A different take on DWI punishment(s)

[kadee79]

Wonder if it will sink in for those who drink & drive?

Tennessee lawmakers on Wednesday unanimously passed a bill that would require drunk drivers to pay child support to victims' children.

The bill passed in the Senate this week and had previously passed in the House of Representatives in February.

The legislation, titled "Ethan, Haile, and Bentley's Law," requires those convicted of drunk driving to provide for the children of deceased victims until they are 18 years old.

If the driver is convicted of driving under the influence and, as a result, caused the death of a parent of a minor, "then the sentencing court must order the defendant to pay restitution in the form of child maintenance to each of the victim's children until each child reaches 18 years of age and has graduated from high school, or the class of which the child is a member when the child reached 18 years of age has graduated," the bill reads.

www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/tennessee-lawmakers-pass-bill-requiring-drunk-drivers-in-fatal-crashes-to-pay-child-support-for-victims-children/ar-AAWuHJp?ocid=msedgdhp&li=BBnb7Kz

[buystoys]

I think it's appropriate and over due.

[haapai]

It's trying to get blood from a turnip. 

• The drunk needs to actually be convicted of DWI.
  
• The drunk needs to be released from jail or prison.
  
• The drunk needs to be gainfully employed or at least employed enough to have something to grab. 
  

It ain't gonna raise a dime for the kiddies.  It will cost more to attempt to enforce than it will ever steer toward the kids. 

And it will destroy any possibility that the convicted drunk drivers affected will ever be able to carry their own weight.  You can't carry your own weight with a revoked driver's license and garnished wages.  You only survive garnishment because someone else is carrying your ass. 

[dondub]

I just wish all the pro-life family values Christians were for ‘deadbeat dad’ legislation. They want women and kids off welfare but are opposed to this means.

[Tiny]

I'm with Haapai on this one. Blood from a turnip. 

And   I don't think this is fair or just to anyone involved.
What happens when the drunk driver is a teen?
What happens when the victim has an adult child with disabilities?
What happens when the driver is disabled in the crash?   with no way to pay??

I'm not sure if this bill pours salt on a wound by forcing a devastated family to endure continuous exposure to the source of their grief/sorrow/pain on a monthly basis (being reminded every time they have to go to court/keep up with the driver's life so they can keep collecting   or if maybe that kind of 'vengence'  of constantly reminding the driver of the awfulness they caused is cathartic  


I found this 2016 article:
www.griffithinjurylaw.com/library/why-tn-drunk-driving-crashes-differ-from-other-accidents.cfm#:~:text=According%20to%20the%20National%20Highway,someone%20driving%20under%20the%20influence.d

Wrongful death. Drunk driving crashes are overwhelmingly likely to cause the deaths of innocent victims, and relatives of deceased family members have the right to sue a drunk driver for the wrongful death of a loved one. In Tennessee, widowed spouses, children, and parents of a deceased victim can recover many different kinds of damages, including medical and funeral expenses related directly to the victim’s injuries, awards for the mental and physical suffering of the deceased prior to death, and the family’s loss of companionship, guidance, and consortium as a result of the death. Families can also be awarded an amount for the lost income and benefits the victim would have earned throughout his or her lifetime. Due to the heinous nature of drunk driving, families may be awarded punitive damages up to two times the amount of compensatory damages awarded or $500,000, whichever is greater.

And my favorite part of the new bill:

If the driver is convicted of driving under the influence and, as a result, caused the death of a parent of a minor, "then the sentencing court must order the defendant to pay restitution in the form of child maintenance to each of the victim's children until each child reaches 18 years of age and has graduated from high school, or the class of which the child is a member when the child reached 18 years of age has graduated,"

How fair or just is THAT going to be??

Oh look at how sorrowful and repentant that lovely young blonde white woman is - so sorry she killed the parents of those children. She probably can't afford more than $25 a month per kid... so that's what we'll go with.    


I'm wondering if the law is more of a "loop hole" for the unfortunate wealthy person who causes death by driving drunk?   The court decides how much  (or little) the driver pays.  Will that keep the victim's family from being able to sue? 

