Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jun 3, 2019 10:56:46 GMT -5
I need/want to put up laundry lines on our vacation land. We have 1.6 acres of unimproved land; so no structures, no power, and no water or sewer. We trailer camp and have a generator for the trailer. We fill the water tank on the way in and refill as needed. So we can do dishes, shower, and most importantly - have a flushing toilet. But no washer.
I'm starting to do research on laundry lines. I dislike the umbrella style. I'd prefer to do 2 posts, sunk in concrete. So - metal verses wood posts? I'll be using this for towels and maybe airing out blankets. I'm thinking 1-2 lines.
Any thoughts? Suggestions? Comments? Pros? Cons?
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 3, 2019 11:31:24 GMT -5
Galvanized steel posts would carry less risk of rot (though for only laundry lines you may not care nearly as much given that rot and eventual failure has minimal implications). Steel posts are often also cheaper.
The biggest disadvantage of metal posts (in general use, not necessarily for laundry) is their look. Most people just tend to like the look of wood better. Wood is also easier to attach something to later (birdhouse, sign, whatever).
Give some consideration to whether you even really care to sink them in concrete. Dig a hole, fill it firmly with dirt from the hole, be done. It's just a laundry line. If you ever decide you don't like the location, or if something does rot or get damaged, it's much easier to dig up or replace if you aren't facing a big hunk of concrete in the hole.
ETA: If you have super sandy soil, you won't want to just pack with dirt, some gravel or concrete may be better there. If you have more clay-like dirt, then dirt is all you probably need (in general I think putting fence posts in concrete causes more trouble than it's worth).
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 3, 2019 11:43:26 GMT -5
We used clothes line poles when I was a kid. Rather than a permanent structure, we tied a rope to an anchor point (tree at both ends, or a bolt on the house). You clothes pin the clothes onto the rope and then use laundry poles to raise the rope higher off the ground, to keep the laundry clean, higher than a dog and and small kids, and help it dry faster. Not having a permanent footer lets you move the line around, depending on where the sun is, and lets you take the whole thing down when you're not using it. (Empty clothes lines are notorious child entanglers).
They have them on amazon for 12 bucks each, look for clothesline props.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 3, 2019 11:50:53 GMT -5
We used clothes line poles when I was a kid. Rather than a permanent structure, we tied a rope to an anchor point (tree at both ends, or a bolt on the house). You clothes pin the clothes onto the rope and then use laundry poles to raise the rope higher off the ground, to keep the laundry clean, higher than a dog and and small kids, and help it dry faster. Not having a permanent footer lets you move the line around, depending on where the sun is, and lets you take the whole thing down when you're not using it. (Empty clothes lines are notorious child entanglers).
They have them on amazon for 12 bucks each, look for clothesline props.
We also had both ends tied to trees. Along a similar idea if you did't have trees and wanted it more movable...you could just take and make a base for a post out of treated lumber, a big "X" on the ground with a post coming up out of it. Make 2 of those and move them around to be wherever you want them. They'd be heavy enough not to move, but still movable enough you could move them anywhere you wanted.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Jun 3, 2019 12:19:41 GMT -5
We were a family of 6. And my parents were old school. We had a metal pipe (I'd guesstimate is was a 4 to 5 inch diameter pipe) set in a concrete footing. It was filled with concrete too. It had 4 hooks at the top of the pipe. I think it was about 6.5 feet from the ground to the hooks (maybe seven feet). There was a chunk of an old tree stump at the bottom of the post so my mom (and then I) could reach the hooks (us women folk are 5 foot tall). My mom used an old stepstool to get the lines on the garage (and sometimes to hang laundry). The three clothes lines (20 feet maybe 30feet) went from the post to hooks on the garage (there were 3 hooks). Mom could also run 2 clothes lines from the hooks from the post in the other direction to hooks set into the back porch of the house. She'd also run a line from the garage to a hook in the Giant Tree (old cotton wood that was old before I was born). My mom also had big long wooden poles pointy on one end and a V notch on the other to use with the lines. One of the poles went in the middle of the line to keep it from sagging when it was filled with heavy wet laundry (think jeans and towels or blankets).
I would NOT sink your post just into the ground. Wet laundry is HEAVY. Wind catching laundry (sheets) and a windy day can also be a powerful force. Sure would suck to have your clean laundry hit the ground when the post shifts or rots and gives way.
