azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 17:04:26 GMT -5
I’m looking for feedback on my finances and next steps. Typed this up in word doc and realized that I last posted a budget review to YM in 2016 as we were preparing to buy a new house.
DH and I are 40 with DD10 and DD6.
Retirement Savings
• My 401k $335,000; putting in max (currently $19k) since 2016, 6% to 401k and 5% to Roth 401k
o Company match is 5% = $8400 (.05*168,000 salary)
o Company also puts in non-guaranteed profit sharing of 2% = $3360
o $55k of balance is Roth 401k which only became an option 3 yrs ago – I struggle with figuring out how much I should put in pre-tax vs Roth.
o Using 6% returns, the 401k calculator shows me on track to have 401k income of $7250/month (without pension and SS)
• I also receive long term incentive rewards which have 3 year vesting cycles and a current market value of 33,000. These started two years ago and have totaled about $15,000/year.
• I have a health retirement account funded by my employer which has a current balance of $25,000. It’s projected to have $85,000 when I’m 60. My employer will fund a second account for the half the balance for DH so $42,500. These accounts can be used to pay for healthcare needs including insurance premiums before Medicare eligibility.
• I also have a vested pension on track to be worth $885/month.
• DH’s 401k balance is $50,000. He puts in $200/month, no company match.
• We put $5500 into a Roth in DH’s name for the first time in 2018. Planning to add $5500 in 2019.
General Savings
• We have $50,000 in savings account.
• Additional $3000 in kids’ accounts.
• Note that given my current salary, these are light. I only made $60,000/year in 2012; DH was disabled and unemployed. We’ve come a long, long way. We paid off $15,000 in student loans, paid off cards, and put 20% = 70,000 on house down payment in 2016.
Income (monthly)
• My net income $7660
• DH net income $2200
= total net income $9660
Expenses (monthly)
• Mortgage $1830 (includes tax and ins)
• Private school tuition $1020 (non-negotiable thru 8th grade, then the plan is public high school)
o This is about what we spend for summer camps, so it’s a year round bill.
• Groceries $500
• Dining out $500
• Gas (vehicles) $250
• Church $200 (non-negotiable)
• DH hobby money $200
• Electric $125
• Gas (furnace) $50
• 2 cell phones $120
• Internet $60
• Water $25
• Trash $25
• Charity $76 (compassion international sponsorships)
• Life ins $100 (myself at $1M and DH at $250k because of salary and health differences; I also have $420k in coverage thru work)
• Auto ins $120
• Hulu $12
• Amazon music $4
• Entertainment $100 (movies, tickets, etc)
• Vacations $300 (this is a 9 yr monthly avg)
• Shopping $600 (catch-all category for kids clothes, home improvements, Walmart trips, etc)
• Kids activities $100 (lessons, sports, etc)
Total expenses $6317
Difference +$3443
On average $2000/month has been going into savings. Obviously we could save more, but I want to live a little too. I’m trying to find a balance.
Bonus
• My bonus is 15-30% of my annual salary of $168,000. In 2019, it was $28,500. In the past 3 years, half has gone into savings. The other half has gone to pay off debts, taking a large vacation, and getting settled into our new house.
Debt
• Mortgage $259,000 at 4%, 30 yr payoff 6/2048
• No car loans; DH’s has 200k miles and we expect to replace with $15,000 used vehicle in the next 1-2 yrs
• No credit card debt (have $40k credit available as emergency, emergency fund)
Miscellaneous
• I have both short term and long term disability. DH has short term, but his salary is lower and we survived his previous disability with much less total income.
• We didn’t start saving for retirement until 2006; no spare money during my low salary years and DH’s disability.
• I think we’re on track for retirement, maybe need to shift to more after tax savings. I could see putting $5500 into Roth for me too. I think we’re getting close to being ineligible, so I need to research that more.
• We opened a 529 account in 2019 and put through the kids’ private tuition to save about $500 in income taxes after tax reform law went into effect. We haven’t started saving for college yet; it’s been more important to me to catch up on our retirement.
• I waiver back and forth between saving for college and paying off the mortgage in order to cashflow college including helping them pay back student loans for a few years after they graduate. I want them to have skin in the game like I did.
• I love the idea of being mortgage-free, but I’ve read enough here through the years that I’m leaning more and more towards investing instead to make more money.