[happyhoix]

18 year old who was driving 151 MPH who ran into a car with six people doing 40 MPH - killed all six.

www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/florida-teen-charged-151-mph-luxury-car-crash-killed-6-farm-workers-rcna25546

Doesn’t appear drinking was involved - but he liked to post selfies of himself going fast - 180 MPH a few weeks prior to this accident.

My first thought - what 18 year old kid can afford a 2019 BMW? What is the responsibility of parents that give this kind of car to an 18 year old?

They’re looking at 15 years x 6 - although if he’s from a wealthy family, I’m sure that’s not what he’ll get.

[Opti]

Apr 23, 2022 13:27:11 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

18 year old who was driving 151 MPH who ran into a car with six people doing 40 MPH - killed all six.

www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/florida-teen-charged-151-mph-luxury-car-crash-killed-6-farm-workers-rcna25546

Doesn’t appear drinking was involved - but he liked to post selfies of himself going fast - 180 MPH a few weeks prior to this accident.

My first thought - what 18 year old kid can afford a 2019 BMW? What is the responsibility of parents that give this kind of car to an 18 year old?

They’re looking at 15 years x 6 - although if he’s from a wealthy family, I’m sure that’s not what he’ll get.

Plea of Not guilty?!  

[happyhoix]

Apr 23, 2022 13:50:52 GMT -5 Opti said:

Apr 23, 2022 13:27:11 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

18 year old who was driving 151 MPH who ran into a car with six people doing 40 MPH - killed all six.

www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/florida-teen-charged-151-mph-luxury-car-crash-killed-6-farm-workers-rcna25546

Doesn’t appear drinking was involved - but he liked to post selfies of himself going fast - 180 MPH a few weeks prior to this accident.

My first thought - what 18 year old kid can afford a 2019 BMW? What is the responsibility of parents that give this kind of car to an 18 year old?

They’re looking at 15 years x 6 - although if he’s from a wealthy family, I’m sure that’s not what he’ll get.

Plea of Not guilty?!  

Yeah I saw it that. He admitted to the cops on the scene how fast he was going - unless he’s got some expensive lawyer who can keep that admission from entering into evidence.

[billisonboard]

Apr 24, 2022 20:09:29 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Apr 23, 2022 13:50:52 GMT -5 Opti said:

Plea of Not guilty?!  

Yeah I saw it that. He admitted to the cops on the scene how fast he was going - unless he’s got some expensive lawyer who can keep that admission from entering into evidence.

Galle told an investigator after the crash while en route to the hospital he was going “above 120.” 

However, officials conducted search warrants for the airbag control modules of both vehicles and found Galle was driving at 151 mph at impact, while the other car was driving at 38 mph. 

link

[justme]

Based on amounts I've seen a lot of people post on what is child support - the amount would likely be a lot smaller than the SS benefits they should receive.

[Tennesseer]

Apr 23, 2022 13:27:11 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

18 year old who was driving 151 MPH who ran into a car with six people doing 40 MPH - killed all six.

www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/florida-teen-charged-151-mph-luxury-car-crash-killed-6-farm-workers-rcna25546

Doesn’t appear drinking was involved - but he liked to post selfies of himself going fast - 180 MPH a few weeks prior to this accident.

My first thought - what 18 year old kid can afford a 2019 BMW? What is the responsibility of parents that give this kind of car to an 18 year old?

They’re looking at 15 years x 6 - although if he’s from a wealthy family, I’m sure that’s not what he’ll get.

Ethan Couch, ‘Affluenza Teen’ Who Killed 4 While Driving Drunk, Is Freed

Ethan Couch, whose trial for killing four people while driving drunk sparked widespread conversations about the privilege of being raised wealthy, was released from a Texas jail on Monday after nearly two years.

Mr. Couch, 20, became known as the “affluenza teen” after a psychologist suggested during his trial that growing up with money might have left him with psychological afflictions, too rich to tell right from wrong. He attracted further attention when he and his mother, Tonya Couch, fled to Mexico in an effort to evade possible jail time.

