Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Jan 19, 2021 23:29:31 GMT -5
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 20, 2021 1:40:05 GMT -5
No, this study does NOT say anything about how protective the vaccine is against the new variant, only how protective antibody to a previous COVID infection is, and a crappy job at that.
In the study, Moore and her colleagues took blood from 44 people who'd had Covid-19. Nearly all of their cases were confirmed to have occurred prior to September, which is before the variant was spotted in South Africa.
The researchers then looked to see whether their antibodies would fight off the new variant. For about half of the 44 people, their antibodies were powerless against the new variant.
From this statement, they took blood from those who had been infected before Sept (were the antibody levels normalized? I doubt it by the way it was worded) and assumed they’d inactivate the variant virus. So you have varying amounts of antibody, from people who have been infected long (>4 months, but they know antibody starts declining by then) before the study started. People who have been infected have cells in their body which will ‘turn on’ to produce more antibody when stimulated. Why make antibody when there is no infection? It’s just a waste of energy.
Study not peer reviewed, and from what I read it was a pretty poorly designed study.
More crappy science reporting.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 20, 2021 7:08:32 GMT -5
In addition, even with all those issues, the antibodies were 50% effective. Again, the sky is not falling, and there was nothing about severity of illness. A vaccines job is s to prevent severe infections and death. If you get mild symptoms, does it matter. Just makes it more imperative for everyone to be vaccinated.
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Jan 20, 2021 7:40:08 GMT -5
This kind of reporting is one reason why a lot of people have just given up...they hear or read this stuff and decide this is never going to end so why bother anymore.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 20, 2021 8:25:59 GMT -5
All pandemics end. Just a matter of how
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Blonde Granny
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Post by Blonde Granny on Jan 20, 2021 8:31:02 GMT -5
Fear not......Trump is gone and Biden will be your president now......nothing but rose buds and happy days from now on.
BG....and her last comments on what will be coming next.
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saveinla
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Post by saveinla on Jan 20, 2021 8:33:39 GMT -5
Fear not......Trump is gone and Biden will be your president now......nothing but rose buds and happy days from now on. BG....and her last comments on what will be coming next. Not really - you cannot bring back 400,000 dead people - all of whom were very important to their family. Hope you think of that when you make these comments.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jan 20, 2021 9:56:49 GMT -5
Fear not......Trump is gone and Biden will be your president now......nothing but rose buds and happy days from now on. BG....and her last comments on what will be coming next. Not really - you cannot bring back 400,000 dead people - all of whom were very important to their family. Hope you think of that when you make these comments. Exactly. The 400,000 deceased had never been acknowledged by our federal government until last night. Biden and Harris did a touching tribute to the 400,000 deceased and their family and friends.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 20, 2021 10:19:51 GMT -5
Not only that, but all the decisions surrounding the pandemic that the Trump administration has made has led to our current situation. Doing anything to improve our situation now will take a herculean effort, because half the country will not believe what is being said. That is trump's legacy. It will take a concerted effort, cooperation, and time to solve this. But lets pretend that the current situation was not due to Trump's incompetence.
If 10,000 Americans died from a terrorist attack, just think of what we would have done. Compare that to what we have done with 40 times that number.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 20, 2021 12:01:20 GMT -5
This kind of reporting is one reason why a lot of people have just given up...they hear or read this stuff and decide this is never going to end so why bother anymore. This kind of reporting drives me nuts. The study does NOT say what the title says it does. But most don’t understand this. In fact, the study didn’t even look at vaccinated individuals.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2021 13:30:42 GMT -5
Thanks, mich and pulmonarymd, for making sense of this, as usual.
Serious question: we (everywhere) were flying blind a year ago. We knew little about spread from asymptomatic individuals, the wide range of severity (from "no worse than the flu" to MUCH worse, sometimes with serious lingering health problems), the most effective way to treat it, how it was spread, etc.
In hindsight, what should we have done differently? Yes, denying it, calling it a "hoax" and ignoring science certainly put the USA behind other countries but even the countries that reacted quickly are struggling now (UK, Germany). Many of the most effective smartphone-based tools for contact tracing and enforcing quarantines would be unacceptable in the US. (In Taiwan if you're quarantined and you go out without your phone, you will be heavily fined if they call you at random and you don't answer.)
