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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2020 11:52:20 GMT -5
I was wondering about the lack of news from the major media outlets in regards to Covid-19 and children. Quote; A newly published study in Lancet found that children, including infants, generally have mild symptoms of COVID-19, and even those who develop the disease severely enough to warrant intensive care unit admission are unlikely to die.
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have consistently reported that children do not appear to be at higher risk for COVID-19 than adults. While some children and infants have been sick with COVID-19, adults make up most of the known cases to date. The study confirmed previous reports from China suggesting that the death rate for children is significantly lower than older, adult patients.www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/covid-19-in-children-is-usually-mild-deaths-rare-study-says/ar-BB15YKfx
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 30, 2020 12:07:37 GMT -5
I don't think there is a media blackout, there aren't enough numbers perhaps to draw conclusions. Did you see the article on the 5 deaths in Florida? I think the youngest was nine, two eleven yr. old twins and perhaps a sixteen and seventeen year old.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jul 30, 2020 12:10:35 GMT -5
you quoted a mainstream media source to prove there is no mainstream media coverage?
I don't know about you, but I've seen plenty of coverage that children appear not to suffer teh same horrible COVID symptoms that adults do. However, they can still be asymptomatic spreaders.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2020 12:12:37 GMT -5
I don't think there is a media blackout, there aren't enough numbers perhaps to draw conclusions. Did you see the article on the 5 deaths in Florida? I think the youngest was nine, two eleven yr. old twins and perhaps a sixteen and seventeen year old. I wasn't trying to infer there was a blackout, just that maybe they didn't cover it because there wasn't that much to cover, a good thing. I have seen what you mentioned here while looking into the subject.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2020 12:14:46 GMT -5
you quoted a mainstream media source to prove there is no mainstream media coverage? I don't know about you, but I've seen plenty of coverage that children appear not to suffer teh same horrible COVID symptoms that adults do. However, they can still be asymptomatic spreaders. I could of been more clear. I was thinking along the lines of what you see on the mainstream network evening news. I'm aware they can spread the virus the same as any.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 30, 2020 12:42:39 GMT -5
you quoted a mainstream media source to prove there is no mainstream media coverage? I don't know about you, but I've seen plenty of coverage that children appear not to suffer teh same horrible COVID symptoms that adults do. However, they can still be asymptomatic spreaders. I could of been more clear. I was thinking along the lines of what you see on the mainstream network evening news. I'm aware they can spread the virus the same as any. This has been known and repeated many times, and repeatedly studied to see how severely children are affected. Even though this is true, a small number of children get a severe inflammatory syndrome similar to Kawaski's disease as a result. There was a cluster of this in NYC this spring, and that was widely reported. Just because there does not appear to be significant lasting effects in children, as this is a new disease, the long term ramifications on their health is unknown, and whether this could lead to long term lung damage and lung disease is also unknown. One reason that trying to prevent infections in children is the correct approach, and that the question of re-opening schools and how to do it is such a difficult one. IMHO
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Mardi Gras Audrey
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Post by Mardi Gras Audrey on Jul 30, 2020 12:55:15 GMT -5
Is death the only outcome that would cause us worry? Do we worry about quality of life and long term health risks, especially in a little one who hasn’t had a chance to experience life? I may be able to risk long term complications for myself or my parents (I am 41 and have had a good life do far) but why would I do that to my children? I have a 1 and 4 year old. I want them to have MORE opportunities to live their best life than I had. Saddling them with long term health complications from something that we can take steps to prevent is a crime and is totally despicable in my book. We should be protecting the little ones so they have their best future. Saddling someone with a lifetime of limited life is unacceptable. Also, if they have all the health problems, how are they going to work to pay taxes to pay down the multi trillion dollar debt? And pay for my social security?
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jul 30, 2020 15:04:49 GMT -5
I think that for a long time, there was not really a concern about the children. When COVID hit, the first thing that they did was close all the schools. As SIP occurred across the US. the children were pretty much sequestered at home. With playgrounds closed, schools closed, indoor play places closed, you really did not see a large spread from children. Adults were still going about their jobs, and still needing to go out and getting exposed though.
Once summer hit, they really had no idea exactly how it would spread with kids. I know that a few day camps opened up and closed down quickly, because they found that it did continue to spread rapidly among kids. These were really the first 'real life' examples of community spread in children with this opportunity.
If you consider that for many viruses (especially childhood viruses) the disease is much less severe in kids than adults, this does make sense. Chicken pox, measles, mumps are all diseases that hit adults way harder than kids. It's not that the kids can't get severe disease, but like with COVID they are less likely to die than adults.
