Medicare at 60

[Tiny]

www.cnn.com/2021/09/03/politics/lower-medicare-eligibility-age-democratic-legislation/index.html

What do you think of this?  How will it effect current workers 50 and older?  How will effect workers (and their spouses) who are currently in their 60's?  

How does this effect you/your spouse? 

Here's the long part: 

How does Medicare at 60 effect employers of people over 60?  Would this remove potentially high cost people from their healthcare plans?    Does that help employers? 

Can't the Republicans get on board with this (Medicare isn't socialism or Communism) ?  Couldn't they claim this is trump's big beautiful healthcare solution (that replaces the ACA)?   It's not... but I can see where the Tail End of the Boomer generation and the front end of the Gen X generation would see this as a plus. 

my siblings are hitting 65 but their wives are still a handful of years away - so either sibling keeps working to provide healthcare coverage for wife OR wife keeps working to cover their healthcare.    i suspect my Sis-in-laws would be happier if they (or their hubby) could "retire" at the same time.     

And for the Gen X'ers - I'm hearing a lot of "I don't think I will make it working my job until 65 or my full retirement age.  I DON"T want to work that long!  I'm chained to my job until I reach 65 or atleast until a few years before (when I will suck it up and pay the $$ for healthcare) because of "healthcare".     

I would think Medicare at 60 could be a "retirement" or FI game changer for a lot of people in their mid 50's .


 

[daisylu]

I think this would be big for many blue collar workers, and would lead to earlier retirements. My dad(65yo) has had physically demanding jobs since he was 16. His body shows it. Later in life, he was able to finally start saving for retirement and they could maintain their standard of living for decades - if not for healthcare. He is continuing to work until mom is eligible for Medicare, next year. He would have liked to retire at the start of year when he was recovering from Covid, but his healthcare options are $$$$. So he chooses to wait. He could probably make it work at this point, but he figures he has made it this long another year is not a big deal.


For me, I am 4 years older than DH(42). Due to an ATV accident when he was 18 he has all sorts of bones issues, plus a TBI that affects his memory (he is finally addressing that, and it is alleviating somewhat). He had 2 knee surgeries (1 on each knee) before he was 35, and has spent his working life on concrete - his ortho has already said that he will need replacements, it is just a matter of when. Because of all of this, we have always planned that he will retire early. It likely will not be a full retirement, as he will find something to do. For that reason retirement accounts have always been our top financial priority. Medicare at 60 would give us more options in case something happens and I can not work to provide healthcare.

[Lizard Queen]

If I retire from my current job between 60-65, I get $450/month from my employer for healthcare until 65. I'm eying retirement at 60 for that reason. I would think that'd go away if medicare is available at 60, which is fine, but then maybe I'll retire earlier. Or maybe I'll wait until after my almost 9yo no longer needs to be on my insurance, which puts us close or over 65 anyway.

Lots to say, I don't know yet, but it would be a great thing regardless. I think it would do a lot for businesses that hire and retain older folks.

[minnesotapaintlady]

It would be great if they did it, but not a huge game-changer for my personal plans of retiring at 59/60, it would just save me the money I'm preparing to spend.  Without it I'd go the ACA route and even if they do lower medicare to 60, Carrot will only be 18 when I'm planning on retiring, so I have to factor extra into his college/launch fund to cover his health insurance (unless his dad will cover him, he'll only be 53 then). 

[Deleted]

Overall, probably a good idea.

It would bring a younger, presumably healthier group into Medicare with lower average healthcare costs.

It would free up opportunities for younger people as the 60+ who were just working for the insurance leave.

It would certainly ease the burden on early retirees.  My brother retired at 60 with retiree health care fully paid for- till they just stopped it 2 years later.  He and DSIL ended up paying $22K/year for ACA and they didn't qualify for subsidies.  I'm sure plenty of people fall in between the cracks- enough savings and income that they don't qualify for subsidies but the cost of ACA is anything but "affordable".

Downsides:

Medicare is taxpayer-supported unless you're so rich you're paying the full IRMAA surcharge (individual over $500K income, couple over $750K).  More people in the program means more support needed.

Hospitals lose money on Medicaid patients, just about break even on MediCARE and make money on those with private insurance.  This will shift towards more break-even patients.

