Let’s Talk Numbers…..

[Deleted]

Say a person’s base yearly income is $65k, ~$5400/month gross. 

Their only debt is a mortgage payment of $750/month PITI, but they receive $800/month in rent. Besides maintenance and repairs, the only other regular cost for that house is $120/month for lawn care during the growing seasons. Mortgage is scheduled to end in 10 years if it’s not prepaid.

Car is 18yo, in good shape despite the age, but realistically speaking, will have to be replaced at some point.

No consumer loans or credit card debt.

Will retire hopefully in about 8 years, with a pension equal to 30% of their high 3 years, which will almost certainly be more than the current base salary. This person kind of prefers that the mortgage is paid off before retirement, but wonders if they can make it work if it’s not.

Will also receive SS, for whatever that will be worth at the time.

Will also have money in TSP (similar to a 401k) at retirement. Employer matches contributions up to 5% of salary. Currently saving 15%, plus 5% from employer. Prefer not to disclose the balance, because of prior mistakes. It is 6 figures, but not even close to what it should/could be.

Recurring household bills where this person currently lives are $500-$600/month for cable, internet and utilities. Someone else pays the mortgage and for maintenance and repairs. Groceries and household supplies are paid for by whoever goes shopping for them, no particular “system”. There is a joint savings account “for the house” that both parties contribute equally to, but it’s rarely used, for no particular reason.

Health, vision and dental insurance total ~$170/month.

Car insurance is ~$20/month, paid every 6 months. Regularly drives another, newer vehicle, but someone else pays the insurance on that vehicle.

Cell phone bill is ~$120/month (includes interest free payments on an IPad).

How much do you think is a reasonable goal for the TSP account at retirement? All of the money in there is pre tax. How much should be saved after tax? The TSP offers a Roth, but I don’t really understand Roth’s and whether or not that is a good option. Please don’t flame me for my ignorance, teach me instead.

There is a little money here and a little money there, in savings accounts, but the bulk of the money this person has is in their TSP account. One savings account is for irregular expenses, saving to spend. Another is an EF. But all of the savings accounts together are still a fraction of the TSP account.

With the information I’ve provided, what would your budget look like? Please bear in mind that “fuck off” money must be included in the budget, as that is this person’s main (sometimes only!) motivation for going to work every day, to have some money to spend on random shit if they want.

[giramomma]

Is the person retiring at 65?

[Deleted]

Oct 18, 2021 15:55:57 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Is the person retiring at 65?

No, hopefully at 58 or 59.

Their employer offers some kind of SS supplement that they can get until they actually qualify for SS. I don’t know the details though, or if it’s equal to what they would receive from SS once they are eligible. I do know for sure that the “supplement” is real though.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Oct 18, 2021 16:03:19 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Oct 18, 2021 15:55:57 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Is the person retiring at 65?

No, hopefully at 58 or 59.

Their employer offers some kind of SS supplement that they can get until they actually qualify for SS. I don’t know the details though, or if it’s equal to what they would receive from SS once they are eligible. I do know for sure that the “supplement” is real though.

Health insurance?

[giramomma]

Oct 18, 2021 16:11:33 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Oct 18, 2021 16:03:19 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

No, hopefully at 58 or 59.

Their employer offers some kind of SS supplement that they can get until they actually qualify for SS. I don’t know the details though, or if it’s equal to what they would receive from SS once they are eligible. I do know for sure that the “supplement” is real though.

Health insurance?

Yes. That would be my bigger concern.

I would also want to know if medicare will be enough to cover any health related issues that crop up when the person ages...I'm talking late 70s, 80s, etc. While I know there are spry people in this world, my experience is that someone living until they are 90 with no health issues, and then one day just passing away in their sleep is pretty rare. There is no one in my family or DH's like that. I'm exposed/have been exposed to a fair amount of people, and I can think of two that would qualify. One was our neighbhor and the other is a family friend.

[Deleted]

Oct 18, 2021 16:11:33 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Oct 18, 2021 16:03:19 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

No, hopefully at 58 or 59.

Their employer offers some kind of SS supplement that they can get until they actually qualify for SS. I don’t know the details though, or if it’s equal to what they would receive from SS once they are eligible. I do know for sure that the “supplement” is real though.

Health insurance?

Health insurance will have the same premiums and plans as if the person was still employed.

