laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 7:59:06 GMT -5
Word on the street is that China has decided to take back Hong Kong right now because Trump is such a weak ass bitch that the United States won't be able to do anything about it. That is a huge bastion of capitalism that is now being controlled by Communists.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 9:22:49 GMT -5
Why should the US do anything about it?
One country, two systems until 2047 was an agreement between the UK and China.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Jul 7, 2020 9:30:49 GMT -5
Why should the US do anything about it?One country, two systems until 2047 was an agreement between the UK and China. America has a lot of business interests there. What happens to our "information" "knowledge" "American proprietary stuff" when the "Hong Kong" businesses become Chinese Businesses run by the Chinese government? Isn't that something that Trump campaigned on? The he was gonna stop China from "stealing" American "information" "knowledge" "proprietary stuff"? We might not be able to effect the agreement - but I would think we'd try to work in some "good for the US of A" stuff into how Hong Hong is run (be it regulations, laws, whatever). If not that - I would think we'd buy time to get the stuff (and people) we want to keep "safe" or "protect" out of Hong Kong. Big Business does NOT turn on a dime. FWIW: I don't ever think America would have much say about what happens with Hong Kong. But atleast it would be nice if we were in the room when it happens... (sorry for the Hamilton reference - but the concept is apropos to the situation. If we aren't involved we get nothing or get cut out of what ever happens AND it's a "slap in the face" that we wouldn't be part of something so important that effects many countries/so much business. ) Unless Trump has some charismatic/powerful/friendly to China people working with this issue - I suspect China will go ahead and be rude to America in this issue. I doubt they will burn bridges - but I see no reason they need to give any extra courtesy to the USA.
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justme
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Post by justme on Jul 7, 2020 9:47:22 GMT -5
I doubt it since trump has released several China is evil elect me so i can squish them ads.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 9:51:51 GMT -5
I doubt it since trump has released several China is evil elect me so i can squish them ads. Then someone should point out that he is beyond useless at squishing them and they are making great gains with him as Pres. Lincoln Group?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 9:52:02 GMT -5
Why should the US do anything about it?One country, two systems until 2047 was an agreement between the UK and China. America has a lot of business interests there. What happens to our "information" "knowledge" "American proprietary stuff" when the "Hong Kong" businesses become Chinese Businesses run by the Chinese government? Isn't that something that Trump campaigned on? The he was gonna stop China from "stealing" American "information" "knowledge" "proprietary stuff"? We might not be able to effect the agreement - but I would think we'd try to work in some "good for the US of A" stuff into how Hong Hong is run (be it regulations, laws, whatever). If not that - I would think we'd buy time to get the stuff (and people) we want to keep "safe" or "protect" out of Hong Kong. Big Business does NOT turn on a dime. Hong Kong went back to China in 97, if we haven’t safeguarded anything critical in 23 years then that’s on us. The US should remove Hong Kong’s special trade status if China takes away what autonomy remains.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 9:54:15 GMT -5
America has a lot of business interests there. What happens to our "information" "knowledge" "American proprietary stuff" when the "Hong Kong" businesses become Chinese Businesses run by the Chinese government? Isn't that something that Trump campaigned on? The he was gonna stop China from "stealing" American "information" "knowledge" "proprietary stuff"? We might not be able to effect the agreement - but I would think we'd try to work in some "good for the US of A" stuff into how Hong Hong is run (be it regulations, laws, whatever). If not that - I would think we'd buy time to get the stuff (and people) we want to keep "safe" or "protect" out of Hong Kong. Big Business does NOT turn on a dime. Hong Kong went back to China in 97, if we haven’t safeguarded anything critical in 23 years then that’s on us. The US should remove Hong Kong’s special trade status if China takes away what autonomy remains. Well it was safeguarded for 19 years under guys like Obama. Too bad Trump isn't as tough with foreign relations as Obama was.
