gs11rmb
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Post by gs11rmb on Aug 12, 2021 7:45:28 GMT -5
giramomma Cheesey mentioned untreated depression.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Aug 12, 2021 8:19:50 GMT -5
If your child would end up homeless, wouldn’t you do whatever was necessary to prevent that? Even if it was something you didn’t want to do? We have all been faced with less than desirable choices. No different here. She needs to put aside her issues and do what is right by her son I don't disagree with you, but you should know by now that not all parents do right by their kids. I mean, sometimes it's very overt. I worked kids whose parents put them lowest on the totem pole. IOW, neither the parents did right by the kids. Sometimes it's not so overt. My parents didn't do right by me. But, unless you actually lived with us, you wouldn't see behind the curtain. I am under no illusions that people will do the right thing. My job is predicated on people doing the wrong thing. But, if her child being homeless does not motivate her, I do not know what will.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Aug 12, 2021 8:23:24 GMT -5
I don't disagree with you, but you should know by now that not all parents do right by their kids. I mean, sometimes it's very overt. I worked kids whose parents put them lowest on the totem pole. IOW, neither the parents did right by the kids. Sometimes it's not so overt. My parents didn't do right by me. But, unless you actually lived with us, you wouldn't see behind the curtain. There are also mental health issues at play in this situation. Making the rational decision to either vaccinate or find a new job seems so straightforward to everyone posting but it doesn't sound as if Cheesy FL-Vol 's daughter is thinking straight. I've never had to deal with this situation so perhaps my advice is completely wrong but have you considered not trying to influence her decision? Do you think it would be effective to say "ok your choice is the vaccine or homelessness and the involvement of DFCS, so what do you want to do"? From a legal standpoint, untreated depression is irrelevant. Unless she is incompetent(and competency BROADLY interpreted) she is free t do what she wants, unless DCF is involved. If the child is truly at risk, they need to be notified. But that does not appear to be the case. In these situations, all that can be done is offer advice, and then stand back. Saving people from themselves is impossible. All that can be done is try to minimize the fallout in her child, which may require the authorities involvement. But people do not want to go that route.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 12, 2021 8:31:04 GMT -5
I don't disagree with you, but you should know by now that not all parents do right by their kids. I mean, sometimes it's very overt. I worked kids whose parents put them lowest on the totem pole. IOW, neither the parents did right by the kids. Sometimes it's not so overt. My parents didn't do right by me. But, unless you actually lived with us, you wouldn't see behind the curtain. I am under no illusions that people will do the right thing. My job is predicated on people doing the wrong thing. But, if her child being homeless does not motivate her, I do not know what will. My granddaughter would not be homeless. But I am not sure how her mother isn't motivated to get vaccinated with the way she talks about her kid's father.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Aug 12, 2021 9:17:28 GMT -5
I am under no illusions that people will do the right thing. My job is predicated on people doing the wrong thing. But, if her child being homeless does not motivate her, I do not know what will. My granddaughter would not be homeless. But I am not sure how her mother isn't motivated to get vaccinated with the way she talks about her kid's father. Does that mean your child comes to live with you as well? Because, unless DCF is involved, that is what would happen. Then all the messy family dynamics that are talked about on this board occur. Not that I disagree with your position, but that is how people get away with bad behavior and decisions. They always have a fallback position, and the reasonable one is there to pick up the pieces.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 12, 2021 9:24:13 GMT -5
The granddaughter will go live with her father if her mother can no longer provide her with a home.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Aug 12, 2021 9:29:26 GMT -5
There are also mental health issues at play in this situation. Making the rational decision to either vaccinate or find a new job seems so straightforward to everyone posting but it doesn't sound as if Cheesy FL-Vol 's daughter is thinking straight. Did I miss where Chessy said her daughter is mentally ill? Even still. Chessy cannot force her daughter into treatment if that is the case, as long as her daughter is an adult. Maybe the best she could do is hire a lawyer to get custody of her grandkid, but I'm not getting getting the vibe that it's that dire from Chessy. (But, it is hard to get tone, and all that sort of verbal communication from a messsage board.)
My kids go to a private school where money flows. Many parents are pro-trump, because money is the most important thing. Many believe that the rules don't apply to them. More over, many of the act as if parenting their own children is an inconvenience. So they complain about the measure that the school took to keep the kids safe last year, and then they go on unneeded vacations to Florida during the height of the pandemic last fall/winter. Furthermore, some families did not quarantine after travel like they were supposed to, before sending the kids to school. Because why not?
They aren't mentally ill.
