OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Aug 7, 2019 21:43:11 GMT -5
For me, Not at all, When We had the so called freeway shooter here in Phoenix, People were avoiding the freeways. Not Me, I would have looked forward to seeing them!
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 7, 2019 22:16:03 GMT -5
For me, Not at all, When We had the so called freeway shooter here in Phoenix, People were avoiding the freeways. Not Me, I would have looked forward to seeing them!
Seeing who? The shooting victims?
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Aug 7, 2019 22:42:19 GMT -5
For me, Not at all, When We had the so called freeway shooter here in Phoenix, People were avoiding the freeways. Not Me, I would have looked forward to seeing them!
This sounds a lot like Cadet BoneSpurs saying he would have run in and stopped the shooters. Just about as likely too.
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Aug 7, 2019 22:44:45 GMT -5
For me, Not at all, When We had the so called freeway shooter here in Phoenix, People were avoiding the freeways. Not Me, I would have looked forward to seeing them!
Seeing who? The shooting victims? No, the shooter!
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Aug 7, 2019 22:49:32 GMT -5
The only actual victim, was the man wrongly arrested, put into solitary confinement for seven months, only for it to come out,, He didn't do it!! The police crime lab tech,, screwed the pooch on this one, yep, seven month solitary confinement!! All charges dropped, completely innocent!!
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Aug 7, 2019 23:04:47 GMT -5
This is interesting. Sunday my wife and I went to a hot air balloon festival put on by a private entity at a county park. They had two county officers at the gate where we drove in just standing there doing nothing. We were in our car for over five minutes and saw them just stand there talking to each other. Parked the car in the mowed field, walked to the pedestrian gate and entered. Maybe a hundred people sitting in the first section a wooded picnic area. Walked through that section to the main event area. 30 food trucks split evenly down two rows with maybe 500 people in lines purchasing food and souvenirs. On the other side of this area was a band on a stage, more tents selling stuff and then the hot air balloon section which was roped off. No one at the gates checked any back packs or strollers, etc, let alone check actual people, The workers at the gate just answered questions of what was where, etc..... People brought in all sorts of large dogs on leashes etc. Probably a total of a thousand people on the ground at about all times. We did not see one person doing any security on the ground for the 3 1/2 hours we were there. I commented to my wife after about a half hour I won dered if there was any security on the grounds at that time. Most of the enclosed fencing of the event was basically orange construction type fencing you see on highway construction or building sites that is maybe four feet high and not going to keep anyone from coming through it if they wanted to.
I know we are considered a safe community for the most part, but even the county fair which is in the same city as this event always has security at the gates and on the premises. I felt fine, but in the back of my mind was the Garlic festival in California, let alone the two weekend shootings. If we had young children with us, I am not sure we would have stayed. Anyone with an assault rifle would have killed a hundred people in less than three minutes.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 8, 2019 0:21:17 GMT -5
I am not afraid of much.
but other people are quite afraid.
it depends on where you live, I think. and whether you are frail. and whether you are a woman or a man. it depends on a lot of things.
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plugginaway22
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Post by plugginaway22 on Aug 8, 2019 6:23:29 GMT -5
Not afraid to go out, but sure makes me think about different things when we are out in a public place! So thankful that my kiddos are grown adults, but sad for my baby G-daughter and the one on the way...what will their world look like in 15-20 years?
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Cheesy FL-Vol
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Post by Cheesy FL-Vol on Aug 8, 2019 6:48:19 GMT -5
No, not really. Are we afraid to go out in our car when we know statistics of car accidents? Are we afraid to go for a walk or bike ride knowing statistics of pedestrian & cyclist deaths? Are we afraid to get on a plane knowing the statistics of plane crashes? Are we afraid to travel to different parts of the country knowing the probabilities of natural disasters that may strike?
I am not going to stay huddled in my house in fear of whatever may be out there. Life is for living and enjoying. None of us are getting out of here alive, whether it is from a shooting, an accident, or whether you live long enough to live out your life in a nursing home.
Like plugginaway said, one does think a bit differently about public places, but you can't let fear control your life.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Aug 8, 2019 7:08:47 GMT -5
I'm not, but being a little claustrophobic around crowds, I don't usually go to the places that would be attractive to a mass murderer.
