cooper88
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Post by cooper88 on Mar 6, 2022 21:40:20 GMT -5
My grandmother lived to 103. Her SSA amount was pathetic, but because she retired at 65 she only had COLA increases which were tiny for close to forty years.
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nidena
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Post by nidena on Mar 6, 2022 23:04:07 GMT -5
At my present age, I'm not really sure but I'm aiming for max age for full benefit. It'll be supplementing the military pension and disability and I'm hoping to have my house paid off by then.
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justme
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Post by justme on Mar 7, 2022 1:36:52 GMT -5
I plan to wait until at least full retirement. But that's also just over 30 years away so who knows what the fuck they'll do before then. I'm not really counting it in my retirement numbers.
How old I'll live is a crap shoot. My oldest grandparent lived to a bit over 75, but she did that dealing with the horrible consequences of fen-phen so she likely would have lived longer. A grandfather lived to only to early 60s but he had polio 30ish years before and was living with complications so likely would have lived longer. The other two were heart issues (I've heard his diet was not great) and stroke.
I have health shit too so it's a toss up for a long time or not. My plan is to save enough to have a great retirement or have a fucking baller "I'm gone in a year so let's fucking wild out" time.
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on Mar 7, 2022 9:07:40 GMT -5
I made a spreadsheet with retirement scenarios retiring at 62 and taking social security at 62, 67 and 70. I projected my estimated 401K balance at that time and estimated funds needed, so the funds needed - social security payout would be the amount to withdraw from the 401K.
In every scenario, retiring and living off 401k funds to hold off on taking social security resulted in running out of 401K funds well before life expectancy and social security would not be enough to live off. Taking social security even at 62 would cover a good chunk of my expenses and allow me to maintain a 401k balance for the rest of my life expectancy. So, I concluded at least in my case, I need to take social security when I retire and preserve 401k funds as much as possible.
I'm still 10 years away from age 62 and I'm cautiously optimistic I may be able to retire then but it may end up being closer to 65.
I think this is going to differ for different people depending on the monthly income needed, potential social security amount and potential income from 401K.
In general, I think you can conservatively grow 401k funds by a higher amount than social security would increase and it doesn't make sense to draw down your savings to hold off on taking social security.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Mar 7, 2022 9:14:15 GMT -5
My grandmother never worked a day in her life. Her husband died 1951 but had stopped working due to his cancer.
SS started paying in 1942. Grandma drew off his wages until she was 94 in 1989. Yes, it was small, but because of the time in which she lived, it was not going to be large. Grandpa had never received a check because he was too young. She is the only one who drew from his record.
My family has a great deal of longevity. My parents were each over 90 when they died. Now that I am doing genealogy, I am seeing through the generations that barring accidents or dying during child birth, many of my ancestors lived well in to their 80's and 90's. Given the lack of medical care, I find that astounding.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2022 9:28:16 GMT -5
If I need it at 62, I’m going to take it at 62. Planning to try to wait until I’m 70 will mean planning to work past the time I’m eligible to retire and frankly, I don’t see that happening.
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tractor
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Post by tractor on Mar 7, 2022 9:39:30 GMT -5
I never factored it into my retirement plan, so at this point I will wait until I'm at full retirement age and decide then. I don't plan to still be working, because when I hit 62 both my wife and I will have full pensions, along with 401K savings and lifetime health insurance. We are very well structured for retirement. Any SS will be considered extra.