He served his 720-day sentence in a jail in Tarrant County, and was freed about a week before his 21st birthday.

Mr. Couch was 16 in June 2013 when he and a group of friends stole beer from a store and had a party at his parents’ house before going for a drive. He struck and killed four people on the side of a road near Burleson, Tex., a Fort Worth suburb, and a passenger in his car was paralyzed and suffered brain damage.

He had a blood alcohol level of 0.24, three times the legal limit in Texas, hours after the crash.

He pleaded guilty in 2013 to four counts of manslaughter and a juvenile court judge sentenced him to 10 years of probation, defying prosecutors who sought a 20-year prison sentence. The victims’ families were outraged, and critics felt he got special treatment because of his wealth.

In December 2015, a six-second video that appeared to show Mr. Couch at a party where alcohol was served — a possible parole violation — was posted on Twitter. Two weeks later, he and his mother went missing.

They were arrested about two weeks later, about 1,200 miles away in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico, where they had changed their appearances and ditched their identifications. Mr. Couch was brought back to Texas and placed in juvenile detention, while his case was moved to adult court.

In April 2016, Dee Anderson, Tarrant County’s sheriff, said Mr. Couch had created “zero issues” since beginning his jail stint that January.

“I do believe Ethan Couch is not the same person he was when he came to jail,” he said. “The time he’s spent, it’s a rude awakening for anyone.”

Under the terms of his probation, Mr. Couch will not be permitted to drive or drink alcohol, and cannot leave the Fort Worth area without approval from probation or court officials. He must look for a job and perform community service.

In a statement, Mothers Against Drunk Driving said it was “small consolation” that Mr. Couch would remain on probation.

“Two years in jail for four people killed is a grave injustice to the victims and their families who have been dealt life sentences because of one person’s devastating decision to drink and drive,” the organization said. “The 720 days Ethan Couch served for his crimes shows that drunk driving homicides still aren’t treated as the violent crimes that they are.”

Ethan Couch, ‘Affluenza Teen’ Who Killed 4 While Driving Drunk, Is Freed

[billisonboard]

Apr 24, 2022 20:33:47 GMT -5 justme said:

Based on amounts I've seen a lot of people post on what is child support - the amount would likely be a lot smaller than the SS benefits they should receive.

Certainly they shouldn't receive less than the SS benefits due them but I would have no problem with the convicted drunk driver covering at least some of that cost instead of it all coming out of the diminishing SS Fund.

[justme]

Apr 24, 2022 20:42:01 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Apr 24, 2022 20:33:47 GMT -5 justme said:

Based on amounts I've seen a lot of people post on what is child support - the amount would likely be a lot smaller than the SS benefits they should receive.

Certainly they shouldn't receive less than the SS benefits due them but I would have no problem with the convicted drunk driver covering at least some of that cost instead of it all coming out of the diminishing SS Fund.

Eh considering how crappy our system is with child support, unless this is via an entirely different system it shouldn't lower what the SS benefit is.

[happyhoix]

Apr 24, 2022 20:37:28 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Apr 23, 2022 13:27:11 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

18 year old who was driving 151 MPH who ran into a car with six people doing 40 MPH - killed all six.

www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/florida-teen-charged-151-mph-luxury-car-crash-killed-6-farm-workers-rcna25546

Doesn’t appear drinking was involved - but he liked to post selfies of himself going fast - 180 MPH a few weeks prior to this accident.

My first thought - what 18 year old kid can afford a 2019 BMW? What is the responsibility of parents that give this kind of car to an 18 year old?

They’re looking at 15 years x 6 - although if he’s from a wealthy family, I’m sure that’s not what he’ll get.

Ethan Couch, ‘Affluenza Teen’ Who Killed 4 While Driving Drunk, Is Freed

Ethan Couch, whose trial for killing four people while driving drunk sparked widespread conversations about the privilege of being raised wealthy, was released from a Texas jail on Monday after nearly two years.

