Opti
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Post by Opti on Nov 19, 2021 11:15:29 GMT -5
Hasn't happened yet, but I think it deserves its own thread. I looked it up, the deliberations in Zimmerman's trial was 16 hours by six jurors. This trial has twelve jurors. www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/no-verdict-yet-in-rittenhouse-trial-after-over-20-hours-of-deliberations/ar-AAQUcAV?ocid=uxbndlbingDay four of deliberations in the Kyle Rittenhouse trial is set to begin on Friday as jurors have yet to reach a verdict in the case. Jurors have spent approximately 23 hours deliberating over the past three days.
Defense attorney Mark Richards said this is the longest deliberation he has ever had in his career as a defense trial attorney, CBS Chicago reports. When asked what he thinks is going on in the jury room, he noted that jurors were sitting in two groups of six — leading to speculation there may be a split.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Nov 19, 2021 13:14:44 GMT -5
NOT GUILTY!!!
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Nov 19, 2021 13:15:00 GMT -5
Not guilty on all 5 counts.
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daisylu
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Post by daisylu on Nov 19, 2021 13:20:27 GMT -5
I'd like to say I'm surprised. 🤬
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Nov 19, 2021 13:35:21 GMT -5
I'd like to say I'm surprised. 🤬 ☝exactly that.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Nov 19, 2021 13:41:33 GMT -5
Not surprised. The judge telegraphed the verdict last Friday by dropping the gun charges.
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hurley1980
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Post by hurley1980 on Nov 19, 2021 13:41:51 GMT -5
Nothing?!?! Not guilty of ANYTHING?!?!?! What absolute BS. White privilege wins again
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kadee79
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S.W. Ga., zone 8b, out in the boonies!
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Post by kadee79 on Nov 19, 2021 13:48:23 GMT -5
He "may" be dead before the end of next week if some folks do what they said would happen!
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Nov 19, 2021 14:03:58 GMT -5
Of all charges. Just saw a pop up headline. Anyone surprised? I think he got what that judge worked very hard to achieve
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Nov 19, 2021 14:33:51 GMT -5
Nothing?!?! Not guilty of ANYTHING?!?!?! What absolute BS. White privilege wins again Exactly!
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Nov 19, 2021 14:51:30 GMT -5
It is good to be a white guy in America. Especially if you are carrying a gun.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Nov 19, 2021 15:09:00 GMT -5
I feel like there is a terrible precedence being set here. I feel like we're going to see a lot more of these in the future.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Nov 19, 2021 15:16:15 GMT -5
I feel like there is a terrible precedence being set here. I feel like we're going to see a lot more of these in the future. Correct. Apparently I can walk down a street in my small town, and if someone looks at me funny, blow him away, and if someone else tries to stop me, I shoot them too, if they scare me. And I’m white.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Nov 19, 2021 15:16:19 GMT -5
It is good to be a white guy in America. Especially if you are carrying a gun. Is it? I count 2 dead white guys and one injured. I think its a relief for all the white conservatives who love self defense and stand your ground laws. I think if you are a white person who supports something other than whitish conservative causes, you might want to re-evaluate your risks around white people obviously carrying guns anywhere, but especially at any protest. Jump kick guy isn't part of the tally only because those shots missed him.
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daisylu
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Post by daisylu on Nov 19, 2021 15:19:36 GMT -5
He "may" be dead before the end of next week if some folks do what they said would happen! I doubt it. I would bet he is going to be heavily guarded for a while. I am glad I live in the boonies.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Nov 19, 2021 15:20:31 GMT -5
I feel like there is a terrible precedence being set here. I feel like we're going to see a lot more of these in the future. Unfortunately this isn't the precedent. In this case Kyle getting convicted would have been setting a precedent.
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mollyc
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Post by mollyc on Nov 19, 2021 15:28:08 GMT -5
Sadly not a surprise. He's been treated like a poor widdle baby since after his first shot. I wonder if things would have gone differently if he didn't have such a baby face.
I wish I believed in ghosts because he definitely needs some sort of consequence or, like that other asshole that got away with murdering someone over a fight he started, he'll just keep doing shit and feeling justified.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Nov 19, 2021 15:48:53 GMT -5
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Nov 19, 2021 15:50:12 GMT -5
I wonder if this will change the conviction rate for women who have killed their abuser? Like none of them will be convicted going forward. Or do only men get to kill in self defense? Almost there. Only white male conservatives get this treatment.
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hurley1980
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Post by hurley1980 on Nov 19, 2021 16:07:42 GMT -5
Sadly not a surprise. He's been treated like a poor widdle baby since after his first shot. I wonder if things would have gone differently if he didn't have such a baby face.I wish I believed in ghosts because he definitely needs some sort of consequence or, like that other asshole that got away with murdering someone over a fight he started, he'll just keep doing shit and feeling justified. I've wondered if his age has helped him a lot (along with being white and middle class). If he was a 40 year old poor or homeless man (even still being white), he probably would have been charged with something. If he was a 40 year old black man, he wouldn't be alive to go to court.