My dad took it at 62 because he had no savings and needed the money. He turns 80 this year and has found a way to survive on the reduced income (mainly due to my financial support). I don't plan to burden my kids like he has.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2022 10:09:49 GMT -5
I never factored it into my retirement plan, so at this point I will wait until I'm at full retirement age and decide then. I don't plan to still be working, because when I hit 62 both my wife and I will have full pensions, along with 401K savings and lifetime health insurance. We are very well structured for retirement. Any SS will be considered extra. My dad took it at 62 because he had no savings and needed the money. He turns 80 this year and has found a way to survive on the reduced income (mainly due to my financial support). I don't plan to burden my kids like he has. My Mom didn’t plan, and has no savings. If she hadn’t destroyed my Grandmother’s house, she would’ve been ok with her SS income, but she also makes bad choices that make her situation worse. Refer back to “destroyed my Grandmother’s house”, plus excessive shopping. If she had more income, she would just make more bad choices. I don’t want to be in a similar situation myself at her age. And like you, I don’t want to cause my children the stress my Mom causes me.
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Mar 7, 2022 10:19:11 GMT -5
I never factored it into my retirement plan, so at this point I will wait until I'm at full retirement age and decide then. I don't plan to still be working, because when I hit 62 both my wife and I will have full pensions, along with 401K savings and lifetime health insurance. We are very well structured for retirement. Any SS will be considered extra. My dad took it at 62 because he had no savings and needed the money. He turns 80 this year and has found a way to survive on the reduced income ( mainly due to my financial support). I don't plan to burden my kids like he has. My son worries that I would dumpster dive rather than ask for financial support. My choices my consequences is the way I live. So far so good
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2022 10:20:10 GMT -5
My family has a great deal of longevity. My parents were each over 90 when they died. Now that I am doing genealogy, I am seeing through the generations that barring accidents or dying during child birth, many of my ancestors lived well in to their 80's and 90's. Given the lack of medical care, I find that astounding. I know- my great-grandmother died at 93. She was shaped like an apple dumpling and never was subjected to all the stuff I do on a regular basis- bloodwork, colonoscopies, mammograms, etc. She did not try to do 10,000 steps per day or ride a bicycle. Family members nearby helped her but she lived in her own house up to a few days before she died, shortly after entering a nursing home. We should all have such great timing.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Mar 7, 2022 10:39:49 GMT -5
Are you going to wait until your full retirement age to collect social security? Later? Are you going to start collecting as soon as you can when you turn 62? I'm late to the game.... My FRA is 67. I'm 58. I do not expect to be working much longer (or will be working some low paying job at some point). I will receive a no cola pension at 65. My best case scenario I take SS at 70. Worse case I take it at 67. I would really like my SS to be as much as possible because SS in conjunction with my pension will give me "guaranteed" (I don't want to say fixed...) income that should cover my basic living expenses expenses at 70. My 401K/other money will become the icing on the cake at that point. I had to "re-write" the way I thought about retirement and how to finance it. I had this idea that 401K money was for AFTER SS and Pension spending. But in my case, I will be spending 401K money early and then cutting back on my reliance on it as my pension kicks in and then perhaps a bit more when SS kicks in. Back in my 40's when I was taking a wild ass guess as to home my retirement would play out - I imagined I would be taking SS at 62 -- as I wouldn't "need" it to be a large amount and because SS "might be providing less income than I expected anyway - might as well get money from it sooner than later". I AM glad I planned around SS maybe not being a whole lot - as it made me save more/pay more attention to my savings.
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seriousthistime
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Post by seriousthistime on Mar 7, 2022 11:20:18 GMT -5
My FRA was 66. I worked up to a month past my 69th birthday. When I retired I got my annual leave payout and waited to collect SS until age 70.
My younger DSis's FRA was 66 and 4 months. She decided to retire at 62 and collect SS amounting to something just slightly north of my monthly grocery budget, a consequence of having worked off the books for a number of years. She now supplements her meager SS by continuing to work off the books. It will not be sustainable as she ages. She won't be able to do what she does when she's 80.