Part of putting this together is that I’d really like to meet with a for fee financial planner to get advice, but I’m not sure how to choose a good one. I’ve asked friends and family for references but no one seems to use one. Are there any big holes in my financial picture? What should our next steps/goals be? I’m feeling kind of lost.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jun 28, 2019 18:17:44 GMT -5
So. It's hard to judge without knowing when you plan on retiring, and what your plan is if you have to pull the plug on working much earlier than you anticipated. I would probably try to save more...because likely the 2K in excess will decrease as your kids get older. Even as you stop paying for private school tuition.
I would also contribute to the kids' college fund, or if you have relatives that give gifts, ask for contributions instead of things for gift giving occasions. You make too much to demonstrate a financial need, and I wouldn't count on merit based scholarships. I'd also have a chat with the oldest about what you expect to pay for college...now, actually. She might decide to be industrious and start babysitting sooner than later.
I would also find a way to take some really nice vacations...(Our last big vacation was 5K, but that was for 2.5 weeks). You won't have time when your kids are older. My kids aren't enrolled in anything full time over the summers, except for DD1 being in cheer. Between the 15, 11 and 7 year old's schedules, we have two 5-day windows to vacation this summer.
We took a 2.5 week vacation 4 summers ago. I think we cans squeeze another 2 week vacation in next summer. And then I think we are done vacationing as a complete family.
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on Jun 28, 2019 18:37:37 GMT -5
My first suggestion is to build your retirement plan around retiring at ago 50. Not that you will actually retire. But planning for 50 gives you options. Remember that something like 40% of the workforce leaves their job before they had planned. Some due to the employee’s health. Some due to the health of family members. Some due to forced early retirement. Or for other reasons. (I was fortunate to be able to retire at 60, when I became the only person in what had been a five person department).
Since it is pretty likely that your effective tax rate today is lower than your tax rate will be in retirement, I would only contribute as much to 401K accounts as it takes to get the maximum employer match. Everything else should go to Roth IRA’s or other investments that aren’t subject to RMD’s. You don’t want RMD’s to force you into higher tax brackets in retirement.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:01:22 GMT -5
I'd like to plan to retire at 60.
I like the idea of bigger vacations now. We did a disney cruise last fall to celebrate my big promotion. That was about $13k. We spend $3k on spring break at the beach. It's such a different lifestyle than when I grew up that it feels like too much of a splurge. On the other hand, I do like spending on travel and giving my kids experiences.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 28, 2019 19:03:50 GMT -5
My first suggestion is to build your retirement plan around retiring at ago 50. Not that you will actually retire. But planning for 50 gives you options. I would probably set retirement for when your youngest graduates college rather than 50 (assuming it's not 70, and I know it's not LOL.) So maybe 55 or 60. I can really see wanting to pay off the mortgage to cash-flow college. But I would probably do both at the same time rather than one and then the other, ie prepay the mortgage if you want AND save for college. (I know that most people here are against pre-paying a mortgage.) So the variables are, mortgage, college, fun/vacations. I would use the bonuses for that. Yes you need to budget for fun/vacations from your monthly budget. But your bonuses COULD be divided into 35% pre-payment on the mortgage (yes I know some people won't agree!), 35% college savings, and 30% fun. Or whatever variation of those percentages works for you.
We did not prepay our mortgage, and we are older than you. But I can promise you that neither of us ever slept better than the night of the day we paid it off, and it was OURS.
I also know that many people here have plenty in the bank and still choose to keep a mortgage. That's why personal finance is just that ... personal LOL.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 28, 2019 19:06:22 GMT -5
ETA: We earn MUCH MUCH less than you, and we have 4 kids. Our splurges were always on experiences/travel.
I cannot imagine ever regretting time spent experiencing something new, together.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:13:16 GMT -5
We could save more than 2k and have in the past. Where would I put it though? And when do I save enough? We are on track to put aside 19k+5.5k+2.4k = 26.9k (over 10% of our gross for retirement) with my company putting in about the same. Not arguing with you, just thinking out loud. Besides that we are on track to save an additional $24k.
Both kids are bright and testing well above grade level. We are open about finances and talk about our hs choice and why we don't want to spend $20k/yr on it. We also talk about how we make enough money for what we need, some wants, and save a lot. How we won't qualify for need based scholarships and how we will work together to choose the right college and that their grades will be a factor. With the 10 yr old we've even been honest about prioritizing our retirement over college accounts. I've even teased that I want to have enough to retire when she starts having babies so I can help her save a fortune on daycare.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 28, 2019 19:13:23 GMT -5
Last thought. My best friend in CT bought real estate for each of her kids, when they were very young. RE investments are a whole 'nother kettle of fish, they may or may not work for you. But it could be something to consider.
