djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 13, 2020 3:48:39 GMT -5
Individually, we can't solve a pandemic. But more individuals doing the right things (like isolating, minimizing risk, etc) gets us closer to solving it. It would seem to be in everyone's best interest, right? Why aren't more individuals willing to do that, though? What is a higher priority to them, than survival?Apparently, it's going out to eat, going to bars, going to Disney World, going to Home Depot every week, etc... And, let us not forget church... I think those of us who have some survivalist in us are stocking up on things and preparing for things to get worse. I think some people will be shocked when fall rolls around. It's only going to get worse. How can it not? And, they will still proclaim their right to gather at church or get their hair colored... So, on and on the pandemic will rage. all of the weaknesses and deficiencies in our system have been exposed. it is likely that things will get many times worse than they were in April. and rather than being more prepared, it seems like we are less prepared than ever.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Jul 13, 2020 6:11:54 GMT -5
Yep, I'm going to be stocking up again. Some things are still not in stock in the stores or not large quantities of stuff, seem really thin.
Got my supply of water softener salts, 4 bags, should last a few months.
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alabamagal
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Post by alabamagal on Jul 13, 2020 7:47:30 GMT -5
Ignore Trump. He's not the subject here. The question is about the American people, and looking to leadership (in general) for the answers. Our reliance on leadership to solve this FOR us. When leadership fails, especially this badly, how long do we WAIT for new leadership to step in, step up, with a solution? Why do we continue to think within our (broken) political system, as if that's the ONLY way things can be done here? Why do we wait to be LED to a solution, instead of collectively working toward a solution as a people? One of the doctors on TV the other day mentioned that this fall our country could quite easily become every person for themselves and we could see major failures of government and other systems if our country doesn't come up with a plan soon and follow it. He suggested people read the CDC guidelines and make plans to protect themselves and their families despite what they may hear from state and other leaders. I 100% agree. At 100K infections per day, it still takes over a year to infect the population. What happens to supply chains? Trucking? And every other business out there when large numbers of people are sick, recovering, or dead? I’m not disagreeing with your post, but at 100,000 cases per day, it would take over 10 years to get to the entire population. The problem is it is not a steady increase, but where the rates are increasing, and those people need to take even more precautions.
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oped
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Post by oped on Jul 13, 2020 8:17:59 GMT -5
One of the doctors on TV the other day mentioned that this fall our country could quite easily become every person for themselves and we could see major failures of government and other systems if our country doesn't come up with a plan soon and follow it. He suggested people read the CDC guidelines and make plans to protect themselves and their families despite what they may hear from state and other leaders. I 100% agree. At 100K infections per day, it still takes over a year to infect the population. What happens to supply chains? Trucking? And every other business out there when large numbers of people are sick, recovering, or dead? I’m not disagreeing with your post, but at 100,000 cases per day, it would take over 10 years to get to the entire population. The problem is it is not a steady increase, but where the rates are increasing, and those people need to take even more precautions. If people had taken even more precautions when they weren't rising... they wouldn't be rising. This thing has an insane lead time, not to mention asymptomatic spread. By the time its spreading knowingly at a steady increase... its too late. And at that point, the point where many are now, the system is again overloaded and can't get tests and there is a week long+ lag in testing results... and we as individuals can't solve that. Those of us who have the luxury can minimize our risk. Not everyone is that lucky.
