retire sooner or just work less? Update post 187

[debthaven]

I will be eligible to retire in 15 months, at 62. But I'll get a bigger pension for every year I keep working up to age 67. Remember, I'm in France. 

I do NOT plan to continue to 67. But I'm wondering if I shouldn't continue to work till 64 or 65, especially with the state of things today. Not much opportunity to travel these days.

So question for those of you who are recently retired, or who plan to retire soon ... If you had/had had the option of working part time, (ie two or three days/ week) would you prefer/have preferred to continue working, but less?

I work 4 days/week, but I work a LOT more hours than what is considered full-time for a university adjunct here.

I'm considering working past 62, but reducing my hours (ie going down from 4 to 3 days for a year or two, then from 3 to 2 days for a year or two, etc.) instead.

Any thoughts?

PS My DH always says he'll retire when he's dead. DH is a graphic designer, so he can truly work from anywhere in the world as long as he has an internet connection. So there's that too. Although he does work when we're away, it's never (or rarely) disruptive.

[Deleted]

As you said, you are in another country so your pension system is much different than ours.  Many here don't even have pensions.

For most of us, retiring at age 62 brings insurance problems.  If you go part-time, you aren't necessarily covered.  And I still would have had to contribute to the pension, SS, etc if I worked part-time at my same job.

At age 65.5, I had hit a sweet spot.  I had 25 years (late start sort of) so 50% of my salary plus retiree insurance benefits at $23 a month that work with Medicare.  I got SS on top of that so all was ok.

I have some regrets that I waited so long, but it was the right decision for us.  

[debthaven]

If I worked less, I would still have to contribute. But it's true, we pay much less for healthcare here. (It's NOT free, but IS much cheaper.)

Thanks, that's a good point.

ETA: @bamafan1954 , what I'm calling my "pension" is what you guys call "social security". Maybe I should edit my OP? 

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

We are in this position.  When TD turns 63.5, his intention is to do a COBRA slide into Medicare since that is the only decent option we have for healthcare.  We will have to pay for it, but we have the money to do so.  Otherwise, local options for healthcare in the marketplace where we live are crap (and I only recently discovered that they've gotten even crappier when I had PT last week and talked about what was available with my PT as she purchases their insurance on the marketplace).  He just turned 62.

We want to travel, so his intention is to maybe work as a consultant for a few jobs each year and try to plan it around our traveling.  He can work however many hours he needs to work, and when the job is over he's done until another job they want him on comes along.  

[debthaven]

The Walk of the Penguin Mich if this helps, DH tells his clients that he is ALWAYS available. But he warns them that when he's travelling, he can't guarantee the internet connection so he COULD be late/temporarily unavailable. 

Sounds like that could work for TD too ... because as a consultant, it's very difficult to tell clients that you might be unavailable. DH just says yes, then tells people we'll be away from X to Y date, so he may not be as reactive as he usually is.

Thanks, glad to see I'm not the only person struggling with this LOL!!!

[Happy prose]

I will have 25 yrs in two years from now. I will be 63. 25 yrs gets me full pension (about 45% of my pay) and health benefits that I have to contribute to. I won't collect SS until 66 and 10 months, and medicare at 65. My health benefits will be based on my pension salary, then becomes cheaper once I'm on medicare. I think I will retire at the 25 yr mark. Life is short. 

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Sept 27, 2020 17:21:26 GMT -5 debthaven said:

The Walk of the Penguin Mich if this helps, DH tells his clients that he is ALWAYS available. But he warns them that when he's travelling, he can't guarantee the internet connection so he COULD be late. 

Sounds like that could work for TD too ... because as a consultant, it's very difficult to tell clients that you might be unavailable. 

Glad to see I'm not the only persoon struggling with this LOL!!!

There is no doubt in my mind that he'd give his job the ole 'heave ho' other than for health insurance.  It has helped that he is one of the few very experienced engineers in this area in his field (the rest have either died or retired) and he's wanted by everyone.  I think he really likes where he is right now, so hopefully can continue here for another couple years.

[debthaven]

I think I will retire at the 25 yr mark. Life is short.

So if I understand correctly Happy prose , you'll stop working completely at that point? 

That's what I'm hesitating about ... I agree that life is short, but I'm suddenly wondering if retiring at 62 as I planned rather than working less for longer is the best solution. 