I agree with Giramomma - I also live in WI, but I live in Milwaukee County in a more Affluent Suburb. Last Fall we had a slate of anti-mask, keep schools open at any cost School Board Members Elected to the School Board. Even though the experts and Administrators said students should wear masks in School - at least those under 12/unvaccinated - they voted to be open with no requirement that students wear masks. My 27 year old son is also dug in and says he will not get vaccinated. We are hoping that once the Pfizer Vaccine is approved by the FDA he will get vaccinated. My son is perfectly sane. We feel he is just listening to bad advice. DH and I are also deeply troubled by our Son's refusal to get vaccinated.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Aug 12, 2021 9:31:37 GMT -5
What are the odds of her actually being homeless?
I have anxiety and as my name implies can tend towards drama but I actually know in the back of my head the odds. People who know me know when to let me go.
It's if I am calm and serious they know to worry. An actual crisis is my comfort zone and my personality does a 180. DH has commented it's quite eerie.
She lives in a state that is taking pride in its shitty COVID response. Very few employers are requiring vaccination. She works in an industry that is hurting for bodies so jobs are abundant.
She wouldn't be unemployed long.
And statistically speaking most Americans are one to two paychecks away from homelessness should we take all their kids too? Remember YM is way above the average financially.
And like it or not not getting vaccinated is not child endangerment according to the law. Personal feelings aren't justification for calling CPS.
Unless she's an actual danger to the child I think escalating it that far is rather overkill.
You can't save stupid people from themselves. You need to weigh how much earth you are willing to scorch in an attempt to do so.
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Aug 12, 2021 9:37:34 GMT -5
I saw this on the NYT a couple days ago, it might help to show it to her to help put into context what she's been hearing in the news. People that were vaccinated get COVID, but it's still a small % that are in the hospital/dying. www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/08/10/us/covid-breakthrough-infections-vaccines.htmlIf I was really worried and just wanted to get her over the hump, I'd probably just say "Look, you know I love you and I'm asking you to trust my research on this. Just get it". Obviously I hope my kids would trust me over Dr. Mercola.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Aug 12, 2021 9:52:14 GMT -5
I saw this on the NYT a couple days ago, it might help to show it to her to help put into context what she's been hearing in the news. People that were vaccinated get COVID, but it's still a small % that are in the hospital/dying. www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/08/10/us/covid-breakthrough-infections-vaccines.htmlIf I was really worried and just wanted to get her over the hump, I'd probably just say "Look, you know I love you and I'm asking you to trust my research on this. Just get it". Obviously I hope my kids would trust me over Dr. Mercola. I get what Cheesy is dealing with. I have spent the last 18 months playing whack-a-mole with conspiracy theories with my sister. It is utterly exhausting, because it seems like there is another one that comes out weekly by those who live in those rabbit holes. BTW……the mainstream media is in on all of this (according to them), so a NYT article is useless. This is all part of it. I have the education and experience and all of these conspiracy theorists STLL trump my education and experience in my sister’s eyes. This hurts me and my ego not a little. For me, I am not above using bribery.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Aug 12, 2021 9:59:13 GMT -5
I saw this on the NYT a couple days ago, it might help to show it to her to help put into context what she's been hearing in the news. People that were vaccinated get COVID, but it's still a small % that are in the hospital/dying. www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/08/10/us/covid-breakthrough-infections-vaccines.htmlIf I was really worried and just wanted to get her over the hump, I'd probably just say "Look, you know I love you and I'm asking you to trust my research on this. Just get it". Obviously I hope my kids would trust me over Dr. Mercola. I get what Cheesy is dealing with. I have spent the last 18 months playing whack-a-mole with conspiracy theories with my sister. It is utterly exhausting, because it seems like there is another one that comes out weekly by those who live in those rabbit holes. BTW……the mainstream media is in on all of this (according to them), so a NYT article is useless. This is all part of it. I have the education and experience and all of these conspiracy theorists STLL trump my education and experience in my sister’s eyes. This hurts me and my ego not a little. For me, I am not above using bribery. I spent an hour with a patient trying to debunk all of these. It is utterly exhausting, and it is far from certain that it was effective. people are just convinced of their beliefs, and they are unwilling to be convinced otherwise
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gs11rmb
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Post by gs11rmb on Aug 12, 2021 10:26:01 GMT -5
What are the odds of her actually being homeless? I have anxiety and as my name implies can tend towards drama but I actually know in the back of my head the odds. People who know me know when to let me go. It's if I am calm and serious they know to worry. An actual crisis is my comfort zone and my personality does a 180. DH has commented it's quite eerie. She lives in a state that is taking pride in its shitty COVID response. Very few employers are requiring vaccination. She works in an industry that is hurting for bodies so jobs are abundant. She wouldn't be unemployed long. And statistically speaking most Americans are one to two paychecks away from homelessness should we take all their kids too? Remember YM is way above the average financially. And like it or not not getting vaccinated is not child endangerment according to the law. Personal feelings aren't justification for calling CPS.