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oped
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Post by oped on Jul 13, 2020 8:19:24 GMT -5
Surviving a pandemic is not synonymous with solving a pandemic.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jul 13, 2020 8:57:02 GMT -5
Surviving a pandemic is not synonymous with solving a pandemic. I can see how things could be managed better to minimize the impact of the pandemic but i don't see near term solution.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 13, 2020 9:57:02 GMT -5
Surviving a pandemic is not synonymous with solving a pandemic. I can see how things could be managed better to minimize the impact of the pandemic but i don't see near term solution. There is no near term solution now. Probably never was one. But, it could be bad, or it could be horrific. other countries tried to keep it bad. We, since we are exceptional, are going for horrific. Half the country is now or soon to experience how bad this can get. We will see if we have the ability to do what needs to be done.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jul 13, 2020 10:13:25 GMT -5
Surviving a pandemic is not synonymous with solving a pandemic. I can see how things could be managed better to minimize the impact of the pandemic but i don't see near term solution. A solution currently does not exist. Best we can do is mitigation, which is what we are currently trying to do.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jul 13, 2020 10:35:30 GMT -5
I can see how things could be managed better to minimize the impact of the pandemic but i don't see near term solution. There is no near term solution now. Probably never was one. But, it could be bad, or it could be horrific. other countries tried to keep it bad. We, since we are exceptional, are going for horrific. Half the country is now or soon to experience how bad this can get. We will see if we have the ability to do what needs to be done. Of course there is! It's Trump's solution. Ignore the virus and it will go away like magic. Meanwhile, the US is running out of PPE and hospitals are putting patients in conference rooms because there's just no more room.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jul 13, 2020 11:13:25 GMT -5
I can see how things could be managed better to minimize the impact of the pandemic but i don't see near term solution. A solution currently does not exist. Best we can do is mitigation, which is what we are currently trying to do. "Mitigation" - great word. Markedly better than manage in this context. Thank you.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Jul 13, 2020 11:16:53 GMT -5
Oh, boy, Cuomo is letting loose on Trump!
You don't fight a virus with politics. You fight it with science.
He's also mandating health forms with contact info from out of state travelers before they leave the airport. Fine of $2k for noncompliance. Outbreaks from traveling shows they haven't been self quarantining, so trying to get on top of it.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 13, 2020 11:44:01 GMT -5
Oh, boy, Cuomo is letting loose on Trump! You don't fight a virus with politics. You fight it with science. He's also mandating health forms with contact info from out of state travelers before they leave the airport. Fine of $2k for noncompliance. Outbreaks from traveling shows they haven't been self quarantining, so trying to get on top of it. Again, why anything but a national approach won't work. If the virus is raging someplace, we are all at risk. just think of the people who have to travel, such as delivery workers. now we want to add pro and college sports to the mix. God help us
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sesfw
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Post by sesfw on Jul 13, 2020 11:52:20 GMT -5
This administration has shown me that either citizens of the US have a lower IQ level than I thought, OR, they are easily manipulated. I'm not happy with either scenario.
Busymon .......... don't know your age but I was a young wife and mother in the 1960s when Dr Spock came out with his 'baby and child care' book. He said to not discipline children but let them learn at their own. Poor little darlin's psyche can't handle being told what is acceptable and unacceptable.
So you had a generation of 60s undisciplined and gonna do whatever I want kids. Now those kids are g-parents and have taught at least 2 generations of not caring for the common good. A da*n bunch of takers, very few givers. Members of Congress are part of these generations.
And it's going to take at least 2 generations to turn this around. It's the biblical '40'. Moses and 40 years in the wilderness for 2 generations of slaves to die off and the children being strong enough for their promised land.
Really wish I had better thoughts on this, but just watching the younger generations around me and listening to some of the people on this forum .......... I hope for the best, and hopefully enough people will get sick of this political game and say ....... ENOUGH.
The world will never again be what DH and I grew up in and raised our family in. Technology is too far advanced for that. I can hope someday people will care for each other again.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 13, 2020 12:14:52 GMT -5
Keep thinking your generation is so much better. The ones who thought that Jim Crow laws were fine, refuse to change, and want to MAGA
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 13, 2020 12:15:43 GMT -5
And I am a child of the 60's. So no, it has nothing to do with that. And your generation raised us.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jul 13, 2020 12:16:42 GMT -5
