nidena
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Post by nidena on Oct 6, 2021 17:04:54 GMT -5
A new Pew Research Center analysis of census data finds that in 2019, roughly four-in-ten adults ages 25 to 54 (38%) were unpartnered – that is, neither married nor living with a partner.1 This share is up sharply from 29% in 1990.2 Men are now more likely than women to be unpartnered, which wasn’t the case 30 years ago.www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2021/10/05/rising-share-of-u-s-adults-are-living-without-a-spouse-or-partner/Unpartnered adults have lower earnings, on average, than partnered adults and are less likely to be employed or economically independent.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Oct 6, 2021 17:28:30 GMT -5
so I am "unpartnered" now, as I was in the last census. I'd be curious for the anecdotal data from the 2020 census that I don't consider to be valid with all the garbage from teh previous administration about how the questionnaires would be administered. but, back to topic, I'm employed FT and have been since graduating college, and I'm on my way to being economically independent. I'm still paying off some stupid life choices.
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busymom
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Post by busymom on Oct 6, 2021 17:50:39 GMT -5
Most of DD's friends are still single. A number of her old college friends got married, but not even half.
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nidena
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Post by nidena on Oct 6, 2021 17:59:37 GMT -5
Never got around to getting married. Was engaged twice. Now, I don't think I'd have the tolerance to share space with someone. My own messiness is enough. I wouldn't want to deal with theirs, too, or, on the flip side, they being super clean and irritated that I'm not. lol.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Oct 6, 2021 18:47:26 GMT -5
Our tax laws are written to encourage "marriage".
Is the lower earnings for singles because more of their income goes to taxes?
What is in the "earnings"?? is it the same as gross income??
I'm guessing if I was the sole bread winner and married I'd have more disposable income - but pretty close to the same expenses (housing for example) and we could get by with one car (I take public transportation) and I'm thinking the food bill wouldn't go up that much...
Even if my spouse earned as much as I did - we'd still pay less in income taxes on our combined income.
I wonder if enough middle and high income singles will realize this and push for a change in the tax codes.
That change from married to single - effects the tax planning for some high income retired folks - since when one of them dies the survivor has a dramatically different tax burden.
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Post by minnesotapaintlady on Oct 6, 2021 20:48:35 GMT -5
Our tax laws are written to encourage "marriage".
Is the lower earnings for singles because more of their income goes to taxes? What is in the "earnings"?? is it the same as gross income?? I'm guessing if I was the sole bread winner and married I'd have more disposable income - but pretty close to the same expenses (housing for example) and we could get by with one car (I take public transportation) and I'm thinking the food bill wouldn't go up that much... Even if my spouse earned as much as I did - we'd still pay less in income taxes on our combined income. I wonder if enough middle and high income singles will realize this and push for a change in the tax codes. That change from married to single - effects the tax planning for some high income retired folks - since when one of them dies the survivor has a dramatically different tax burden. I don't think that's true. I know they are written to encourage children, but the standard deductions and tax brackets are just doubled for married. So while yeah, a person making 100K single is going to be paying more in taxes than a married couple making 100K, it will be the same as two single cohabitating people making 50K each. In fact, I think I remember in the past (like 25 years ago) it was the opposite and there was a "marriage penalty" due to the tax brackets not lining up and being double of single. Some of my friends refused to get married because of that.
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resolution
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Post by resolution on Oct 7, 2021 7:00:00 GMT -5
Most things it's break even to be married, but a few things still have penalties. For example, you qualify for a subsidy on ACA medical premiums if your income is under $51k for a single person or 69k combined for a married couple.
EITC is like that too, it phases out much earlier for married couples than for two singles.
Seems like being married is a tax benefit if you have a very high earner supporting a low earner, break even for two upper middle class earners, and a penalty for low earners.
