hurley1980
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Post by hurley1980 on Jul 22, 2022 16:23:42 GMT -5
I don't knock asylum seekers. I understand what they are doing. If America continues its fall from grace, many of us Americans may be seeking asylum for ourselves in the future (please let me in Canada)!
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jul 22, 2022 17:07:46 GMT -5
I want to extend a sincere thank you to rip van winkle for continuing to bring up these mythical Repo-con ‘concerns’ ( if that word isn’t too strong for the reality). I enjoy knowing there is so much bed wetting on the right, and many on the left that can debunk all the crapola that comes spewing forth. Thanks rip!
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Post by tallguy on Jul 22, 2022 17:14:50 GMT -5
I want to extend a sincere thank you to rip van winkle for continuing to bring up these mythical Repo-con ‘concerns’ ( if that word isn’t too strong for the reality). I enjoy knowing there is so much bed wetting on the right, and many on the left that can debunk all the crapola that comes spewing forth. Thanks rip! To be fair, it does not require all that much to debunk pretty much any right-wing talking point. If these people were smart enough to come up with good talking points, they would be centrists instead.
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tbop77
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Post by tbop77 on Jul 23, 2022 6:29:35 GMT -5
I'm waiting for Trump to come down that elevator and make his signature campaign promise that he is going to build a wall and Mexico is going to pay for it when he announces he is going to run in 2024. They ate that crap up last time! Oh, that would probably happen after he locked Hillary up! LOL Or revealed his health care plan Or tax cuts for the middle class OMG, I can't stop!!!
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 23, 2022 13:53:02 GMT -5
...escalator....
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jul 23, 2022 14:51:47 GMT -5
Heaven forbid he have to manage his way down stairs. Or a ramp!
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 23, 2022 15:01:16 GMT -5
Heaven forbid he have to manage his way down stairs. Or a ramp! i like the fact that most of those supporters that day were phony. you start out with the IMAGE of success, and people start to believe it. now he has tens of millions of useful idiots following him around like he is Supply Side Jesus.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jul 23, 2022 17:32:00 GMT -5
Heaven forbid he have to manage his way down stairs. Or a ramp! i like the fact that most of those supporters that day were phony. you start out with the IMAGE of success, and people start to believe it. now he has tens of millions of useful idiots following him around like he is Supply Side Jesus. Paid no less to be there.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 23, 2022 18:18:08 GMT -5
i like the fact that most of those supporters that day were phony. you start out with the IMAGE of success, and people start to believe it. now he has tens of millions of useful idiots following him around like he is Supply Side Jesus. Paid no less to be there. from nothing comes nothing. nothing good, anyway. at best, this episode of sleeping with the Devil makes us more unsure, more insecure, and more defensive. at worst.....we become the monster.
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ripvanwinkle
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Post by ripvanwinkle on Jul 23, 2022 22:14:18 GMT -5
The link and graphs are interesting. Probably add 30% for current year figures. This kind of proves my point on why these mayors are crying about their overburdened social services and wanting more money from the Feds. And its growing. Since I'm not a statistical analyst this goes over my head but the graphs are revealing.
Maybe these mayors should press harder on their respective congress people to do more to stop the influx?
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Post by Opti on Jul 23, 2022 23:09:49 GMT -5
The link and graphs are interesting. Probably add 30% for current year figures. This kind of proves my point on why these mayors are crying about their overburdened social services and wanting more money from the Feds. And its growing. Since I'm not a statistical analyst this goes over my head but the graphs are revealing.
Maybe these mayors should press harder on their respective congress people to do more to stop the influx? Actually, both Table 3 and Table 4 show the total is less in 2018 than what it was in 2015. California had a major decrease compared to some increases in Florida, Texas and elsewhere. Figure 4 shows how illegal immigration has been dropping year over year from Mexico. Figure 5 shows an increase from all other countries that are not Mexico.
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ripvanwinkle
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Post by ripvanwinkle on Jul 24, 2022 0:21:47 GMT -5
The link and graphs are interesting. Probably add 30% for current year figures. This kind of proves my point on why these mayors are crying about their overburdened social services and wanting more money from the Feds. And its growing. Since I'm not a statistical analyst this goes over my head but the graphs are revealing.
Maybe these mayors should press harder on their respective congress people to do more to stop the influx? Actually, both Table 3 and Table 4 show the total is less in 2018 than what it was in 2015. California had a major decrease compared to some increases in Florida, Texas and elsewhere. Figure 4 shows how illegal immigration has been dropping year over year from Mexico. Figure 5 shows an increase from all other countries that are not Mexico. "The head of the US Border Patrol says he's getting ready for as many as 8,000 people to be apprehended daily, more than double the daily number of the 2019 surge under the Trump administration. That staggering number "will probably become the norm over the next 30 to 45 days," Border Patrol Chief Raul Ortiz told CNN in an exclusive interview. There have already been 940,000 arrests this fiscal year, which started in October".