I know at least three people whose decision to work off the books is coming back to bite them in the butt at a time when they are becoming less able to work, either through age or disability. One of them did not even pay into SS for the amount of time needed to qualify for any benefits.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 7, 2022 11:29:22 GMT -5
Our handyman took a job at an apartment complex for a few years to bolster his social security. I don't know how much of his business he put off the books, but I know he did a lot of little side jobs during his bigger jobs, which I suspect were just cash.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2022 11:35:11 GMT -5
I know at least three people whose decision to work off the books is coming back to bite them in the butt at a time when they are becoming less able to work, either through age or disability. One of them did not even pay into SS for the amount of time needed to qualify for any benefits. This is one of the reasons I don't like to hire people who do work around the house "off the books". I figure I'm helping them evade taxes and also enabling them to short-change their retirement income. And of course since they'll end up relying on needs- based social programs when they can no longer work we all end up paying for them. My mother had a friend who was a hairdresser- a couple of marriages less than 10 years, working mostly off the books- and she told Mom she planned to retire at 62 and start collecting SS. Mom had top explain the 40-quarter requirement to her (and also break the news, of course, that paying in for only 40 quarters wouldn't get her much SS).
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seriousthistime
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Post by seriousthistime on Mar 7, 2022 12:11:22 GMT -5
I know at least three people whose decision to work off the books is coming back to bite them in the butt at a time when they are becoming less able to work, either through age or disability. One of them did not even pay into SS for the amount of time needed to qualify for any benefits. This is one of the reasons I don't like to hire people who do work around the house "off the books". I figure I'm helping them evade taxes and also enabling them to short-change their retirement income. And of course since they'll end up relying on needs- based social programs when they can no longer work we all end up paying for them. My mother had a friend who was a hairdresser- a couple of marriages less than 10 years, working mostly off the books- and she told Mom she planned to retire at 62 and start collecting SS. Mom had top explain the 40-quarter requirement to her (and also break the news, of course, that paying in for only 40 quarters wouldn't get her much SS). One of those three people was married to a man 14 years older. He died at age 61. She expected to get surviving spouse benefits on his record but doesn't have minor children at home so will have to wait a good long time before those benefits kick in. I had a house cleaner for a few years, and when I hired him he handed me a business card with a business name, designating himself as "owner" of the business. Before he started we had the discussion about whether he was running his income through a business and paying taxes. He assured me he was. I always paid by check. He frequently mentioned he would take cash. He wasn't doing the best job anyway, so I let him go. The only thing I pay in cash is holiday tips for my hair stylist and so forth.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 7, 2022 12:37:21 GMT -5
The only times we didn't pay by check were quick stop by's 5-15 minute repairs, for $10-30. We've gotten invoices and receipts, and the guy is completely licensed, so it's not the bulk of what he made. But, he also didn't work a full day, just a couple hours in the morning and again in the afternoon (sometimes). So I think he's probably making more now working full-time for someone else.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Mar 7, 2022 15:41:50 GMT -5
I don't like to pay cash for the same reasons. I know the people are not going to pay SS on it as well as income tax. They need to have some kind of retirement and most of the people that want cash only seem to live pay check to pay check already.