Mr. Couch, 20, became known as the “affluenza teen” after a psychologist suggested during his trial that growing up with money might have left him with psychological afflictions, too rich to tell right from wrong. He attracted further attention when he and his mother, Tonya Couch, fled to Mexico in an effort to evade possible jail time.

He served his 720-day sentence in a jail in Tarrant County, and was freed about a week before his 21st birthday.

Mr. Couch was 16 in June 2013 when he and a group of friends stole beer from a store and had a party at his parents’ house before going for a drive. He struck and killed four people on the side of a road near Burleson, Tex., a Fort Worth suburb, and a passenger in his car was paralyzed and suffered brain damage.

He had a blood alcohol level of 0.24, three times the legal limit in Texas, hours after the crash.

He pleaded guilty in 2013 to four counts of manslaughter and a juvenile court judge sentenced him to 10 years of probation, defying prosecutors who sought a 20-year prison sentence. The victims’ families were outraged, and critics felt he got special treatment because of his wealth.

In December 2015, a six-second video that appeared to show Mr. Couch at a party where alcohol was served — a possible parole violation — was posted on Twitter. Two weeks later, he and his mother went missing.

They were arrested about two weeks later, about 1,200 miles away in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico, where they had changed their appearances and ditched their identifications. Mr. Couch was brought back to Texas and placed in juvenile detention, while his case was moved to adult court.

In April 2016, Dee Anderson, Tarrant County’s sheriff, said Mr. Couch had created “zero issues” since beginning his jail stint that January.

“I do believe Ethan Couch is not the same person he was when he came to jail,” he said. “The time he’s spent, it’s a rude awakening for anyone.”

Under the terms of his probation, Mr. Couch will not be permitted to drive or drink alcohol, and cannot leave the Fort Worth area without approval from probation or court officials. He must look for a job and perform community service.

In a statement, Mothers Against Drunk Driving said it was “small consolation” that Mr. Couch would remain on probation.

“Two years in jail for four people killed is a grave injustice to the victims and their families who have been dealt life sentences because of one person’s devastating decision to drink and drive,” the organization said. “The 720 days Ethan Couch served for his crimes shows that drunk driving homicides still aren’t treated as the violent crimes that they are.”

Ethan Couch, ‘Affluenza Teen’ Who Killed 4 While Driving Drunk, Is Freed

Couch was driving drunk, it doesn’t look like the kid that killed six people when going 150 MPH was drunk - but had a history of being a speed demon (someone sent the cops a video of this guy going 181 MPH). 

I wonder, historically, how these two crimes - driving drunk vs driving recklessly - get prosecuted. It seems like reckless driving should be a greater crime - I certainly hope this kid doesn’t get just two years for killing six people. 

[Tennesseer]

Apr 25, 2022 5:42:02 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Apr 24, 2022 20:37:28 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Ethan Couch, ‘Affluenza Teen’ Who Killed 4 While Driving Drunk, Is Freed

Ethan Couch, whose trial for killing four people while driving drunk sparked widespread conversations about the privilege of being raised wealthy, was released from a Texas jail on Monday after nearly two years.

Mr. Couch, 20, became known as the “affluenza teen” after a psychologist suggested during his trial that growing up with money might have left him with psychological afflictions, too rich to tell right from wrong. He attracted further attention when he and his mother, Tonya Couch, fled to Mexico in an effort to evade possible jail time.

He served his 720-day sentence in a jail in Tarrant County, and was freed about a week before his 21st birthday.

Mr. Couch was 16 in June 2013 when he and a group of friends stole beer from a store and had a party at his parents’ house before going for a drive. He struck and killed four people on the side of a road near Burleson, Tex., a Fort Worth suburb, and a passenger in his car was paralyzed and suffered brain damage.

He had a blood alcohol level of 0.24, three times the legal limit in Texas, hours after the crash.