Like I said earlier, that is ~$170/month now, for health, dental and vision insurance. Would be the same costs for a retiree. The health insurance currently has a $300 deductible and $6k OOP max. There are several insurers and plans to choose from, even in retirement.

And at least one of those plans offers something or another that works with Medicare and enhances benefits at no extra costs, plus reimburses $75 of the Medicare part B premiums monthly. I don’t understand Medicare at all, so please don’t ask a bunch of questions, because I probably won’t know the answer. All I know for sure is what I stated here, which sounds like a good thing to me. If it’s not, please explain why.

[Deleted]

Oct 18, 2021 16:16:59 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Oct 18, 2021 16:11:33 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Health insurance?

Yes. That would be my bigger concern.

I would also want to know if medicare will be enough to cover any health related issues that crop up when the person ages...I'm talking late 70s, 80s, etc. While I know there are spry people in this world, my experience is that someone living until they are 90 with no health issues, and then one day just passing away in their sleep is pretty rare. There is no one in my family or DH's like that. I'm exposed/have been exposed to a fair amount of people, and I can think of two that would qualify. One was our neighbhor and the other is a family friend.

When I work my side gig, I work with a few people that retired from federal employment at different ages and I’m a federal employee. The ones that talk openly, carried their health insurance benefits into retirement, and coupled with Medicare, they have virtually no OOP expenses. But the fact they they still work, means (to me) that they are fairly healthy in the first place. Idk what it would be like for someone that has serious chronic conditions or a lot of health issues.

But I’m pretty sure the insurance from their job doesn’t hurt. Or am I missing something?

[buystoys]

Health insurance from the job definitely helps.  ACA plans aren't cheap and, in my area anyway, don't have good coverage.

I'd play around with FIRECalc.com and i-Orp.com and start throwing some numbers around.  I calculated our annual expenses, subtracted DH's annual pension and subtracted SS at 60% since that was worse than anything we had seen or heard at the time.  We then shot fot 25X expenses.  I played around with those numbers with the planners to see what our "safe" withdrawal could be.  As it worked out, we both are on SSDI and getting 100% of our benefit right now.  We don't spend as much as we could as we are also self insured for long term care.

I'd start putting money into your Roth that's available.  You can access those funds before you're 59.5 without penalty and you may need to use them if you retire before 65. 

[Deleted]

Oct 18, 2021 17:00:46 GMT -5 buystoys said:

Health insurance from the job definitely helps.  ACA plans aren't cheap and, in my area anyway, don't have good coverage.

I'd play around with FIRECalc.com and i-Orp.com and start throwing some numbers around.  I calculated our annual expenses, subtracted DH's annual pension and subtracted SS at 60% since that was worse than anything we had seen or heard at the time.  We then shot fot 25X expenses.  I played around with those numbers with the planners to see what our "safe" withdrawal could be.  As it worked out, we both are on SSDI and getting 100% of our benefit right now.  We don't spend as much as we could as we are also self insured for long term care.

I'd start putting money into your Roth that's available.  You can access those funds before you're 59.5 without penalty and you may need to use them if you retire before 65. 

Do you mean the Roth available through the TSP? 

I can’t bear the thought of working until I’m 65yo. Idc if I have to eat bologna and crackers for the rest of my life, I just can’t. And if I knew now that I’ll have to, regardless, I swear I would just quit my job tomorrow. SHIIIIIT, I’d just call whoever is in charge of the shift right now and tell them “FUUUUCK you, I FUCKING QUIT!!!!”

Just thinking about it is REALLY stressing me out and making me sorry I even started this thread.

All I want is somebody to tell me how much I need in my TSP account to retire, or what they think their budget would look like, with the info I’ve shared.

This was supposed to be a “somebody I know is going through this”, but this post has upset my nerves talking about working until I’m 65yo……… and I’ve had a couple of adult beverages (and am ready for a refill DON’T JUDGE ME!).

I want to bury my head back in the sand, but I feel like this is too important, and I need y’all’s help.

[azucena]

If you have 8 yrs left, you can roughly expect that retirement acct to double. That will help make up for prior mistakes. We all have them so cut yourself some slack.

You might consider pushing your 15% to 20% to really gain momentum.

What's the sig other situation for retirement? If he's ahead of the game, can you lean on that and contribute less to household accounts with the excuse of shoring up your retirement?

[Lizard Queen]

Please don't get upset. At first glance, it appears okay. Let's say the pension will be $2000/month. How much more than that do you think you may need?