We're extending Medicare to people who haven't paid into the system as long.  All of us get the same Medicare options whether we worked 20 quarters at minimum wage or whether we worked 40 years.  Having people who are now paying into Medicare stop paying and start enrolling will weaken an already financially-strapped system.

I'm also worried about the slippery slope.  Will it be 50-55 next?  

It might be a partial answer but it has some adverse consequences.

[jerseygirl]

Sure, early Medicare sounds great and would help many. Unfortunately Medicare as is is expected to run out of money around 2034.
So money or tax issue needs to be addressed. Working people right now have deductions for Medicare to pay for folks already in system. These taxes would need to be increased.

[susana1954]

I don't completely understand all the different types of Medicare since my state teacher retirement insurance puts me in a special type of Medicare Advantage plan that includes prescription drug coverage for $23 + the regular Medicare premium.  To include DH was more.  We were paying about $600 total including drug coverage, which is a bargain by most standards.

For others, you either have to pay the Medicare premium + cover 20% of covered charges + 100% of prescription drugs unless you elect for other types of coverage, which have premiums in addition to basic Medicare.  Most of these require that you do a separate prescription plan, which I think still has a doughnut hole where you cover 100% until you get out of it.  (I don't know because mine has no doughnut hole.)  I would think from looking to see if it would be better to cover DH outside my state plan that you would easily spend about $600 a month in premiums for just one person if you include prescription drug coverage.  Of course, there are cheaper plans, but they have poorer coverage.  

I just don't want anyone to think that Medicare is this super cheap insurance.  Maybe it is if  you currently have a high deductible plan, but not for everyone.  I spend more for healthcare than I did for both DH and me when I was working even with the super cheap Advantage plan and just me.  And there are limits that there aren't in other plans.

[TheOtherMe]

The way my federal retiree insurance works, with Medicare B and BCBS, I pay nothing except prescription drugs.  

I paid for it for several years when I had the gallbladder surgery.

Of course, it doesn't cover eyeglasses or dental.

[Deleted]

Sept 3, 2021 19:04:24 GMT -5 susana1954 said:

I don't completely understand all the different types of Medicare since my state teacher retirement insurance puts me in a special type of Medicare Advantage plan that includes prescription drug coverage for $23 + the regular Medicare premium.  To include DH was more.  We were paying about $600 total including drug coverage, which is a bargain by most standards.

<snip>

I just don't want anyone to think that Medicare is this super cheap insurance.  Maybe it is if  you currently have a high deductible plan, but not for everyone.  I spend more for healthcare than I did for both DH and me when I was working even with the super cheap Advantage plan and just me.  And there are limits that there aren't in other plans.

I'm paying $565/month for traditional Medicare and a supplement.  That includes IRMAA surcharges which are base don income.  In 2017, the year before I retired, I was paying $900/month for an "Affordable" Care Act policy with a $6,000 deductible.  I now pay very little out of pocket except the deductible/copay for my one prescription and the occasional immunization ($47 each for Shingrix).

I'll agree, though, that Medicare is not cheap.  I paid into it over 38 working years. In my case, my employers and I paid in over $120,000.  That's just for Medicare A (hospital stays), which (thank heaven) I've never used.  

But what "limits that there aren't in other plans" do you have?  A narrow network of providers?  Step therapy, where you have to try cheaper, less invasive therapies before they approve the one your doc wants to do?  BF works for a Medicare call center and he does find many people unhappy with Medicare Advantage.

[giramomma]

Sept 3, 2021 13:08:20 GMT -5 jerseygirl said:

Sure, early Medicare sounds great and would help many. Unfortunately Medicare as is is expected to run out of money around 2034.
So money or tax issue needs to be addressed. Working people right now have deductions for Medicare to pay for folks already in system. These taxes would need to be increased.

I read somewhere that Medicare Part A will have to start reducing what it's paying out in 2026.

That's the part that covers hospitals, hospice, etc. if I understand things correctly.

[giramomma]

My parents paid 10K a year per person for extra medicare coverage.

Huge blessing for Dad's cancer, since they didn't have many out of pocket costs for that.

This won't affect us. I already took a job for the benefits, rather than the pay. I understand that is a luxury. But, also in part, smartness on my end. Yes it would have been nice to go into the private sector and earn more money. But the money we would have earned really wouldn't have moved the needle on our lifestyle all that much.