I'm like a field of corn- all ears!
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 20, 2021 13:47:02 GMT -5
1 Should have been using WHO or other countries test kits 2 Once it became apparent masks were effective, national mandate 3 Should not have locked down entire country 4 Better CDC guidelines for what measures to use based on rate of positivity 5 Better coordination of treatment algorithms, and funding studies so we would have a better understanding of what works 6 Consider paying people to stay home and more pressure on Congress regarding second coronavirus bill 7 Not been as aggressive about re-opening 8 Better at prioritizing what should be open, i.e. schools vs bars for example 9 Used defense production act to ramp up manufacturing tests, needles, PPE, etc 10 Better coordination with Congress to get money to states to deliver vaccine 11 More transparencies about everything surrounding COVID 12 Actually pay attention to the pandemic playbook that was left behind, not ignore lessons from the scenario they gamed in October 2019, not pulled support for the cooperation with China regarding emerging diseases, coordinated with WHO, and actually cooperate with our allies
IOW: not much
In reality, we still would be in a difficult place, but if you look at the projected dead if we tried vs what has happened, it is criminal. The world thought we were best positioned to deal with this. Our response has been abysmal. The richest, most technologically advance country in the world, and this is the best we could do? Never would have believed it. And the consequence of all those poor decisions is that our ability to contain the virus is basically non-existent now. The course of the pandemic is basically set in stone from now until the end of March. The only things we can do: actually wear masks and socially distance, since we will not shut the country down. And pray that the vaccine works as advertised, manufacturing can be ramped up more quickly, and it can be delivered as fast as it is made. SMH
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 20, 2021 15:20:07 GMT -5
Thanks, mich and pulmonarymd, for making sense of this, as usual. Serious question: we (everywhere) were flying blind a year ago. We knew little about spread from asymptomatic individuals, the wide range of severity (from "no worse than the flu" to MUCH worse, sometimes with serious lingering health problems), the most effective way to treat it, how it was spread, etc. In hindsight, what should we have done differently? Yes, denying it, calling it a "hoax" and ignoring science certainly put the USA behind other countries but even the countries that reacted quickly are struggling now (UK, Germany). Many of the most effective smartphone-based tools for contact tracing and enforcing quarantines would be unacceptable in the US. (In Taiwan if you're quarantined and you go out without your phone, you will be heavily fined if they call you at random and you don't answer.) I'm like a field of corn- all ears! The first thing was not disbanded the Emerging Infectious disease group. This was a group that was keeping an eye on infectious diseases throughout the world, and China was an area of interest. This really left us in a huge hole, because everyone knows China lies and can't be trusted. Had we still had our connections in China, we might have gotten a better handle on how bad this disease was long before China finally realized they had a problem on their hands. I think that Trump pulled this group's funding in 2019?? Much of what we learned, we learned on the fly. We learned that fomites (inanimate surfaces) were not as much of a source of infection as they initially thought and airborne transmission was much more important. It was about this time that masks became more important and sanitizing everything that got touched was less so. We were in Vancouver mid Feb and had stopped at a drug store. In Vancouver (which has a huge Asian population and masks are common there not even during a pandemic), you could not find a mask. I was restocking us with the good cough syrup and talking to their pharmacist about the sign that they had up that the masks they had were only for employees, not for sale. I asked him about the sign and he said that they had been out of masks for nearly a month at that time. This is a good example of Monday morning quarterbacking for me, that Vancouver did not have near the problem of other cities in Canada, but they also have a substantial Asian population. I wonder if that helped? We should not have been so arrogant to turn down the WHO's test kits. It was stupid of the US to remake the wheel, when we were already behind the 8 ball. The fact that the cause for the US test failure was a dumbass mistake never should have been made. I'm still shaking my head over this one. This is sterile technique 101. There should never have been a lack of PPE in the US. We had the resources to act, and didn't. We were (still are) wholly dependent upon other countries for PPE. Companies were willing to shift to help, but the only industry that really did this to any great effect was the distilling industry making hand sanitizer. Having any sort of announcement go through the HHS/White House to consider the political implications of what the CDC thought needed to be done. Their hands were tied, and their message diluted. This