Roth simply means post tax. You pay the tax now so you don't have to later.

[Deleted]

Oct 18, 2021 18:14:55 GMT -5 azucena said:

If you have 8 yrs left, you can roughly expect that retirement acct to double. That will help make up for prior mistakes. We all have them so cut yourself some slack.

You might consider pushing your 15% to 20% to really gain momentum.

What's the sig other situation for retirement? If he's ahead of the game, can you lean on that and contribute less to household accounts with the excuse of shoring up your retirement?

I’ve been considering increasing the 15% to 20% but I’m not sure where to put it.

Mister doesn’t care what bills I do pay, or whether I pay any at all. I feel like I live pretty good for my $500 or $600 contribution to the household. I pay those 2 because I want control over them (I don’t want to fight with Mister about me leaving lights on, even though I usually don’t….. or cranking the heat up when I’m cold…… (which happens less frequently lately because…… I’m getting old ) and because I feel like any adult should contribute SOMETHING toward where they lay their head at night. 

Anywayyyyy…… trying to pay even less toward the household I live in, doesn’t feel right.

His income is more than mine, but so are his expenses. I don’t want to be a mooch and live off of him, even if it would help me pad my retirement accounts.

He’s younger than me, and his retirement benefits aren’t as good as mine., But I’d still like for him to have the OPTION to retire ASAP. So as much as my own retirement is my priority, I don’t want him to get screwed either.

[Deleted]

I'd back into it a different way.

What do you think you'll need to spend in retirement? What income do you anticipate? The assets you need to fund any shortfall should be the shortfall X 25. (4% is considered a safe withdrawal rate.) This al ignires inflation and your future contributions and investment income but it's a start. Azucena hit the nail on the head- my retirement assets did double in the 8 years before I retired! That included a really generous employer 401(k) match (6% on the first 6% I put in plus another 6% just because I joined the company after they terminated their pension plan).

You do need your estimated spending in retirement to allow for the occasional "oh, crap" expenses. They can include:

1. Out-of-pocket medical including deductibles, especially if you have a high-deductible plan, as well as dental and hearing aids, both of which can get expensive. (Vision is pretty cheap if you buy your glasses on-line from Zenni.) Also, if you're counting on retiree health insurance before Medicare, consider the possibility it can be reduced or eliminated unless it's covered by a union contract. My brother and SIL ended up paying $22K/month for ACA coverage when his employer abruptly took it away. Both finally got on Medicare in the last year.

2. Major home maintenance- exterior painting, new HVAC, new roof.

3. Car replacement.

I think a lot of people do just fine in retirement and then they encounter one of the above and realize they don't have the funds.

[Rukh O'Rorke]

Oct 18, 2021 18:04:40 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Oct 18, 2021 17:00:46 GMT -5 buystoys said:

Health insurance from the job definitely helps.  ACA plans aren't cheap and, in my area anyway, don't have good coverage.

I'd play around with FIRECalc.com and i-Orp.com and start throwing some numbers around.  I calculated our annual expenses, subtracted DH's annual pension and subtracted SS at 60% since that was worse than anything we had seen or heard at the time.  We then shot fot 25X expenses.  I played around with those numbers with the planners to see what our "safe" withdrawal could be.  As it worked out, we both are on SSDI and getting 100% of our benefit right now.  We don't spend as much as we could as we are also self insured for long term care.

I'd start putting money into your Roth that's available.  You can access those funds before you're 59.5 without penalty and you may need to use them if you retire before 65. 

Do you mean the Roth available through the TSP? 

I can’t bear the thought of working until I’m 65yo. Idc if I have to eat bologna and crackers for the rest of my life, I just can’t. And if I knew now that I’ll have to, regardless, I swear I would just quit my job tomorrow. SHIIIIIT, I’d just call whoever is in charge of the shift right now and tell them “FUUUUCK you, I FUCKING QUIT!!!!”

Just thinking about it is REALLY stressing me out and making me sorry I even started this thread.

All I want is somebody to tell me how much I need in my TSP account to retire, or what they think their budget would look like, with the info I’ve shared.

This was supposed to be a “somebody I know is going through this”, but this post has upset my nerves talking about working until I’m 65yo……… and I’ve had a couple of adult beverages (and am ready for a refill DON’T JUDGE ME!).

I want to bury my head back in the sand, but I feel like this is too important, and I need y’all’s help.

Bologna and crackers isn’t so cheap, how about lentil soup?

