lynnerself
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Post by lynnerself on Jul 24, 2020 10:04:41 GMT -5
Department of Homeland Security Plane Lands in Seattle
I post this with caution because I am not familiar with the source.
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oped
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Post by oped on Jul 24, 2020 10:07:18 GMT -5
The homeschool group I used to be a part of posted a public forum this week so I visited some pages of people I haven't been communicating with in awhile... Saw a feed full of how the mob is now running the country and etc. right wing propaganda is working for the base. And demonizing Gov Wolf who is the reason we have some kind of containment in PA.
I have little hope left for the republic, actually.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jul 24, 2020 11:03:01 GMT -5
Department of Homeland Security Plane Lands in Seattle
I post this with caution because I am not familiar with the source.
The Stranger is a local alternative newspaper. You may have heard of Dan Savage. He is a major factor for that paper.
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jul 24, 2020 12:09:14 GMT -5
Department of Homeland Security Plane Lands in Seattle
I post this with caution because I am not familiar with the source.
The Stranger is a local alternative newspaper. You may have heard of Dan Savage. He is a major factor for that paper. They also have very "interesting" ballot endorsements.
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Artemis Windsong
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Post by Artemis Windsong on Jul 24, 2020 12:15:52 GMT -5
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Artemis Windsong
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Post by Artemis Windsong on Jul 24, 2020 12:25:38 GMT -5
I feel like I'm watching Hitler take power in Germany or the fall of the Roman Empire. I'm really hoping it"s the fall of an empire. So,"'I'm really hoping it"s the fall of an empire'" or the fall of the U.S. and want Hitler to take over? Go to South America like Argentina where you will get what you want. How far would those protestors and thug vandals get under Hitler? How do you spell mass grave.
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dondub
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The meek shall indeed inherit the earth but only after the Visigoths are done with it.
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Post by dondub on Jul 24, 2020 13:32:48 GMT -5
The Stranger is a local alternative newspaper. You may have heard of Dan Savage. He is a major factor for that paper. They also have very "interesting" ballot endorsements. The best in town!
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jul 24, 2020 14:00:55 GMT -5
I so wish that Trump's supporters could have their eyes opened long enough to see how much he relishes throwing gasoline on any fire he sees. Even your own linked article states from the beginning that the cause of the increased protest activity is Trump's sending in federal agents, which is viewed (not necessarily incorrectly) as an attempt to occupy the city. Increased anger from protesters is due primarily to that incursion by federal agents and their associated tactics, such as regularly gassing crowds and the use of batons and rubber bullets, not to mention snatching people off the streets and taking them away to unknown places. As with most other things in which Trump has involved himself, he succeeds only in making things worse.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 24, 2020 14:05:13 GMT -5
I feel like I'm watching Hitler take power in Germany or the fall of the Roman Empire. I'm really hoping it"s the fall of an empire. So,"'I'm really hoping it"s the fall of an empire'" or the fall of the U.S. and want Hitler to take over? Go to South America like Argentina where you will get what you want. How far would those protestors and thug vandals get under Hitler? How do you spell mass grave.
Charming. It sounds like maybe you'd be a better fit to move to Argentina than latebloomer.
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Artemis Windsong
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Post by Artemis Windsong on Jul 24, 2020 14:30:18 GMT -5
You are now in charge of the solution with tallguy.
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Icelandic Woman
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Post by Icelandic Woman on Jul 24, 2020 15:01:56 GMT -5
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Sharon
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Post by Sharon on Jul 24, 2020 15:05:31 GMT -5
Now there has been a surveillance plan seen at the Portland Airport
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oped
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Post by oped on Jul 24, 2020 15:44:32 GMT -5
This is who they are targeting with tear gas and rubber bullets and the collapse of the republic.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 24, 2020 16:58:40 GMT -5
I have more sympathy for the vandals than for the US Secret Police. not that I have much for either.....
sorry to say so, but that is how I feel.
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jul 24, 2020 17:08:33 GMT -5
You are now in charge of the solution with tallguy. Great! Let's start by sending federal agents in to snatch Trump, Pence, McConnell, and Barr and take them away to an unknown location. Permanently. Should fix or at least ameliorate most of the problems we currently have in this country.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2020 17:41:49 GMT -5
I have more sympathy for the vandals than for the US Secret Police. not that I have much for either..... sorry to say so, but that is how I feel. I'm with you on that. I did not know until recently that protests were still ongoing in several places not just Seattle. After a week of protesting IMO its time to move on and do things, concrete things that will move your agenda forward. Create a lobbying group or create a non-profit. Meet with politicians, police departments, etc. and find a way forward. Protesting day after day and vandalizing things makes you almost as bad as what you are protesting against. Marching and protesting gets awareness and concerns out in the open. Once that is done its time to turn to the hard work of making what you want a reality.