ETA: I honestly don't remember how it worked ... I think they took 20-year mortgages so both houses were paid off when both children were in college. Then the children sold the houses (with their parents' help, of course). Something like that, not exactly sure of the details.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:22:55 GMT -5
Responding in pieces as I digest advice and type from my phone.
I need to learn more about rmds - thanks for bringing that up.
I like the suggestion of splitting the bonus - that's what we have been doing.
I'm a saver, risk averse, and numbers geek. It's so tempting to forecast throwing the bonus money on the mortgage to make it go away quickly. Splitting the money doesn't accomplish college savings or mortgage goal quickly. That's a drawback lol.
Dh and I finished school with no monetary help from our parents. My parents paid for a $150 walmart trip each fall semester and that was it. His were on food stamps so his $5k in loans were really his own living expenses. We had $25k in student loans and paid them off ourselves. I guess I'm thinking I learned a lot thru that experience and I don't see it being a bad thing for my kids. And what they'd miss in need based aid, we could help with during and after college. And yeah, I know college costs more now.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 28, 2019 19:26:46 GMT -5
College costs a LOT more now. That doesn't mean you have to pay for everything. But who knows what it will cost when your DDs are college-aged?! I totally understand wanting them to have some skin in the game, but you don't want them crippled by SLs either. I am SUPER impatient, so I definitely get what you say about the fact that splitting the money doesn't accomplish either goal quickly LOL. But even if you break it into 3-5 year chunks, you will not pay off your house in 5 years. You need to find a balance ... both for your budget, and for your own sanity. You need to find some form of "set it and forget it", at least medium-term, I think.
Best of luck to you! You are such a super smart cookie, you will figure out what works best for you and your family.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:27:00 GMT -5
I don't have any knowledge or interest in real estate but thanks for throwing that out there.
My job is such that I don't have extra time or head space to learn it either. My job also precludes me from taking more than a week off at a time, but so far I've managed to fully take a week unplugged so I'm fortunate in that respect.
I've reached the tipping point where my time is valuable particularly to claw back time with my kids so I should also brainstorm ways to use extra money towards that - like I just can't pull the trigger on a cleaning lady.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 28, 2019 19:31:30 GMT -5
like I just can't pull the trigger on a cleaning lady.I'm sorry but to me, that's just silly. You work hard and you earn a very good living. You don't need a live-in maid, but there's nothing wrong with having someone come in twice a month (or even once if you want to start there) to take some of the pressure off, and allow you to spend more time with your kids. If you're worried about someone cleaning your kids' rooms, no problem! Just tell the cleaner to do the common areas and your/DH's rooms LOL.
Per the RE, might your DH be interested in looking into it? I know he has a lot more time that you.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:33:16 GMT -5
I can totally picture throwing an entire years bonus on college tuition and student loan debt and that could be $15-30k net of taxes. 2019 was the lowest bonus payout % that my company has had in the 10+ years that I've been there. A more typical net would be $20k.
Hope that doesn't come across as bragging, just working thru the numbers for myself too because I'm still not used to them.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 28, 2019 19:36:45 GMT -5
Not bragging at all! I missed the SL debt ... did you list it? I may have missed it, but I didn't see it anywhere.
I'd probably deal with that first.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:37:34 GMT -5
A big part of my struggle with the idea of a cleaning lady is that I don't want that to be the norm for my kids. Like I'm thankful for the way I grew up with instilled work ethic. And my kids are at the ages where they can really help and begin to build those skills themselves and they are not yet terribly busy with homework and activities. I'm irritated by how lazy they seem to me sometimes.
DH looking into real estate wouldn't be a good idea. He wanted to take $10k and invest in a steak n shake because the sign said 50% of the profits.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:40:24 GMT -5
Ours is paid off. I meant kids future student loan debt. Like if tuition is $50k, and we could only cash flow $25k so they'd take $25k in loans and end up $100k in debt. Then we would pay 20k/yr for 4 yrs post college and they'd pay $5k/yr and it would be gone (ignoring interest to keep it simple).