Can have with bologna and crackers…

[Rukh O'Rorke]

I want to know what the mistakes were??

Not contributing?


Withdrawing for hookers and blow?


Speculative investments?

[CCL]

Oct 18, 2021 16:03:19 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Oct 18, 2021 15:55:57 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Is the person retiring at 65?

No, hopefully at 58 or 59.

Their employer offers some kind of SS supplement that they can get until they actually qualify for SS. I don’t know the details though, or if it’s equal to what they would receive from SS once they are eligible. I do know for sure that the “supplement” is real though.

Hubby retired with a "supplement." The day he turned 62 they took it away. His was very close to what his SS turned out to be. We considered waiting to collect SS, but felt we were better off getting the payments right away rather than drain the 401k to pay the bills.

[CCL]

Oct 18, 2021 19:15:53 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

I'd back into it a different way.

What do you think you'll need to spend in retirement? What income do you anticipate? The assets you need to fund any shortfall should be the shortfall X 25. (4% is considered a safe withdrawal rate.) This al ignires inflation and your future contributions and investment income but it's a start. Azucena hit the nail on the head- my retirement assets did double in the 8 years before I retired! That included a really generous employer 401(k) match (6% on the first 6% I put in plus another 6% just because I joined the company after they terminated their pension plan).

You do need your estimated spending in retirement to allow for the occasional "oh, crap" expenses. They can include:

1. Out-of-pocket medical including deductibles, especially if you have a high-deductible plan, as well as dental and hearing aids, both of which can get expensive. (Vision is pretty cheap if you buy your glasses on-line from Zenni.) Also, if you're counting on retiree health insurance before Medicare, consider the possibility it can be reduced or eliminated unless it's covered by a union contract. My brother and SIL ended up paying $22K/month for ACA coverage when his employer abruptly took it away. Both finally got on Medicare in the last year.

2. Major home maintenance- exterior painting, new HVAC, new roof.

3. Car replacement.

I think a lot of people do just fine in retirement and then they encounter one of the above and realize they don't have the funds.

$22k per month for ACA coverage? Or did you mean $2200 per month? Either way, that's pretty steep. There's no way we could afford that.

[Deleted]

Oct 18, 2021 19:39:52 GMT -5 Rukh O'Rorke said:

I want to know what the mistakes were??

Not contributing?


Withdrawing for hookers and blow?


Speculative investments?

The mistakes were taking loans and withdrawals….. kind of treating the retirement account like a regular savings account.

The loans were paid back with (not much) interest. The withdrawals, besides the penalties, I could not contribute to the account for 6 months.

Most of the bad decisions regarding my TSP were made during the worst few years of my life. Years that I was just trying to survive and do what I needed to do for my children. I see the financial mistakes in hindsight, but I don’t know that I’d do anything differently today considering all the circumstances.

[giramomma]

So. It sounds like you can count on 5400 a month for a pension, give or take. I gather that from this: Will retire hopefully in about 8 years, with a pension equal to 30% of their high 3 years, which will almost certainly be more than the current base salary.

It sounds like even including income tax, your expenses will be no more than 3k a month.

That gives you at least a 2400/month cushion.

I know you don't like questions, but this is where personal finances becomes personal.

My parents likely had similar income in retirement. They had property taxes and medicare supplements. They lived on dad's pension (guessing 3ishK) and banked his SS (2k a month). At 75, my dad had 100K from saving SS.  That's plenty for all of the things that Athena cited: major home maintenance, car replacement, etc.

My mom shouldn't have to touch anything for retirement. Dad's pension, SS and RMDs should be more than enough. Even with extra expenses like lawn service.

So. I don't know that you need to save more money for retirement. I would assume the feds aren't going to get rid of the federal pension system.

If you want to travel like Mich and Athena, then yes, you may want to save some more money. How much depends on how expensive you want to go with travel. If you want to live in a expensive facility in your final years, should you need that, then yes, you should save more money. But, then you'll need a ball park of what those places cost in your next of the woods.

Otherwise, based on what I saw from my parents, combined with your data...I don't really think you need to be saving more than you already are.

ETA: DH and I both have pensions. I am 46. We probably could stop saving for retirement at this point (like putting 0 away beyond our required pension contribution).. but...

1. Until we get on medicare, health insurance will cost us 2K a month through my work

2. I want to live in an expensive facility when the time comes and we can't manage our home anymore. Our monthly income is about 3-4K short of what monthly rent is at this type of facility.