goes into the fact that there was political pressure to minimize COVID's impact on the US. The fact that there were people other than scientists that were trying to control the MMWR is absolutely reprehensible. As a result, they have probably lost a lot of very good scientists because they didn't need to be put into the position that the HHS and the White House put them in. I'm not sure about the head of the CDC, about how much pushback he provided. Optics suggest not much, but I really don't know. I think someone stronger might have been able to do better. Not politicizing the disease. WA got hit hard and we got shut down fast and hard. I think as a result, things could have been as bad here as it was in NY last spring. Our governor was using Fauci as a resource and listened. I do understand why things were shut down, because by suggesting people SIP rather than congregating, people still tended to congregate - but in the areas that were open. Going to the grocery store became a family activity. There should have been far more support for schools than they had. DeVos should fall on the sword for this, she did a piss poor job in the cabinet. The popular press and the lack of science knowledge in the US really did hamper us too. The article in the OP is a great example of this. Too many publications are coming out that are bypassing peer review - which mostly is crappy science. Unfortunately, few people can discern the difference between crappy science and good science and the press treats them both the same way. The previous administration was left a Pandemic Playbook as to everything that needed to be considered if something happened like this actually did happen. Absolutely no one cracked it open to see what was considered. Most of the problems that the US had were discussed in this. IOW - this administration had a set of instructions on what they needed to do. Instead, they decided to wing it. And that's the reason why we have the mess we do right now. It was likely going to be bad, but it shouldn't have been like this. Early in the pandemic, I read a string of emails by epidemiologists that were sent among each other in the US government's response to the pandemic. You could read the frustration that they all had in their emails, and they were talking of things that I had never even thought of. So many people knew what needed to be done, but they were silenced.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Jan 20, 2021 20:16:55 GMT -5
1 Should have been using WHO or other countries test kits 2 Once it became apparent masks were effective, national mandate 3 Should not have locked down entire country 4 Better CDC guidelines for what measures to use based on rate of positivity 5 Better coordination of treatment algorithms, and funding studies so we would have a better understanding of what works 6 Consider paying people to stay home and more pressure on Congress regarding second coronavirus bill 7 Not been as aggressive about re-opening 8 Better at prioritizing what should be open, i.e. schools vs bars for example 9 Used defense production act to ramp up manufacturing tests, needles, PPE, etc 10 Better coordination with Congress to get money to states to deliver vaccine 11 More transparencies about everything surrounding COVID 12 Actually pay attention to the pandemic playbook that was left behind, not ignore lessons from the scenario they gamed in October 2019, not pulled support for the cooperation with China regarding emerging diseases, coordinated with WHO, and actually cooperate with our allies IOW: not much In reality, we still would be in a difficult place, but if you look at the projected dead if we tried vs what has happened, it is criminal. The world thought we were best positioned to deal with this. Our response has been abysmal. The richest, most technologically advance country in the world, and this is the best we could do? Never would have believed it. And the consequence of all those poor decisions is that our ability to contain the virus is basically non-existent now. The course of the pandemic is basically set in stone from now until the end of March. The only things we can do: actually wear masks and socially distance, since we will not shut the country down. And pray that the vaccine works as advertised, manufacturing can be ramped up more quickly, and it can be delivered as fast as it is made. SMH you forgot a few pulmonary: 13. Not destroying faith in science to make yourself look "better" and stoking the belief that "my" opinion is just as valid and correct as that of people who actually studied infectious diseases 14. Not playing snake oil salesman (I really want someone to pump a certain person full of disinfectant and shove an UV lamp up his ***) 15. Not destroying all confidence in the news media because they don't declare you the greatest ever and thereby removing a vehicle of reaching people with the information they need to hear. Including the FACT that when faced with a new, unknown disease it is to be expected that information and recommendations changes due to additional information becoming available!
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jan 20, 2021 21:05:16 GMT -5
I can testify that eating lysol does not work. I used a wipe then made the mistake of removing my braces without rinsing first. Blech. Here I sit still sick. Did I do it wrong ?