These captured and released into the country are whats causing the mayors to squeal like a pig caught under the fence.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 24, 2022 1:09:49 GMT -5
The link and graphs are interesting. Probably add 30% for current year figures. This kind of proves my point on why these mayors are crying about their overburdened social services and wanting more money from the Feds. And its growing. Since I'm not a statistical analyst this goes over my head but the graphs are revealing. 1) why should we add 30%? total immigration has been declining since 2007, according to that report. what would make it grow by 30%? 2) no, it does not prove your point in any way. the total number of "illegals" is 3% of the population, and they burden social services less than poor whites, because there are many times more poor whites than poor browns. 3) i agree. you are not a statistician. you really suck at it, actually. but i am still interested in hearing your reasoning about why the stats are 30% HIGHER now.
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tbop77
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Post by tbop77 on Jul 24, 2022 7:01:32 GMT -5
The link and graphs are interesting. Probably add 30% for current year figures. This kind of proves my point on why these mayors are crying about their overburdened social services and wanting more money from the Feds. And its growing. Since I'm not a statistical analyst this goes over my head but the graphs are revealing. 1) why should we add 30%? total immigration has been declining since 2007, according to that report. what would make it grow by 30%? 2) no, it does not prove your point in any way. the total number of "illegals" is 3% of the population, and they burden social services less than poor whites, because there are many times more poor whites than poor browns. 3) i agree. you are not a statistician. you really suck at it, actually. but i am still interested in hearing your reasoning about why the stats are 30% HIGHER now.But, but, but....that what Fox News reports~~~
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 24, 2022 7:22:08 GMT -5
The link and graphs are interesting. Probably add 30% for current year figures. This kind of proves my point on why these mayors are crying about their overburdened social services and wanting more money from the Feds. And its growing. Since I'm not a statistical analyst this goes over my head but the graphs are revealing. 1) why should we add 30%? total immigration has been declining since 2007, according to that report. what would make it grow by 30%? 2) no, it does not prove your point in any way. the total number of "illegals" is 3% of the population, and they burden social services less than poor whites, because there are many times more poor whites than poor browns. 3) i agree. you are not a statistician. you really suck at it, actually. but i am still interested in hearing your reasoning about why the stats are 30% HIGHER now. Because that’s what he believes. Facts no longer matter to conservatives. It’s all about feelings and owning the liberal
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2022 7:44:10 GMT -5
Actually, both Table 3 and Table 4 show the total is less in 2018 than what it was in 2015. California had a major decrease compared to some increases in Florida, Texas and elsewhere. Figure 4 shows how illegal immigration has been dropping year over year from Mexico. Figure 5 shows an increase from all other countries that are not Mexico. "The head of the US Border Patrol says he's getting ready for as many as 8,000 people to be apprehended daily, more than double the daily number of the 2019 surge under the Trump administration. That staggering number "will probably become the norm over the next 30 to 45 days," Border Patrol Chief Raul Ortiz told CNN in an exclusive interview. There have already been 940,000 arrests this fiscal year, which started in October".
These captured and released into the country are whats causing the mayors to squeal like a pig caught under the fence.
From that article- That staggering number "will probably become the norm over the next 30 to 45 days," Border Patrol Chief Raul Ortiz told CNN in an exclusive interview.
It was a surge. They happen. It's like looking at record breaking weather and concluding it's the norm. It's not.
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2022 7:46:58 GMT -5
Here's another good graph to look at - www.cato.org/blog/border-patrol-criminal-arrest-statistics-historical-perspectiveFar from living during a period of high criminal apprehensions along the border, we are likely living during a period of relatively low border criminality.
Notice how different things are now compared to the large spikes in the 1940s and the biggest one from 1955 ending around the late 1960s.
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2022 7:57:04 GMT -5
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2022 8:10:42 GMT -5
The horrible thing about RW sources that like engaging their listeners by making them mad, is they intentionally choose not to put things in context. RW viewers want more enforcement at the border, but even when they get it, they aren't happy. Probably because they do not find out that the number of unlawful entries has dropped. abcnews.go.com/US/annual-border-arrests-hit-record-high-trending-recent/story?id=80736222The U.S. Border Patrol arrested migrants more times in the past year than in any other fiscal year in recorded history, according to Customs and Border Protection data released Friday.
Authorities encountered unauthorized migrants along the southwest border more than 1.73 million times in budget year 2021, according to the data. Of those, about 1.66 million arrests were made by Border Patrol.