I do give my cleaning lady her Christmas bonus in cash. I don't consider that income to her.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2022 16:58:29 GMT -5
Someone age 65 can expect to live 17 years on average. There is a significant number of people who live to 90. People underestimate their life expectancy The other thing many people don't consider is the U-shaped spending curve in retirement. They may get SS early "while I'm young enough to enjoy it", but being married to a man 15 years older showed me the importance of having enough money to have a high-quality old age. Medicare doesn't cover dental care, new glasses or hearing aids, except for some limited coverage in Medicare Advantage plans. Hearing aids and well-fitting dentures may paint a gloomy picture but try living life without them when you need them. (And decent dental care means you can eat a more nutritious diet.) At some point you may not want to mow your lawn or clean your house or do some of the more strenuous DIY things you did before. We were fortunate to be able to enjoy travel up to the year before DH died but flew Business Class in long hauls, took private transport to and from the airport so we didn't have to struggle with luggage on public transportation, got hotels close to subway stops, etc. Even if you just stay home, you may want more services such as grocery delivery to reduce wear and tear. I'm now 69 and have only some cardiac insufficiency but I can see the day coming when I'll be hiring out cleaning and lawn care. I'm fighting it. A comfortable old age is not cheap.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Mar 7, 2022 17:09:47 GMT -5
Someone age 65 can expect to live 17 years on average. There is a significant number of people who live to 90. People underestimate their life expectancy The other thing many people don't consider is the U-shaped spending curve in retirement. They may get SS early "while I'm young enough to enjoy it", but being married to a man 15 years older showed me the importance of having enough money to have a high-quality old age. Medicare doesn't cover dental care, new glasses or hearing aids, except for some limited coverage in Medicare Advantage plans. Hearing aids and well-fitting dentures may paint a gloomy picture but try living life without them when you need them. (And decent dental care means you can eat a more nutritious diet.) At some point you may not want to mow your lawn or clean your house or do some of the more strenuous DIY things you did before. We were fortunate to be able to enjoy travel up to the year before DH died but flew Business Class in long hauls, took private transport to and from the airport so we didn't have to struggle with luggage on public transportation, got hotels close to subway stops, etc. Even if you just stay home, you may want more services such as grocery delivery to reduce wear and tear. I'm now 69 and have only some cardiac insufficiency but I can see the day coming when I'll be hiring out cleaning and lawn care. I'm fighting it. A comfortable old age is not cheap. Very true. People make decisions without considering what being old, old means. Having resources then gives you options. Delaying SS can mean many thousands a year more when you are in your 80s, with a yearly increase built in. By delaying SS, you get a guaranteed 8% ROI. Where else are you getting that risk free. If what is happening now isn't a sobering reminder of investment risk, I do not know what is. The projections my advisor is using for our planning is a 6% ROI until retirement, then 4%, just to be on the more conservative side. 8% guaranteed is a no lose proposition.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2022 17:13:15 GMT -5
Someone age 65 can expect to live 17 years on average. There is a significant number of people who live to 90. People underestimate their life expectancy The other thing many people don't consider is the U-shaped spending curve in retirement. They may get SS early "while I'm young enough to enjoy it", but being married to a man 15 years older showed me the importance of having enough money to have a high-quality old age. Medicare doesn't cover dental care, new glasses or hearing aids, except for some limited coverage in Medicare Advantage plans. Hearing aids and well-fitting dentures may paint a gloomy picture but try living life without them when you need them. (And decent dental care means you can eat a more nutritious diet.) At some point you may not want to mow your lawn or clean your house or do some of the more strenuous DIY things you did before. We were fortunate to be able to enjoy travel up to the year before DH died but flew Business Class in long hauls, took private transport to and from the airport so we didn't have to struggle with luggage on public transportation, got hotels close to subway stops, etc. Even if you just stay home, you may want more services such as grocery delivery to reduce wear and tear. I'm now 69 and have only some cardiac insufficiency but I can see the day coming when I'll be hiring out cleaning and lawn care. I'm fighting it. A comfortable old age is not cheap.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Mar 7, 2022 18:40:12 GMT -5
My family has a great deal of longevity. My parents were each over 90 when they died. Now that I am doing genealogy, I am seeing through the generations that barring accidents or dying during child birth, many of my ancestors lived well in to their 80's and 90's. Given the lack of medical care, I find that astounding. I know- my great-grandmother died at 93. She was shaped like an apple dumpling and never was subjected to all the stuff I do on a regular basis- bloodwork, colonoscopies, mammograms, etc. She did not try to do 10,000 steps per day or ride a bicycle. Family members nearby helped her but she lived in her own house up to a few days before she died, shortly after entering a nursing home. We should all have such great timing. My grandmother gave birth at home with her sister as her midwife to 12 children in 15 years. She never saw a doctor during those pregnancies. She never had any kind of routine treatments either. Both of my grandmas were about the same height and weight. Both had pudgy stomachs from having all of those babies. The grandma who lived to 89 lost a lot of weight in her last years. She was very lucky in that one of her sons, who never married, provided a home for her from the time she lost her husband. At some point she had some procedure that I was told was to fix her "woman" parts because of having all of those babies. I was too young to ask any questions. She died in a hospital and never spent one day in a nursing home. Knowing now what I now about caring for the elderly, I believe my uncle was a saint and his siblings didn't realize it. She was also very lucky to live in a small town where the doctor made house calls about the last 5 years of her life. When she was hospitalized, he had all of them come to the hospital to meet with the doctor to decide how to treat her. He could have made those decisions himself but he didn't. He included the other siblings. The doctor said during that last hospital stay that she had colon cancer but she was so weak that even if she recovered from the illness that killed her, he would not have recommended treating her.