Perhaps they should have been working on how kids were going to go back to school last March when everything shut down. Much was learned in the shutdown, but I feel that we are playing a game of catch-up.
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kadee79
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Post by kadee79 on Jul 30, 2020 22:17:59 GMT -5
Chicken pox, measles, mumps are all diseases that hit adults way harder than kids. It's not that the kids can't get severe disease, but like with COVID they are less likely to die than adults. But....having had personal experience with chicken pox....I got it when I was in my late 20's...my son gave it to me. I had it in places no one should ever have it. My son had 36 spots over his entire body, I had 40 spots just on my nose. However, BOTH of us still have that virus in our bodies & it is possible it can come back as shingles. So there is a long term effect from that one...for sure. The shots for shingles don't promise to prevent it, only to make it not as severe...like the yearly flu shots. BTW, I missed 6 weeks of work with it & my Dr. made me come in the back door so I wouldn't scare the other patients in the waiting room...yes, it was that bad. So at this point....no one knows what the possible long term effect of this virus can be even if a kid has a mild case.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Jul 30, 2020 22:49:50 GMT -5
There's also the issue that some kids die from childhood illnesses - like chickenpox. kids die from the flu every year. I'm guessing most parents are ok with childhood illnesses - until their kid dies from it or has some "get to live with that complication for the rest of your life" thing happen. As long as your kid doesn't have a bad outcome, who cares. And it's easy to feel that "my kid is a healthy typical kid - they will be fine. Look at me. I survived childhood!"
I keep seeing that "I survived childhood - the threat isn't real!" argument fairly often these days on facebook. Not sure if people agree with it out of fear or if they are just oblivious.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jul 30, 2020 22:56:24 GMT -5
Chicken pox, measles, mumps are all diseases that hit adults way harder than kids. It's not that the kids can't get severe disease, but like with COVID they are less likely to die than adults. But....having had personal experience with chicken pox....I got it when I was in my late 20's...my son gave it to me. I had it in places no one should ever have it. My son had 36 spots over his entire body, I had 40 spots just on my nose. However, BOTH of us still have that virus in our bodies & it is possible it can come back as shingles. So there is a long term effect from that one...for sure. The shots for shingles don't promise to prevent it, only to make it not as severe...like the yearly flu shots. BTW, I missed 6 weeks of work with it & my Dr. made me come in the back door so I wouldn't scare the other patients in the waiting room...yes, it was that bad. So at this point....no one knows what the possible long term effect of this virus can be even if a kid has a mild case. That wasn’t the point I was trying to make. No one knows why children seem to get a milder form of COVID, but it maybe the same reason why they get milder forms of many childhood diseases that knock adults on their backs for weeks if they get it. However, that does not stop them from transmitting COVID to susceptible adults. There has been some talk that kids do not transmit it as easily. I had a post doc that caught chicken pox from her nephew, she was hospitalized for 6 weeks and a few of those weeks she was in ICU. When she came back to the lab, she looked like death warmed over. She probably dropped 30 lbs from her frame that she did not need to lose.
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kadee79
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Post by kadee79 on Jul 30, 2020 23:25:33 GMT -5
I was trying to point out 2 things....kids can give it to adults who will suffer more AND they themselves may end up with life altering affects from it...like damaged lungs....which could mean no running, no sports of many kinds, etc.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 11:06:07 GMT -5
Fauci said this morning in the hearing that children are NOT immune from COVID and they can/do spread it to others.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 11:29:34 GMT -5
I could of been more clear. I was thinking along the lines of what you see on the mainstream network evening news. I'm aware they can spread the virus the same as any. This has been known and repeated many times, and repeatedly studied to see how severely children are affected. Even though this is true, a small number of children get a severe inflammatory syndrome similar to Kawaski's disease as a result. There was a cluster of this in NYC this spring, and that was widely reported. Just because there does not appear to be significant lasting effects in children, as this is a new disease, the long term ramifications on their health is unknown, and whether this could lead to long term lung damage and lung disease is also unknown. One reason that trying to prevent infections in children is the correct approach, and that the question of re-opening schools and how to do it is such a difficult one. IMHO I'm Aware. (first bolded) I am of the opinion we are on the cusp of a fully informational age, 'going to school' seems archaic and a needless cost to society. (second bolded) I would expect significant pushback from the entrenched 'old school' teaching system, it's quite the tax cash cow, not to mention kids grouping in classrooms and disease as is the concern today. As far as Covid-19, I feel schools K-12 should remain closed until a viable treatment is available, whether vaccine, etc. Quote; If we want to understand why standard schools are what they are, we have to abandon the idea that they are products of logical necessity or scientific insight. They are, instead, products of history. Schooling, as it exists today, only makes sense if we view it from a historical perspective. www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/freedom-learn/200808/brief-history-education
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 11:31:06 GMT -5
