azucena
Junior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2011 13:23:14 GMT -5
Posts: 5,187
|
Post by azucena on May 4, 2022 13:59:54 GMT -5
Dragging the thread back on topic - I know I have 3 friends still paying on their college undergrad loans from when we graduated in 2001. Two took deferments in the 2010s - one had no idea that interest would still continue to accumulate. One was paying less than the monthly interest. One graduated with a bachelor's in business and then decided to go back to college to become a teacher. Massively negative ROI on those additional loans.
|
|
Rukh O'Rorke
Senior Associate
Joined: Jul 4, 2016 13:31:15 GMT -5
Posts: 10,018
|
Post by Rukh O'Rorke on May 4, 2022 14:21:32 GMT -5
Well, your comment struck me as offensive for the same reason. We lost several family members too. I read it and wondered how that was relevant to the discussion of student loan debt. I truly am sorry for the loved ones you lost. I did not mean to be insensitive. I just feel that some people's compensation was adjusted to compensate for the additional risk they took on. I realize that is not true for everyone. Nidena brought up social workers - they need a Master's Degree but their average salary is around $50,000/yr. Doctors make something like $174,000-400,000 a year. even if they have a 200,000 loan balance they should be able to afford their student loan payments. Rural Doctors are a different story - to go to a rural area, they often give up some earning potential so it is not an apples to apples comparison. I think adjusting/capping the interest rates is a good place to start. It not only fixes it for current borrowers, but also the kids currently in school or those who are not there yet. We have been underfunding education for about 25 years in this country. my original comment here was to point out why they deserved pay increases as they went from providing care to risking their lives while providing care. I'm not sure why that was interpreted as being offensive.
|
|
bean29
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 22:26:57 GMT -5
Posts: 9,912
|
Post by bean29 on May 4, 2022 16:13:41 GMT -5
Dragging the thread back on topic - I know I have 3 friends still paying on their college undergrad loans from when we graduated in 2001. Two took deferments in the 2010s - one had no idea that interest would still continue to accumulate. One was paying less than the monthly interest. One graduated with a bachelor's in business and then decided to go back to college to become a teacher. Massively negative ROI on those additional loans. Yeah I asked my Nephew if he had gotten his loans forgiven and he said he had consolidated what was left of his undergrad SL and his Graduate School SL together, and now he was told the clock started over at the consolidation date. He said it would be wonderful if they re-consider his loans for forgiveness. He is about 40 and about 15 years out of his undergrad degree. He is back to teaching in the Classroom I guess. He also was doing job development/work study oversight for HS students... I think he still does that but has more classroom duties too.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Apr 19, 2024 18:13:50 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2022 17:37:29 GMT -5
my original comment here was to point out why they deserved pay increases as they went from providing care to risking their lives while providing care. I'm not sure why that was interpreted as being offensive. That was exactly how I interpreted it- the money the traveling health care workers got was essentially combat pay. Well, if you have a kid in college now and take part in any college finance forums or groups you'll know that taking student loans right now is all the rage whether you need them or not because of all the talk of blanket forgiveness. Not saying everyone is doing it, but there are a lot that are taking the "just in case" route.
oh dear! I feel like this alone will kill any chance it had for widespread application! Yes- very worrying. So...even parents who might be able to pay are planning to take out loans because they might be forgiven? Wow.
|
|
nidena
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 28, 2010 20:32:26 GMT -5
Posts: 3,580
|
Post by nidena on May 4, 2022 20:32:38 GMT -5
Will Biden forgive student loan debt? Here’s where things stand now (as of May 4, 2022) Any amount of debt forgiveness would have a profound impact on borrowers. Forgiving $10,000 per borrower would eliminate $321 billion of student loans, leaving about one-third of borrowers debt-free, according to a recent report from the Federal Reserve of New York. Erasing $50,000 in debt, by contrast, would discharge $904 billion, and eight in 10 borrowers would be debt-free as a result.
Another unknown. But White House Press Secretary Jen Psaki told a gaggle of reporters yesterday that the administration is "looking at steps to help people making less than $125,000 a year."
|
|
nidena
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 28, 2010 20:32:26 GMT -5
Posts: 3,580
|
Post by nidena on May 7, 2022 11:19:17 GMT -5
|
|
susana1954
Well-Known Member
Joined: Feb 23, 2021 18:50:55 GMT -5
Posts: 1,396
|
Post by susana1954 on May 7, 2022 17:41:32 GMT -5
I guess I'm just not seeing why past borrowers might get their loans forgiven, but not current/future borrowers. I am all for 0% interest, public service forgiveness, etc. But if you borrow money to become a lawyer or even a basket weaver, I don't see the fairness.