I think if we can weather the next few years and my health holds, I can still seriously look at retiring at 58 if we continue to save. If we decided to stop saving, then I'd have to push it out to 60-62.

[CCL]

Oct 18, 2021 20:09:05 GMT -5 giramomma said:

So. It sounds like you can count on 5400 a month for a pension, give or take. I gather that from this: Will retire hopefully in about 8 years, with a pension equal to 30% of their high 3 years, which will almost certainly be more than the current base salary.

It sounds like even including income tax, your expenses will be no more than 3k a month.

That gives you at least a 2400/month cushion.

I know you don't like questions, but this is where personal finances becomes personal.

My parents likely had similar income in retirement. They had property taxes and medicare supplements. They lived on dad's pension (guessing 3ishK) and banked his SS (2k a month). At 75, my dad had 100K from saving SS.  That's plenty for all of the things that Athena cited: major home maintenance, car replacement, etc.

My mom shouldn't have to touch anything for retirement. Dad's pension, SS and RMDs should be more than enough. Even with extra expenses like lawn service.

So. I don't know that you need to save more money for retirement. I would assume the feds aren't going to get rid of the federal pension system.

If you want to travel like Mich and Athena, then yes, you may want to save some more money. How much depends on how expensive you want to go with travel. If you want to live in a expensive facility in your final years, should you need that, then yes, you should save more money. But, then you'll need a ball park of what those places cost in your next of the woods.

Otherwise, based on what I saw from my parents, combined with your data...I don't really think you need to be saving more than you already are.

ETA: DH and I both have pensions. I am 46. We probably could stop saving for retirement at this point (like putting 0 away beyond our required pension contribution).. but...

1. Until we get on medicare, health insurance will cost us 2K a month through my work

2. I want to live in an expensive facility when the time comes and we can't manage our home anymore. Our monthly income is about 3-4K short of what monthly rent is at this type of facility.

I think if we can weather the next few years and my health holds, I can still seriously look at retiring at 58 if we continue to save. If we decided to stop saving, then I'd have to push it out to 60-62.

I thought she was saying the $5400 per month is current income while working and the 30% is the pension amount.

[giramomma]

Yeah. I can see both ways. I read it as the pension of 30% of the high years will be more than base.

I thought there were bonuses, OT, or something else. That's what I assumed when I saw base salary. I guess the way I read it the numbers don't make sense.

Around here, bus drivers are notorious for racking up a ton of overtime. Usually a bus driver ends up being the highest paid city employee-even making more than the mayor sometimes, well over 100K after overtime. Their base, however may only be 50K. I don't know if/how OT is taken into account in pension calculations. My neighbor is in law enforcement. She also would make good bank with overtime. But, I don't know how that might affect retirement.

But, it's also hard to offer real advice without a clearer picture.

[Rukh O'Rorke]

Oct 18, 2021 20:04:37 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Oct 18, 2021 19:39:52 GMT -5 Rukh O'Rorke said:

I want to know what the mistakes were??

Not contributing?


Withdrawing for hookers and blow?


Speculative investments?

The mistakes were taking loans and withdrawals….. kind of treating the retirement account like a regular savings account.

The loans were paid back with (not much) interest. The withdrawals, besides the penalties, I could not contribute to the account for 6 months.

Most of the bad decisions regarding my TSP were made during the worst few years of my life. Years that I was just trying to survive and do what I needed to do for my children. I see the financial mistakes in hindsight, but I don’t know that I’d do anything differently today considering all the circumstances.

 it's tough to know which way to go as a single mom I think.

I've got a lot saved up now, but I do have a lot of guilt on what we gave up, what my kids gave, so that I could squirrel it away. It didn't seem that way at the time of course, but looking back I can see the things it was a mistake to miss or cut corners on. Especially in 2008 I was very salty as it seems all those sacrifices were for naught.

I'd rather be dealing with too little saved now than those guilts, tbh. 

[Deleted]

Oct 18, 2021 19:47:51 GMT -5 CCL said:

$22k per month for ACA coverage? Or did you mean $2200 per month? Either way, that's pretty steep. There's no way we could afford that.

Oops. $22k per year. That was for both of them.

[buystoys]

Oct 18, 2021 18:04:40 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Oct 18, 2021 17:00:46 GMT -5 buystoys said:

Health insurance from the job definitely helps.  ACA plans aren't cheap and, in my area anyway, don't have good coverage.