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Jul 7, 2020 9:55:21 GMT -5
I sure feel for those in hong kong right now, but if anyone was to cry foul - shouldn't be the uk if that is who the agreement was with?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 9:57:59 GMT -5
Hong Kong went back to China in 97, if we haven’t safeguarded anything critical in 23 years then that’s on us. The US should remove Hong Kong’s special trade status if China takes away what autonomy remains. Well it was safeguarded for 19 years under guys like Obama. Too bad Trump isn't as tough with foreign relations as Obama was. I’m not a Trump fan but can you cite a source showing that? I’m under the understanding US dealings with the Special Administration Division of Hong Kong haven’t changed. I’m really interested in Hong Kong, Taiwan long term US relations vs another Trump bashing thread.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 10:01:57 GMT -5
This is today's article that inspired this thread. linkI don't have the link to an article I glimpsed the other day about China moving in on Hong Kong right now because of Trump being such a weak president and not fearing retaliation.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 10:04:38 GMT -5
Actually this was the exact article I was reading link
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 10:10:42 GMT -5
Another article of interest link
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 10:18:53 GMT -5
Russia is expanding it's territory, China is expanding it's territory...in case you need it, this is just proof that Trump is nothing but hot air.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 10:29:48 GMT -5
Russia is expanding it's territory, China is expanding it's territory...in case you need it, this is just proof that Trump is nothing but hot air. Where did Russia expand beyond Crimea? Hong Kong has been Chinas since 97, I don’t see this as an expansion of their territory.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 10:31:39 GMT -5
Another article of interest linkThat’s an interesting article, I definitely think the US should look at rescinding Hong Kong having special trade status. I’m not sure if it really impacts China much though, as I understand it Hong Kong is a much smaller part of trade compared to mainland China now vs 1997.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 10:35:26 GMT -5
Russia is expanding it's territory, China is expanding it's territory...in case you need it, this is just proof that Trump is nothing but hot air. Where did Russia expand beyond Crimea? Hong Kong has been Chinas since 97, I don’t see this as an expansion of their territory.Then you are working on ignoring the fact that voicing democratic ideas in Hong Kong has now become illegal. It is a very significant change in Hong Kong status.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 10:36:16 GMT -5
Another article of interest linkThat’s an interesting article, I definitely think the US should look at rescinding Hong Kong having special trade status. I’m not sure if it really impacts China much though, as I understand it Hong Kong is a much smaller part of trade compared to mainland China now vs 1997. Exactly. It won't bother China at all.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 10:41:41 GMT -5
Where did Russia expand beyond Crimea? Hong Kong has been Chinas since 97, I don’t see this as an expansion of their territory.Then you are working on ignoring the fact that voicing democratic ideas in Hong Kong has now become illegal. It is a very significant change in Hong Kong status. Not ignoring, it’s already a done deal for 2047, I don’t see it happening 27 years earlier as a huge surprise or game changer. The UK is pretty much powerless to stop it and I don’t support the US enforcing a UK/China agreement. We can either spend ourselves into oblivion counteracting the Chinese in Asia and delay the inevitable or alter strategy. I would take the approach of stopping US direct meddling and strongly supporting Japan/South Korea with arms sales as a counter to China in the region.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Jul 7, 2020 17:29:42 GMT -5
America has a lot of business interests there. What happens to our "information" "knowledge" "American proprietary stuff" when the "Hong Kong" businesses become Chinese Businesses run by the Chinese government? Isn't that something that Trump campaigned on? The he was gonna stop China from "stealing" American "information" "knowledge" "proprietary stuff"? We might not be able to effect the agreement - but I would think we'd try to work in some "good for the US of A" stuff into how Hong Hong is run (be it regulations, laws, whatever). If not that - I would think we'd buy time to get the stuff (and people) we want to keep "safe" or "protect" out of Hong Kong. Big Business does NOT turn on a dime. Hong Kong went back to China in 97, if we haven’t safeguarded anything critical in 23 years then that’s on us. The US should remove Hong Kong’s special trade status if China takes away what autonomy remains.Does that really hurt China?