This is on my mind because my oldest grandson starts college this fall. He is going to the local university and will live at home. He received 3 scholarships totaling $9500. Even then, there is a shortfall. He won't have to borrow for the first 3 years because of the small 529 I set up, but that money will run out before he graduates.
|
|
jerseygirl
Senior Member
Joined: May 13, 2018 7:43:08 GMT -5
Posts: 4,749
|
Post by jerseygirl on May 7, 2022 18:16:34 GMT -5
Also have a GS looking at colleges. No one wants him to have loans. But so confusing since won’t know the actual costs until he’s admitted the colleges come forward with financial aid (non loan!) I swear the college costs are as bad as medical bills in this country - obscure
|
|
minnesotapaintlady
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 9, 2020 21:48:27 GMT -5
Posts: 7,465
Member is Online
|
Post by minnesotapaintlady on May 7, 2022 18:21:45 GMT -5
Also have a GS looking at colleges. No one wants him to have loans. But so confusing since won’t know the actual costs until he’s admitted the colleges come forward with financial aid (non loan!) I swear the college costs are as bad as medical bills in this country - obscure I found the Net Price Calculators on the school's websites to be very close to what the final offers were (10 schools). The only ones that were off were off in our favor due to competitive aid/scholarships that the calculator can't account for.
|
|
Ombud
Junior Associate
Joined: Jan 14, 2013 23:21:04 GMT -5
Posts: 7,592
|
Post by Ombud on May 8, 2022 11:12:07 GMT -5
GS1 owes about $7800 on his SL. 1 loan is at 2.5% the other also under 3%. It's been paused since he graduated 2020 and his plan is to get a teaching credential 2023. He currently can only teach as a resource Music & Movement teacher for TK & K students in a private school company. But that leaves him spending 1/2 his time driving to sites & he wants his own class. If it doesn't pause until he starts next year (yeah made up his mind until too late for this fall) does he pay now? Only makes $26 an hour and works 3/4 time.
|
|
haapai
Junior Associate
Character
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 20:40:06 GMT -5
Posts: 5,877
|
Post by haapai on May 8, 2022 12:42:22 GMT -5
Will he have to borrow more to get his teaching credential? Will he be able to work while pursuing that credential?
|
|
nidena
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 28, 2010 20:32:26 GMT -5
Posts: 3,580
|
Post by nidena on May 9, 2022 15:06:42 GMT -5
|
|
minnesotapaintlady
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 9, 2020 21:48:27 GMT -5
Posts: 7,465
Member is Online
|
Post by minnesotapaintlady on May 9, 2022 15:32:44 GMT -5
Well, that's not necessarily true. The donor paid the balances due the school. It did not pay off any loans they had taken up to that point.
|
|
minnesotapaintlady
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 9, 2020 21:48:27 GMT -5
Posts: 7,465
Member is Online
|
Post by minnesotapaintlady on May 11, 2022 16:11:20 GMT -5
So, in case anyone is interested, the new rates for 2022-2023 were announced today. Undergrad Direct: 4.993% Grad Direct: 6.543%
Parent Plus and Grad Plus: 7.543%
|
|
nidena
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 28, 2010 20:32:26 GMT -5
Posts: 3,580
|
Post by nidena on May 17, 2022 14:50:57 GMT -5
|
|
haapai
Junior Associate
Character
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 20:40:06 GMT -5
Posts: 5,877
|
Post by haapai on May 17, 2022 15:45:59 GMT -5
That is amazingly generous! He doesn't even know the total amount! The school could tell him the total amount of student loans certified through their financial aid office but he's going even further and creating a repayment fund to pay off student loans that the school has no way of knowing about.
|
|
haapai
Junior Associate
Character
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 20:40:06 GMT -5
Posts: 5,877
|
Post by haapai on May 17, 2022 16:42:44 GMT -5
First, my hat is off to nidena for trumpeting good news.
Secondly, the linked article scares me. It doesn't take a whole lot of math to figure out that about $300K divided by about 100 graduates works out to about $30K per graduate. Hmm ... that's about the average amount of federal student loan debt owed by the graduate that has any.
In other words, someone is doing some guesstimating and it's being reported without anyone pointing out that it's guesstimating. Either the reporter that filed this story is guesstimating or the president of the college is guesstimating. Either way, the brevity of the article disturbs me. WTF has happened to the fourth estate? How the heck does something this detail-free using suspiciously round numbers ever get published?
I'm going to google for follow-up articles in a moment, but I cannot contain my disappointment with this article.
|
|
haapai
Junior Associate
Character
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 20:40:06 GMT -5
Posts: 5,877
|
Post by haapai on May 17, 2022 19:40:44 GMT -5
I goggled, at least a bit, and I found the same article with the same gaps republished so many times that I could not find anything else.