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 20, 2021 21:08:34 GMT -5
1 Should have been using WHO or other countries test kits 2 Once it became apparent masks were effective, national mandate 3 Should not have locked down entire country 4 Better CDC guidelines for what measures to use based on rate of positivity 5 Better coordination of treatment algorithms, and funding studies so we would have a better understanding of what works 6 Consider paying people to stay home and more pressure on Congress regarding second coronavirus bill 7 Not been as aggressive about re-opening 8 Better at prioritizing what should be open, i.e. schools vs bars for example 9 Used defense production act to ramp up manufacturing tests, needles, PPE, etc 10 Better coordination with Congress to get money to states to deliver vaccine 11 More transparencies about everything surrounding COVID 12 Actually pay attention to the pandemic playbook that was left behind, not ignore lessons from the scenario they gamed in October 2019, not pulled support for the cooperation with China regarding emerging diseases, coordinated with WHO, and actually cooperate with our allies IOW: not much In reality, we still would be in a difficult place, but if you look at the projected dead if we tried vs what has happened, it is criminal. The world thought we were best positioned to deal with this. Our response has been abysmal. The richest, most technologically advance country in the world, and this is the best we could do? Never would have believed it. And the consequence of all those poor decisions is that our ability to contain the virus is basically non-existent now. The course of the pandemic is basically set in stone from now until the end of March. The only things we can do: actually wear masks and socially distance, since we will not shut the country down. And pray that the vaccine works as advertised, manufacturing can be ramped up more quickly, and it can be delivered as fast as it is made. SMH you forgot a few pulmonary: 13. Not destroying faith in science to make yourself look "better" and stoking the belief that "my" opinion is just as valid and correct as that of people who actually studied infectious diseases 14. Not playing snake oil salesman (I really want someone to pump a certain person full of disinfectant and shove an UV lamp up his ***) 15. Not destroying all confidence in the news media because they don't declare you the greatest ever and thereby removing a vehicle of reaching people with the information they need to hear. Including the FACT that when faced with a new, unknown disease it is to be expected that information and recommendations changes due to additional information becoming available! I needed to edit myself. Trying to stick to the facts. But yes, undermining science, expertise, and understanding that science needed to guide the response would have been helpful, as would a degree of humility. I was talking to a respiratory therapist today. The amount of death and suffering we have witnessed over the last month has been overwhelming at times. I have been doing this over 30 years; never have I felt so useless than I have felt at times than during this pandemic. There are periods when I get despondent. Somehow, I just get up and do it again tomorrow. But we are all tired, and feel alone, as it feels as if the majority of people do not care. I have seen enough death over the years. I thought I had found a way to come to terms with it. The last 10 months has tested that belief. This has sucked the joy out of my work, and prevents me from being able to recharge. I hope it hadn’t permanently changed me, and I can find that joy again. Sorry to vent, it has been an awful week. Our friends 21 yo daughter died suddenly, and my father-in-law may die from this
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Jan 20, 2021 23:17:03 GMT -5
I needed to edit myself. Trying to stick to the facts. But yes, undermining science, expertise, and understanding that science needed to guide the response would have been helpful, as would a degree of humility. I was talking to a respiratory therapist today. The amount of death and suffering we have witnessed over the last month has been overwhelming at times. I have been doing this over 30 years; never have I felt so useless than I have felt at times than during this pandemic. There are periods when I get despondent. Somehow, I just get up and do it again tomorrow. But we are all tired, and feel alone, as it feels as if the majority of people do not care. I have seen enough death over the years. I thought I had found a way to come to terms with it. The last 10 months has tested that belief. This has sucked the joy out of my work, and prevents me from being able to recharge. I hope it hadn’t permanently changed me, and I can find that joy again. Sorry to vent, it has been an awful week. Our friends 21 yo daughter died suddenly, and my father-in-law may die from this I am sorry for the pain you feel and the despair at losing your joy in your work. I wish I could take that away but I can't. However, please know that you are NOT useless. This disease has just made you less "effective", for lack of a better word, at healing people. There is so much that was and still is unknown. At this point you need to count the people you did heal and are healing. Look for the victories not the losses. And know that many, many people do care. Most of them just stay in and wear masks when out. We just tend to be more quiet than the Covidiots. We care for those who fight for us and, on a personal note, I believe I speak for many here when I say you are "my people". Take care of you. The world has always needed you, but it needs you even more now