Unless she's an actual danger to the child I think escalating it that far is rather overkill.You can't save stupid people from themselves. You need to weigh how much earth you are willing to scorch in an attempt to do so. I'm sorry if I gave the impression that I thought Cheesey should call CPS. That's not what I meant at all. It doesn't seem as if her grand child is in danger, well, beyond the risk that his mother contracts COVID. What I was trying to say is that rather than talking the daughter out of her supposed either/or dilemma (government tracking poison v. homelessness) just ask her which choice she is going to make. If she chooses homelessness then CPS will get involved to ensure the child is safe. That doesn't mean that she'll automatically lose custody.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Aug 12, 2021 14:54:46 GMT -5
I saw this on the NYT a couple days ago, it might help to show it to her to help put into context what she's been hearing in the news. People that were vaccinated get COVID, but it's still a small % that are in the hospital/dying. www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/08/10/us/covid-breakthrough-infections-vaccines.htmlIf I was really worried and just wanted to get her over the hump, I'd probably just say "Look, you know I love you and I'm asking you to trust my research on this. Just get it". Obviously I hope my kids would trust me over Dr. Mercola. I get what Cheesy is dealing with. I have spent the last 18 months playing whack-a-mole with conspiracy theories with my sister. It is utterly exhausting, because it seems like there is another one that comes out weekly by those who live in those rabbit holes. BTW……the mainstream media is in on all of this (according to them), so a NYT article is useless. This is all part of it. I have the education and experience and all of these conspiracy theorists STLL trump my education and experience in my sister’s eyes. This hurts me and my ego not a little. For me, I am not above using bribery. Annnnnddddddd…….. my bribe didn’t work. We leave weeks from today for the Maldives, and my sister, who promised me she would get vaccinated did not. I have now paid for her trip, and she lied to me. All trust is destroyed.
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daisylu
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Post by daisylu on Aug 12, 2021 14:58:55 GMT -5
I get what Cheesy is dealing with. I have spent the last 18 months playing whack-a-mole with conspiracy theories with my sister. It is utterly exhausting, because it seems like there is another one that comes out weekly by those who live in those rabbit holes. BTW……the mainstream media is in on all of this (according to them), so a NYT article is useless. This is all part of it. I have the education and experience and all of these conspiracy theorists STLL trump my education and experience in my sister’s eyes. This hurts me and my ego not a little. For me, I am not above using bribery. Annnnnddddddd…….. my bribe didn’t work. We leave weeks from today for the Maldives, and my sister, who promised me she would get vaccinated did not. I have now paid for her trip, and she lied to me. All trust is destroyed. She does understand that now she can not go, right?! WTF is wrong with people?
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Aug 12, 2021 15:00:51 GMT -5
Annnnnddddddd…….. my bribe didn’t work. We leave weeks from today for the Maldives, and my sister, who promised me she would get vaccinated did not. I have now paid for her trip, and she lied to me. All trust is destroyed. She does understand that now she can not go, right?! WTF is wrong with people? It is too late. Money has been paid for tickets and reservations.
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daisylu
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Post by daisylu on Aug 12, 2021 15:05:49 GMT -5
She does understand that now she can not go, right?! WTF is wrong with people? It is too late. Money has been paid for tickets and reservations. They do not require vaccinations? She would still go, knowing how she duped you? That takes some nerve.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Aug 12, 2021 15:07:29 GMT -5
It is too late. Money has been paid for tickets and reservations. They do not require vaccinations? She would still go, knowing how she duped you? That takes some nerve. Nope, no requirement for vaccines. But she has a prescription for imervectin (sp?) and hydrochloroquine!
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daisylu
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Post by daisylu on Aug 12, 2021 15:09:30 GMT -5
Family sucks sometimes.
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Cheesy FL-Vol
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Post by Cheesy FL-Vol on Aug 12, 2021 15:09:35 GMT -5
She does understand that now she can not go, right?! WTF is wrong with people? It is too late. Money has been paid for tickets and reservations. Take someone else more deserving to fill her spot.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Aug 12, 2021 15:12:22 GMT -5
They do not require vaccinations? She would still go, knowing how she duped you? That takes some nerve. Nope, no requirement for vaccines. But she has a prescription for imervectin (sp?) and hydrochloroquine!That will work! FYI, it is Ivermectin. The paste is flying off the shelves at farm stores
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Aug 12, 2021 15:13:00 GMT -5
It is a sunk cost. I would eat the money just for lying. Enjoy your trip without her
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Cheesy FL-Vol
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Post by Cheesy FL-Vol on Aug 12, 2021 15:16:30 GMT -5
It is my hope that she goes ahead and gets the vaccine. She knows she can’t lose income. Her alternative is to find a different place to work. She is one of those that I think burns bridges, so not entirely sure how easy it will be in spite of demand for workers.
