove that they’re anti-LGBTQ+. Normally, the truth is the best defense against defamation; if a journalist can prove that what they wrote is true, then it doesn’t matter how damaging it is to someone’s reputation. The law would change that when it comes to anti-LGBTQ+ statements. If a magazine reports that, for example, Pastor Jonathan Shelley is anti-LGBTQ+ because he said he would be supportive “if someone walks into a homo bar and shoots ’em all, shoots a bunch of homos and kills all of them,” Shelley could sue the magazine. The magazine could be blocked from citing his statements as proof of anti-LGBTQ+ sentiment because they’re a part of his “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs.” “Journalists are seeing this as something that only applies to them, but this applies across the board,” Andrade – the bill’s author – said earlier this week, explaining that it applies to social media users as well. When asked for a comment on the bill, DeSantis’s office pointed to a February 7 roundtable discussion he participated in where defamation lawyers complained about how hard it is to bring defamation lawsuits. “A guy like me who’s an elected official, I have an ability to press my case,” he responded. “Some of these other citizens just simply do not.” DeSantis has long had a combative relationship with the press, with his press secretary even attacking an LGBTQ Nation journalist on Twitter for asking her to explain statements her boss made. Earlier today, his office announced that he will be “boycotting” MSNBC and NBC because Andrea Mitchell commented on DeSantis’s attacks on teaching Black history in schools. Donald Trump is another major Republican who supports making it easier for people to sue if they don’t like what is said about them in the media. When running for president in 2016, he said that he would “open up our libel laws” to make it easier to sue. Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes That sounds stupid. Well this is the direction DeSantis' run for president, Florida and other conservative states are heading. It's time for you to live up to your Proboard's profile quote: "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Will you do something?
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Feb 24, 2023 11:57:34 GMT -5
ripvanwinkle -what do you think of this proposed Florida law suggested by Governor Ron DeSantis: Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes
A Florida Republican introduced a bill that would make it easier for religious people to sue those who call them out as homophobic or transphobic, a bill built on a suggestion from Gov. Ron DeSantis (R). State Rep. Alex Andrade (R) filed H.B. 991 on Tuesday. The bill would make it easier to sue journalists, publications, or social media users for defamation if they accuse someone of racism, sexism, homophobia, or transphobia. The bill specifically says that publications can’t use truth as a defense when it comes to reporting on people’s anti-LGBTQ+ sentiments by citing the person’s “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs” or “a plaintiff’s scientific beliefs.” And the bill isn’t limited to professional journalists in scope – it affects anyone in public, including people on social media. Transgender Harvard Law School’s Cyberlaw Clinic instructor Alejandra Caraballo called the bill “absolutely chilling.” “If someone calls you a fa***t or tra**y and you say they discriminated against you, they can now sue you for at least $35k and cite their religious beliefs,” she noted on Twitter. “This would apply to the internet as well. This would empower bigots to target the LGBTQ community with impunity.” “This applies to the internet as well so if the person is in Florida, you could be liable even if you have never stepped foot in Florida.” Others noted that the bill violates federal free speech protections and would be struck down if passed. “If it’s not struck down, my wife and I are moving to Portugal,” First Amendment lawyer Barry Chase told the Tampa Bay Times to illustrate how confident he is that the attack on free speech won’t be upheld in court. The bill makes several changes to how defamation lawsuits work to make it easier for someone to win a lawsuit if they are accused of discriminatory statements or actions. Under current law, someone suing for defamation has to prove that the defamation hurt their reputation, but H.B. 991 would make it so that statements “that the plaintiff has discriminated against another person or group because of their race, sex, sexual orientation, or gender identity constitutes defamation per se.” That is, if someone calls DeSantis transphobic for, say, holding a ceremony at a Christian school on the first day of Pride Month to sign a bill banning transgender girls and women from participating in school sports, he wouldn’t have to show that the accusation hurt his reputation anymore in order to win his suit. Being accused of transphobia would be considered damaging in and of itself. In other words, it’s the legal version of conservatives’ belief that accusing someone of racism is worse than being racist. Moreover, the bill would lower the “actual malice” standard when it comes to reporting about public figures. Currently, public figures suing for defamation can’t just prove that statements made about them are false. They have to prove that a news organization acted with a “reckless disregard” for the truth as well, which is hard to prove. The rule doesn’t apply to private figures who sue for defamation. The bill would limit who counts as a public figure to only applying “when the allegation does not relate to the reason for his or her public status.” H.B. 991 would make it so that the plaintiff in a case automatically wins attorney’s fees if they win their trial, no matter how little money they’re awarded by a jury. This is to encourage more lawsuits to be filed. The bill also says that statements from an anonymous source must be presumed false when it comes to defamation cases, making it harder for media outlets to publish statements from whistleblowers. Last, the bill says that a plaintiff’s religious or “scientific” beliefs can’t be used to prove that they’re anti-LGBTQ+. Normally, the truth is the best defense against defamation; if a journalist can prove that what they wrote is true, then it doesn’t matter how damaging it is to someone’s reputation. The law would change that when it comes to anti-LGBTQ+ statements. If a magazine reports that, for example, Pastor Jonathan Shelley is anti-LGBTQ+ because he said he would be supportive “if someone walks into a homo bar and shoots ’em all, shoots a bunch of homos and kills all of them,” Shelley could sue the magazine. The magazine could be blocked from citing his statements as proof of anti-LGBTQ+ sentiment because they’re a part of his “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs.” “Journalists are seeing this as something that only applies to them, but this applies across the board,” Andrade – the bill’s author – said earlier this week, explaining that it applies to social media users as well. When asked for a comment on the bill, DeSantis’s office pointed to a February 7 roundtable discussion he participated in where defamation lawyers complained about how hard it is to bring defamation lawsuits. “A guy like me who’s an elected official, I have an ability to press my case,” he responded. “Some of these other citizens just simply do not.” DeSantis has long had a combative relationship with the press, with his press secretary even attacking an LGBTQ Nation journalist on Twitter for asking her to explain statements her boss made. Earlier today, his office announced that he will be “boycotting” MSNBC and NBC because Andrea Mitchell commented on DeSantis’s attacks on teaching Black history in schools. Donald Trump is another major Republican who supports making it easier for people to sue if they don’t like what is said about them in the media. When running for president in 2016, he said that he would “open up our libel laws” to make it easier to sue. Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes I'm having trouble with the rationale. They are trying to threaten opponents into silence (with uneven lawsuit rules) by essentially admitting that they are worthy of defamation by their own views/words - but because those views/words are part of their "religious" beliefs they shouldn't be held up to public scrutiny? And should instead get to take their revenge on others who don't share their views or "religious" beliefs? How broad/narrow is this proposed law? Because I can think of lots of ways this could backfire on them if it is equally applicable to people of other beliefs. Big can of worms they want to open, here. This tactic of opening lawsuits up to everyone (similar to the abortion reporting ones in some states) feels like they are setting up and encouraging a DDOS type of attack, via endless lawsuits by groups of followers, for perceived enemies.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Feb 24, 2023 13:27:40 GMT -5
Rip is somewhat correct that DeSantis did not ask for names or actual medical records. However, one of the universities (maybe USF) has declined to provide information because the request broke down the information into so much detail, including dates, ages, doctors, therapists, insurance providers, diagnosis and treatment, that they felt identifying the person would not be a hard task. If they limit it to patients that have Medicaid, it would be extremely easy.
I don’t know about Florida, but the University hospital at my school is not funded by state dollars in any way other than Medicare or Medicaid. This state doesn’t even fund education at the public universities. They are barely public universities at all. The hospitals are owned by large healthcare providers.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 24, 2023 17:30:22 GMT -5
ripvanwinkle -what do you think of this proposed Florida law suggested by Governor Ron DeSantis: Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes
A Florida Republican introduced a bill that would make it easier for religious people to sue those who call them out as homophobic or transphobic, a bill built on a suggestion from Gov. Ron DeSantis (R). State Rep. Alex Andrade (R) filed H.B. 991 on Tuesday. The bill would make it easier to sue journalists, publications, or social media users for defamation if they accuse someone of racism, sexism, homophobia, or transphobia. The bill specifically says that publications can’t use truth as a defense when it comes to reporting on people’s anti-LGBTQ+ sentiments by citing the person’s “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs” or “a plaintiff’s scientific beliefs.” And the bill isn’t limited to professional journalists in scope – it affects anyone in public, including people on social media. Transgender Harvard Law School’s Cyberlaw Clinic instructor Alejandra Caraballo called the bill “absolutely chilling.” “If someone calls you a fa***t or tra**y and you say they discriminated against you, they can now sue you for at least $35k and cite their religious beliefs,” she noted on Twitter. “This