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jul 7, 2020 17:53:56 GMT -5
Russia is expanding it's territory, China is expanding it's territory...in case you need it, this is just proof that Trump is nothing but hot air. Where did Russia expand beyond Crimea? Hong Kong has been Chinas since 97, I don’t see this as an expansion of their territory. When China took over Hong Kong they signed an agreement they would allow Hong Kong to remain the way they were under the British. China picked a time when the US is helmed by a weak leader and the world is occupied by covid is a great time for them to step in and step all over that agreement. Russia, in a blatant aggressive act, has been paying bounties for dead Americans, apparently confident that Trump will do nothing about it (seems they are right). Another of Trump's best dictator buddies, Erdogan from Turkey, has been trading arms with Libya and getting into fights with the French - www.reuters.com/article/us-nato-france-turkey-analysis/france-turkey-tensions-mount-after-nato-naval-incident-idUSKBN2481K5 Once again, confident Trump will do nothing against Turkey. Trump is busy protecting confederate statues and pretending the virus is a hoax. He won't do anything about any of these aggressive international actions.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 20:08:35 GMT -5
Hong Kong went back to China in 97, if we haven’t safeguarded anything critical in 23 years then that’s on us. The US should remove Hong Kong’s special trade status if China takes away what autonomy remains.Does that really hurt China? Not too much, but what else would you suggest the US do?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 20:21:56 GMT -5
Where did Russia expand beyond Crimea? Hong Kong has been Chinas since 97, I don’t see this as an expansion of their territory. When China took over Hong Kong they signed an agreement they would allow Hong Kong to remain the way they were under the British. China picked a time when the US is helmed by a weak leader and the world is occupied by covid is a great time for them to step in and step all over that agreement. Russia, in a blatant aggressive act, has been paying bounties for dead Americans, apparently confident that Trump will do nothing about it (seems they are right). Another of Trump's best dictator buddies, Erdogan from Turkey, has been trading arms with Libya and getting into fights with the French - www.reuters.com/article/us-nato-france-turkey-analysis/france-turkey-tensions-mount-after-nato-naval-incident-idUSKBN2481K5 Once again, confident Trump will do nothing against Turkey. Trump is busy protecting confederate statues and pretending the virus is a hoax. He won't do anything about any of these aggressive international actions. Not sure if you have read my other posts in this thread but I’m aware of the UK/China Hong Kong agreement. What do you suggest the US do to enforce the UK/China agreement? How do you suggest paying for it? Any other agreements between two sovereign nations you suggest the US foot the bill for enforcing? I think expecting the US to police the world is the problem.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jul 7, 2020 20:39:48 GMT -5
When China took over Hong Kong they signed an agreement they would allow Hong Kong to remain the way they were under the British. China picked a time when the US is helmed by a weak leader and the world is occupied by covid is a great time for them to step in and step all over that agreement. Russia, in a blatant aggressive act, has been paying bounties for dead Americans, apparently confident that Trump will do nothing about it (seems they are right). Another of Trump's best dictator buddies, Erdogan from Turkey, has been trading arms with Libya and getting into fights with the French - www.reuters.com/article/us-nato-france-turkey-analysis/france-turkey-tensions-mount-after-nato-naval-incident-idUSKBN2481K5 Once again, confident Trump will do nothing against Turkey. Trump is busy protecting confederate statues and pretending the virus is a hoax. He won't do anything about any of these aggressive international actions. Not sure if you have read my other posts in this thread but I’m aware of the UK/China Hong Kong agreement. What do you suggest the US do to enforce the UK/China agreement? How do you suggest paying for it? Any other agreements between two sovereign nations you suggest the US foot the bill for enforcing? I think expecting the US to police the world is the problem. At a minimum having the leader of the free world officially condemn the communist crack down would be nice. Has that happened, but it got buried in all the hundreds of tweets issued on a daily basis from our potus? Because that’s entirely possible. I can’t keep up with his twitter feed. In the old days of Reagan or Bush or even Clinton we had allies who would join us in issuing sanctions against China for their human rights violations, but sadly you’re right, without allies there really isn’t much trump can do, even if he wanted to. Such a weak potus.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 20:52:28 GMT -5
Not sure if you have read my other posts in this thread but I’m aware of the UK/China Hong Kong agreement. What do you suggest the US do to enforce the UK/China agreement? How do you suggest paying for it? Any other agreements between two sovereign nations you suggest the US foot the bill for enforcing? I think expecting the US to police the world is the problem. At a minimum having the leader of the free world officially condemn the communist crack down would be nice. Has that happened, but it got buried in all the hundreds of tweets issued on a daily basis from our potus? Because that’s entirely possible. I can’t keep up with his twitter feed. In the old days of Reagan or Bush or even Clinton we had allies who would join us in issuing sanctions against China for their human rights violations, but sadly you’re right, without allies there really isn’t much trump can do, even if he wanted to. Such a weak potus. I’d approve of a statement condemning it from the US President, but it wouldn’t accomplish anything. I’m not sure why anyone but the UK would consider sanctions, the agreement wasn’t with anyone but them.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jul 7, 2020 21:00:49 GMT -5
At a minimum having the leader of the free world officially condemn the communist crack down would be nice. Has that happened, but it got buried in all the hundreds of tweets issued on a daily basis from our potus? Because that’s entirely possible. I can’t keep up with his twitter feed. In the old days of Reagan or Bush or even Clinton we had allies who would join us in issuing sanctions against China for their human rights violations, but sadly you’re right, without allies there really isn’t much trump can do, even if he wanted to. Such a weak potus. I’d approve of a statement condemning it from the US President, but it wouldn’t accomplish anything. I’m not sure why anyone but the UK would consider sanctions, the agreement wasn’t with anyone but them. The communists are banning books and arresting people for trying to protest their government. There was a time when the world’s democracies would unite to denounce that kind of suppression, but not anymore, I guess. If Germany invaded Poland now I guess we’d shrug and say that was strictly between Germany and Poland. What do we care.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jul 7, 2020 21:19:02 GMT -5
actually, America has ALWAYS had an isolationist streak.