I'd play around with FIRECalc.com and i-Orp.com and start throwing some numbers around.  I calculated our annual expenses, subtracted DH's annual pension and subtracted SS at 60% since that was worse than anything we had seen or heard at the time.  We then shot fot 25X expenses.  I played around with those numbers with the planners to see what our "safe" withdrawal could be.  As it worked out, we both are on SSDI and getting 100% of our benefit right now.  We don't spend as much as we could as we are also self insured for long term care.

I'd start putting money into your Roth that's available.  You can access those funds before you're 59.5 without penalty and you may need to use them if you retire before 65. 

Do you mean the Roth available through the TSP? 

I can’t bear the thought of working until I’m 65yo. Idc if I have to eat bologna and crackers for the rest of my life, I just can’t. And if I knew now that I’ll have to, regardless, I swear I would just quit my job tomorrow. SHIIIIIT, I’d just call whoever is in charge of the shift right now and tell them “FUUUUCK you, I FUCKING QUIT!!!!”

Just thinking about it is REALLY stressing me out and making me sorry I even started this thread.

All I want is somebody to tell me how much I need in my TSP account to retire, or what they think their budget would look like, with the info I’ve shared.

This was supposed to be a “somebody I know is going through this”, but this post has upset my nerves talking about working until I’m 65yo……… and I’ve had a couple of adult beverages (and am ready for a refill DON’T JUDGE ME!).

I want to bury my head back in the sand, but I feel like this is too important, and I need y’all’s help.

Please don't stress!  You're doing a good thing by thinking about it now rather than later!

I agree with gira that you're likely investing now for the big things that come along in retirement.  Those can be expensive, so you want to invest as much as possible to cover them. 

Yes, I mean your Roth available through the TSP.  Move your current investing from the pre-tax to the post-tax (Roth) option.  That will start you on accumulating money you can access before 59.5.  You can invest in the same mutual fund(s) as you currently are. 

Hugs, Pink!  Please don't stress about this.  You're doing good!

[TheOtherMe]

I'm a federal retiree.  

With the health insurance I have chosen and Medicare Part B, the only out of pocket medical expenses I have are prescriptions, which are very reasonable through that health insurance.

I have vision insurance, which I'm quitting during open season as my doctor isn't in the program any more and no one else around here is either.

I have had dental insurance with the same federal program for many years and I'm grandfathered in to the benefits and cost.


My gallbladder surgery, which ended up with 4 ER visits and surgery, didn't cost me a penny.  I did have some prescriptions that came from it but that was my only out of pocket cost.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Personally, I would not muddy the waters with all the "other person" income and savings and what they're covering/not covering.  With no legal protection of marriage that would at least divide the assets, you should make your plans as if that could be gone at any time.  You don't want to be tied to a person because you're financially dependent on them. 

So...with that...how much do you WANT to have in retirement?  I think the 2K estimate above for the pension is reasonable.  Another $1000?   Well, with no social security that would mean you'd need 300K in savings in addition to the pension.  This would give you 3K/month, but you couldn't make any big ticket withdrawals.  You'd have to save up for them from your 3K.  The social security gives you more of a cushion because you could essentially stop the monthly withdrawals on your investments once you start drawing that.

Firecalc is super happy with a 36K/year income starting with 100K in assets today retiring at 59 with 2K pension starting at 59 and 12K/year social security starting at 65 (100% success rate) but it falls apart once you hit 37K/year, so not much cushion.  Putting 10K/year into your accounts until 59 gets you to 40K/year. 

[Deleted]

Oct 19, 2021 4:55:56 GMT -5 buystoys said:

Oct 18, 2021 18:04:40 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Do you mean the Roth available through the TSP? 

I can’t bear the thought of working until I’m 65yo. Idc if I have to eat bologna and crackers for the rest of my life, I just can’t. And if I knew now that I’ll have to, regardless, I swear I would just quit my job tomorrow. SHIIIIIT, I’d just call whoever is in charge of the shift right now and tell them “FUUUUCK you, I FUCKING QUIT!!!!”

Just thinking about it is REALLY stressing me out and making me sorry I even started this thread.

All I want is somebody to tell me how much I need in my TSP account to retire, or what they think their budget would look like, with the info I’ve shared.

This was supposed to be a “somebody I know is going through this”, but this post has upset my nerves talking about working until I’m 65yo……… and I’ve had a couple of adult beverages (and am ready for a refill DON’T JUDGE ME!).