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wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on Oct 7, 2021 7:08:00 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure tax wise in my state you might be better off to be single. Maybe it would be okay if the total income was one of ours. We both withhold at the single rate and we'd be owing a bunch plus penalties if we used the married tables. In fact, I probably need to look into withholding extra for these last few paychecks. If you owe over $500, the penalties for underpayment kick in. We owed $400 something last year.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2021 7:39:44 GMT -5
Seems like being married is a tax benefit if you have a very high earner supporting a low earner, break even for two upper middle class earners, and a penalty for low earners. I think it's also a tax penalty on a high-earner two-income couple. I'm wondering if this is why my nephew in CA, who's got a high-power bank job, and his GF, who's in marketing, didn't bother getting married when they had a baby on the way. They do own a house together and the baby has DN's last name. When the Ex and I got married in 1984, NJ clobbered us with extra taxes because we had roughly equal earnings and essentially one income was taxed at the highest marginal amount. You could file separately only if you did for Federal, which we did one year. Anyway- I've been paired and I've been single. It's definitely a good safety margin to have an extra income and extra available health insurance if one disappears. OTOH, I was MUCH better off financially after my divorce, even with no CS, because the Ex had been unemployed for 5 years and still maxed out his credit cards till they were cut off, used mine fraudulently, and insisted on a high-priced cable package and food from good delis all the time. DS and I moved into a smaller house and I was actually able to max out my 401(k) again. With second DH, yes, I WAS better off. He was retired but got decent SS and had very simple tastes. It's always irked me that most thresholds, brackets, etc. are halved or doubled for singles- whichever works to our disadvantage. When DH died, my mortgage and property taxes stayed the same. Utilities went down a little. Food went down but certainly not cut in half. It does NOT cost half as much for one person to live as it does for two.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Oct 7, 2021 8:35:17 GMT -5
It also strikes me that there's a population that Pew is missing. Which are those that are partnered up but don't live together. Athena is one example here. One of my colleagues is another...she was married but separated from her husband when she was in the first few years of grad school. They lived in different states. One of my old music teachers was married, but she and her spouse lived in separate states during the week and only saw each other on weekends. Given then worked on weekends, too, there wasn't a lot of time to be partners, even when they managed to share the same dwelling.
And now that I think about it, in recent years (2-3), I have or had clients that were married and not living with their spouse. Infact, I have a client now that the parents are married, and the mom and child live in my city, and the dad and older sibling live 4 hours away. I can think of four other previous clients where the families were married, but were not really cohabitating because of work. To say you either live with your partner or you don't have a partner...those are very old school notions.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Oct 7, 2021 8:37:05 GMT -5
I am happily single and intend to stay that way. I have lived alone for most of the last 40 years. I know I could not live with anyone else.
Two long term relationships of about 15 years each made me think that was my limit.
As athena said, it does NOT cost half of the cost for two people to live for a single person to live.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Oct 7, 2021 8:50:48 GMT -5
A new Pew Research Center analysis of census data finds that in 2019, roughly four-in-ten adults ages 25 to 54 (38%) were unpartnered – that is, neither married nor living with a partner.1 This share is up sharply from 29% in 1990.2 Men are now more likely than women to be unpartnered, which wasn’t the case 30 years ago.www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2021/10/05/rising-share-of-u-s-adults-are-living-without-a-spouse-or-partner/Unpartnered adults have lower earnings, on average, than partnered adults and are less likely to be employed or economically independent. People suck. Why not? I was actually talking to a friend about this last night. I'm at a stage where I want to do what I want without considering anyone else's feelings. It's probably a good idea for me not to get married if that is my intent. However I was raised in a traditional/Catholic/Mexican family where it was just assumed that after growing up I would get married and then have children. It's not the 50s anymore and people are not following the norms that were previously followed.
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Blonde Granny
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Post by Blonde Granny on Oct 7, 2021 8:55:50 GMT -5
So, I'm single...or just call me a widow. I fail to see any value to my situation. I pay taxes, I buy new cars, buy groceries, visit the Dr. and dentist.......Most of my friends and neighbors are also widows...
Sheesh, some people just have to stick their noses into things that don't matter or have any value at all.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Oct 7, 2021 9:56:52 GMT -5
I'm guessing that married men let a lot of the daily life maintenance stuff and decisions about that stuff (kid stuff, housework, meal planning and prep, grocery shopping, laundry, etc...) fall on to their wife. And that gives him more time to network (drinks after work with coworkers, or outings with clients, or just working late).
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Oct 7, 2021 10:53:46 GMT -5
I revel in my unpartnered status, and am doing quite well financially.
Unpartnered adults have lower earnings, on average, than partnered adults and are less likely to be employed or economically independent.