Good goodness, can't anyone comment on the difference between no owing the university anything and not owing on federal student loans! I just can't believe that this kind of twitter/tik-tok tripe gets replayed on four or five (maybe seven) major news outlets without anyone saying that there's less here than hits the ear or eye.
Good G! What has happened to the fourth estate? How in the name of truth can they just replay this stuff without checking it out first?
|
|
gs11rmb
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 12:43:39 GMT -5
Posts: 3,299
|
Post by gs11rmb on May 18, 2022 8:17:32 GMT -5
There was a story on CBS Sunday Morning about student loans. They interviewed a 28 year-old woman living in the San Francisco area who had over $200,000 in student loans from Penn State. She seemed like a nice person but was so clueless that I wonder why they chose her to highlight the problem of large loans. She said something to the effect that she and her boyfriend couldn't eat out or travel as much as they would like because of the loan repayments. She did recognize that she needed to increase her income and her solution ... go to law school and take out more loans.
To be fair, if she ends up a partner in a large law firm, having $400-500K in loans is doable.
|
|
Tiny
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 29, 2010 21:22:34 GMT -5
Posts: 13,362
|
Post by Tiny on May 18, 2022 12:44:52 GMT -5
FROM the Article: Hirschorn did not get into specifics of how the loan repayment will work during the announcement, but said the gift will help repay loans that were certified through the school's financial aid office.
The college will also use Spiegel and Kerr’s gift to create the Alternative Loan Debt Repayment Fund, which will make charitable gifts to graduating students who have similar educational loans secured outside of Otis College.
Over 90% of students at Otis, a private nonprofit college, receive financial aid. The Chronicle of Higher Education puts Otis in the top 1% of most diverse colleges in the country, with 77% of its students identifying as non-white and 26% as international students.
I was pondering what "paid off their student loans" actually meant... I was also a little suspicious of "gee, great students with wealthy backgrounds got their debts paid off..." Nothing like the wealthy helping the wealthy and making it sound like they actually helped the people who needed helping... I found this: Otis is a private, nonprofit college established in 1918, the first professional arts school in Los Angeles. A good 77% of its 1,200 students identify as nonwhite, and 30% are the first in their family to attend college. So, OK, this probably did do a "nice" for people who needed a "nice". And to play devil's advocate: what about the classes behind them - they get stuck with their loans... is that fair? Might they be tempted to take MORE loan money in hopes they will not have to pay it back?? My real emotion/reaction to all of this - Good! Let's get back to the "Good Old Days" when Wealthy Americans gave back to the community - we've got libraries, parks, sports programs, etc... helping college students with loan debt is a start... I ponder why the ultra wealthy don't just pool some money together and start providing some sort of "student loan relief" for ALL the students who have loans - that are NOT part of lawsuits for predatory lending or against a "for profit" school that did not deliver on their promises (ie lied about job placements, etc).
|
|
scgal
Well-Known Member
Joined: Sept 18, 2020 16:56:48 GMT -5
Posts: 1,283
|
Post by scgal on May 19, 2022 13:11:56 GMT -5
I would like to see a study done on people who are at least 5 yr post grad with min 35k in student loans. How many bought a home, new car, travel on vacations.
I know the student loan program is broken, but I think most people don't put the effort into paying it back first.
|
|
raeoflyte
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 15:43:53 GMT -5
Posts: 14,711
|
Post by raeoflyte on May 19, 2022 13:21:48 GMT -5
I would like to see a study done on people who are at least 5 yr post grad with min 35k in student loans. How many bought a home, new car, travel on vacations. I know the student loan program is broken, but I think most people don't put the effort into paying it back first. You have to pay to live somewhere. I don't think buying a home should be a mark against someone. And few cities have good public transit. I've felt that owning a car is a necessity. I've always owned old cars, but I have a lot of help from my folks when those old cars break down. Rides, cars to borrow, etc. I can see where someone would feel like an old car is a liability.
|
|
scgal
Well-Known Member
Joined: Sept 18, 2020 16:56:48 GMT -5
Posts: 1,283
|
Post by scgal on May 19, 2022 13:32:10 GMT -5
I would like to see a study done on people who are at least 5 yr post grad with min 35k in student loans. How many bought a home, new car, travel on vacations. I know the student loan program is broken, but I think most people don't put the effort into paying it back first. You have to pay to live somewhere. I don't think buying a home should be a mark against someone. And few cities have good public transit. I've felt that owning a car is a necessity. I've always owned old cars, but I have a lot of help from my folks when those old cars break down. Rides, cars to borrow, etc. I can see where someone would feel like an old car is a liability. I tend to think that to buy a house costs money, down, lawyers etc... gotta drive but a hyundai drives you to the same place a lexus does. Peoples choices of needs and how they justify them vs not paying their student loans and their justification for it yet complain about still being in debt for 15 years post grad. Who is really to blame?