A lot of people are, though. They were showing footage on the news last night about crowds in Time Square panicking when they heard a car backfire, mistaking it for a gunshot. Some pushed their way into one of the theaters, forcing the show to stop. I would be nervous, too, in a big open, very crowded space.
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tractor
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Post by tractor on Aug 8, 2019 8:05:55 GMT -5
Not at all, if it’s my time, bring it on. No amount of violence will keep me from going out, I’m more likely to avoid a large crowd out of a general dislike for masses of people than based on an irrational fear.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Aug 8, 2019 9:16:30 GMT -5
I'm not, but being a little claustrophobic around crowds, I don't usually go to the places that would be attractive to a mass murderer.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Aug 8, 2019 9:27:25 GMT -5
Not at all, if it’s my time, bring it on. No amount of violence will keep me from going out, I’m more likely to avoid a large crowd out of a general dislike for masses of people than based on an irrational fear. it does make me more aware of my surroundings than I think I may have been when I was younger. yesterday, in fact, I got off the T and moved to the next car down the line as I was wary of a very large and unsteady homeless guy that was on the verge of picking a fight with a well dressed man who was ignoring the bait being thrown (literally, the homeless guy threw a bag full of stuff at his feet) his way. I'm not sure whether it had anything to do with the fact that those two were the only non-whites in the sparsely filled car or what, but I was all set with having the first guy almost land in my lap when the train lurched around a curve. hard pass on getting stuck in that mess.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Aug 8, 2019 9:50:33 GMT -5
I am not afraid of much. but other people are quite afraid. it depends on where you live, I think. and whether you are frail. and whether you are a woman or a man. it depends on a lot of things. For me it depends. I use the expressways where shootings have happened (usually gang related or maybe drug related or domestic violence). I use public transportation (again with the shootings). The downtown train station is a death trap (terrorism). I walk past Federal buildings (terrorism). I work in a building with about 2000 other people (some of whom I'm sure have unsavory friends or abusive/dangerous relatives/spouses/SOs) so there's a potential for domestic violence or a murderous employee. And my building is surrounded by other buildings with just as many or more people.... all with their own baggage. I walk down streets filled with commuters walking to work right next to streets filled with cars/vehicles. I have to worry about guns, bombs, and vehicles - EVERY day. But for the most part I don't. I like to go to public places (concerts, movies, restaurants, stores, parks, the occasional mall, etc.). Isn't that what 'freedom' is all about? Being able to walk around in public without being afraid? I always thought that was a big part of "American Freedom". Maybe it's not... I personally highly doubt that some "hero" is gonna sucessfully whip out their handgun and shoot/incapacitate someone spewing bullits with a military type weapon should the occassion arise. People are gonna get hurt/die no matter what. Just saying. I pretty much just go about my everyday life - being about the same amount of 'careful' I've always been (as a woman). It helps that I don't have sketchy friends who are 'close friends' and I try to avoid/limit being with the sketchy relatives. (there's alot of truth to the "Choose your friends carefully" thing - you can choose friends/relatives to be involved with. ) I'm sure my feelings would change dramatically - should I be part of an event that involved guns, bombs, or vehicles.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Aug 8, 2019 9:53:46 GMT -5
Yes and no.
I am fearful of large gatherings that some deranged individual might choose to target a large number of people in a short amount of time with an automatic weapon. My family regularly moves in and out of areas where large numbers of "Brown People" live and work.
My DD will travel to the East Cost in the next week or two to a wedding for a family member of a high school friend. One of the members of that family was wounded, but survived the Sikh Temple Shooting in 2012. It did run through my mind maybe the event will be targeted by some deranged individual. Her friend has been on a vacay with my DD, My Mother and I. I will not tell my DD not to attend, but I will be praying for their safety.
This guys father was killed in that shooting, and this is what he had to say in an interview this week:
"I see this dialectical divided mindset that exists. I think trauma causes it but trauma is furthering that divide – to say I'm going to protect my own or protect my rights or protect myself through firearms."
Kaleka asked whether the First and Second Amendments should be re-examined and possibly changed, pointing out that when America's founding fathers wrote the amendments guaranteeing freedom of speech and the right to bear arms, the technology did not exist that allows people to spew hatred online to millions of people or use weapons that can fire hundreds of rounds within minutes and kill so many people so efficiently.