He pleaded guilty in 2013 to four counts of manslaughter and a juvenile court judge sentenced him to 10 years of probation, defying prosecutors who sought a 20-year prison sentence. The victims’ families were outraged, and critics felt he got special treatment because of his wealth.

In December 2015, a six-second video that appeared to show Mr. Couch at a party where alcohol was served — a possible parole violation — was posted on Twitter. Two weeks later, he and his mother went missing.

They were arrested about two weeks later, about 1,200 miles away in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico, where they had changed their appearances and ditched their identifications. Mr. Couch was brought back to Texas and placed in juvenile detention, while his case was moved to adult court.

In April 2016, Dee Anderson, Tarrant County’s sheriff, said Mr. Couch had created “zero issues” since beginning his jail stint that January.

“I do believe Ethan Couch is not the same person he was when he came to jail,” he said. “The time he’s spent, it’s a rude awakening for anyone.”

Under the terms of his probation, Mr. Couch will not be permitted to drive or drink alcohol, and cannot leave the Fort Worth area without approval from probation or court officials. He must look for a job and perform community service.

In a statement, Mothers Against Drunk Driving said it was “small consolation” that Mr. Couch would remain on probation.

“Two years in jail for four people killed is a grave injustice to the victims and their families who have been dealt life sentences because of one person’s devastating decision to drink and drive,” the organization said. “The 720 days Ethan Couch served for his crimes shows that drunk driving homicides still aren’t treated as the violent crimes that they are.”

Ethan Couch, ‘Affluenza Teen’ Who Killed 4 While Driving Drunk, Is Freed

Couch was driving drunk, it doesn’t look like the kid that killed six people when going 150 MPH was drunk - but had a history of being a speed demon (someone sent the cops a video of this guy going 181 MPH). 

I wonder, historically, how these two crimes - driving drunk vs driving recklessly - get prosecuted. It seems like reckless driving should be a greater crime - I certainly hope this kid doesn’t get just two years for killing six people. 

I am aware one was speeding and one was drunk. If you noticed it, I highlighted a line in your post I replied to.

Only noting Couch and the speeding guy probably came from rich family (if at 18 years old he can afford a 2019 BMW).

Money buys good legal representation. Representation poor people cannot afford.

[happyhoix]

Apr 25, 2022 11:13:07 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Apr 25, 2022 5:42:02 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Couch was driving drunk, it doesn’t look like the kid that killed six people when going 150 MPH was drunk - but had a history of being a speed demon (someone sent the cops a video of this guy going 181 MPH). 

I wonder, historically, how these two crimes - driving drunk vs driving recklessly - get prosecuted. It seems like reckless driving should be a greater crime - I certainly hope this kid doesn’t get just two years for killing six people. 

I am aware one was speeding and one was drunk. If you noticed it, I highlighted a line in your post I replied to.

Only noting Couch and the speeding guy probably came from rich family (if at 18 years old he can afford a 2019 BMW).

Money buys good legal representation. Representation poor people cannot afford.

I know what you were pointing out - but you made me think about the circumstances of the two crimes. In my mind, joyriding is worse than DUI and should have a more harsh punishment- but is that right? I guess I’m thinking if you’re drunk you have a diminished capacity so you don’t know what you’re doing, but if you know you tend to be stupid when drunk (and aren’t we all) should you do more to keep yourself from driving if you tied one on? Like give your car keys to someone else?

Just curious if anyone knows how the law punishes these two different offenses.

[Tennesseer]

Apr 23, 2022 13:27:11 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

18 year old who was driving 151 MPH who ran into a car with six people doing 40 MPH - killed all six.

www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/florida-teen-charged-151-mph-luxury-car-crash-killed-6-farm-workers-rcna25546

Doesn’t appear drinking was involved - but he liked to post selfies of himself going fast - 180 MPH a few weeks prior to this accident.

My first thought - what 18 year old kid can afford a 2019 BMW? What is the responsibility of parents that give this kind of car to an 18 year old?

They’re looking at 15 years x 6 - although if he’s from a wealthy family, I’m sure that’s not what he’ll get.

