Repeal The Jones Act 1920?

[ripvanwinkle]

My neighbor is a retired VP oil executive from Texaco. Sunday we were talking about the current energy problem. He had many thought on it and he mentioned the Jones act of 1920.

www.investopedia.com/terms/j/jonesact.asp

He said it should be repealed or at least waived. Biden could do it to help our oil/gas/container shipping problem. "The Jones Act requires goods shipped between U.S. ports to be transported on ships that are built, owned, and operated by United States citizens or permanent residents". Foreign ships are cheaper to build so we don't build them.

Sounds like repealing it is a great idea to me.

[dondub]

Mar 22, 2022 0:13:14 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

My neighbor is a retired VP oil executive from Texaco. Sunday we were talking about the current energy problem. He had many thought on it and he mentioned the Jones act of 1920.

www.investopedia.com/terms/j/jonesact.asp

He said it should be repealed or at least waived. Biden could do it to help our oil/gas/container shipping problem. "The Jones Act requires goods shipped between U.S. ports to be transported on ships that are built, owned, and operated by United States citizens or permanent residents". Foreign ships are cheaper to build so we don't build them.

Sounds like repealing it is a great idea to me.

Sounds like you think trolling is too. What does your neighbor think about the manipulative greed of the oil companies maxing their current profits on the backs of the poor?

[pulmonarymd]

I thought we wanted to keep manufacturing jobs in the US. Do this and watch our shipbuilding get offshd as well

[Cheesy FL-Vol]

Trying to understand the logic here.

Are goods from foreign locales shipped to west coast ports and then transferred to US ships to get said goods to the east or southern ports? Don't many shipped goods get sent to other locations via train or truck? 

How does a proposed repeal positively affect the current US energy problem?

When I think of energy, I think of electricity, natural gas, and of course fuel. Electricity is generated via wind, solar, water, nuclear, and in some places still coal. I think these are all generated in the US, correct? Does the US provide enough of it's own natural gas to supply the regions that use it, or is that imported? Oil is domestic and imported.

[billisonboard]

Sounds to me like one of those trot it out to "solve" any number of "crises" over the years type arguments. I can hear someone whispering to a new person at a meeting, "Here it comes, Jim Bob is about to pronounce in his serious no nonsense voice 'What must be done to solve this problem is repeal of the Jones Act'" After his does it, the person just shrugs and says, "Every time."

[Opti]

www.eia.gov/energyexplained/oil-and-petroleum-products/where-our-oil-comes-from.php

[Opti]

www.factcheck.org/2021/08/trump-and-boeberts-oil-spin/


The United States continues to import a smaller amount of its petroleum from the Middle East, part of a decadeslong trend that has continued under President Joe Biden.



The U.S. gets most of its imported oil from Canada. About 9.8% of U.S. petroleum imports (most of it crude oil) came from Persian Gulf countries in 2020, according to U.S. Energy Information Administration data. That has dropped to an average of about 6.6% in the first five months of 2021.

“While OPEC+ recently agreed to production increases, these increases will not fully offset previous production cuts that OPEC+ imposed during the pandemic until well into 2022,” National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan said in the Aug. 11 statement. “At a critical moment in the global recovery, this is simply not enough.”

An EIA report on oil and petroleum products notes that the U.S. exported about 8.5 million barrels per day of petroleum in 2020, while importing about 7.9 million barrels per day, “making the United States a net annual petroleum exporter for the first time since at least 1949.”



Settle cited an EIA forecast released on Feb. 17 that projected “the U.S. will import more petroleum than it exports in 2021 and 2022.”

The decline in domestic crude oil production came “as result of a decline in drilling activity related to low oil prices,” according to an EIA report in January. “Responses to the COVID-19 pandemic led to supply and demand disruptions,” the report noted.



In fact, the EIA has been forecasting that the U.S. would import more petroleum than it exports in 2021 and 2022 ever since April 2020 — in its first monthly forecast to consider the expected economic effects of the U.S. COVID-19 response measures announced in March of that year (and long before Trump left office).

[djAdvocate]

this "energy independence" argument is a red herring.

we already are energy independent.  that happened under Obama.

