Deleted
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Sept 24, 2021 12:09:08 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2021 12:09:08 GMT -5
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tractor
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Post by tractor on Sept 24, 2021 12:23:58 GMT -5
As far as I know, people of all colors are dying from COVID, and all have the opportunity to get vaccinated. This is not a race issue, it's the action of someone starved for attention.
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moon/Laura
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Post by moon/Laura on Sept 24, 2021 12:48:48 GMT -5
Why are you using rags from the UK instead of US sources? From a different article on Newsweek, it says that at least part of the reason Blacks are reluctant to get the vaccine has to do with past racist treatment, which makes them not trust the government or the vaccine.
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Sept 24, 2021 12:58:34 GMT -5
Why are you using rags from the UK instead of US sources? From a different article on Newsweek, it says that at least part of the reason Blacks are reluctant to get the vaccine has to do with past racist treatment, which makes them not trust the government or the vaccine. Exactly. Google Tuskegee and it will tell you a WHOLE lot about why American Blacks are so mistrusting of the medical community.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Sept 24, 2021 14:02:11 GMT -5
He's just trying to rile people up. Don't feed the troll.
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kadee79
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S.W. Ga., zone 8b, out in the boonies!
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Post by kadee79 on Sept 24, 2021 14:27:59 GMT -5
He's just trying to rile people up. Don't feed the troll. Wish I could like your post 1000 times!
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Sept 24, 2021 14:44:27 GMT -5
Also google Henrietta Lacks.
Or read the book The Immortal Life if Henrietta Lacks. It’ll make you mad.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Sept 24, 2021 15:10:51 GMT -5
Why are you using rags from the UK instead of US sources? From a different article on Newsweek, it says that at least part of the reason Blacks are reluctant to get the vaccine has to do with past racist treatment, which makes them not trust the government or the vaccine. Exactly. Google Tuskegee and it will tell you a WHOLE lot about why American Blacks are so mistrusting of the medical community. Or google Eugenics in America (it happened in other countries too). As I am a woman - I tended to follow how eugenics effected women - as in sterilizations without patient knowledge or consent. Go to the doctor or the hospital because you had a medical issue - and say yes, please give me this life saving surgery (with sterilization on the side that wasn't mentioned very loudly or clearly or that the medical professionals just neglected to tell me about). Happened for DECADES - I think into the 1970's.
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dondub
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Sept 24, 2021 16:56:46 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by dondub on Sept 24, 2021 16:56:46 GMT -5
Also google Henrietta Lacks. Or read the book The Immortal Life if Henrietta Lacks. It’ll make you mad. Great book! Donnadub had that in her book club and recommended it to me.
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moon/Laura
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Sept 24, 2021 19:53:16 GMT -5
Post by moon/Laura on Sept 24, 2021 19:53:16 GMT -5
@x No one asked you to delete anything. I *did* ask why you were using questionable "news" sources from other countries instead of one from here. I mean...seriously. And I will also note that, as usual, you insist on ignoring any and all racial factors as if none exist, ever.
You're correct that the virus doesn't care about anything but replicating. But if you can't (won't) see that the memories of past transgressions do absolutely play a part in the lower vaccination numbers of Blacks now, then I don't know what to tell you.
As for others who don't trust, they don't matter for the purposes of this thread because the topic was BLM related, not a general "vaccination rates are not as high as they should be because....." This was just another way for you to deny that Blacks are treated unequally - now, or ever. Was this overt/deliberate racism ? No, but that doesn't mean that there's none at all.
PS. Yes, I do think that people who can get the vaccine (meaning they have no health reasons not to) but don't are selfish.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2021 20:44:26 GMT -5
I’m just one random Black person and I can only speak for myself and share what other Black people have said to me.
Many Black people that I know have gotten the vaccine, many with reservations, but they felt they were damned if they do, and damned if they don’t, because the virus seems to have taken a toll on Black folks, especially Black men. Some of the reasons Black people seem to be hit harder with the virus may have something to do with healthcare needs and how likely they are to seek medical treatment for underlying conditions, if they have the means to pay for it, insurance and whatnot. Idk, and I’m not going to argue about any of it.