For any sort of longevity I'd treat your clothesline post(s) like Fence posts OR maybe deck posts.
I'm not sure if heavy wet or wind pulled laundry can tear (or work out over time) a hook out of a 4 by 4 wooden post so I'd probably go the metal post route.
I'd make the hooks as high up as possible. You can alway use a step stool when hanging laundry - atleast then your blankets and sheets won't hit the ground.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Jun 3, 2019 12:26:42 GMT -5
We used clothes line poles when I was a kid. Rather than a permanent structure, we tied a rope to an anchor point (tree at both ends, or a bolt on the house). You clothes pin the clothes onto the rope and then use laundry poles to raise the rope higher off the ground, to keep the laundry clean, higher than a dog and and small kids, and help it dry faster. Not having a permanent footer lets you move the line around, depending on where the sun is, and lets you take the whole thing down when you're not using it. (Empty clothes lines are notorious child entanglers).
They have them on amazon for 12 bucks each, look for clothesline props.
We also had both ends tied to trees. Along a similar idea if you did't have trees and wanted it more movable...you could just take and make a base for a post out of treated lumber, a big "X" on the ground with a post coming up out of it. Make 2 of those and move them around to be wherever you want them. They'd be heavy enough not to move, but still movable enough you could move them anywhere you wanted. Have you ever hung heavy wet laundry on a clothes line? OK, maybe your movable posts would work if you only needed about 6 feet of line space and there was no wind. this is a general example and not really a "critic" of the idea of using movable posts... just that it can be complicated and might require more creativeness/experimenting to make it work: I have a custom built "flag post" - it's base is a 12 by 2 inch board 30 inches long. A 4 by 4 50 inch post is attached to it with a deck screw. The post is reinforce at the bottom with additional 4by4 peices. I weight the whole thing down with a big cinder block. And this is just to keep a 3 by 5 nylon American Flag on a 3/4 inch aluminum pole (in an aluminum flag holder) from blowing the whole thing over. The post held firm but during a storm the flag and pole BENT the aluminum flag holder and pulled out some of screws securing it to the 4by4 post. Yeah, you don't put out laundry in bad weather, but remember it was a nylon flag....
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2019 12:28:19 GMT -5
The Amish family where we take our pony to for training have the most awesome laundry line I've ever seen. She loads things at the house and a pulley system takes it a good 100 feet or more across the yard and up to the peak of their barn.
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haapai
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Post by haapai on Jun 3, 2019 12:30:46 GMT -5
I share your dislike of umbrella-type air-drying gizmos. They'll hold a lot of smalls, but once you start hanging sheets and towels on them, you tend to run out of room quite quickly and anything that drapes and catches the wind will get tangled up with other stuff and dries poorly. This is not what you need when you limited time, sunny weather, and breeze.
Is your vacation property treeless? I ask because a line strung between two trees requires no post-hole digging, no concrete anchor, and less sun than you might think. As long as air is moving, and it doesn't rain too much, stuff will dry in the shade.
FWIW, my folks owned their vacation property for almost twenty years before pulling out the clothesline system that came with the property. Two galvanized metal T's with four lines strung along them came in very handy for many years even though they had a dryer inside. It took a combination of fewer folks creating wet towels and new (much richer) neighbors, for them to dismantle what had come with the house.
I'm sorta leaning toward the metal supports system myself. If properly footed, it can handle a lot of weight and disposing of the metal supports when the time comes is probably easier than getting rid of an equivalent amount of degraded wood.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jun 3, 2019 12:34:14 GMT -5
Neighbors behind me have metal posts. They sold the house this past winter. Original owners used the laundry lines daily with two small kids. New people have never used it.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Jun 3, 2019 12:34:19 GMT -5
The Amish family where we take our pony to for training have the most awesome laundry line I've ever seen. She loads things at the house and a pulley system takes it a good 100 feet or more across the yard and up to the peak of their barn. Yes! That is awesome! I gotta wonder what kind of tension that line has to keep it from sagging and what it's made out of. A friend's house has a pulley system like that - there's 2 lines that go from the house to the garage (across 20 feet of back yard) both lines use pulleys. I would have to look - the next time I'm there - there might have been more lines (they were also old school and a family 6 - just with a smaller backyard (a suburban "postage stamp" sized and no trees. I know her mom still has 2 working lines (she hangs out towels and sheets and sometimes clothes).