I wonder if they compounded these? are the lower earnings only for those earning? or are the unemployed included with zeros?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Oct 7, 2021 12:28:35 GMT -5
I revel in my unpartnered status, and am doing quite well financially. Unpartnered adults have lower earnings, on average, than partnered adults and are less likely to be employed or economically independent.
I wonder if they compounded these? are the lower earnings only for those earning? or are the unemployed included with zeros? The link in the OP answers that question.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Oct 7, 2021 13:34:56 GMT -5
Lots of interesting trends in that study.
Unpartnered men doing worse in many areas, while unpartnered women are doing better in areas (in 2019, vs the same group in 1990). But a larger % of both unpartnered are living with parents, now.
Most of the growth in unpartnered is in never married, esp men.
In nearly every area listed, partnered have improved from 1990 to 2019. But unpartnered tend to be the younger bunch, and partnered skew older...
It occurs to me that the 54 year olds in 2019 were the 25 year olds in 1990, but the others studied are of different generations. So in 1990 they were looking at me and DH just out of college, compared to my parents. In 2019, they are comparing our kids to us...
I could read the shift in income inequality into all the data - those from a wealthy background get greater education (w/o debt) leading to better jobs (especially earlier), marrying a similar background spouse vs those w/o education advantages (or starting in an education debt-hole) leading to waiting longer and longer to afford (time- or money-wise) a partner/family.
The ones being left behind are the non-college degreed males, as good paying manufacturing jobs go extinct. Hmm, no wonder this demographic is cranky and loud and want to burn it all down.
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Icelandic Woman
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Post by Icelandic Woman on Oct 8, 2021 15:19:19 GMT -5
I have been happily single and living alone since 1998. I have a FT job and own a home and have a newer car with no car payment. I made some bad financial and life choices when I was younger so won't be able to retire until I am well into my 60s and closer to paying off my mortgage. But I couldn't imagine living with anyone ever again. I like being able to do whatever I want whenever I want in my own home without having to think about someone else.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2021 17:36:40 GMT -5
Mister and I moved in together in 2019. I guess that’s when I officially became “partnered”? We are not married.
Mister pays more of the household expenses than I do. I also insist that living in my other house for free is not an option. So my fixed expenses are a bit less than before we moved, which allows me to save even more money for retirement, and in general.
I wasn’t doing bad before then, though. My housing costs were more than reasonable for my income, no high credit card balances (I actually only have 1 cc and am not interested in having more) and I had no loans besides my mortgage. All of that is still true for me. I paid my car off in 2008 and still have it.
Mister wasn’t doing bad either. His income was more than mine, but so were his expenses because he paid more in rent than my mortgage payment, he had a car payment, and the biggie…. 3 minor children.
My income has increased since 2019, but that was going to happen anyway, due to negotiated raises and Cost of Living adjustments. Mister’s income is more than mine and his has also increased, due to a few things that also would have happened anyway. But his expenses have also increased since we moved, since he pays for most things for the house. A few things that tie up almost $2k of his net income will end next year.
When we talked about cohabitating, it was my preference that we buy something where we could meet all of our obligations on 1 income, preferably mine, the smaller one. It wouldn’t be fun, and we might have to eat a lot of rice and beans, but we could do it, if necessary. We could’ve afforded more house, but I want to retire in a reasonable time more than I want a fancy house. Mister is younger than me and one of those people that don’t know what to do with themselves if they aren’t going to work every day, so he’ll probably work past the time he can retire, but I’d still like for it to just be an option for him, sooner rather than later.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 7:13:04 GMT -5
But I couldn't imagine living with anyone ever again. I like being able to do whatever I want whenever I want in my own home without having to think about someone else. I agree. I did live on my own from ages 22-25, then bought a 2-family with a guy I was dating (big mistake- he wanted to be together 24/7), moved in with and then married my first husband, divorced him when I was 44 but had full custody of DS so I was still in charge of someone else. Married again at age 50, widowed 5 years ago. Life is pretty darn good and I've avoided the scary scenario DH and I worried about- he was 15 years older and his mother had Alzheimer's near the end of her life. He didn't bring a lot of assets into the marriage and we worried that if he ended up in LTC it could drain my assets down to an uncomfortable level. It didn't happen and I'm not going to take that chance with anyone else. The guy I'm dating is NOT as neat, organized and uncluttered as I am. I can barely fit into the passenger seat in his car because it's jammed with Stuff, front and back. Not my circus, not my monkeys. If we lived together we might kill each other.