"Now we can imagine a shooting happening any place: faith, a mall, store, movie, elementary schools. And some people, even after all that, are not inspired enough to change what is happening," he said. www.jsonline.com/story/news/2019/08/05/oak-creek-sikh-temple-shooting-victims-son-asks-what-is-going-to-be-the-tipping-point/1924216001/
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 8, 2019 9:56:09 GMT -5
Not at all, if it’s my time, bring it on. No amount of violence will keep me from going out, I’m more likely to avoid a large crowd out of a general dislike for masses of people than based on an irrational fear. it does make me more aware of my surroundings than I think I may have been when I was younger. yesterday, in fact, I got off the T and moved to the next car down the line as I was wary of a very large and unsteady homeless guy that was on the verge of picking a fight with a well dressed man who was ignoring the bait being thrown (literally, the homeless guy threw a bag full of stuff at his feet) his way. I'm not sure whether it had anything to do with the fact that those two were the only non-whites in the sparsely filled car or what, but I was all set with having the first guy almost land in my lap when the train lurched around a curve. hard pass on getting stuck in that mess. When I worked in Manhattan, I would always stand against the subway wall while waiting for the train. Too many crazy people pushing waiting passengers onto the tracks as the subway pulled into the station.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Aug 8, 2019 10:02:24 GMT -5
it does make me more aware of my surroundings than I think I may have been when I was younger. yesterday, in fact, I got off the T and moved to the next car down the line as I was wary of a very large and unsteady homeless guy that was on the verge of picking a fight with a well dressed man who was ignoring the bait being thrown (literally, the homeless guy threw a bag full of stuff at his feet) his way. I'm not sure whether it had anything to do with the fact that those two were the only non-whites in the sparsely filled car or what, but I was all set with having the first guy almost land in my lap when the train lurched around a curve. hard pass on getting stuck in that mess. When I worked in Manhattan, I would always stand against the subway wall while waiting for the train. Too many crazy people pushing waiting passengers onto the tracks as the subway pulled into the station. that thought has crossed my mind more than a few times since I've been taking public transportation. there's benches built into the wall at the station near work, so waiting on the T to head home, I'll sit if there's any space. basically the only time I sit that isn't the actual commuter rail for an hour.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Aug 8, 2019 10:08:26 GMT -5
I'm not, but being a little claustrophobic around crowds, I don't usually go to the places that would be attractive to a mass murderer.
A lot of people are, though. They were showing footage on the news last night about crowds in Time Square panicking when they heard a car backfire, mistaking it for a gunshot. Some pushed their way into one of the theaters, forcing the show to stop. I would be nervous, too, in a big open, very crowded space.
What kind of places where people congregate are NOT attractive to mass murderers? There's been 'mass murder" at stores, movie theaters, churches, highways, concerts... and having a lack of brown people present isn't always a guarantee someone isn't gonna open up with a military type weapon, place a bomb, or drive their vehicle into the 'crowd'. Even a backyard party can get get ugly - if someone at the party is a 'target' for someone with malicious intent. (I remember a story about a backyard party where an estranged spouse/SO showed up and started shooting... I believe everyone was white.)
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Aug 8, 2019 10:12:32 GMT -5
I meant to add that we all have to manage our own "Illusion of Security".
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Cheesy FL-Vol
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Post by Cheesy FL-Vol on Aug 8, 2019 10:18:05 GMT -5
I'm not, but being a little claustrophobic around crowds, I don't usually go to the places that would be attractive to a mass murderer.
A lot of people are, though. They were showing footage on the news last night about crowds in Time Square panicking when they heard a car backfire, mistaking it for a gunshot. Some pushed their way into one of the theaters, forcing the show to stop. I would be nervous, too, in a big open, very crowded space.
I am also a little crowd phobic. Not enough to prevent me from enjoying whatever, but enough to make me feel uncomfortable.
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ners
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Post by ners on Aug 8, 2019 10:18:44 GMT -5
Not really. I try to be aware of my surroundings.
It is very sad that my church has a uniformed police officer in the gathering space during weekly services.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Aug 8, 2019 10:34:57 GMT -5
I'm not, but being a little claustrophobic around crowds, I don't usually go to the places that would be attractive to a mass murderer.