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:43:00 GMT -5
My kids seem to leave a trail of clutter throughout the house, but I could totally borrow your rule that if an area wasn't picked up enough for the cleaner then it becomes theirs to clean.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 28, 2019 19:44:12 GMT -5
That's wonderful! But maybe best not to tell them that until they're actually in college, or closer ...
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 28, 2019 19:50:54 GMT -5
I'm so sorry azucena, I feel like I've hijacked your thread! I'll shut up now!
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souldoubt
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Post by souldoubt on Jun 28, 2019 19:55:43 GMT -5
A big part of my struggle with the idea of a cleaning lady is that I don't want that to be the norm for my kids. Like I'm thankful for the way I grew up with instilled work ethic. And my kids are at the ages where they can really help and begin to build those skills themselves and they are not yet terribly busy with homework and activities. I'm irritated by how lazy they seem to me sometimes. We have a cleaning lady that comes once a month. Her job isn't to clean up things we leave laying around we pay her to do a deep cleaning while there's still plenty of cleaning for us to do the rest of the month to keep the place looking somewhat clean. When we know she's coming that's motivation to get clean clothes that are sitting on dressers put away, things that have accumulated on desks/tables put away and so on. There's a difference between someone cleaning your place and someone cleaning up after you because stuff isn't put away.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 28, 2019 19:56:37 GMT -5
That's wonderful! But maybe best not to tell them that until they're actually in college, or closer ... Oh yes, this will definitely be a semi-secret that dh is on board with. No hijack - it's all very much related in my mind. I enjoyed talking to you but I'm going to log off for the night. Hoping for additional useful conversation from you and others thru the weekend and at the start of the the work week so I can continue to learn.
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plugginaway22
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Post by plugginaway22 on Jun 28, 2019 20:44:31 GMT -5
I miss these kind of posts with financial reviews. Back in the day I learned so much from everyone here, now no one seems to discuss. You are in a fantastic position at your ages! Keep up the good savings rate and you will be fine. Put some of the cash in a money market account, most are over 2%, even CDs are better than sitting in a checking account. Start a taxable account. Stash more for their educations, it is never enough. It also will allow them to take advantage of study abroad programs that many cannot afford. Some day I will get up the nerve to ask what our next moves should be!
P.S. I agree with Debt that nothing feels better than a paid off home!
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jun 28, 2019 23:41:24 GMT -5
A big part of my struggle with the idea of a cleaning lady is that I don't want that to be the norm for my kids. Like I'm thankful for the way I grew up with instilled work ethic. And my kids are at the ages where they can really help and begin to build those skills themselves and they are not yet terribly busy with homework and activities. I'm irritated by how lazy they seem to me sometimes. DH looking into real estate wouldn't be a good idea. He wanted to take $10k and invest in a steak n shake because the sign said 50% of the profits. Honestly, I think it's the norm now, that if you have the funds, you outsource what you can. No one says you have to go about life the hard way. I don't think you get extra points for it on your day of reckoning.
I think part of one's work ethic is personality. A cleaning lady will have no bearing on that part.
I think I have a fine work ethic. My parents prohibited me from working a job until I was 19. Even then, they were upset that I got a very small job in college (I got paid $200 a semester) when I was 19. I also am terribly messy. Mostly because I'm an out of sight, out of mind person. I think making a bed every day is the stupidest thing ever. I still have a fine work ethic. I mean, I'm holding down two jobs and maintaining a perfect 4.0 in grad school with four kids and doing the parenting thing. This is where my efforts matter. Whether or not I make my bed has no bearing on my GPA, nor will it help me qualify for a merit raise at work. (Sidenote: I've always been like this. Even in high school, I thought it was "OK" to be lazy where it didn't matter so I could do things that did matter..)
You know how sometimes folks say that a job takes how ever much we allow for it. So, if we decide we have 45 minutes to clean the bathroom, it takes 45 minutes. Or if we have 15, it takes 15. My kids operate the same way. If they know they have all evening available to pick up, because their homework is done and they don't have any activities for the night...well, it takes them all evening to get them to pick up. If we tell them..you have to be somewhere in 20 minutes, and you have to get the dishwasher unloaded and do another chore, goodness..they find a way to move quickly to get it done.