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Is it possible to only teach one class a year?  Are there advantages to your pension if you even continue part time?  In a normal year, what do you want to do?  Is the money necessary?

[jerseygirl]

I’ve retired a few times! But go back because I really enjoy the consulting work I do and work primarily from home. Do enjoy going into the offices of companies I’m working with. Chance to get ‘dressed up’ maybe into Manhattan or other country
Don’t need health insurance as we have from previous jobs, financially ok and able to help kids, grandkids
But damn, I worked hard to get my PhD and work is intellectually interesting
So no, retiring isn’t for me (at least now)

[debthaven]

Mich, one class a year is definitely not enough! And yes, the money is necessary. I need either the salary or the pension/SS. 

All this was sparked by a lunch with my oldest French friend last Friday. She is a former schoolteacher who became a psychotherapist. 

Our birthdays are two months apart. We have both been counting down the days till we can retire.

And we both reached the same conclusion (independently) ... that maybe we'd be better off "slowing down" rather than completely stopping when we reach 62. 

[debthaven]

Jerseygirl you sound a lot like my DH! No PhD but he loves working and seeing clients. 

Sorry I need to go to bed now but I'm looking forward to seeing more posts tomorrow!

[dippyegg]

Why not reduce it and try it for 1 year, then make a decision based on that?

[Tennesseer]

debthaven - Do you enjoy working in your profession? 

Is it relatively easy for you getting to and back home from your job?

Is your health okay?

I would consider those questions  important as to how much longer I plan to work.

[finnime]

My thoughts are: COVID-19 has changed everything, and it will continue to have an effect for years to come. Traveling will be different; teaching will be different. Given the choices you have, I would go for stepping down some on working, as you said: reducing by two courses, then by another one or two, then see how the world is.

Of course, in 15 months you may find yourself eager to be done with it entirely. But you're a planner. Life IS short, but life in retirement may be long. Extra $$ for a couple of years can only be good.

[Lizard Queen]

I say ease into it, because it doesn't sound like you hate working, your DH will be working anyway, and also the boost in income could come in handy later on.

[buystoys]

DH and I both ended up retiring early due to disabilities.  It wasn't what we had planned and a lot of what we thought we'd do went out the window.  If I had the funds to retire earlier, I would.  You never know what life is going to throw at you.  Fortunately, we had both planned on a comfortable retirement, so we're not in a horrific financial bind.  But I won't be doing long plane flights to see some far off country.  Retirement is still good, it's just not what we originally planned.

[Happy prose]

Sept 27, 2020 17:27:24 GMT -5 debthaven said:

I think I will retire at the 25 yr mark. Life is short.

So if I understand correctly Happy prose , you'll stop working completely at that point? 

That's what I'm hesitating about ... I agree that life is short, but I'm suddenly wondering if retiring at 62 as I planned rather than working less for longer is the best solution. 

Yes, my current plan is to completely stop working. I really don't think I'll miss it. We shall see!

[justme]

My parents retired just before 60 and if you asked them they probably say they wish they did it sooner lol. I'm forgetting their exact age when they retired, but I think it was just after I graduated so about a decade ago. I do remember at the time they were wavering back and forth and the big catalyst was a union was slowly taking over and he decided to retire before new rules took over the pension. Their upside was that their pension came with insurance - though my dad was really glad when they became eligible for medicare and could save a lot of money. 

Personally I'm the type that wants to retire once I can comfortably. Though I wouldn't be against consulting work as long as it wasn't place specific. 


So for you - my big question to you is what's the difference between waiting or not? What do you gain?

I'd be more inclined if the days could be concurrent. ie If I could have 4 day weekends every week or switch it up and have 8 days off in a row without vacation I would be way more incline. Or like work a week and then not work a week.  

[sesfw]

I retired earlier than I wanted to.  Got laid off at age 61 and couldn't find another job so started SS at 62.  I lasted about 6 months in 'retirement' before started going nuts.  So I found things to do.  Volunteer, part time temp positions, etc.  My work is manufacturing so it's a different scenario but the boredom got to me.

I'm now 79 and work part time, on call position and I love it.  Average about 25 hours a week.

I would say to pull back a bit on what you are doing, and revisit it each year.  The world is changing very quickly and next year will bring different things.