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oped
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Post by oped on Jul 24, 2020 18:02:34 GMT -5
How do you go about getting concrete things though? Protesting for Civil Rights the first time around lasted years. The Montgomery Bus Boycott itself lasted over a year.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 24, 2020 19:03:16 GMT -5
what people who don't like protests forget is that they are inherently disruptive. if they are not disruptive, they are not effective. period.
so, yeah- I am happy to see people getting angry about the protests on this thread. that means they are working. and people need to keep being angry until REAL policies are implemented to fix shit.
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lynnerself
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Post by lynnerself on Jul 24, 2020 19:06:23 GMT -5
Dad with leaf blower arrested Tuesday, says he was taken to ground by federal officers during Portland protestUnfortunately behind a paywall at OregonLive "Around 12:30 am Tueday, officers used tear gas on the crowd. Duffy says he didn't hear any warning, but started backing up and leaving amid flashbangs. There was an officer nearby who was telling people to get out of the street. Duffy says he didn't feel threatened by the officer at that time." "One of the agents in camo, holding a baton, came from Duffy's side and charged him, he said. Duffy believes he was targeted because he brought a leaf blower." Duffy said the agent tried to grab his leaf blower, which was strapped to his body. Since he didn't have time to unstrap, he said he was taken to the ground and his glasses were broken as the two officer arrested him." The story goes on to account the confusion between agencies, that he couldn't call his wife and he wasn't told what he was charged with until his arraignment at 3:30 pm. And that he was doxed, his personal information posted on Twitter.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2020 19:18:41 GMT -5
This is who they are targeting with tear gas and rubber bullets and the collapse of the republic. I love this video. I showed it to DBF. I definitely don’t mean to offend anyone, but I have to say that I’m glad to see that at least some of White America is finally understanding that there is a real problem. It’s not that I want to see White Americans hurt or abused, I absolutely don’t, I don’t want any of my sisters and brothers harmed, regardless of race or ethnicity! It’s just that, if I can just be honest, we need White Americans to see and understand if we’re ever to see any change. Black and Brown Americans can’t do it by ourselves, it’s just fact that White Americans have more power than we do because we are outnumbered, and because more of them are IN positions of power.
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lynnerself
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Post by lynnerself on Jul 24, 2020 19:33:13 GMT -5
There has been a little push back because this group is mostly white "Though the Wall of Moms has become an overnight Internet sensation, the group has also attracted skepticism. Some scholars and racial justice activists have criticized the group and the attention it has attracted for centering the voices of mostly white mothers.
Black mothers have been calling for criminal justice reform and racial equity for many years. They have lost sons and daughters at the hands of police. A group of seven mothers who have lost African American children to police action or gun violence, known as the Mothers of the Movement, have toured around the United States to protests and conferences. But they have never gone viral quite like the Wall of Moms." Their response is this:
"Wall of Mom organizers said they want to help amplify the voices of mothers like these — mothers who have suffered losses and who have for years fought for systemic change in police practices.
“When you have the privilege that we have as white women, you have to use it for good, and I hope that that’s what this is,” said Vinson, who is white. “I think it’s really, really important that we gain the trust of the black community here, and that’s going to take some work, because we haven’t always been dependable. We have an obligation to be humble, to listen and center black voices.” "
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lynnerself
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Post by lynnerself on Jul 24, 2020 19:39:43 GMT -5
President Trump on Thursday derided Portland, Ore., Mayor Ted Wheeler as “a fool” for having joined protesters in his city objecting to the presence of federal agents deployed by Trump and getting tear-gassed in the process.
“He made a fool out of himself,” Trump said during an appearance on Fox News. “He wanted to be among the people. So he went into the crowd. And they knocked the hell out of him. That was the end of him. So it was pretty, pretty pathetic.” I didn't think he would keep quiet about this. Although I thought it would be in a tweet.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2020 19:49:28 GMT -5
How do you go about getting concrete things though? Protesting for Civil Rights the first time around lasted years. The Montgomery Bus Boycott itself lasted over a year. By figuring out what you really want and coming up with steps to take you there. What is needed is measurable doable goals not wants like I want black people to be treated better. The latter needs to be broken down into concrete goals or actions to help get to that subjective goal. I was born in the 60s. That's when integration in the schools became a thing. It was a scary and very tough time for those young black kids whose lives were on the line and their supporters going against the status quo. Bravery and action is needed for lasting change. So lets start with something on the easier concrete side. Lessen police violence and/or defund the police. Both of these could be worked at a local level, a state level, and even a federal level. Given the current federal administration in power, I'd keep efforts to local or state level where its more likely progress could be made now. People would need to organize and first IMO talk with police departments and the politicians who are above them or legislate them. What can be done to lessen police violence against civilians? IMO remove practices that have caused unintentional deaths and work with police to come up with less lethal more humane options. Dialogue about police procedures and concerns and match and contrast that with concerns of the policed.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jul 24, 2020 19:58:50 GMT -5
Laws that provide extra protection for police need to be removed so they are more susceptible to criminal charges and convictions for their crimes.