This administration has shown me that either citizens of the US have a lower IQ level than I thought, OR, they are easily manipulated. I'm not happy with either scenario.Busymon .......... don't know your age but I was a young wife and mother in the 1960s when Dr Spock came out with his 'baby and child care' book. He said to not discipline children but let them learn at their own. Poor little darlin's psyche can't handle being told what is acceptable and unacceptable. So you had a generation of 60s undisciplined and gonna do whatever I want kids. Now those kids are g-parents and have taught at least 2 generations of not caring for the common good. A da*n bunch of takers, very few givers. Members of Congress are part of these generations. And it's going to take at least 2 generations to turn this around. It's the biblical '40'. Moses and 40 years in the wilderness for 2 generations of slaves to die off and the children being strong enough for their promised land. Really wish I had better thoughts on this, but just watching the younger generations around me and listening to some of the people on this forum .......... I hope for the best, and hopefully enough people will get sick of this political game and say ....... ENOUGH. The world will never again be what DH and I grew up in and raised our family in. Technology is too far advanced for that. I can hope someday people will care for each other again. As a Trump voter you have become part of the problem and offer no solutions. And as a child of the 50’s with 2 successful daughters of my own, I call BS on your rant. Fortunately we will never return to those stultifying days of yore you apparently miss so much.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 13, 2020 18:54:41 GMT -5
One of the doctors on TV the other day mentioned that this fall our country could quite easily become every person for themselves and we could see major failures of government and other systems if our country doesn't come up with a plan soon and follow it. He suggested people read the CDC guidelines and make plans to protect themselves and their families despite what they may hear from state and other leaders. I 100% agree. At 100K infections per day, it still takes over a year to infect the population. What happens to supply chains? Trucking? And every other business out there when large numbers of people are sick, recovering, or dead? I’m not disagreeing with your post, but at 100,000 cases per day, it would take over 10 years to get to the entire population. The problem is it is not a steady increase, but where the rates are increasing, and those people need to take even more precautions. I figure that there are 6 cases for every one counted. using that math, and herd immunity at 50%, the virus goes total in 7 months.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 13, 2020 18:54:52 GMT -5
This administration has shown me that either citizens of the US have a lower IQ level than I thought, OR, they are easily manipulated. I'm not happy with either scenario.Busymon .......... don't know your age but I was a young wife and mother in the 1960s when Dr Spock came out with his 'baby and child care' book. He said to not discipline children but let them learn at their own. Poor little darlin's psyche can't handle being told what is acceptable and unacceptable. So you had a generation of 60s undisciplined and gonna do whatever I want kids. Now those kids are g-parents and have taught at least 2 generations of not caring for the common good. A da*n bunch of takers, very few givers. Members of Congress are part of these generations. And it's going to take at least 2 generations to turn this around. It's the biblical '40'. Moses and 40 years in the wilderness for 2 generations of slaves to die off and the children being strong enough for their promised land. Really wish I had better thoughts on this, but just watching the younger generations around me and listening to some of the people on this forum .......... I hope for the best, and hopefully enough people will get sick of this political game and say ....... ENOUGH. The world will never again be what DH and I grew up in and raised our family in. Technology is too far advanced for that. I can hope someday people will care for each other again. I am a child of the 60s as well. Just because Dr. Spock advocated something does not mean most mothers actually followed it. Mine certainly did not as did pretty much anyone I am aware of. I have a feeling caring for the common good means different things for both of us. Its hard for me to see what I know of my generation as takers given that the biggest taker I know is in office. He does not care for the common good, never has. Like, hate or fear Hillary, at least she cared enough about the common good to explore good healthcare practices and try to advocate for a better system. I think they were born the same year.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 13, 2020 18:56:42 GMT -5
This administration has shown me that either citizens of the US have a lower IQ level than I thought, OR, they are easily manipulated. I'm not happy with either scenario.Busymon .......... don't know your age but I was a young wife and mother in the 1960s when Dr Spock came out with his 'baby and child care' book. He said to not discipline children but let them learn at their own. Poor little darlin's psyche can't handle being told what is acceptable and unacceptable. So you had a generation of 60s undisciplined and gonna do whatever I want kids. Now those kids are g-parents and have taught at least 2 generations of not caring for the common good. A da*n bunch of takers, very few givers. Members of Congress are part of these generations. And it's going to take at least 2 generations to turn this around. It's the biblical '40'. Moses and 40 years in the wilderness for 2 generations of slaves to die off and the children being strong enough for their promised land. Really wish I had better thoughts on this, but just watching the younger generations around me and listening to some of the people on this forum .......... I hope for the best, and hopefully enough people will get sick of this political game and say ....... ENOUGH. The world will never again be what DH and I grew up in and raised our family in. Technology is too far advanced for that. I can hope someday people will care for each other again. As a Trump voter you have become part of the problem and offer no solutions. And as a child of the 50’s with 2 successful daughters of my own, I call BS on your rant. Fortunately we will never return to those stultifying days of yore you apparently miss so much. I got beaten as a kid. most of my peers did, too.
choosing between Spock and my dad, I will take Spock, thanks.