And yes, there is another group that does not trust the government and medical community at all to be straight with them about what’s really going on….. what the real reason is that they want to poke them with needles and inject something in their bodies. We can fuss and disparage them all day long, but I most definitely understand the distrust of government AND the medical community. These people are not the ones running around saying there’s a chip in the vaccine or any of the other outrageous claims. But they are wary of the vaccine because HISTORY has proven that Black folks are “expendable” and it’s ok to lie to and use Black folks to their detriment and with out their approval.
What I hear is that it’s called a “vaccine”, but at the same time, it’s said that it won’t prevent a person getting sick from the virus, they just maybe won’t get terribly sick and/or die….. Which is not exactly what even I thought a “vaccine” is supposed to do. So even with the vaccine, a person can still spread the virus to other people. Correct?
So I don’t have a good answer when I’m asked how the vaccine is supposed to stop the spread when even vaccinated individuals can spread the virus.
Maybe some of you that are smarter than me can give me an answer that makes sense that I can take back to people I know that asks those questions. Because all I have at that point is just looking stupid with no real answer.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Sept 24, 2021 20:54:41 GMT -5
No vaccine prevents 100% of infections. There have always been breakthrough infections. Think the flu vaccine. Even in a good year, it is about 70% effective. But, even if you get infected, you will likely have a milder case, meaning your risk of hospitalization and death is lower. That would seem to be a positive thing, and for the life of me, I do not understand why people are treating this fact as a negative.
Vaccines decrease your risk of getting sick, even if they are imperfect. Fewer people get sick, they are ill for a shorter period of time, and likely have less virus in their system, so are less contagious. With a higher percentage of people vaccinated, less virus circulates, fewer people get sick, and cases continue to spiral downward. Once a large enough percentage of the population is immune, the virus has very few susceptible hosts, so even if someone get infected, they cannot infect others. That is herd immunity
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Sept 24, 2021 21:25:24 GMT -5
In rural southern areas people without transportation can have trouble getting to the place to get the shots,
One such rural area with a large black population in Mississippi had a lady who made it her mission to make sure everyone got the vaccine, and she personally went around making sure it happened. At the time, they were at 93 percent-amazing for any southern county, black or white. I’ll have to see if I can find that article.
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moon/Laura
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Sept 25, 2021 8:07:37 GMT -5
Post by moon/Laura on Sept 25, 2021 8:07:37 GMT -5
dondub - I've removed 2 of your posts that served no purpose other than to bait and inflame. Knock it the F off.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2021 13:57:08 GMT -5
No vaccine prevents 100% of infections. There have always been breakthrough infections. Think the flu vaccine. Even in a good year, it is about 70% effective. But, even if you get infected, you will likely have a milder case, meaning your risk of hospitalization and death is lower. That would seem to be a positive thing, and for the life of me, I do not understand why people are treating this fact as a negative. Vaccines decrease your risk of getting sick, even if they are imperfect. Fewer people get sick, they are ill for a shorter period of time, and likely have less virus in their system, so are less contagious. With a higher percentage of people vaccinated, less virus circulates, fewer people get sick, and cases continue to spiral downward. Once a large enough percentage of the population is immune, the virus has very few susceptible hosts, so even if someone get infected, they cannot infect others. That is herd immunity I don’t think they view that part as a negative. Ahhhhh, *Herd immunity* that’s what I keep forgetting during the conversations. I will try to remember that going forward. Maybe because “stop the spread” is usually the phrase that’s used, without explaining HOW, with herd immunity. Without that part of the dialog, “stop the spread” doesn’t sound quite right when we know that people that have had the vaccine can still spread the virus. I don’t really try to badger anyone into getting the vaccine but if I’m talking to someone that is asking genuine questions, I prefer to give them helpful, truthful answers. But I’m not a Doctor or scientist, and don’t know the ins and outs of exactly how it all works, obviously, since I’ve always failed to mention and explain herd immunity. But if I can give an honest answer to a question that helps someone make up their mind, I’d like to be able to.