it took some really heavy campaigning to get us into BOTH WW1 AND WW2. it is where the PR industry was born- those campaigns.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Jul 7, 2020 21:35:54 GMT -5
When China took over Hong Kong they signed an agreement they would allow Hong Kong to remain the way they were under the British. China picked a time when the US is helmed by a weak leader and the world is occupied by covid is a great time for them to step in and step all over that agreement. Russia, in a blatant aggressive act, has been paying bounties for dead Americans, apparently confident that Trump will do nothing about it (seems they are right). Another of Trump's best dictator buddies, Erdogan from Turkey, has been trading arms with Libya and getting into fights with the French - www.reuters.com/article/us-nato-france-turkey-analysis/france-turkey-tensions-mount-after-nato-naval-incident-idUSKBN2481K5 Once again, confident Trump will do nothing against Turkey. Trump is busy protecting confederate statues and pretending the virus is a hoax. He won't do anything about any of these aggressive international actions. Not sure if you have read my other posts in this thread but I’m aware of the UK/China Hong Kong agreement. What do you suggest the US do to enforce the UK/China agreement? How do you suggest paying for it? Any other agreements between two sovereign nations you suggest the US foot the bill for enforcing? I think expecting the US to police the world is the problem. I don't really know, but Obama managed to juggle the Great Recession, Ebola, kept China in check and made it look kinda effortless. Trump is just weak. Weak and stupid.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2020 9:38:50 GMT -5
Not sure if you have read my other posts in this thread but I’m aware of the UK/China Hong Kong agreement. What do you suggest the US do to enforce the UK/China agreement? How do you suggest paying for it? Any other agreements between two sovereign nations you suggest the US foot the bill for enforcing? I think expecting the US to police the world is the problem. I don't really know, but Obama managed to juggle the Great Recession, Ebola, kept China in check and made it look kinda effortless. Trump is just weak. Weak and stupid. So it really was just Trump bashing and not discussing the Hong Kong situation. Got it, I’ll stop responding.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2020 9:43:22 GMT -5
I’d approve of a statement condemning it from the US President, but it wouldn’t accomplish anything. I’m not sure why anyone but the UK would consider sanctions, the agreement wasn’t with anyone but them. The communists are banning books and arresting people for trying to protest their government. There was a time when the world’s democracies would unite to denounce that kind of suppression, but not anymore, I guess. If Germany invaded Poland now I guess we’d shrug and say that was strictly between Germany and Poland. What do we care. As much as I am for getting the US military out of foreign entanglements I am staunchly pro NATO so it wouldn’t be kept with just Germany/Poland.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jul 8, 2020 9:50:51 GMT -5
The communists are banning books and arresting people for trying to protest their government. There was a time when the world’s democracies would unite to denounce that kind of suppression, but not anymore, I guess. If Germany invaded Poland now I guess we’d shrug and say that was strictly between Germany and Poland. What do we care. As much as I am for getting the US military out of foreign entanglements I am staunchly pro NATO so it wouldn’t be kept with just Germany/Poland. So how would/should NATO respond to one member country invading another?
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