I can convert unused sick leave to cover retiree health insurance premiums when I retire. Then, of course, I have to start paying. I think the retirement baseline is 30 years of service, plus you have to be 50-some thing to retire.

I CAN retire at 57. And I might. Who knows what this cancer thing is going to mean for my future. It's not the best choice. Best choice is to retire at 60ish.

I will absolutely not rely on the federal government for my health care needs. Or let the federal government dictate what kind of treatment I can get if I am sick. Or how many days they will let me stay. That assumes that the folks elected into power represent me. Haven't had one yet that does. Voting is more of an exercise of which person can I tolerate and won't make things 100 times worse.  Not a very high bar.

I also have been on the same insurance for 20 years, now. I feel like I know the ins and outs pretty well. Never had a problem until this billing snafu I'm going through. Always been pleased with the access to the medical care for myself and my kids.

IMVHO, we need to get to a point where folks are interested and able to take jobs for the benefits. Otherwise we're going to have a hard time eventually with getting work done in the public sector.

[Deleted]

Sept 4, 2021 7:35:39 GMT -5 giramomma said:

I will absolutely not rely on the federal government for my health care needs. Or let the federal government dictate what kind of treatment I can get if I am sick. Or how many days they will let me stay. That assumes that the folks elected into power represent me. Haven't had one yet that does. Voting is more of an exercise of which person can I tolerate and won't make things 100 times worse.  Not a very high bar.

Unless you have an iron-clad union contract (and you might), this may be out of your control.  According to the Early Retirement Board, the City of NY is now trying to push all of its retirees into a Medicare Advantage plan. Susana taught for years and she's got that.  My brother's company provided retiree health insurance- until it didn't. He and DSIL are very grateful to have finally reached Medicare age.

So far I haven't had any big issues with Medicare and I've just been though a boatload of cardiac tests.  I didn't mention in my earlier post that I do fork out $150 every 3 or 4 months for my own bloodwork because my previous doc's office couldn't code the claims properly and I almost had to fork over $800 for "not medically necessary" tests (they forgot to have me sign a waiver so I was off the hook) but it's worth it to me.  No BS, no surprise bills, I go when I feel like it and get the results the next day.

[giramomma]

Sept 4, 2021 7:51:44 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

Unless you have an iron-clad union contract (and you might), this may be out of your control.  According to the Early Retirement Board, the City of NY is now trying to push all of its retirees into a Medicare Advantage plan. 

No union contract. Even better. My elected officials at the state level use the same benefit system I do.

Our state lawmakers like to bitch and moan about how state workers are lower than folks on SNAP. But the law makers aren't exactly going to change the benefits for themselves, either, if they perceive the change is going to be detrimental to them.

[susana1954]

Sept 4, 2021 8:00:46 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Sept 4, 2021 7:51:44 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

Unless you have an iron-clad union contract (and you might), this may be out of your control.  According to the Early Retirement Board, the City of NY is now trying to push all of its retirees into a Medicare Advantage plan. 

No union contract. Even better. My elected officials at the state level use the same benefit system I do.

Our state lawmakers like to bitch and moan about how state workers are lower than folks on SNAP. But the law makers aren't exactly going to change the benefits for themselves, either, if they perceive the change is going to be detrimental to them.

Our elected officials don't get retiree benefits, but the judicial system, etc. does.  They as well as other state employees are also on a Medicare Advantage plan.  The state was looking for a way to get rid of retiree healthcare costs.  They subsidize it, though.

I'd be curious, @athena53, as to a breakdown of your supplement and prescription healthcare (Part D) cost.  Or is that part of your supplement? I was coming in at about that price for DH without an IRMAA surcharge.

As far as limitations, I am operating on second-hand knowledge since I haven't had the type of issues that test what is and isn't covered.  This is what the ladies of the church told me, but I am sure it varies by supplement.  I know my present eye drops were only recently added and are at Tier 3 so have a $60 copay per bottle, which lasts almost a month.  Previously, it wasn't covered at all because it was too new.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Sept 4, 2021 7:35:39 GMT -5 giramomma said:

My parents paid 10K a year per person for extra medicare coverage.

Huge blessing for Dad's cancer, since they didn't have many out of pocket costs for that.

What the heck?  We're they really high income and paying IRMAA?  I didn't think anyone paid that much in medicare supplements.  My aunt said she pays about $400/month in supplements and she had 0 out of pocket for her cancer treatments. 