One that still rankles me from here in Seattle is the Indigenous wood carver in a crosswalk carrying a piece of carving wood and his knife. Hard of hearing and drunk. Cop gets out of his car and yells for him to stop. He didn’t. Maybe he couldn’t hear the order. So the cop pumped 4 into him, killing him. The protective special statute allowed no charges to be filed for what was just a cold blooded killing.
Those have to be removed. A small but concrete step.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2020 20:18:03 GMT -5
There has been a little push back because this group is mostly white "Though the Wall of Moms has become an overnight Internet sensation, the group has also attracted skepticism. Some scholars and racial justice activists have criticized the group and the attention it has attracted for centering the voices of mostly white mothers.
Black mothers have been calling for criminal justice reform and racial equity for many years. They have lost sons and daughters at the hands of police. A group of seven mothers who have lost African American children to police action or gun violence, known as the Mothers of the Movement, have toured around the United States to protests and conferences. But they have never gone viral quite like the Wall of Moms." Their response is this:
"Wall of Mom organizers said they want to help amplify the voices of mothers like these — mothers who have suffered losses and who have for years fought for systemic change in police practices.
“When you have the privilege that we have as white women, you have to use it for good, and I hope that that’s what this is,” said Vinson, who is white. “I think it’s really, really important that we gain the trust of the black community here, and that’s going to take some work, because we haven’t always been dependable. We have an obligation to be humble, to listen and center black voices.” "
This is the hard thing about social change in general. The haves or the almost haves usually have to help in the change for those put by society on the outside. White women who are moms are fulfilling the obligations society expects of them. And because they are white, i.e. part of the majority race they are considered more known and less dangerous than a similar group of black moms. If instead of white moms this was a band of white transgender teens female to male, we'd get to see what society really thought was more scary - transgenders who become men or black women/black people. So back to part of the main agenda. Police are allowed to kill in defense of their own life. The measure is if they are in fear of losing their life they are allowed to take the other's life. I think that needs to be modified and codified to stop senseless deaths just because cops are afraid of others and/or they enjoy power trips when the opportunity presents itself. I think education and understanding is needed on both sides. Police need a better understanding of the black people they police so they can better assess who is a threat and who is not, because obviously sometimes getting it wrong is fatal to the policed when it really shouldn't be. As part of the policed, I think it would be helpful if the police educated us on their touchpoints and timing on resolving situations. The police clock seems faster and more extreme than the civilian clock IMO for most situations.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2020 20:18:49 GMT -5
Laws that provide extra protection for police need to be removed so they are more susceptible to criminal charges and convictions for their crimes. One that still rankles me from here in Seattle is the Indigenous wood carver in a crosswalk carrying a piece of carving wood and his knife. Hard of hearing and drunk. Cop gets out of his car and yells for him to stop. He didn’t. Maybe he couldn’t hear the order. So the cop pumped 4 into him, killing him. The protective special statute allowed no charges to be filed for what was just a cold blooded killing. Those have to be removed. A small but concrete step. Not just removed, but also charged and convicted of murder. Because that’s often what it is, murder. Charge them just like I would be charged if I killed someone in cold blood. Except, maybe it would depend on who I killed.... Ray Ray down the street.... I could maybe get away with that if my story was good enough. Don’t mind me. I’m not really having a good day.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2020 20:20:38 GMT -5
Laws that provide extra protection for police need to be removed so they are more susceptible to criminal charges and convictions for their crimes. One that still rankles me from here in Seattle is the Indigenous wood carver in a crosswalk carrying a piece of carving wood and his knife. Hard of hearing and drunk. Cop gets out of his car and yells for him to stop. He didn’t. Maybe he couldn’t hear the order. So the cop pumped 4 into him, killing him. The protective special statute allowed no charges to be filed for what was just a cold blooded killing. Those have to be removed. A small but concrete step. I agree. There are not enough allowances and procedures for deaf people, blind people, people off their meds, autistic, etc. or in other words not enough training/planning for non standard people that exist. There should be serious repercussions for ignoring those possibilities.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 24, 2020 20:33:18 GMT -5