The prior record was set in 2000 at about 1.64 million, according to Border Patrol data.
The estimated number of migrants who evaded Border Patrol custody in 2000 was pegged at more than 2.1 million by the Department of Homeland Security. That number declined by about 92% between 2000 and 2018 as Border Patrol funding increased. For 2021, reports analyzed by the Migration Policy Institute estimate the number of successful unlawful entries to be about 540,000.
Despite the surge of Haitian migrants seen in Del Rio, Texas, last month, overall enforcement actions declined for the second month in a row from 209,840 in August to about 192,000 in September. Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas has pointed to the declining numbers as evidence the administration's migration strategy is working.
"Tragically, former President Trump slashed our international assistance to Guatemala, El Salvador and Honduras, slashed the resources that we were contributing to address the root causes of irregular migration," Mayorkas said in August as anticipated seasonal migration declines failed to bear out over summer.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 24, 2022 13:35:45 GMT -5
1) why should we add 30%? total immigration has been declining since 2007, according to that report. what would make it grow by 30%? 2) no, it does not prove your point in any way. the total number of "illegals" is 3% of the population, and they burden social services less than poor whites, because there are many times more poor whites than poor browns. 3) i agree. you are not a statistician. you really suck at it, actually. but i am still interested in hearing your reasoning about why the stats are 30% HIGHER now. Because that’s what he believes. Facts no longer matter to conservatives. It’s all about feelings and owning the liberal Gingrich predicted it when he said "feelings are the new facts". prescient.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 24, 2022 13:38:43 GMT -5
Actually, both Table 3 and Table 4 show the total is less in 2018 than what it was in 2015. California had a major decrease compared to some increases in Florida, Texas and elsewhere. Figure 4 shows how illegal immigration has been dropping year over year from Mexico. Figure 5 shows an increase from all other countries that are not Mexico. "The head of the US Border Patrol says he's getting ready for as many as 8,000 people to be apprehended daily, more than double the daily number of the 2019 surge under the Trump administration. That staggering number "will probably become the norm over the next 30 to 45 days," Border Patrol Chief Raul Ortiz told CNN in an exclusive interview. There have already been 940,000 arrests this fiscal year, which started in October".
These captured and released into the country are whats causing the mayors to squeal like a pig caught under the fence.
except there is no evidence that they are "captured and released". under Obama they were captured and deported. why on Earth would it be different under Obama 2.0?
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tbop77
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Post by tbop77 on Jul 24, 2022 17:38:52 GMT -5
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ripvanwinkle
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Post by ripvanwinkle on Jul 24, 2022 17:44:14 GMT -5
"The head of the US Border Patrol says he's getting ready for as many as 8,000 people to be apprehended daily, more than double the daily number of the 2019 surge under the Trump administration. That staggering number "will probably become the norm over the next 30 to 45 days," Border Patrol Chief Raul Ortiz told CNN in an exclusive interview. There have already been 940,000 arrests this fiscal year, which started in October".
These captured and released into the country are whats causing the mayors to squeal like a pig caught under the fence.
except there is no evidence that they are "captured and released". under Obama they were captured and deported. why on Earth would it be different under Obama 2.0? Here is some interesting predictions from the Center for Immigration Studies. All point to increasing illegal immigration as far as I can see.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jul 24, 2022 17:48:32 GMT -5
Murdoch came out strong against Trump In his papers. I wondered if it would make it to FAUX.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 24, 2022 17:50:59 GMT -5
except there is no evidence that they are "captured and released". under Obama they were captured and deported. why on Earth would it be different under Obama 2.0? Here is some interesting predictions from the Center for Immigration Studies. All point to increasing illegal immigration as far as I can see.
ok. the CIS. thanks. how much do you know about the CIS? i know them extremely well. i have studied them for years. i know all about their membership, their research, their financial backing, their staffing, their reports and studies. what do you know?
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ripvanwinkle
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Post by ripvanwinkle on Jul 24, 2022 22:20:54 GMT -5
Here is some interesting predictions from the Center for Immigration Studies. All point to increasing illegal immigration as far as I can see.
ok. the CIS. thanks. how much do you know about the CIS? i know them extremely well. i have studied them for years. i know all about their membership, their research, their financial backing, their staffing, their reports and studies. what do you know? I don't know a thing about the CIS organization. It seemed legit. If I entered keywords like immigration, deportations, 2022, Biden etc in Bing, Google, Yahoo or other search engines tons of sites come up. I have no way of knowing what their political leanings are. There's not a banner or disclaimer saying their writings are right wing or left wing somewhere on the page or story.