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Mar 7, 2022 19:47:37 GMT -5
I know- my great-grandmother died at 93. She was shaped like an apple dumpling and never was subjected to all the stuff I do on a regular basis- bloodwork, colonoscopies, mammograms, etc. She did not try to do 10,000 steps per day or ride a bicycle. Family members nearby helped her but she lived in her own house up to a few days before she died, shortly after entering a nursing home. We should all have such great timing. My grandmother gave birth at home with her sister as her midwife to 12 children in 15 years. She never saw a doctor during those pregnancies. She never had any kind of routine treatments either. Both of my grandmas were about the same height and weight. Both had pudgy stomachs from having all of those babies. The grandma who lived to 89 lost a lot of weight in her last years. She was very lucky in that one of her sons, who never married, provided a home for her from the time she lost her husband. At some point she had some procedure that I was told was to fix her "woman" parts because of having all of those babies. I was too young to ask any questions. She died in a hospital and never spent one day in a nursing home. Knowing now what I now about caring for the elderly, I believe my uncle was a saint and his siblings didn't realize it. She was also very lucky to live in a small town where the doctor made house calls about the last 5 years of her life. When she was hospitalized, he had all of them come to the hospital to meet with the doctor to decide how to treat her. He could have made those decisions himself but he didn't. He included the other siblings. The doctor said during that last hospital stay that she had colon cancer but she was so weak that even if she recovered from the illness that killed her, he would not have recommended treating her. I know when and how my father and mother died. And I only know of two procedures/surgeries that my mother had and one was elective. I know zilch about their family history. Beyond that I have absolutely no clue as to medical history on either side! Don’t know if that’s a blessing or a curse. I do know I am not predisposed to fathers cause of death though!
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Mar 7, 2022 21:11:55 GMT -5
It also depends on what years are going to be included. I think my highest earning year drops off this year if it hasn't already. I'm concerned my SS will be wicked low because of the jobs I've had in the last decade or so. My IT jobs won't be included if I wait until 67. (I think full retirement is 67 for my year.) I think that used to matter but doesn't any longer. The Social Security Administration adds up inflation-adjusted wages for the 35 years you earned the most, divides by 35 to get your average annual wage, then divides by 12 to get your average monthly wage.link Excellent explanation of SS formulas in that link, very thorough. I'm planning to have DH (higher earner) wait to 70 to take SS. Our FRA is 67, so waiting to 70 increases it to 124%. Taking it at 62 reduces it by 30%, IOW we'd get only 70% of our baseline FRA benefits. Putting numbers to this: if we'd get $2k/month at FRA, that's only $1400/month at 62, or $2480/month at 70. Open Social Security is a good resource to explore the optimal time to claim.
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Mar 7, 2022 21:16:55 GMT -5
I'll likely take it at 62, but will depend on a lot of other things - stock market,, etc.
could be a nice hedge to let it build up a bit. but I might need the hedge at 62.
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Mar 7, 2022 21:44:04 GMT -5
My father died at 96, my mother is 98, and still living pretty independently. Looking at 99 later this year. She's still in the family homestead and we visit her often to do chores, and she has a cleaning person.