A lot of people are, though. They were showing footage on the news last night about crowds in Time Square panicking when they heard a car backfire, mistaking it for a gunshot. Some pushed their way into one of the theaters, forcing the show to stop. I would be nervous, too, in a big open, very crowded space.
What kind of places where people congregate are NOT attractive to mass murderers? There's been 'mass murder" at stores, movie theaters, churches, highways, concerts... and having a lack of brown people present isn't always a guarantee someone isn't gonna open up with a military type weapon, place a bomb, or drive their vehicle into the 'crowd'. Even a backyard party can get get ugly - if someone at the party is a 'target' for someone with malicious intent. (I remember a story about a backyard party where an estranged spouse/SO showed up and started shooting... I believe everyone was white.) People who want to murder a lot of random people (for whatever reason) will go someplace that has a lot of people in a concentrated area. Since I don't like crowds, I rarely go to those kinds of places.
But if it was a targeted attack against my workplace, the church I go to, the library where we have our book club - sure, I could be in the crosshairs, too.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 8, 2019 10:56:29 GMT -5
lots of good, thoughtful answers on this thread. I enjoyed reading them.
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busymom
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Post by busymom on Aug 8, 2019 11:05:50 GMT -5
As someone who grew up in a large city, plus, being a woman, I've always "watched my back". But now, when I go places, I pay a lot more attention to where the exits are located. It's not fear. It's self-preservation.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Aug 8, 2019 11:42:04 GMT -5
I will admit to making a conscious effort to be more aware of my surroundings when I have been at Disney World, but it hasn't stopped me from going.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 8, 2019 11:45:49 GMT -5
I'm not afraid to go out.
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pooks
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Post by pooks on Aug 8, 2019 12:10:03 GMT -5
I'm not afraid to go out, but I do worry about my daughter. She frequents many of the places that have been targets (schools, concerts, festivals, shopping, movies) and I have seen online that there is a streak of fanatic in the local area and a love of guns. It isn't the majority, but it is higher than I would like.
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steff
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Post by steff on Aug 8, 2019 12:25:37 GMT -5
Last weekend, my kiddo was on vacation in Biloxi at a casino that was having a large poker tournament. When he left I talked to him about Gilroy & just being more aware of his surroundings. I didn't call him after El Paso. But as I sat here in the middle of the night watching Dayton unfold, I couldn't help it, I called him.
I told him that I didn't want to go all "mom" on him, but I couldn't help it. I asked him to be extra vigilant with watching his surroundings, to always find the exits, and to please please please be safe. I was on edge until he got home.
I worry more about him because he does go to places with large crowds. I know hubby is safe at work because after 9/11 it takes almost an act of God to get into the plant without being an employee. Plus no employees can get into the office areas without being escorted there.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 8, 2019 12:52:26 GMT -5
Last weekend, my kiddo was on vacation in Biloxi at a casino that was having a large poker tournament. When he left I talked to him about Gilroy & just being more aware of his surroundings. I didn't call him after El Paso. But as I sat here in the middle of the night watching Dayton unfold, I couldn't help it, I called him.
I told him that I didn't want to go all "mom" on him, but I couldn't help it. I asked him to be extra vigilant with watching his surroundings, to always find the exits, and to please please please be safe. I was on edge until he got home.
I worry more about him because he does go to places with large crowds. I know hubby is safe at work because after 9/11 it takes almost an act of God to get into the plant without being an employee. Plus no employees can get into the office areas without being escorted there.
we lost the war on terror. it is because our leaders are cowards. they appeal to our fears rather than our bravery.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Aug 8, 2019 13:06:20 GMT -5
lots of good, thoughtful answers on this thread. I enjoyed reading them. So do I, but I do want to throw an additional thought in here: how do you think the answer we provide here are different from what the people in Time Square would have said prior to going out? I would think not very different at all. Yet we all saw what happened when that motorcycle (car?) backfired → general panic.
How certain can we be that all/most of us who are "not afraid to go out" would have reacted differently? Are we truly not afraid or is this just a coping mechanism that we assume in order for us to go on and deal with the uncertainties of daily life?
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