Is death the only outcome that would cause us worry? Do we worry about quality of life and long term health risks, especially in a little one who hasn’t had a chance to experience life? I may be able to risk long term complications for myself or my parents (I am 41 and have had a good life do far) but why would I do that to my children? I have a 1 and 4 year old. I want them to have MORE opportunities to live their best life than I had. Saddling them with long term health complications from something that we can take steps to prevent is a crime and is totally despicable in my book. We should be protecting the little ones so they have their best future. Saddling someone with a lifetime of limited life is unacceptable. Also, if they have all the health problems, how are they going to work to pay taxes to pay down the multi trillion dollar debt? Agree with your post.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 31, 2020 11:34:48 GMT -5
This has been known and repeated many times, and repeatedly studied to see how severely children are affected. Even though this is true, a small number of children get a severe inflammatory syndrome similar to Kawaski's disease as a result. There was a cluster of this in NYC this spring, and that was widely reported. Just because there does not appear to be significant lasting effects in children, as this is a new disease, the long term ramifications on their health is unknown, and whether this could lead to long term lung damage and lung disease is also unknown. One reason that trying to prevent infections in children is the correct approach, and that the question of re-opening schools and how to do it is such a difficult one. IMHO I'm Aware. (first bolded) I am of the opinion we are on the cusp of a fully informational age, 'going to school' seems archaic and a needless cost to society. (second bolded) I would expect significant pushback from the entrenched 'old school' teaching system, it's quite the tax cash cow, not to mention kids grouping in classrooms and disease as is the concern today. As far as Covid-19, I feel schools K-12 should remain closed until a viable treatment is available, whether vaccine, etc. Quote; If we want to understand why standard schools are what they are, we have to abandon the idea that they are products of logical necessity or scientific insight. They are, instead, products of history. Schooling, as it exists today, only makes sense if we view it from a historical perspective. www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/freedom-learn/200808/brief-history-educationSo your post about not seeing information on the mainstream news was pointless?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 11:41:22 GMT -5
I'm Aware. (first bolded) I am of the opinion we are on the cusp of a fully informational age, 'going to school' seems archaic and a needless cost to society. (second bolded) I would expect significant pushback from the entrenched 'old school' teaching system, it's quite the tax cash cow, not to mention kids grouping in classrooms and disease as is the concern today. As far as Covid-19, I feel schools K-12 should remain closed until a viable treatment is available, whether vaccine, etc. Quote; If we want to understand why standard schools are what they are, we have to abandon the idea that they are products of logical necessity or scientific insight. They are, instead, products of history. Schooling, as it exists today, only makes sense if we view it from a historical perspective. www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/freedom-learn/200808/brief-history-educationSo your post about not seeing information on the mainstream news was pointless? No, plenty of middle age/older people out there, still use it for their main source of information. Information on all age groups during a report on Covid-19 would be beneficial in regards to just the schooling question alone.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 31, 2020 11:45:41 GMT -5
So your post about not seeing information on the mainstream news was pointless? No, plenty of older people out there still use it for their main source of information. No, you claimed that these sort of findings on children were not reported in the mainstream media. Yet, you are aware of what I posted. Where did you get your information, from medical journals? Otherwise, it was reported in some sort of news format. Print? Television news? Online reports? Or are you so smart you just know it?
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Jul 31, 2020 11:51:56 GMT -5
So your post about not seeing information on the mainstream news was pointless? No, plenty of middle age/older people out there, still use it for their main source of information. Information on all age groups during a report on Covid-19 would be beneficial in regards to just the schooling question alone. Then why did you throw that "incendiary bomb" about your views/opinions on what a waste of taxpayers money the education system in America is?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 12:03:53 GMT -5
No, plenty of older people out there still use it for their main source of information. No, you claimed that these sort of findings on children were not reported in the mainstream media. Yet, you are aware of what I posted. Where did you get your information, from medical journals? Otherwise, it was reported in some sort of news format. Print? Television news? Online reports? Or are you so smart you just know it? You should read/comprehend all my posts on this thread, You would not be stating this if you did. (bolded) You seem a little aggressive with this post here, what's the matter, get burned from passing BS somewhere else on this forum. Your P/A posting comes across like a rookie, lol.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 12:04:47 GMT -5
No, plenty of middle age/older people out there, still use it for their main source of information. Information on all age groups during a report on Covid-19 would be beneficial in regards to just the schooling question alone. Then why did you throw that "incendiary bomb" about your views/opinions on what a waste of taxpayers money the education system in America is? Because I didn't say that. (bolded) You would want this; When comparing proportional spending of developed countries on teacher salaries, the United States falls lower than countries such as Canada, France and Korea. However, the United States spends a higher percentage than most countries on non-teaching educational staff, which includes school administrators.