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Oct 9, 2021 10:56:20 GMT -5
I’ve been divorced for 40 years Actually lived with someone for almost seven years! But I never gave up my apartment in those 7 years. Had friends tell me to give up apt and look at all the money I could save! That apartment my was my security/sanity saving sanctuary! Made no sense to anyone but me. And good YM’s are probably hyper ventilating. I can’t even comprehend anyone breathing my air on a permanent basis. But that just me. And a lot of what Icelandic Woman said much better than me.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Oct 9, 2021 11:06:33 GMT -5
These rates have been rising since I moved out on my own in 1981. From then until I moved in with TD in 2012, I have lived on my own and in those intervening years yet another study has come out that more people are living alone than the last study that came out. My lunch buddy neighbor is a widow. She has absolutely no intention of living with another spouse or SO. I think it is funny as the guy who lives across the street from her I think is besotted by her. We have talked about it during our lunches, and her husband the last 15 years of his life made her life so miserable that she vowed never again. When I moved in here, I was amazed as to how seamless it really was. Other than closet space, where I keep trying to encroach on TD’s third of the remaining closet. He doesn’t need it, I do.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 14:02:47 GMT -5
I work in an accounting office that does income taxes. (I am not a CPA). It is definitely beneficial to be married. Try filing "married but filing separately". 99.9% of the time there is no benefit to that.
We had one middle income married man that lost his wife. The wife did not have any tax withholding. After she passed away, when the man had to start filing "single", he owed in taxes for the first time ever. He was in a different tax bracket.
There is a tax bracket for married and a tax bracket for single.
However - I still would not get married for this reason. That reminds me of my sister trying to tell me to buy a house so I could save on income taxes. Ummmmm, no, I am not going to take out a mortgage to save a couple of hundred dollars on income taxes.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 15:13:44 GMT -5
Actually lived with someone for almost seven years! But I never gave up my apartment in those 7 years. Had friends tell me to give up apt and look at all the money I could save! That apartment my was my security/sanity saving sanctuary! Made no sense to anyone but me. And good YM’s are probably hyper ventilating. Not this one. DH and I dated for 6 years before we married and kept separate houses. I was newly-divorced, DS was 12 and we were in no rush. I think moving in together- whether it was the one I’d just bought or the one DH owned-would not have worked. And then when we moved from NJ to KS for my job it took a year for DH’s to sell. Good thing his had the smaller mortgage payment.
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Post by minnesotapaintlady on Oct 9, 2021 18:34:14 GMT -5
I work in an accounting office that does income taxes. (I am not a CPA). It is definitely beneficial to be married. Try filing "married but filing separately". 99.9% of the time there is no benefit to that. Married filing separately is a whole different animal. But two single people living together would not pay less taxes being married.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Oct 9, 2021 20:05:04 GMT -5
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Oct 10, 2021 8:09:45 GMT -5
My motto is "I do whatever I want to all the time."
I am a SINK making 6 figures a year, and I like it! I like answering to no one and having the money to do most of what I want. Decisions are all mine. At this point considering someone else in any decision making process would be difficult.
Sometimes I wouldn't mind having someone to travel with though, or to take to work functions. My best friend travels with me some but her health is not the best and she has some financial constraints. I think I'm going to have to get used to traveling alone at some point.
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Sam_2.0
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Post by Sam_2.0 on Oct 10, 2021 8:11:04 GMT -5
They don't make it super clear - is cohabiting with a romantic partner, or any roommate?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2021 8:12:11 GMT -5
I work in an accounting office that does income taxes. (I am not a CPA). It is definitely beneficial to be married. Try filing "married but filing separately". 99.9% of the time there is no benefit to that. Married filing separately is a whole different animal. But two single people living together would not pay less taxes being married. I will contact our software company tomorrow and tell them their tax brackets are wrong.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Oct 10, 2021 8:21:25 GMT -5
They don't make it super clear - is cohabiting with a romantic partner, or any roommate? This analysis is based on the premise that adults who live with a romantic partner – whether they are married or cohabitating – link
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