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Value Buy
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Sept 30, 2021 9:15:44 GMT -5
Post by Value Buy on Sept 30, 2021 9:15:44 GMT -5
I’m just one random Black person and I can only speak for myself and share what other Black people have said to me. Many Black people that I know have gotten the vaccine, many with reservations, but they felt they were damned if they do, and damned if they don’t, because the virus seems to have taken a toll on Black folks, especially Black men. Some of the reasons Black people seem to be hit harder with the virus may have something to do with healthcare needs and how likely they are to seek medical treatment for underlying conditions, if they have the means to pay for it, insurance and whatnot. Idk, and I’m not going to argue about any of it. And yes, there is another group that does not trust the government and medical community at all to be straight with them about what’s really going on….. what the real reason is that they want to poke them with needles and inject something in their bodies. We can fuss and disparage them all day long, but I most definitely understand the distrust of government AND the medical community. These people are not the ones running around saying there’s a chip in the vaccine or any of the other outrageous claims. But they are wary of the vaccine because HISTORY has proven that Black folks are “expendable” and it’s ok to lie to and use Black folks to their detriment and with out their approval. What I hear is that it’s called a “vaccine”, but at the same time, it’s said that it won’t prevent a person getting sick from the virus, they just maybe won’t get terribly sick and/or die….. Which is not exactly what even I thought a “vaccine” is supposed to do. So even with the vaccine, a person can still spread the virus to other people. Correct? So I don’t have a good answer when I’m asked how the vaccine is supposed to stop the spread when even vaccinated individuals can spread the virus. Maybe some of you that are smarter than me can give me an answer that makes sense that I can take back to people I know that asks those questions. Because all I have at that point is just looking stupid with no real answer. Evidently it is not just a black person's issue. A couple of weeks ago I read an article that in NYC Hispanics are behind blacks in getting vaccinated, and surprisingly, at least to me, Asians were far behind both groups. Please do not ask for a reference, as I was just browsing the internet, and came upon it....... EDITED TO CORRECT AN ERROR! Asians is the correct word I should have used. TY Andi
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Sept 30, 2021 9:57:23 GMT -5
I’m just one random Black person and I can only speak for myself and share what other Black people have said to me. Many Black people that I know have gotten the vaccine, many with reservations, but they felt they were damned if they do, and damned if they don’t, because the virus seems to have taken a toll on Black folks, especially Black men. Some of the reasons Black people seem to be hit harder with the virus may have something to do with healthcare needs and how likely they are to seek medical treatment for underlying conditions, if they have the means to pay for it, insurance and whatnot. Idk, and I’m not going to argue about any of it. And yes, there is another group that does not trust the government and medical community at all to be straight with them about what’s really going on….. what the real reason is that they want to poke them with needles and inject something in their bodies. We can fuss and disparage them all day long, but I most definitely understand the distrust of government AND the medical community. These people are not the ones running around saying there’s a chip in the vaccine or any of the other outrageous claims. But they are wary of the vaccine because HISTORY has proven that Black folks are “expendable” and it’s ok to lie to and use Black folks to their detriment and with out their approval. What I hear is that it’s called a “vaccine”, but at the same time, it’s said that it won’t prevent a person getting sick from the virus, they just maybe won’t get terribly sick and/or die….. Which is not exactly what even I thought a “vaccine” is supposed to do. So even with the vaccine, a person can still spread the virus to other people. Correct? So I don’t have a good answer when I’m asked how the vaccine is supposed to stop the spread when even vaccinated individuals can spread the virus. Maybe some of you that are smarter than me can give me an answer that makes sense that I can take back to people I know that asks those questions. Because all I have at that point is just looking stupid with no real answer. Evidently it is not just a black person's issue. A couple of weeks ago I read an article that in NYC Hispanics are behind blacks in getting vaccinated, and surprisingly, at least to me, Orientals were far behind both groups. Please do not ask for a reference, as I was just browsing the internet, and came upon it....... Asian people are not "orientals". They are Asian. Oriental is what inanimate objects are such as rugs or art. Calling an Asian person Oriental is basically calling them "thing". Not cool.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Sept 30, 2021 11:13:54 GMT -5