How do you go about getting concrete things though? Protesting for Civil Rights the first time around lasted years. The Montgomery Bus Boycott itself lasted over a year. By figuring out what you really want and coming up with steps to take you there. What is needed is measurable doable goals not wants like I want black people to be treated better. The latter needs to be broken down into concrete goals or actions to help get to that subjective goal. I was born in the 60s. That's when integration in the schools became a thing. It was a scary and very tough time for those young black kids whose lives were on the line and their supporters going against the status quo. Bravery and action is needed for lasting change. So lets start with something on the easier concrete side. Lessen police violence and/or defund the police. Both of these could be worked at a local level, a state level, and even a federal level. Given the current federal administration in power, I'd keep efforts to local or state level where its more likely progress could be made now. People would need to organize and first IMO talk with police departments and the politicians who are above them or legislate them. What can be done to lessen police violence against civilians? IMO remove practices that have caused unintentional deaths and work with police to come up with less lethal more humane options. Dialogue about police procedures and concerns and match and contrast that with concerns of the policed. People are doing all of that and more. And have been for decades. The protests are to keep the pressure on for real change to happen. If the powers that be had not ignored and jerked people around when they tried peaceful means you wouldn't be dealing with protests now.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2020 20:34:10 GMT -5
Laws that provide extra protection for police need to be removed so they are more susceptible to criminal charges and convictions for their crimes. One that still rankles me from here in Seattle is the Indigenous wood carver in a crosswalk carrying a piece of carving wood and his knife. Hard of hearing and drunk. Cop gets out of his car and yells for him to stop. He didn’t. Maybe he couldn’t hear the order. So the cop pumped 4 into him, killing him. The protective special statute allowed no charges to be filed for what was just a cold blooded killing. Those have to be removed. A small but concrete step. Not just removed, but also charged and convicted of murder. Because that’s often what it is, murder. Charge them just like I would be charged if I killed someone in cold blood. Except, maybe it would depend on who I killed.... Ray Ray down the street.... I could maybe get away with that if my story was good enough.
Don’t mind me. I’m not really having a good day. This is a useful point and one to remember when looking at police violence. When bad people get killed by the police, generally there isn't any outcry at their deaths even if they could be avoided. If someone gets killed after a mass shooting spree or killing their spouse and kids, we in society are generally okay with it no matter the circumstances. For a bad enough crime, society in general is OK with murder by cop or murder as punishment aka the death penalty.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 24, 2020 20:44:29 GMT -5
By figuring out what you really want and coming up with steps to take you there. What is needed is measurable doable goals not wants like I want black people to be treated better. The latter needs to be broken down into concrete goals or actions to help get to that subjective goal. I was born in the 60s. That's when integration in the schools became a thing. It was a scary and very tough time for those young black kids whose lives were on the line and their supporters going against the status quo. Bravery and action is needed for lasting change. So lets start with something on the easier concrete side. Lessen police violence and/or defund the police. Both of these could be worked at a local level, a state level, and even a federal level. Given the current federal administration in power, I'd keep efforts to local or state level where its more likely progress could be made now. People would need to organize and first IMO talk with police departments and the politicians who are above them or legislate them. What can be done to lessen police violence against civilians? IMO remove practices that have caused unintentional deaths and work with police to come up with less lethal more humane options. Dialogue about police procedures and concerns and match and contrast that with concerns of the policed. People are doing all of that and more. And have been for decades. The protests are to keep the pressure on for real change to happen. If the powers that be had not ignored and jerked people around when they tried peaceful means you wouldn't be dealing with protests now. They have been doing some of that and other stuff. Maybe I'm misreading this, but it feels like when you typed you, you meant the US, and ignored similar issues in Canada and abroad. torontosun.com/news/local-news/arrests-made-as-toronto-statues-defaced-during-blm-protestsRyerson and Macdonald’s statues were targeted in particular because of their involvement in the creation of Canada’s residential school system for Indigenous children. Messages written on signs left at the statues read: “Tear down monuments that represent slavery, colonialism and violence.”On their website, BLM Toronto made the call to defund, demilitarize, disarm and dismantle the police, saying, among other things, “the Toronto Police Services (TPS) budget is over $1.1 billion dollars, which is more than public funding allotted to libraries, housing, shelters combined. We believe that Black communities, and all communities, deserve better.”One of the more sucky things I have discovered in life is the amount of effort it requires to change things when it is not the right time, i.e too early or late versus when it is a good time for said change. Now appears to be a good time to make certain changes.
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