would apply to the internet as well. This would empower bigots to target the LGBTQ community with impunity.” “This applies to the internet as well so if the person is in Florida, you could be liable even if you have never stepped foot in Florida.” Others noted that the bill violates federal free speech protections and would be struck down if passed. “If it’s not struck down, my wife and I are moving to Portugal,” First Amendment lawyer Barry Chase told the Tampa Bay Times to illustrate how confident he is that the attack on free speech won’t be upheld in court. The bill makes several changes to how defamation lawsuits work to make it easier for someone to win a lawsuit if they are accused of discriminatory statements or actions. Under current law, someone suing for defamation has to prove that the defamation hurt their reputation, but H.B. 991 would make it so that statements “that the plaintiff has discriminated against another person or group because of their race, sex, sexual orientation, or gender identity constitutes defamation per se.” That is, if someone calls DeSantis transphobic for, say, holding a ceremony at a Christian school on the first day of Pride Month to sign a bill banning transgender girls and women from participating in school sports, he wouldn’t have to show that the accusation hurt his reputation anymore in order to win his suit. Being accused of transphobia would be considered damaging in and of itself. In other words, it’s the legal version of conservatives’ belief that accusing someone of racism is worse than being racist. Moreover, the bill would lower the “actual malice” standard when it comes to reporting about public figures. Currently, public figures suing for defamation can’t just prove that statements made about them are false. They have to prove that a news organization acted with a “reckless disregard” for the truth as well, which is hard to prove. The rule doesn’t apply to private figures who sue for defamation. The bill would limit who counts as a public figure to only applying “when the allegation does not relate to the reason for his or her public status.” H.B. 991 would make it so that the plaintiff in a case automatically wins attorney’s fees if they win their trial, no matter how little money they’re awarded by a jury. This is to encourage more lawsuits to be filed. The bill also says that statements from an anonymous source must be presumed false when it comes to defamation cases, making it harder for media outlets to publish statements from whistleblowers. Last, the bill says that a plaintiff’s religious or “scientific” beliefs can’t be used to prove that they’re anti-LGBTQ+. Normally, the truth is the best defense against defamation; if a journalist can prove that what they wrote is true, then it doesn’t matter how damaging it is to someone’s reputation. The law would change that when it comes to anti-LGBTQ+ statements. If a magazine reports that, for example, Pastor Jonathan Shelley is anti-LGBTQ+ because he said he would be supportive “if someone walks into a homo bar and shoots ’em all, shoots a bunch of homos and kills all of them,” Shelley could sue the magazine. The magazine could be blocked from citing his statements as proof of anti-LGBTQ+ sentiment because they’re a part of his “constitutionally protected religious expression or beliefs.” “Journalists are seeing this as something that only applies to them, but this applies across the board,” Andrade – the bill’s author – said earlier this week, explaining that it applies to social media users as well. When asked for a comment on the bill, DeSantis’s office pointed to a February 7 roundtable discussion he participated in where defamation lawyers complained about how hard it is to bring defamation lawsuits. “A guy like me who’s an elected official, I have an ability to press my case,” he responded. “Some of these other citizens just simply do not.” DeSantis has long had a combative relationship with the press, with his press secretary even attacking an LGBTQ Nation journalist on Twitter for asking her to explain statements her boss made. Earlier today, his office announced that he will be “boycotting” MSNBC and NBC because Andrea Mitchell commented on DeSantis’s attacks on teaching Black history in schools. Donald Trump is another major Republican who supports making it easier for people to sue if they don’t like what is said about them in the media. When running for president in 2016, he said that he would “open up our libel laws” to make it easier to sue. Christians could sue people who call them homophobic if this GOP bill passes I'm having trouble with the rationale. They are trying to threaten opponents into silence (with uneven lawsuit rules) by essentially admitting that they are worthy of defamation by their own views/words - but because those views/words are part of their "religious" beliefs they shouldn't be held up to public scrutiny? And should instead get to take their revenge on others who don't share their views or "religious" beliefs? How broad/narrow is this proposed law? Because I can think of lots of ways this could backfire on them if it is equally applicable to people of other beliefs. Big can of worms they want to open, here. This tactic of opening lawsuits up to everyone (similar to the abortion reporting ones in some states) feels like they are setting up and encouraging a DDOS type of attack, via endless lawsuits by groups of followers, for perceived enemies. they are trying to legally restore white male privilege. this is a trial balloon.
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