Not related to your article.  But a racing car broadsided a school bus with children recently in Albuquerque.  No children killed.  But I can see the speeder paying out of pocket for years to come if any children or adults die in accidents caused by racing cars.

[Opti]

That is a scary video!

[daisylu]

Good luck with getting it enforced. My state was never able to collect child support for my DD because every time they got close to catching him he would switch jobs and work for cash for a while. I know there are other roads I could have taken - haul him into civil court, have him arrested, etc - but it was not worth my time. He stayed away from her and that was good enough for me. She did connect with her half siblings for a minute, but refused to deal with him.

Though I am sure the state would have likely done more if I was receiving some sort of welfare.

[NastyWoman]

Apr 25, 2022 5:42:02 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Apr 24, 2022 20:37:28 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Ethan Couch, ‘Affluenza Teen’ Who Killed 4 While Driving Drunk, Is Freed

Ethan Couch, whose trial for killing four people while driving drunk sparked widespread conversations about the privilege of being raised wealthy, was released from a Texas jail on Monday after nearly two years.

Mr. Couch, 20, became known as the “affluenza teen” after a psychologist suggested during his trial that growing up with money might have left him with psychological afflictions, too rich to tell right from wrong. He attracted further attention when he and his mother, Tonya Couch, fled to Mexico in an effort to evade possible jail time.

He served his 720-day sentence in a jail in Tarrant County, and was freed about a week before his 21st birthday.

Mr. Couch was 16 in June 2013 when he and a group of friends stole beer from a store and had a party at his parents’ house before going for a drive. He struck and killed four people on the side of a road near Burleson, Tex., a Fort Worth suburb, and a passenger in his car was paralyzed and suffered brain damage.

He had a blood alcohol level of 0.24, three times the legal limit in Texas, hours after the crash.

He pleaded guilty in 2013 to four counts of manslaughter and a juvenile court judge sentenced him to 10 years of probation, defying prosecutors who sought a 20-year prison sentence. The victims’ families were outraged, and critics felt he got special treatment because of his wealth.

In December 2015, a six-second video that appeared to show Mr. Couch at a party where alcohol was served — a possible parole violation — was posted on Twitter. Two weeks later, he and his mother went missing.

They were arrested about two weeks later, about 1,200 miles away in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico, where they had changed their appearances and ditched their identifications. Mr. Couch was brought back to Texas and placed in juvenile detention, while his case was moved to adult court.

In April 2016, Dee Anderson, Tarrant County’s sheriff, said Mr. Couch had created “zero issues” since beginning his jail stint that January.

“I do believe Ethan Couch is not the same person he was when he came to jail,” he said. “The time he’s spent, it’s a rude awakening for anyone.”

Under the terms of his probation, Mr. Couch will not be permitted to drive or drink alcohol, and cannot leave the Fort Worth area without approval from probation or court officials. He must look for a job and perform community service.

In a statement, Mothers Against Drunk Driving said it was “small consolation” that Mr. Couch would remain on probation.

“Two years in jail for four people killed is a grave injustice to the victims and their families who have been dealt life sentences because of one person’s devastating decision to drink and drive,” the organization said. “The 720 days Ethan Couch served for his crimes shows that drunk driving homicides still aren’t treated as the violent crimes that they are.”

Ethan Couch, ‘Affluenza Teen’ Who Killed 4 While Driving Drunk, Is Freed

Couch was driving drunk, it doesn’t look like the kid that killed six people when going 150 MPH was drunk - but had a history of being a speed demon (someone sent the cops a video of this guy going 181 MPH). 

I wonder, historically, how these two crimes - driving drunk vs driving recklessly - get prosecuted. It seems like reckless driving should be a greater crime - I certainly hope this kid doesn’t get just two years for killing six people. 

Somewhat of topic by why? In my opinion at least drunk driving fits the definition of reckless driving with the enhancement of diminished capabilities. I do believe we let these people of too easily with ridiculously low sentences but that would be takking my off topic comment back to  being on topic