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hurricanegirl
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Post by hurricanegirl on Jun 29, 2019 6:41:29 GMT -5
With regard to finding a good fee only CFP....who does your taxes? If you go to a CPA and have a good relationship, that firm may be willing to make a couple of recommendations for a fee only advisor. At all costs, stay away from any "advisor" with a bank or insurance company affiliation IN MY OPINION, you need to start thinking/planning now for future RMD's and the tax consequences, as tskeeter said
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resolution
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Post by resolution on Jun 29, 2019 6:52:43 GMT -5
With the numbers involved, I think it would be a good idea to meet once with a fee only financial planner. I am kind of in the same boat not knowing anyone that can recommend a good planner, but this article has some recommendations at the bottom on how to find one. www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/102014/feeonly-financial-advisers-what-you-need-know.asp I will probably go with the closest NAPFA adviser that I can find when I stop procrastinating. I looked at your post from two years ago and you have made a lot of good progress. Your budget looks solid and realistic. It is hard to answer the question, "how much saving is enough?" because that really depends on where you see your retirement spending and how long you want to stay in the workforce. I think you have enough income to handle both the savings and adding a bi-weekly house cleaner to free up more time to spend with your kids. The nice thing about the house cleaner (and most of your expenses) is that they can be cut at any time if the budget stops working out. Is your $2k monthly savings being invested or just put in a savings account? I notice that you have $50k in a savings account already, which seems more than sufficient for a safe emergency fund. Hopefully the $2k per month that you are saving is going into a brokerage account and invested in ETFs or mutual funds that will give you a decent return. If you keep saving at the same rate and have an allocation that returns 7% per year, then in 10 years your retirement would be a bit over $1.1 million, and the $2k per month non retirement savings (if invested) would be about $350k. This isn't enough to sustain your current expense level, but would be a very solid financial position at 50 and would allow for early retirement if you wanted to substantially cut back. In 20 years the retirement would be over $2.6 million and would be enough to sustain current spending levels at a safe withdrawal rate.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jun 29, 2019 7:01:23 GMT -5
A big part of my struggle with the idea of a cleaning lady is that I don't want that to be the norm for my kids. Like I'm thankful for the way I grew up with instilled work ethic. And my kids are at the ages where they can really help and begin to build those skills themselves and they are not yet terribly busy with homework and activities. I'm irritated by how lazy they seem to me sometimes. We have a cleaning lady that comes once a month. Her job isn't to clean up things we leave laying around we pay her to do a deep cleaning while there's still plenty of cleaning for us to do the rest of the month to keep the place looking somewhat clean. When we know she's coming that's motivation to get clean clothes that are sitting on dressers put away, things that have accumulated on desks/tables put away and so on. There's a difference between someone cleaning your place and someone cleaning up after you because stuff isn't put away. This is what my cleaning people do. I clean things throughout the month and then do a pick clean up and get the clutter gone before they come. I'm not paying them to move the stuff on my dresser so it can be dusted. They don't clean up after me when it comes to clutter. I am another person who sees no reason to make a bed. It gets made when I change the sheets, if Lucy pukes on it and I have to do the sheets when I didn't expect it and the day the cleaners are coming. I never saw the reason to make the bed, ever. The day I went to college, I stopped making my bed. Also, for me, the cleaning lady is a large part of taking care of my mental health.
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plugginaway22
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Post by plugginaway22 on Jun 29, 2019 7:58:55 GMT -5
Funny how everyone thinks differently. For me, walking into my bedroom and seeing the bed made is very helpful for my mental health. Seeing things messy or very cluttered causes feelings of anxiety that filters over into all areas of my life.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jun 29, 2019 8:05:11 GMT -5
Funny how everyone thinks differently. For me, walking into my bedroom and seeing the bed made is very helpful for my mental health. Seeing things messy or very cluttered causes feelings of anxiety that filters over into all areas of my life. I know. DH feels more like you. Clutter bothers him more than clean. Clean bothers me more than clutter.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2019 8:08:26 GMT -5
Funny how everyone thinks differently. For me, walking into my bedroom and seeing the bed made is very helpful for my mental health. Seeing things messy or very cluttered causes feelings of anxiety that filters over into all areas of my life. Clutter makes me very anxious and feeling out of control. Unfortunately things really ARE out of control right now, so there is clutter and because it's so bad I'm overwhelmed and can't function at all. I'm kind of caught in a vicious cycle. I try to keep a couple rooms good so I can sit in them and not be stressed. My room is a disaster since it's where I've been hiding all the mess when people come over, but I always take the 15 seconds to make my bed. If it's not made it drives me nuts.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jun 29, 2019 8:55:19 GMT -5
I have two extra bedrooms where the clutter lives.
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