[Deleted]

Sept 4, 2021 12:29:08 GMT -5 susana1954 said:

I'd be curious, @athena53 , as to a breakdown of your supplement and prescription healthcare (Part D) cost.  Or is that part of your supplement? I was coming in at about that price for DH without an IRMAA surcharge.

$213.25 to United Healthcare for the supplement
$297.00 for Medicare B (double the base rate due to IRMAA)
$55.10 for the Prescription Plan- cheapest I could find since I'm on only one prescription (also double the base rate)

[Rukh O'Rorke]

Sept 3, 2021 12:34:47 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

Overall, probably a good idea.

It would bring a younger, presumably healthier group into Medicare with lower average healthcare costs.

It would free up opportunities for younger people as the 60+ who were just working for the insurance leave.

It would certainly ease the burden on early retirees.  My brother retired at 60 with retiree health care fully paid for- till they just stopped it 2 years later.  He and DSIL ended up paying $22K/year for ACA and they didn't qualify for subsidies.  I'm sure plenty of people fall in between the cracks- enough savings and income that they don't qualify for subsidies but the cost of ACA is anything but "affordable".

Downsides:

Medicare is taxpayer-supported unless you're so rich you're paying the full IRMAA surcharge (individual over $500K income, couple over $750K).  More people in the program means more support needed.

Hospitals lose money on Medicaid patients, just about break even on MediCARE and make money on those with private insurance.  This will shift towards more break-even patients.

We're extending Medicare to people who haven't paid into the system as long.  All of us get the same Medicare options whether we worked 20 quarters at minimum wage or whether we worked 40 years.  Having people who are now paying into Medicare stop paying and start enrolling will weaken an already financially-strapped system.

I'm also worried about the slippery slope.  Will it be 50-55 next?  

It might be a partial answer but it has some adverse consequences.

but maybe that would really work out?

if this age group used a lot less services - and maybe if this age group got more regular preventative care - could be putting money back in rather than a net loss.

[susana1954]

Sept 4, 2021 12:59:46 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

Sept 4, 2021 12:29:08 GMT -5 susana1954 said:

I'd be curious, @athena53 , as to a breakdown of your supplement and prescription healthcare (Part D) cost.  Or is that part of your supplement? I was coming in at about that price for DH without an IRMAA surcharge.

$213.25 to United Healthcare for the supplement
$297.00 for Medicare B (double the base rate due to IRMAA)
$55.10 for the Prescription Plan- cheapest I could find since I'm on only one prescription (also double the base rate)

Ok, that is about what I was looking at for DH except the prescription plan was almost $200.  Many of his meds were generic, but there were so many.  He was also on Brilinta, a Tier 3 drug.

[giramomma]

Sept 4, 2021 12:40:09 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Sept 4, 2021 7:35:39 GMT -5 giramomma said:

My parents paid 10K a year per person for extra medicare coverage.

Huge blessing for Dad's cancer, since they didn't have many out of pocket costs for that.

What the heck?  We're they really high income and paying IRMAA?  I didn't think anyone paid that much in medicare supplements.  My aunt said she pays about $400/month in supplements and she had 0 out of pocket for her cancer treatments. 

I dunno.  Dad picked it out. I wasn't privvy to why he went with what he did.

Don't forget, he had cancer treatments for about a decade. Some months his medical expenses were in excess of 100K. And that was while he was able to lead a very normal life.

[Deleted]

Sept 4, 2021 13:26:04 GMT -5 Rukh O'Rorke said:

but maybe that would really work out?

if this age group used a lot less services - and maybe if this age group got more regular preventative care - could be putting money back in rather than a net loss.

I don't think the numbers work, now that I go through them. Taking someone age 60 who's not paying an IRMAA surcharge:

Medicare A: instead of paying about $300/month into Medicare (employer and employee contribution on about $30K/year) they pay nothing and have coverage. It's an even bigger loss to Medicare if high earners leave early since they were paying the same % on a higher income for the same coverage.

Medicare B and the prescription plan: using what I'm paying in MO x-IRMAA, they'd be paying about $175/month for 80% of doctors, outpatient and prescription coverage costs. That's highly subsidized by the taxpayers.

More regular preventive care? I wish. I have only to look at the condition and the grocery carts of my fellow 60-and-up humans to see how messages about healthy living fall on deaf ears.