|
|
raeoflyte
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 15:43:53 GMT -5
Posts: 14,711
|
Post by raeoflyte on May 19, 2022 13:54:20 GMT -5
You have to pay to live somewhere. I don't think buying a home should be a mark against someone. And few cities have good public transit. I've felt that owning a car is a necessity. I've always owned old cars, but I have a lot of help from my folks when those old cars break down. Rides, cars to borrow, etc. I can see where someone would feel like an old car is a liability. I tend to think that to buy a house costs money, down, lawyers etc... gotta drive but a hyundai drives you to the same place a lexus does. Peoples choices of needs and how they justify them vs not paying their student loans and their justification for it yet complain about still being in debt for 15 years post grad. Who is really to blame? Rent here is stupidly expensive and so are house prices unfortunately. But buying a house locks in your costs vs. Being at the mercy of rent increases. Most young people buying a house are getting gifts for down payments, or using housing assistance programs. I've said before, and will say again that our student loan system is predatory. Lenders charging above market rates on loans that carry no risk is predatory. There are a lot of things that got us here, but the fault and the blame are in the institutions with all the power.
|
|
NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
Posts: 47,197
|
Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 19, 2022 14:30:50 GMT -5
I saw a meme that said we expect 18 year olds to make life impacting financial and career choices when for the past 12 years they had to ask permission for the basic right to use the bathroom.
That pretty much summed up my views on the argument "18 year olds should know better" when it comes to student loans.
|
|
minnesotapaintlady
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 9, 2020 21:48:27 GMT -5
Posts: 7,465
Member is Online
|
Post by minnesotapaintlady on May 19, 2022 14:39:37 GMT -5
It doesn't surprise me at all that 18 year olds get sucked into student loan hell. I'm a little more thrown by all the parents that enable it though. One cannot get these really high debt numbers (for undergrad) without help.
|
|
NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
Posts: 47,197
|
Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 19, 2022 16:36:45 GMT -5
Considering the sub prime mortgage crisis Im not.
I agree with Rae too much power is held by the companies that hold the loans and the colleges that feed off them.
Change needs to happen there before we start yelling at 18 year olds and parents and picking apart every life choice to find blame.
Cause there is no incentive to be judicious, fair or open when you know the person is on.the hook for life.
And no incentive to curb or regulate cost if you know not only can you get a fortune from students but you can convince the parents to take out loans too.
|
|
TheOtherMe
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 14:40:52 GMT -5
Posts: 27,120
Mini-Profile Name Color: e619e6
|
Post by TheOtherMe on May 19, 2022 16:43:14 GMT -5
Niece post a picture on FB yesterday of her, my great nephew and my sister at Iowa State for his first college visit.
My niece was reading some kind of paperwork in it.
I know nothing about what they are thinking of doing in regards to paying for it. I do know that my niece and her husband spend money the second it arrives in their hands. My BIL has said since I've been around those two will go bankrupt someday.
That did make me wonder how they plan to finance his college. Our parents and sister and BIL left it to the the student to figure it out, with guidance on loans.
If and only if he goes to Iowa State, I can see my sister paying for a large chunk of it. That will probably come with grade requirements or at least not flunking courses requirements.
|
|
raeoflyte
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 15:43:53 GMT -5
Posts: 14,711
|
Post by raeoflyte on May 19, 2022 17:05:58 GMT -5
It doesn't surprise me at all that 18 year olds get sucked into student loan hell. I'm a little more thrown by all the parents that enable it though. One cannot get these really high debt numbers (for undergrad) without help. I think it's the fear that without the degree they'll struggle. And finding the school they expect them to do the best at. So many entry level jobs require a bachelor's degree to apply, that do not need any college experience for someone to excel at. But if you can't get your resume on someone's desk its easy to get stuck.
|
|
minnesotapaintlady
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 9, 2020 21:48:27 GMT -5
Posts: 7,465
Member is Online
|
Post by minnesotapaintlady on May 19, 2022 22:04:53 GMT -5
It doesn't surprise me at all that 18 year olds get sucked into student loan hell. I'm a little more thrown by all the parents that enable it though. One cannot get these really high debt numbers (for undergrad) without help. I think it's the fear that without the degree they'll struggle. And finding the school they expect them to do the best at. So many entry level jobs require a bachelor's degree to apply, that do not need any college experience for someone to excel at. But if you can't get your resume on someone's desk its easy to get stuck. I guess I'm used to what things are like here where a large percentage do not go away to a 4 year school and the trades are still big. If DS wouldn't have gotten a bunch of scholarships and aid he would have been living at home and attending one of the local colleges.
|
|