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ken a.k.a OMK
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Post by ken a.k.a OMK on Nov 19, 2021 16:11:59 GMT -5
I'm not surprised. I hope that judge never hears another case.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Nov 19, 2021 16:37:30 GMT -5
I'm not surprised. I hope that judge never hears another case. He will. This is what "systemic racism" means. He's the racist (one of many really) that the current system puts in place to take care of all their boys.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 19, 2021 18:06:39 GMT -5
The Rittenhouse Trial Could Never Have Been What Americans Wanted
A jury has found Kyle Rittenhouse, the teenager who shot three men during protests in Kenosha, Wisconsin, in the summer of 2020, not guilty of the charges against him. Jurors deliberated for more than three days before delivering the verdict this afternoon, accepting his attorneys’ argument that Rittenhouse was acting in self-defense. The trial was inevitably a media circus, spurring intense criticism of the judge and prosecutors from commentators across the political spectrum. Much of that attention offered little insight, and sidestepped the point. The predicament of the Rittenhouse trial was that it could never do what many Americans, especially on the left, wanted. It couldn’t produce a plain answer as to whether Rittenhouse was a hero or a villain. It couldn’t say something about the state of race relations in America. The jury could never have rendered a yea-or-nay verdict on the saturation of guns in American society. These are political matters, not judicial ones. The trial itself turned on narrow and prosaic questions: Beyond a reasonable doubt, did Rittenhouse commit homicide or reckless homicide and recklessly endanger people? During the trial, the judge also dismissed two misdemeanor charges, for breaking curfew and unlawfully possessing a dangerous weapon while younger than 18, citing errors by prosecutors. Ultimately, the not-guilty verdict means simply that Rittenhouse’s self-defense argument was convincing to the jurors. From the start, the events that led to Rittenhouse fatally shooting Joseph Rosenbaum and Anthony Huber, and injuring Gaige Grosskreutz, are incomprehensible without considering the role of race in how things unfolded. The shootings occurred during protests after a white police officer shot Jacob Blake, a Black man, on August 23, 2020. The United States was already in the midst of huge protests following the May murder of George Floyd by a white Minneapolis police officer. But the case could never serve as a plain assessment of race in America, in part because the three men Rittenhouse shot were all white. The most striking element of Rittenhouse’s experience, and one of the reasons it became such a focal point for national attention, was the way he was treated by police. Rittenhouse was 17 when he self-deployed to the streets of Kenosha, not far from his home in Illinois, carrying an AR-style rifle. Just a few minutes before he shot the three men, footage showed police greeting Rittenhouse and giving him a bottle of water. After the shooting, he then went home, where his mother persuaded him to turn himself in. At the police station, detectives cut off his interview when he plainly did not understand Miranda rights. As many commentators have pointed out, a young Black man in the same situation would almost certainly not have been afforded all—or perhaps any—of these indulgences. The Second Amendment may be written in a race-neutral way, but in practice Black Americans do not have the same rights that their white compatriots do. A Black boy might never have had the audacity to go to protests with a rifle on his back. If he had, he almost certainly wouldn’t have been able to waltz past friendly police, turn himself in on his own timeline, and have his rights so carefully protected. But this injustice was outside the scope of the trial. Racially disparate enforcement is a travesty of justice, but undue clemency is not a crime. Neither the police nor our hypothetical Black counterpart were on trial. Or set aside questions of race. Outside the bounds of a polarized court case, most Americans would likely agree that untrained 17-year-olds armed with high-powered rifles should not be appointing themselves property defenders and stationing themselves on the streets of cities in the midst of tense protests. A group of conservatives, largely of the MAGA variety, have chosen to make Rittenhouse into a hero. That’s disgraceful, and not merely because much of the effort has been shameless profiteering. Rittenhouse’s choices during the summer of 2020 aren’t something that anyone should emulate. Even if you are more sympathetic—if, for example, you found yourself moved by Rittenhouse’s apparent breakdown on the witness stand during his trial—you should object to the commodification of the worst moment in a teenager’s life. Complete article here: The Rittenhouse Trial Could Never Have Been What Americans Wanted
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Nov 19, 2021 19:05:08 GMT -5
I feel like there is a terrible precedence being set here. I feel like we're going to see a lot more of these in the future. Correct. Apparently I can walk down a street in my small town, and if someone looks at me funny, blow him away, and if someone else tries to stop me, I shoot them too, if they scare me. And I’m white. As a white woman I would not expect to stay free doing the above in my area or areas I have lived. I think this case and the Zimmerman one has a backdrop belief system of men defending a town or a place to live, get a big dose of self defense leeway.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2021 19:30:27 GMT -5
I expected him to be found not guilty, but I’m still at a loss for words.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Nov 19, 2021 21:23:49 GMT -5
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 19, 2021 21:45:10 GMT -5
Of all charges. Just saw a pop up headline. Anyone surprised? I think he got what that judge worked very hard to achieve of course I am surprised. but only because I think that being afraid doesn't entitle you to kill someone. it is weird that the law doesn't work that way here. weird and dangerous. because anyone can be afraid of anything at any time. therefore nobody is safe, and can be murdered for any reason, including a thousand you wouldn't even think of.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Nov 19, 2021 22:33:36 GMT -5
I think like you posted earlier, the self defense defense is very much situational. And influenced by sex, gender, race, and other perceptions.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2021 0:15:21 GMT -5
Absolutely not guilty, charges should have never been bought forth in the first place. Going to be a rich man after all defamation lawsuits are done.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Nov 20, 2021 7:22:57 GMT -5
So you are allowed:
To bring an illegal gun across state lines Go to a volatile situation with said illegal gun Get into an altercation with someone and shoot them And then shoot others who take him for an active shooter and try to counter that.
That is a reasonable interpretation of the situation.
Question: if the police arrived on the scene and took him for an active shooter, would the police have committed murder? If you think everything he did Is justified, then that should be the conclusion. If you think otherwise, how do we know who the good guys and bad guys are in any situation? Am I allowed to shoot anyone if I put myself into a situation that makes me fearful? Welcome to the Wild West of America, circa 2021
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