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gs11rmb
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Post by gs11rmb on Jan 21, 2021 9:29:47 GMT -5
I needed to edit myself. Trying to stick to the facts. But yes, undermining science, expertise, and understanding that science needed to guide the response would have been helpful, as would a degree of humility. I was talking to a respiratory therapist today. The amount of death and suffering we have witnessed over the last month has been overwhelming at times. I have been doing this over 30 years; never have I felt so useless than I have felt at times than during this pandemic. There are periods when I get despondent. Somehow, I just get up and do it again tomorrow. But we are all tired, and feel alone, as it feels as if the majority of people do not care. I have seen enough death over the years. I thought I had found a way to come to terms with it. The last 10 months has tested that belief. This has sucked the joy out of my work, and prevents me from being able to recharge. I hope it hadn’t permanently changed me, and I can find that joy again. Sorry to vent, it has been an awful week. Our friends 21 yo daughter died suddenly, and my father-in-law may die from this I am sorry for the pain you feel and the despair at losing your joy in your work. I wish I could take that away but I can't. However, please know that you are NOT useless. This disease has just made you less "effective", for lack of a better word, at healing people. There is so much that was and still is unknown. At this point you need to count the people you did heal and are healing. Look for the victories not the losses. And know that many, many people do care. Most of them just stay in and wear masks when out. We just tend to be more quiet than the Covidiots. We care for those who fight for us and, on a personal note, I believe I speak for many here when I say you are "my people". Take care of you. The world has always needed you, but it needs you even more now pulmonarymd if you were not there doing your job how many more people would be dead? I hope you can focus on the lives you are able to save.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 21, 2021 9:35:42 GMT -5
We had 8 people die from covid in 2 weeks prior to Christmas. More since. And they just keep coming. We are not as bad as other areas. Cannot imagine what they are going through
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jan 21, 2021 9:40:48 GMT -5
pulmonarymd I can not imagine how difficult it is for you and all health care works. You are appreciated in real life and here. Please hang in there. I have more hope today than I did yesterday but I also know all of the problems will not go away in a week or a month.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 21, 2021 11:57:24 GMT -5
I’m sorry, pulmonarymd. It has to be hard to watch death like you do and feel it is out of your hands. This is a strange disease, that doesn’t follow any ‘typical’ virus patterns to treat. I think that what makes me angry is that they were predicting this last spring. All that I can think of is that this must have been what physicians felt like before the advent of antibiotics. You know what is going to happen, but your current arsenal is not sufficient to stop it.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jan 21, 2021 11:59:07 GMT -5
pulmonarymd - sorry to hear that the illness is directly in your family/friend circle. that has to feel like the last straw. find hope in yesterday's events and moving fwd. My 8 yo gets to skip a day of school uniforms and dress like an essential worker tomorrow. She's going to be a doctor and has her pretend doctor kit packed with her plastic shot because she's going to vaccinate everyone. I had to help her spell 'vaccine' for her pretend medicine bottle. And then agree with her strong opinion that vaccine should be spelled with an 'x'. Hope that makes you smile just a bit.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 21, 2021 12:06:30 GMT -5
I’m sorry, pulmonarymd . It has to be hard to watch death like you do and feel it is out of your hands. This is a strange disease, that doesn’t follow any ‘typical’ virus patterns to treat. I think that what makes me angry is that they were predicting this last spring. All that I can think of is that this must have been what physicians felt like before the advent of antibiotics. You know what is going to happen, but your current arsenal is not sufficient to stop it. Good analogy. It is also the numbers. 80% of my ICU patients have it right now. Getting something else to treat feels like a breath of fresh air
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2021 12:09:58 GMT -5
My 8 yo gets to skip a day of school uniforms and dress like an essential worker tomorrow. She's going to be a doctor and has her pretend doctor kit packed with her plastic shot because she's going to vaccinate everyone. I had to help her spell 'vaccine' for her pretend medicine bottle. And then agree with her strong opinion that vaccine should be spelled with an 'x'. Hope that makes you smile just a bit. This warms my heart. I've been listening to a podcast interview with the author of "The Doctors Blackwell", about Elizabeth Blackwell, the first woman to be admitted to a US medical school, in the 1840s. She was followed by her sister Emily. I WILL be reading that book. When my sister graduated from Medical school in 1991 there was a healthy % of female graduates. I was asking the rhetorical question of why it wasn't like this in the 1950s or 1960s. My uncles said it was because back then, few women wanted to be doctors". Yeah, right.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 21, 2021 12:16:50 GMT -5