[countrygirl2]

I was reading, they said any petroleum shipped from the Texas area that is imported is sent only on domestic ships, that was one example. Basically they are union and the workers make more money. They are wanting to  use foreign workers like the rest of the shippers do and pay them little or nothing and likely ships from other countries. We would end up with no martime workers and even less US flagged ships then we have now. And I'm betting the savings wouldn't be passed on anyway. We need to face the fact if things are made here we will pay more, wages will have to come up and it will work out fine, like it did in the past. That's how we had a strong middle class. But big business just doesn't want to pay workers anything.

[Tennesseer]

Mar 22, 2022 0:13:14 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

My neighbor is a retired VP oil executive from Texaco. Sunday we were talking about the current energy problem. He had many thought on it and he mentioned the Jones act of 1920.

www.investopedia.com/terms/j/jonesact.asp

He said it should be repealed or at least waived. Biden could do it to help our oil/gas/container shipping problem. "The Jones Act requires goods shipped between U.S. ports to be transported on ships that are built, owned, and operated by United States citizens or permanent residents". Foreign ships are cheaper to build so we don't build them.

Sounds like repealing it is a great idea to me.

Trump could have done it too after all he was President when the OECD study came out in 2019. Maybe Trump figured out he had no way to personally pocket the $19 billion or more in gains.

Odd though how you only mentioned Biden. Hmmmmm.

Protectionism Edit
Critics claim the Jones Act is protectionist, and point to a 2002 report by the United States International Trade Commission that estimated the savings for the U.S. economy that would result from the repeal or amendment of the Jones Act.[37] Critics contend that the Act results in higher costs for moving cargo between U.S. ports, particularly for Americans living in Hawaii, Alaska, Guam, and Puerto Rico.[3][38]

A 2019 study by the OECD estimated that the economic gains to the U.S. economy from the repeal of Jones Act would range from an added $19 billion up to $64 billion.[30]


Efforts at repeal
Legislative efforts to repeal the Jones Act have been repeatedly introduced in Congress since 2010 in the form of the Open America's Waters Act, championed by the late Senator John McCain and by Utah Senator Mike Lee, but have not passed to become law.[39]

Merchant Marine Act of 1920

[Tiny]

Mar 22, 2022 0:13:14 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

My neighbor is a retired VP oil executive from Texaco. Sunday we were talking about the current energy problem. He had many thought on it and he mentioned the Jones act of 1920.

www.investopedia.com/terms/j/jonesact.asp

He said it should be repealed or at least waived. Biden could do it to help our oil/gas/container shipping problem. "The Jones Act requires goods shipped between U.S. ports to be transported on ships that are built, owned, and operated by United States citizens or permanent residents". Foreign ships are cheaper to build so we don't build them.

Sounds like repealing it is a great idea to me.

What if America  just used less fuel?   

It's all about supply and demand...

Thermostats will be lowing (it's spring!)
And I'm guessing people will skip the Sunday Drive and any other unnecessary trips.      

I would think that as that happens (demand drops some)  the "energy problem" will abate. 

[djAdvocate]

Mar 22, 2022 12:40:23 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Mar 22, 2022 0:13:14 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

My neighbor is a retired VP oil executive from Texaco. Sunday we were talking about the current energy problem. He had many thought on it and he mentioned the Jones act of 1920.

www.investopedia.com/terms/j/jonesact.asp

He said it should be repealed or at least waived. Biden could do it to help our oil/gas/container shipping problem. "The Jones Act requires goods shipped between U.S. ports to be transported on ships that are built, owned, and operated by United States citizens or permanent residents". Foreign ships are cheaper to build so we don't build them.

Sounds like repealing it is a great idea to me.

What if America  just used less fuel?   

It's all about supply and demand...

Thermostats will be lowing (it's spring!)
And I'm guessing people will skip the Sunday Drive and any other unnecessary trips.      

I would think that as that happens (demand drops some)  the "energy problem" will abate. 

Obama suggested this.  then he casually remarked that if we kept our TIRES INFLATED, it would drive down fuel demand (which was true).

his critics laughed him out of the room.
that was the first of many signs that we were and are in deep doo.