degree.astate.edu/articles/k-12-education/us-compare-in-global-education.aspx
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 31, 2020 12:13:27 GMT -5
No, you claimed that these sort of findings on children were not reported in the mainstream media. Yet, you are aware of what I posted. Where did you get your information, from medical journals? Otherwise, it was reported in some sort of news format. Print? Television news? Online reports? Or are you so smart you just know it? You should read/comprehend all my posts on this thread, You would not be stating this if you did. (bolded) You seem a little aggressive with this post here, what's the matter, get burned from passing BS somewhere else on this forum. Your P/A posting comes across like a rookie, lol.
Actually, just trying to see where you were able to obtain this information from. I was able to see it in multiple ways. From medical sites, newspaper, and the nightly evening news. You made the claim that it was not reported in the mainstream news. So, again, if that is the case, where did you obtain the information. Straightforward question. It is difficult to determine intent on the internet. But as I can see, you have no interest in being serious.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 12:22:18 GMT -5
You should read/comprehend all my posts on this thread, You would not be stating this if you did. (bolded) You seem a little aggressive with this post here, what's the matter, get burned from passing BS somewhere else on this forum. Your P/A posting comes across like a rookie, lol.
Actually, just trying to see where you were able to obtain this information from. I was able to see it in multiple ways. From medical sites, newspaper, and the nightly evening news. You made the claim that it was not reported in the mainstream news. So, again, if that is the case, where did you obtain the information. Straightforward question. It is difficult to determine intent on the internet. But as I can see, you have no interest in being serious. Or are you so smart you just know it?-------------------Actually, just trying to see where you were able to obtain this information from.--------------------- you have no interest in being serious.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 31, 2020 12:27:01 GMT -5
Actually, just trying to see where you were able to obtain this information from. I was able to see it in multiple ways. From medical sites, newspaper, and the nightly evening news. You made the claim that it was not reported in the mainstream news. So, again, if that is the case, where did you obtain the information. Straightforward question. It is difficult to determine intent on the internet. But as I can see, you have no interest in being serious. Or are you so smart you just know it?-------------------Actually, just trying to see where you were able to obtain this information from.--------------------- you have no interest in being serious. Neither do you😀
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 12:27:54 GMT -5
Or are you so smart you just know it?-------------------Actually, just trying to see where you were able to obtain this information from.--------------------- you have no interest in being serious. Neither do you😀
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2020 12:33:53 GMT -5
I'm Aware. (first bolded) I am of the opinion we are on the cusp of a fully informational age, 'going to school' seems archaic and a needless cost to society. (second bolded) I would expect significant pushback from the entrenched 'old school' teaching system, it's quite the tax cash cow, not to mention kids grouping in classrooms and disease as is the concern today. As far as Covid-19, I feel schools K-12 should remain closed until a viable treatment is available, whether vaccine, etc. Quote; If we want to understand why standard schools are what they are, we have to abandon the idea that they are products of logical necessity or scientific insight. They are, instead, products of history. Schooling, as it exists today, only makes sense if we view it from a historical perspective. www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/freedom-learn/200808/brief-history-educationSo your post about not seeing information on the mainstream news was pointless? No. There was little coverage.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 31, 2020 12:37:01 GMT -5
So your post about not seeing information on the mainstream news was pointless? No. There was little coverage. I disagree, I saw plenty of information regarding it on the evening news
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jul 31, 2020 13:29:22 GMT -5
Quote; If we want to understand why standard schools are what they are, we have to abandon the idea that they are products of logical necessity or scientific insight. They are, instead, products of history. Schooling, as it exists today, only makes sense if we view it from a historical perspective. www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/freedom-learn/200808/brief-history-education And the resistance to change comes from the fact that most of those involved with education were successful in the system as it exists. Calling it into question calls into question their success. I remember sitting outside Miller Hall on the Udub campus waiting for a class to start. I was talking about problems I had with schools and being asked why I was doing Grad work in Education if I didn't like schools.
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Cheesy FL-Vol
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Post by Cheesy FL-Vol on Jul 31, 2020 14:08:32 GMT -5
I have to wonder about the psychological fall-out to children blaming themselves if their teachers and/or family members contract covid after school starts.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jul 31, 2020 14:52:43 GMT -5
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