The child’s father apparently pays CS, but doesn’t really want custody of him, so she needs to do some adulting.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2021 15:18:57 GMT -5
I get what Cheesy is dealing with. I have spent the last 18 months playing whack-a-mole with conspiracy theories with my sister. It is utterly exhausting, because it seems like there is another one that comes out weekly by those who live in those rabbit holes. BTW……the mainstream media is in on all of this (according to them), so a NYT article is useless. This is all part of it. I have the education and experience and all of these conspiracy theorists STLL trump my education and experience in my sister’s eyes. This hurts me and my ego not a little. For me, I am not above using bribery. Annnnnddddddd…….. my bribe didn’t work. We leave weeks from today for the Maldives, and my sister, who promised me she would get vaccinated did not. I have now paid for her trip, and she lied to me. All trust is destroyed. Oh wow. So, how is that supposed to work? You’re supposed to take a pleasant, fun trip with her, like nothing happened? I can’t imagine.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2021 15:20:08 GMT -5
It is my hope that she goes ahead and gets the vaccine. She knows she can’t lose income. Her alternative is to find a different place to work. She is one of those that I think burns bridges, so not entirely sure how easy it will be in spite of demand for workers. The child’s father apparently pays CS, but doesn’t really want custody of him, so she needs to do some adulting. I’m sorry Cheesy.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Aug 12, 2021 16:14:50 GMT -5
She does understand that now she can not go, right?! WTF is wrong with people? It is too late. Money has been paid for tickets and reservations. On a much smaller scale my in laws did this to his family. Host said all adults must be fully vaccinated. They drug their feet, then skipped their 2nd shot because they had colds (of all the guidelines to follow!) Host made them all get negative covid tests before coming but still let them which shocked me. It's a sunk cost either way. Can you look at her for 2 weeks and still enjoy your trip? I think that would wreck the trip for me.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Aug 12, 2021 16:15:51 GMT -5
She does understand that now she can not go, right?! WTF is wrong with people? It is too late. Money has been paid for tickets and reservations. There is no way I would take her. Take someone who is vaccinated.
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Post by empress of self-improvement on Aug 12, 2021 16:25:40 GMT -5
It is too late. Money has been paid for tickets and reservations. There is no way I would take her. Take someone who is vaccinated. And has a passport. Which, unfortunately, is not me, DAMN IT!!!! I wanted to go!!! I'm with everyone else. She knew what she had to do, didn't do it and needs to pretend she's an adult and deal with the consequences. DO NOT TAKE HER!!!!
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 12, 2021 16:36:42 GMT -5
If your child would end up homeless, wouldn’t you do whatever was necessary to prevent that? Even if it was something you didn’t want to do? We have all been faced with less than desirable choices. No different here. She needs to put aside her issues and do what is right by her son Mental illness aside (along with not doing what is best for the child at all costs) she is likely convinced that the vaccine will kill her and harm her child (from that vaccine shedding that is happening). She thinks she IS doing the best thing for her kid, because she is avoiding the poison, mind control, micro chip, dangerous, deadly vaccine. There is a group of people who insist the CDC website has proof that the number of people who have died from the vaccine is greater than the number of people who died from covid. They probably did not notice it was cdc.ru or something like that.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Aug 12, 2021 16:54:47 GMT -5
If your child would end up homeless, wouldn’t you do whatever was necessary to prevent that? Even if it was something you didn’t want to do? We have all been faced with less than desirable choices. No different here. She needs to put aside her issues and do what is right by her son Mental illness aside (along with not doing what is best for the child at all costs) she is likely convinced that the vaccine will kill her and harm her child (from that vaccine shedding that is happening). She thinks she IS doing the best thing for her kid, because she is avoiding the poison, mind control, micro chip, dangerous, deadly vaccine. There is a group of people who insist the CDC website has proof that the number of people who have died from the vaccine is greater than the number of people who died from covid. They probably did not notice it was cdc.ru or something like that. I realize that is her thinking. I unfortunately had my fill of that rabbit hole last week. Not enough alcohol in the world to erase it. People are allowed to make poor decisions. It appears we are going backwards in the intelligence department. If it wasn’t an infectious disease, it wouldn’t matter so much
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Aug 12, 2021 17:01:00 GMT -5
There is no way I would take her. Take someone who is vaccinated. And has a passport. Which, unfortunately, is not me, DAMN IT!!!! I wanted to go!!! I'm with everyone else. She knew what she had to do, didn't do it and needs to pretend she's an adult and deal with the consequences. DO NOT TAKE HER!!!! So she said if she gets the vaccination and has a blood clot, it will be on me. I told her that I accept that risk. That risk is lower if she gets covid. My other alternative is that we have not paid anything other than the deposit for her room and board. We have 24 hours to cancel. We can tell her that even though her flight is a sunk cost, her room is on her. It will kill her to know that she has a business class airfare and needs to pony up twice that to stay where we are at. TD is at the dentist, so he knows nothing about this yet.
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