Good luck

[Tennesseer]

Sept 27, 2020 21:14:00 GMT -5 justme said:

My parents retired just before 60 and if you asked them they probably say they wish they did it sooner lol. I'm forgetting their exact age when they retired, but I think it was just after I graduated so about a decade ago. I do remember at the time they were wavering back and forth and the big catalyst was a union was slowly taking over and he decided to retire before new rules took over the pension. Their upside was that their pension came with insurance - though my dad was really glad when they became eligible for medicare and could save a lot of money. 

Personally I'm the type that wants to retire once I can comfortably. Though I wouldn't be against consulting work as long as it wasn't place specific. 


So for you - my big question to you is what's the difference between waiting or not? What do you gain?

I'd be more inclined if the days could be concurrent. ie If I could have 4 day weekends every week or switch it up and have 8 days off in a row without vacation I would be way more incline. Or like work a week and then not work a week.  

The highlighted was me also. Except I was 53. I could have worked longer but I just didn't want to anymore.

And I too was super glad to get off my employer's med insurance and go on Medicare. Much less costly as the employer's yearly premiums was going up every year, long before Obamacare came into being. Couldn't blame Obamacare for the premium increases.

[justme]

Sept 27, 2020 21:25:43 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Sept 27, 2020 21:14:00 GMT -5 justme said:

My parents retired just before 60 and if you asked them they probably say they wish they did it sooner lol. I'm forgetting their exact age when they retired, but I think it was just after I graduated so about a decade ago. I do remember at the time they were wavering back and forth and the big catalyst was a union was slowly taking over and he decided to retire before new rules took over the pension. Their upside was that their pension came with insurance - though my dad was really glad when they became eligible for medicare and could save a lot of money. 

Personally I'm the type that wants to retire once I can comfortably. Though I wouldn't be against consulting work as long as it wasn't place specific. 


So for you - my big question to you is what's the difference between waiting or not? What do you gain?

I'd be more inclined if the days could be concurrent. ie If I could have 4 day weekends every week or switch it up and have 8 days off in a row without vacation I would be way more incline. Or like work a week and then not work a week.  

The highlighted was me also. Except I was 53. I could have worked longer but I just didn't want to anymore.

And I too was super glad to get off my employer's med insurance and go on Medicare. Much less costly as the employer's yearly premiums was going up every year, long before Obamacare came into being. Couldn't blame Obamacare for the premium increases.

My parents had me "later" so at 53 I was only 20 and still in undergrad   pretty sure they waited until I had a full time job before retiring so I was off the doll, but I'm fuzzy on the exact year lol. 


(I say "later" because even if I got knocked up tomorrow, any kids i have would be 2+ years after they had me lol)

[giramomma]

For me, it depends on what else you might want to do with your time.

I think when I retire, I want to be completely done with work.  I used to think I'd want to ease into it. But, I really don't ease in and out of anything. No use starting to try to ease into anything now.

But, I'm rarely spending much of my time like I want to now, and I have a long list of things I'd like to do before I die. Not sexy travel abroad for months at a time. I would like to travel. but I'd like to make each of the kids few heirloom things. I'd like to have a few hours a day to tend to my flower beds. I'd like to be an avid reader again.  I'd like to volunteer more. I'd like to be involved with my grandkids, as much as my kids will allow. I'd like to be able to cultivate some non-internet messageboard friendships .

[Anne_in_VA]

I retired about 1.5 years ago and am starting to look for a part time job I can do a couple of days a week.  I need to get out of the house more and there’s only so much shopping I can do.  With Covid my options are limited, but once I find something, I will probably keep working until I no longer can,

[Tiny]

I don't think this is part of the OP's question... but it might be relevant depending on how the "pensions" and "survivor benefits" work in France.

How does the retirement income change when one spouse passes? Women tend to outlive men... and women tend to earn less than men (over their life time).

in the US when a spouse passes the remaining spouse gets a lower "survior" benefit. Social Security and Pensions work that way. (sometimes a pension ends with the person's death - and the surviving spouse gets nothing going forward).

Knowing how your future income will work may help you decide to keep working (part time or full time).

FWIW: most of the retirees in my life tend to voice the opinion that they wished they had retired sooner instead of at their full retirement age or right before (so 64 or 65). All of them "discovered" that they COULD have retired sooner due to the income streams they have in retirement. I think what happened is they didn't really start paying attention to how their "retirement" would work until they got to a year or so before they had always been told they should expect to retire. And then it was like "dang... I could have stopped working sooner".