She had a stroke 3ish years ago and refused to tell anyone, just acted weird and avoided communication. Finally insisted and we hauled her to the hospital and insisted they test her for stroke and I remember the doctor being unconvinced she'd had a stroke. she was having a very hard time talking, couldn't get the words she wanted, doctor said she was getting old, etc. etc. but yes, she'd had a stroke. She was in hospital for a few weeks, rehab 2-3 weeks, and then back home with outpatient rehab for a while. Made a full recovery, now she is learning spanish, doing her physical therapy everyday.
I guess I better plan a long one?
maybe I will regress to the mean....
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Mar 7, 2022 21:48:04 GMT -5
My grandmother gave birth at home with her sister as her midwife to 12 children in 15 years. She never saw a doctor during those pregnancies. She never had any kind of routine treatments either. Both of my grandmas were about the same height and weight. Both had pudgy stomachs from having all of those babies. The grandma who lived to 89 lost a lot of weight in her last years. She was very lucky in that one of her sons, who never married, provided a home for her from the time she lost her husband. At some point she had some procedure that I was told was to fix her "woman" parts because of having all of those babies. I was too young to ask any questions. She died in a hospital and never spent one day in a nursing home. Knowing now what I now about caring for the elderly, I believe my uncle was a saint and his siblings didn't realize it. She was also very lucky to live in a small town where the doctor made house calls about the last 5 years of her life. When she was hospitalized, he had all of them come to the hospital to meet with the doctor to decide how to treat her. He could have made those decisions himself but he didn't. He included the other siblings. The doctor said during that last hospital stay that she had colon cancer but she was so weak that even if she recovered from the illness that killed her, he would not have recommended treating her. I know when and how my father and mother died. And I only know of two procedures/surgeries that my mother had and one was elective. I know zilch about their family history. Beyond that I have absolutely no clue as to medical history on either side! Don’t know if that’s a blessing or a curse. I do know I am not predisposed to fathers cause of death though! I know my grandfather died at a younger age than I am right now of colon cancer. It's definitely in our family. I was diagnosed in 1999 and I am still here. I was 48 so had never had a colonoscopy. Three of his children have died from it. I have a 2nd cousin who is younger than 40 who has Stage 4 colon cancer and has been told there is nothing more that can be done for her. It's definitely in my dad's side of the family but do you think I can get my sister to have a colonoscopy. Nope, not doing that. That is what my uncle said so by the time it was caught it was way too late to do anything but prolong his life.
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susana1954
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Post by susana1954 on Mar 7, 2022 21:55:34 GMT -5
I started mine when I was 65 years and 10 months. FRA was 66 for me, but there was no point in waiting. My survivor benefit from my husband would be greater than my benefit at 70, and his health was so bad. As it was, he died the month I received my first check.
I only waited that long because I was still working.
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stillmovingforward
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Post by stillmovingforward on Mar 8, 2022 22:52:10 GMT -5
DH will be, hopefully, taking his at 67 as we're hoping he ends up on a L&I pension until then. I'll take mine at, hopefully, 67 as I carry the medical and can't get Medicare until 65.5. At that point, I might a well work that lady 1.5 years. My good health depends on good medical so it pays to wait.
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jeffreymo
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Post by jeffreymo on Mar 13, 2022 10:14:32 GMT -5
I’ll probably take it at 67. Wife will take hers a year after that for a slight bump to our total benefit. Neither of my grandfathers made it past 67. My dad is now 78.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Mar 13, 2022 23:05:12 GMT -5
I took it at 62. Have Diabetes II wasn’t sure about getting to that break even point. Plus studied the time value theory of money in biz school.. a bird in the hand approach. So I saved it up for 15 months and used it to remodel our basement into a MIL. That has now been rented 54 months in a row for $1295. Just about pays the everything it takes to live in our F&C home. We literally make $15k+ to have downsized without moving. This allows Donnadub to go to age 70 and max out.
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