#scarredforlife
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Jul 13, 2020 19:07:14 GMT -5
I was born in 1946, I grew up ok. My son and DD were born in 69 and 71. They were taught discipline and fairly old fashioned ways, but not as strict as I was, I did not do that. They both turned into good people. You can raise good kids in any generation if you want to. But my mom helped too and we didn't have daycare much till they went to school, I was fortunate to have her help. It worked out well.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Jul 13, 2020 19:12:39 GMT -5
We have a tremendous problem and if we don't get trump out, I don't know if America will exist as a democracy much longer.
There are old guys in congress that need to go, they are in their 80's and I guess money, greed, and power is all they want and under trump they have it.
This has to end, lets hope it does. I'm getting hubs passport renewed and DD's and mine soon as we can. I so hope it never comes to the point we have to leave, but I've never seen anything like this. I don't know who would take 2 old people and a challenged DD anyway.
I am very worried about our country and everyone that does not support him. Also for the poor fools that do. they don't understand he doesn't give a rats ass about them.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jul 14, 2020 9:35:05 GMT -5
We have a tremendous problem and if we don't get trump out, I don't know if America will exist as a democracy much longer. There are old guys in congress that need to go, they are in their 80's and I guess money, greed, and power is all they want and under trump they have it. This has to end, lets hope it does. I'm getting hubs passport renewed and DD's and mine soon as we can. I so hope it never comes to the point we have to leave, but I've never seen anything like this. I don't know who would take 2 old people and a challenged DD anyway. I am very worried about our country and everyone that does not support him. Also for the poor fools that do. they don't understand he doesn't give a rats ass about them. I wonder about where to put some of my money. If the US goes down, I will likely be broke. Real estate value might be zero, stocks might be zero. I can't imagine the US economy going down without sucking the entire world economy down with it, but if I stashed some money in, say, Germany would I at least have something to live on? I'm not sure a passport will be enough to get out. And, now that I have gone down that rabbit hole, I am back to being normal. 🤓
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emma1420
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Post by emma1420 on Jul 14, 2020 10:56:17 GMT -5
We have a tremendous problem and if we don't get trump out, I don't know if America will exist as a democracy much longer. There are old guys in congress that need to go, they are in their 80's and I guess money, greed, and power is all they want and under trump they have it. This has to end, lets hope it does. I'm getting hubs passport renewed and DD's and mine soon as we can. I so hope it never comes to the point we have to leave, but I've never seen anything like this. I don't know who would take 2 old people and a challenged DD anyway. I am very worried about our country and everyone that does not support him. Also for the poor fools that do. they don't understand he doesn't give a rats ass about them. Honestly, if we don't get this inept administration out in November, I suspect that we won't get out from under this virus until 2023 or 2024. Because while I have great faith in the scientists working on the vaccine, based on the way things like PPE and testing has been managed, I have zero faith in this administration being capable of administering a nationwide vaccine program. I mean just look at what has happened. Most people in this country spent part of March, all of April and part of May in their homes. Businesses closed at great financial cost. Tens of millions of people lost their jobs. But, I think the majority of the country understood that we had to make the sacrifice in order to buy ourselves time. To buy ourselves the time to manufacture and distribute the PPE that we needed. To make sure that the our healthcare system didn't get so overwhelmed that people died simply because there weren't enough beds (which still happened, probably just to a lesser degree). To buy ourselves time to better understand how the virus worked and the various transmission paths. And finally to suppress the virus enough and to buy ourselves enough time to develop a robust nationwide testing and tracking program. However, this administration wasted all of that time. They wasted the sacrifice that many ordinary Americans made. They did almost nothing. And so now here we are. The problem is probably worse than it was in March/April (especially because we know more now). But, American are understandably tired and many are not willing to sacrifice again to the same degree. Especially, when the last sacrifice that was made was wasted, and the politicians (mostly from one party) continue to bury their heads in the sand about the reality of the situation. This fall when we have flu season? Things will get worse not better. And, on a personal note, I'm pretty bitter at the way that this President and his administration have handled this situation. The majority of my family lives in Europe. Before this year, I've always visited twice a year, because we are close. I don't think I will see them again until perhaps the end of 2021 (if we elect Biden), if not then probably 2022 or 2023. Knowing that you will potentially be separated from the people you love the most (and who are alive and well) for years simply because the government is incompetent is excruciating.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Jul 14, 2020 11:00:24 GMT -5