As I've said before I don't have any college degrees. You probably have a Masters or PHD in Political Science so you can spend all day digesting the nuances of news stories and events. I on the other hand work all day and just get 30-60 second evening news stories on ABC, CBS, NBC etc who's analysis if any is not indepth at best.
Perhaps for all of us you could compile and post a complete master list of all the internet sites, national newspapers, radio and TV stations, organizations, think tanks, blogs etc and their political leanings so we would be informed up front first and make our own judgement of the info.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 25, 2022 0:12:35 GMT -5
ok. the CIS. thanks. how much do you know about the CIS? i know them extremely well. i have studied them for years. i know all about their membership, their research, their financial backing, their staffing, their reports and studies. what do you know? I don't know a thing about the CIS organization. It seemed legit. If I entered keywords like immigration, deportations, 2022, Biden etc in Bing, Google, Yahoo or other search engines tons of sites come up. first of all, getting high up in SEO dominance is a function of how good your internet strategy is. it has nothing to do with how good you are, how popular you are, or how accurate you are. i am sure you know that, but i am just pointing it out. and yes, CIS APPEARS to be legitimate. i won't bother getting personal about it, but just discuss the data, since that is how and why i discovered them. when i crunch data on immigration, i use CIS data, along with data from four or five other agencies. then, i throw out the worst outliers in either direction, and average the other three or four. from that i get reasonably accurate data. what you should know is that CIS data is ALWAYS tossed out. their data and that of the most liberal organization are so far off the mark that it can't be reasonably aggregated if you care about facts. they are literally 2x the average. and i think you or someone else mentioned that earlier when you or someone else said 20M. that number is wildly wrong, as far as i can tell. i can give you an example of WHY CIS data is wrong, by using another factoid they show at their site. they claim that the cost of immigration is over $100B. however, they neglect to calculate taxes collected from "illegals", which is significant. they also pad the costs considerably by comparison to other sites that monitor these costs more honestly. in short, it is impossible to believe the cost is over $50B. which is not NOTHING. but it is not $100B, either. in fact, the REAL costs are as close to nothing (which is what the most liberal outfits claim) as they are $100B. this is what i am talking about. if you want something accurate, i would suggest trying a centrist thinktank or a legit, nonpartisan study.
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 25, 2022 0:17:44 GMT -5
As I've said before I don't have any college degrees. You probably have a Masters or PHD in Political Science so you can spend all day digesting the nuances of news stories and events. . not at all. i have a PhD in natural curiosity. you can do it, rip. you just need to seek out more than one source of data, and keep going until you get some agreement. if you don't have time for that, then keep an open mind. CIS and FAIR are approximately as rabidly anti-immigration. here is an article at CATO, which is a centrist thinktank, on the subject of immigration cost: www.cato.org/blog/fairs-fiscal-burden-illegal-immigration-study-fatally-flawedi know we were not talking about cost. i am suggesting that CATO might be a better choice for reliable immigration information than CIS or FAIR.
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 25, 2022 0:23:23 GMT -5
edit: before you suspect that CATO might be liberal, keep in mind that this organization was started by the Koch brothers.
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Post by Opti on Jul 25, 2022 6:25:34 GMT -5
ok. the CIS. thanks. how much do you know about the CIS? i know them extremely well. i have studied them for years. i know all about their membership, their research, their financial backing, their staffing, their reports and studies. what do you know? I don't know a thing about the CIS organization. It seemed legit. If I entered keywords like immigration, deportations, 2022, Biden etc in Bing, Google, Yahoo or other search engines tons of sites come up. I have no way of knowing what their political leanings are. There's not a banner or disclaimer saying their writings are right wing or left wing somewhere on the page or story.
As I've said before I don't have any college degrees. You probably have a Masters or PHD in Political Science so you can spend all day digesting the nuances of news stories and events. I on the other hand work all day and just get 30-60 second evening news stories on ABC, CBS, NBC etc who's analysis if any is not indepth at best.
Perhaps for all of us you could compile and post a complete master list of all the internet sites, national newspapers, radio and TV stations, organizations, think tanks, blogs etc and their political leanings so we would be informed up front first and make our own judgement of the info.
It felt off to me because the predictions did not link back to articles explaining their reasoning. Just sound bites with little to under pin them. After DJ's post - I googled Center for Immigration Studies and got more info. Because of my search history compared to yours, I'm not sure you would get the results to evaluate them on the first or second pages. Most search engines are partisan by design based on what they believe you want to see, not what should float to the top for everyone. Just the other day I tried to search a certain shoe manufacturer and their website was not on the first two pages of results. Just a bunch of stores that carried the brand. In the past it usually showed up on page one of results even if it was in the middle of the page.
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