Another thing I'm hearing from those who retired at 64/65 is that they kind of "ran out of time/health" for doing all the things they thought they would be doing in retirement.

I pay attention to these kinds of things - because it helps motivate me to tend to my finances and to stay on track to hopefully 'retire' at 59.5yo... even though I will have to foot the bill for healthcare - I really, really, really don't want to be tied to my employer solely because of needing healthcare AND trying to save up enough to 'retire' at 65 or later - because I might not have enough health/time left to do the things I want to do.

[resolution]

I think that reducing hours in phases sounds very appealing, if you enjoy your work.  I would totally go for something like that if it didn't affect my health insurance eligibility.

Now that I am 50, I am eligible for early retirement at my employer. That comes out to 55% of my pay if I retire right now, but the longer I wait the more the percentage increases.  I would need to pay the full price of the health insurance, which is currently around $1500 per month and will only go up. 

It is very tempting to get paid to not work anymore, but the closer I get to retiring the more I realize that I enjoy my work and the social contact I have with a few coworkers that I really like. I keep moving out my projected retirement date because I don't think I will be ready to retire next summer when I reach full retirement eligibility.

The thing that would make the most sense financially would be to retire, take the pension, and go to work somewhere else for my full salary. But I don't really want to start over somewhere new.  My employer also offers part time with no benefits, so I could conceivable work 20 hours a week and collect the pension, but a good percentage of that 20 hours would go toward buying the health insurance benefits from the pension plan that are currently covered by my employer. So instead I just keep pushing out my projected date since I am not ready for such a big change.

[debthaven]

in the US when a spouse passes the remaining spouse gets a lower "survior" benefit. Social Security and Pensions work that way.

That's an excellent point Tiny . It works the same way here. 

Thank you for all your comments! 

I plan to read them again (and again) on the weekend, but my first thoughts are:
- I really do like my job
- I hate dual/hybrid teaching
- I hate marking
- I'm quite worried about contracting Covid

I work with a student population that respectfully wears their masks all day at school, but then rips them off the minute they leave school. They even have Covid parties!!! 

There isn't much I'd rather do ... we love to travel, but when we're not travelling, I'm a huge homebody. My hobby is amateur theater, I generally am very active in my troupe, but obviously that's off the cards these days. DH is in the same troupe. Sometimes we do the same plays, sometimes we don't. (DH is British, and they cast smaller plays by accent.)

After reading your comments, my plan to go down from my current 4 days/week to 3 days/week next school year, either in Sept (Semester 1) or in Jan (Semester 2), see how that goes, and take it from there. (There is always less work available in Sem 2, so I may decide to do one more "hard" fall semester after this current one.)  

(I'm going to post this before I lose it ... TBC)

[debthaven]

justme raised another important point ... long weekends.

We don't go away for long weekends often at all, but it is important to me to have that option, since 2 of our 4 kids (and our grandson) live in London now. I have had Fridays off for years. I DO work on Fridays, but I don't teach those days. I do my prep and marking on Fridays so I have less to do on the weekend. 

However, as I get older, I find working 4 days in a row difficult. I work a lot of hours so I get up early (for me, but I HATE waking up at 6 or 7 lol) and I work fairly long days. That's another good reason to go down to 3 days.  

Also, DH works from home. I'm gone all day Mon through Thurs, so we joke that Fri is our "at home" day. We're together, even if we work in companionable silence. If it's nice out we take the motorcycle and go to Chinatown for lunch. 

Thanks again for your posts, they have greatly helped me clarify the many things going around in my head!  

ETA: The money is NOT superfluous. Neither of us has ever earned a great salary, but we're quite frugal. What I'm calling a "pension" is really our "social security".  

[debthaven]

resolution I'm sorry, the costs of health insurance are just insane. Same for The Walk of the Penguin Mich.

sesfw kudos to you, still working 25h/week at 79!!! I'm sure you're in fantastic shape!

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Sept 28, 2020 16:03:35 GMT -5 debthaven said:

resolution I'm sorry, the costs of health insurance are just insane. Same for The Walk of the Penguin Mich .

sesfw kudos to you, still working 25h/week at 79!!! I'm sure you're in fantastic shape!

The problem isn’t just the cost, but the access.

The ACA (and who knows how long that will be) allows health insurance to be sold by county.  What is available where I live is not the same as what is available 100 miles south in Seattle.  Locally, there are only 2 plans available, with no out of network/area options.  That’s not going to work for us.