We have a tremendous problem and if we don't get trump out, I don't know if America will exist as a democracy much longer. There are old guys in congress that need to go, they are in their 80's and I guess money, greed, and power is all they want and under trump they have it. This has to end, lets hope it does. I'm getting hubs passport renewed and DD's and mine soon as we can. I so hope it never comes to the point we have to leave, but I've never seen anything like this. I don't know who would take 2 old people and a challenged DD anyway. I am very worried about our country and everyone that does not support him. Also for the poor fools that do. they don't understand he doesn't give a rats ass about them. Honestly, if we don't get this inept administration out in November, I suspect that we won't get out from under this virus until 2023 or 2024. Because while I have great faith in the scientists working on the vaccine, based on the way things like PPE and testing has been managed, I have zero faith in this administration being capable of administering a nationwide vaccine program. I mean just look at what has happened. Most people in this country spent part of March, all of April and part of May in their homes. Businesses closed at great financial cost. Tens of millions of people lost their jobs. But, I think the majority of the country understood that we had to make the sacrifice in order to buy ourselves time. To buy ourselves the time to manufacture and distribute the PPE that we needed. To make sure that the our healthcare system didn't get so overwhelmed that people died simply because there weren't enough beds (which still happened, probably just to a lesser degree). To buy ourselves time to better understand how the virus worked and the various transmission paths. And finally to suppress the virus enough and to buy ourselves enough time to develop a robust nationwide testing and tracking program. However, this administration wasted all of that time. They wasted the sacrifice that many ordinary Americans made. They did almost nothing. And so now here we are. The problem is probably worse than it was in March/April (especially because we know more now). But, American are understandably tired and many are not willing to sacrifice again to the same degree. Especially, when the last sacrifice that was made was wasted, and the politicians (mostly from one party) continue to bury their heads in the sand about the reality of the situation. This fall when we have flu season? Things will get worse not better. And, on a personal note, I'm pretty bitter at the way that this President and his administration have handled this situation. The majority of my family lives in Europe. Before this year, I've always visited twice a year, because we are close. I don't think I will see them again until perhaps the end of 2021 (if we elect Biden), if not then probably 2022 or 2023. Knowing that you will potentially be separated from the people you love the most (and who are alive and well) for years simply because the government is incompetent excruciating.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jul 14, 2020 11:13:43 GMT -5
This administration has shown me that either citizens of the US have a lower IQ level than I thought, OR, they are easily manipulated. I'm not happy with either scenario.Busymon .......... don't know your age but I was a young wife and mother in the 1960s when Dr Spock came out with his 'baby and child care' book. He said to not discipline children but let them learn at their own. Poor little darlin's psyche can't handle being told what is acceptable and unacceptable. So you had a generation of 60s undisciplined and gonna do whatever I want kids. Now those kids are g-parents and have taught at least 2 generations of not caring for the common good. A da*n bunch of takers, very few givers. Members of Congress are part of these generations. And it's going to take at least 2 generations to turn this around. It's the biblical '40'. Moses and 40 years in the wilderness for 2 generations of slaves to die off and the children being strong enough for their promised land. Really wish I had better thoughts on this, but just watching the younger generations around me and listening to some of the people on this forum .......... I hope for the best, and hopefully enough people will get sick of this political game and say ....... ENOUGH. The world will never again be what DH and I grew up in and raised our family in. Technology is too far advanced for that. I can hope someday people will care for each other again. People are people. Age is not the determinant. There are as many older folks who are refusing to mask and refusing to social distance as there are young ones. I raised my kids in the 60s. Both mask and both are practicing social distancing. The same is true of my grandchildren. A good deal of young people today are well aware of the dangers involved and are taking them seriously. Sadly, there will always be some who will not listen and are too selfish to care, but who they are isn't determined by their age, IMO.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Jul 14, 2020 12:08:08 GMT -5
I think it is mostly the ignorant, the ones that are trumpers. They are a class unto themselves. It's beyond belief.
We can't see our grandson either. Time is passing, critical time for grandparents to bond with their grandkids. We have not seen grandson since last Xmas, couldn't go for his birthday. NY is keeping their people safe. We have to quarantine for 14 days if we go up before we see them. Or they have to quarantine. So we can't see him. Don't know when we can. Skype is ok, but just not the same.
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