pulmonarymd - sorry to hear that the illness is directly in your family/friend circle. that has to feel like the last straw. find hope in yesterday's events and moving fwd. My 8 yo gets to skip a day of school uniforms and dress like an essential worker tomorrow. She's going to be a doctor and has her pretend doctor kit packed with her plastic shot because she's going to vaccinate everyone. I had to help her spell 'vaccine' for her pretend medicine bottle. And then agree with her strong opinion that vaccine should be spelled with an 'x'. Hope that makes you smile just a bit. Adorable, did make me smile. One of my favorite ages. I miss that. They are so smart and excited about everything. I would still highly recommend it as a profession, even given my dark mood at the moment.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 21, 2021 12:18:53 GMT -5
My 8 yo gets to skip a day of school uniforms and dress like an essential worker tomorrow. She's going to be a doctor and has her pretend doctor kit packed with her plastic shot because she's going to vaccinate everyone. I had to help her spell 'vaccine' for her pretend medicine bottle. And then agree with her strong opinion that vaccine should be spelled with an 'x'. Hope that makes you smile just a bit. This warms my heart. I've been listening to a podcast interview with the author of "The Doctors Blackwell", about Elizabeth Blackwell, the first woman to be admitted to a US medical school, in the 1840s. She was followed by her sister Emily. I WILL be reading that book. When my sister graduated from Medical school in 1991 there was a healthy % of female graduates. I was asking the rhetorical question of why it wasn't like this in the 1950s or 1960s. My uncles said it was because back then, few women wanted to be doctors". Yeah, right. My Med School class was the first one in school history to have equal numbers of men and women. It is a good thing, different viewpoints, experiences, world views all lead to improving how we do our job
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2021 12:48:11 GMT -5
My Med School class was the first one in school history to have equal numbers of men and women. It is a good thing, different viewpoints, experiences, world views all lead to improving how we do our job I'd read an article written by a woman who said that the first time she went to a female gynecologist she noticed a mobile suspended from the ceiling right over the exam table and realized this doctor had been there/done that. So that's what I gave my sister.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 21, 2021 13:00:23 GMT -5
This warms my heart. I've been listening to a podcast interview with the author of "The Doctors Blackwell", about Elizabeth Blackwell, the first woman to be admitted to a US medical school, in the 1840s. She was followed by her sister Emily. I WILL be reading that book. When my sister graduated from Medical school in 1991 there was a healthy % of female graduates. I was asking the rhetorical question of why it wasn't like this in the 1950s or 1960s. My uncles said it was because back then, few women wanted to be doctors". Yeah, right. My Med School class was the first one in school history to have equal numbers of men and women. It is a good thing, different viewpoints, experiences, world views all lead to improving how we do our job Every medical center I have ever worked in has pictures of their medical and dental school classes along the corridors. It is really amazing to look at how the class makeup changes over the years. Most go from about one female in a sea of males up until around 1960. From 1960 to mid 1980s, they gradually increase until females are 50+% of the class. Looking at how styles change too is pretty funny. Glasses and haircuts definitely evolved over the years.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jan 21, 2021 13:01:12 GMT -5
My Med School class was the first one in school history to have equal numbers of men and women. It is a good thing, different viewpoints, experiences, world views all lead to improving how we do our job I'd read an article written by a woman who said that the first time she went to a female gynecologist she noticed a mobile suspended from the ceiling right over the exam table and realized this doctor had been there/done that. So that's what I gave my sister. Exactly what I meant. We can make things better by having people who have had different experiences contribute. And her knowledge is the same as my when people ask why old men have to stand to pee.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 21, 2021 13:02:16 GMT -5
My Med School class was the first one in school history to have equal numbers of men and women. It is a good thing, different viewpoints, experiences, world views all lead to improving how we do our job I'd read an article written by a woman who said that the first time she went to a female gynecologist she noticed a mobile suspended from the ceiling right over the exam table and realized this doctor had been there/done that. So that's what I gave my sister. LOL! I just found a new GYN I like. He put the pictures of the babies he delivered on the ceiling above the exam table. Much appreciated.
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