Why are you using rags from the UK instead of US sources? From a different article on Newsweek, it says that at least part of the reason Blacks are reluctant to get the vaccine has to do with past racist treatment, which makes them not trust the government or the vaccine. Exactly. Google Tuskegee and it will tell you a WHOLE lot about why American Blacks are so mistrusting of the medical community. I read a really interesting piece that said, although Tuskegee happened and was terrible, that isn't why most POC today are mistrustful. It laid out how generational attitudes are an influencer, but the reality is that the medical community today treats POC so poorly, they don't have to go back to Tuskegee to find a reason not to trust. They have their own book of stories - be it personal or close family and friends. This is even more soul crushing than going back 50 years. If we were just fighting this one horrid thing that happened and ended, there could be progress, but if everyday the community is getting another experience that reinforces the distrust - there is no progress. The experience of today can't be blamed on the story of history.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Sept 30, 2021 11:23:26 GMT -5
Hispanic vaccination rate is rapidly approaching the rate of whites
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Sept 30, 2021 12:17:42 GMT -5
Exactly. Google Tuskegee and it will tell you a WHOLE lot about why American Blacks are so mistrusting of the medical community. I read a really interesting piece that said, although Tuskegee happened and was terrible, that isn't why most POC today are mistrustful. It laid out how generational attitudes are an influencer, but the reality is that the medical community today treats POC so poorly, they don't have to go back to Tuskegee to find a reason not to trust. They have their own book of stories - be it personal or close family and friends. This is even more soul crushing than going back 50 years. If we were just fighting this one horrid thing that happened and ended, there could be progress, but if everyday the community is getting another experience that reinforces the distrust - there is no progress. The experience of today can't be blamed on the story of history. I referred to Tuskegee because it is a widely known and documented case of the medical community and the government telling black men they would treat/cute them but instead they were used as lab rats.
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djAdvocate
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Sept 30, 2021 13:05:07 GMT -5
Post by djAdvocate on Sept 30, 2021 13:05:07 GMT -5
Hispanic vaccination rate is rapidly approaching the rate of whites that makes sense. the efficacy is winning out over the distrust.
it is too bad that conservatives can't reason their way through it similarly.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Sept 30, 2021 15:22:36 GMT -5
Evidently it is not just a black person's issue. A couple of weeks ago I read an article that in NYC Hispanics are behind blacks in getting vaccinated, and surprisingly, at least to me, Orientals were far behind both groups. Please do not ask for a reference, as I was just browsing the internet, and came upon it....... Asian people are not "orientals". They are Asian. Oriental is what inanimate objects are such as rugs or art. Calling an Asian person Oriental is basically calling them "thing". Not cool. My daughter has a friend (18 years old) who is half Japanese. We were talking about insults and slang and I mentioned that years ago Oriental was used to describe anyone that looked like they were from the Orient. She had never heard the term other than for rugs. She didn't know it was offensive. She started using it humorously to describe herself. I guess she was taking back the word - like when women took back bitch and rappers took back the word we can't even type because it is so negative. I was actually happy to hear that it wasn't a common slur in her life, and kinda happy I warned her in case the world is more cruel than her very weird high school.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Sept 30, 2021 16:07:03 GMT -5
Hispanic vaccination rate is rapidly approaching the rate of whites that makes sense. the efficacy is winning out over the distrust.
it is too bad that conservatives can't reason their way through it similarly.
Just adding to this - My suburb is 85% Hispanic - and we had adult vaccination rate of over 50% back in June. I remember having a, um, conversation with my Florida relative (and a local relative who lives in a very White area) who were all about "oh it's those Blacks and Hispanics NOT getting vaccinated" and I was 'Gee, I wonder where in the US that is Cause the not so very white suburbs around me have just as high a rate as your lilly white areas." I'm sure the rate is higher now. We've currently got a pretty high vaccination rate of young people (HS aged). Anyway, the point I'm going for is -- I'm sure the vaccination levels by skin color depend on where in the US they live. I'm guessing it's a Red/Blue area thing and not so much skin color thing.
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