I want to bury my head back in the sand, but I feel like this is too important, and I need y’all’s help.

Please don't stress!  You're doing a good thing by thinking about it now rather than later!

I agree with gira that you're likely investing now for the big things that come along in retirement.  Those can be expensive, so you want to invest as much as possible to cover them. 

Yes, I mean your Roth available through the TSP.  Move your current investing from the pre-tax to the post-tax (Roth) option.  That will start you on accumulating money you can access before 59.5.  You can invest in the same mutual fund(s) as you currently are. 

Hugs, Pink!  Please don't stress about this.  You're doing good!

Got it! And thanks for the encouragement.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

I think you need to sit down and figure out exactly how much you are spending.  When TD retired, we had a couple year idea of how much our basic living expenses were.  Then add how much you want to have to play with.  

With what you are listing, it sounds like your pension might be about $1500/mo?  I read this as 30% of your highest 3 years, so 30% of $5400?  If your house is paid off, your expenses will likely just be covered with your pension, not including any new cars.  So if you double this and add $1500, that would give you a monthly budget of $3000.  Are you saving $2400 of your current income each month?  If so, then you are on track here.

Then it is just basic math.  If you retire at 58, you’ll have about 10 years of pulling from your TSP to fill the void until SS.  That is about $180k.  After SS kicks in, then your needs from your TSP decrease as your SS should fill most of the void.  However, chances are you will need more than $3000….maybe $3500?  That means you might need to supplement from your TSP another $6000/year for the next 20+ years.  That is another $120k.  So a back of the envelope guesstimate would be a minimum of $300k IMO.  

I guess the one thing that I have learned listening to my retired MIL and neighbors is that as long as they are healthy, their expenses seem to go down as they age and slow down.  But this is the caveat…..when you get sick, there are expenses outside of medical that make life easier.  For instance, my FIL was telling us that he has turned to CBD oil as part of his palliative care for lung cancer.  Even though his Canadian healthcare covers all of his medical expenses, they don’t cover this.  It adds $150/mo OOP.  He has better quality living aids, which make his life more comfortable and are not covered by his healthcare.  We saw this with TD’s stepdad as well.  His living aids (chairs, wheelchairs, walking aids, beds, etc) were top of the line because there is a HUGE difference between a $200 wheelchair and a $5000 wheelchair when you start talking comfort.

[Deleted]

Oct 19, 2021 7:41:42 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Personally, I would not muddy the waters with all the "other person" income and savings and what they're covering/not covering.  With no legal protection of marriage that would at least divide the assets, you should make your plans as if that could be gone at any time.  You don't want to be tied to a person because you're financially dependent on them. 

So...with that...how much do you WANT to have in retirement?  I think the 2K estimate above for the pension is reasonable.  Another $1000?   Well, with no social security that would mean you'd need 300K in savings in addition to the pension.  This would give you 3K/month, but you couldn't make any big ticket withdrawals.  You'd have to save up for them from your 3K.  The social security gives you more of a cushion because you could essentially stop the monthly withdrawals on your investments once you start drawing that.

Firecalc is super happy with a 36K/year income starting with 100K in assets today retiring at 59 with 2K pension starting at 59 and 12K/year social security starting at 65 (100% success rate) but it falls apart once you hit 37K/year, so not much cushion.  Putting 10K/year into your accounts until 59 gets you to 40K/year. 

No, I’m not counting on anybody else’s income or help for my retirement. I firmly believe in having my own money and being able to take care of myself, no matter what. I only provided that info to give you all an idea of my current expenses.

How much do I WANT to have in retirement? Good question. Idk the answer. After my paycheck deductions and automatic savings withdrawals, I live on a little over $3k/month now. But I know $3k now won’t be the same $3k years from now.

Thanks for providing some numbers. I just woke up, when my brain catches up with my body, I will give it some more thought.

[TheOtherMe]

Because of the difference between the cheapest walker being sold around here and the most expensive, mom bought herself what she called a "Cadillac".  She used it a lot and it's now at my sister's house.  Since mom paid for it, whoever needs it first will use it.

Her wheelchair was pretty basic because she wasn't leaving the apartment much.  She wasn't in it all day.  It was mostly to get her to and from the car for doctor's appointments.  It isn't one I would want to sit in for hours at a time.  She did go for the cheap one for that.