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 3, 2019 12:43:25 GMT -5
We also had both ends tied to trees. Along a similar idea if you did't have trees and wanted it more movable...you could just take and make a base for a post out of treated lumber, a big "X" on the ground with a post coming up out of it. Make 2 of those and move them around to be wherever you want them. They'd be heavy enough not to move, but still movable enough you could move them anywhere you wanted. Have you ever hung heavy wet laundry on a clothes line? OK, maybe your movable posts would work if you only needed about 6 feet of line space and there was no wind. this is a general example and not really a "critic" of the idea of using movable posts... just that it can be complicated and might require more creativeness/experimenting to make it work: I have a custom built "flag post" - it's base is a 12 by 2 inch board 30 inches long. A 4 by 4 50 inch post is attached to it with a deck screw. The post is reinforce at the bottom with additional 4by4 peices. I weight the whole thing down with a big cinder block. And this is just to keep a 3 by 5 nylon American Flag on a 3/4 inch aluminum pole (in an aluminum flag holder) from blowing the whole thing over. The post held firm but during a storm the flag and pole BENT the aluminum flag holder and pulled out some of screws securing it to the 4by4 post. Yeah, you don't put out laundry in bad weather, but remember it was a nylon flag.... A 12x2 board probably isn't what I'd use for a big 4x4 post...I'd use 4x4 posts as the base, 4 of them, 1 out in each direction, 2 feet each (giving you a 4x4 square foot sizing on the base). Using a 4x4 post with 2x lumber as the base just makes the entire thing top-heavy. I wouldn't worry about wind at all, but I might worry about heavy wet laundry pulling it down inwards (it's certainly not as sturdy as something actually in the ground though). To your point though, I'm definitely assuming they don't need a massively long clothes line if the purpose is just camping in a trailer (i'm assuming for only a few days at a time).
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 3, 2019 12:48:07 GMT -5
We were a family of 6. And my parents were old school. We had a metal pipe (I'd guesstimate is was a 4 to 5 inch diameter pipe) set in a concrete footing. It was filled with concrete too. It had 4 hooks at the top of the pipe. I think it was about 6.5 feet from the ground to the hooks (maybe seven feet). There was a chunk of an old tree stump at the bottom of the post so my mom (and then I) could reach the hooks (us women folk are 5 foot tall). My mom used an old stepstool to get the lines on the garage (and sometimes to hang laundry). The three clothes lines (20 feet maybe 30feet) went from the post to hooks on the garage (there were 3 hooks). Mom could also run 2 clothes lines from the hooks from the post in the other direction to hooks set into the back porch of the house. She'd also run a line from the garage to a hook in the Giant Tree (old cotton wood that was old before I was born). My mom also had big long wooden poles pointy on one end and a V notch on the other to use with the lines. One of the poles went in the middle of the line to keep it from sagging when it was filled with heavy wet laundry (think jeans and towels or blankets). I would NOT sink your post just into the ground. Wet laundry is HEAVY. Wind catching laundry (sheets) and a windy day can also be a powerful force. Sure would suck to have your clean laundry hit the ground when the post shifts or rots and gives way. For any sort of longevity I'd treat your clothesline post(s) like Fence posts OR maybe deck posts. I'm not sure if heavy wet or wind pulled laundry can tear (or work out over time) a hook out of a 4 by 4 wooden post so I'd probably go the metal post route. I'd make the hooks as high up as possible. You can alway use a step stool when hanging laundry - atleast then your blankets and sheets won't hit the ground. How would you treat them like fence posts or deck posts and "not just sink them into the ground"? You can just sink both of those into the ground, and in fact there are a lot of good reasons not to use concrete since that's more prone to holding moisture on the posts promoting rot, and eventually it's going to crack which means it's not secure. If you're worried about the wind, wood is definitely the way you'd want to go. Metal posts will bend long before a big metal hook is going to pull out of a big wooden post.
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justme
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Post by justme on Jun 3, 2019 13:04:29 GMT -5
So at our cottage, from back before we got a dryer but still frequently used. One end is attached to the siding of the cottage and the other to a tree about 40' or so away. And it's one of those pulley laundry lines (had to be, cottage is built up so the line is at least 10' off the ground) so if you used one you wouldn't have to stop, put up the laundry, pick up the basket, move down a little - just push the line out instead. Would even work between two trees and probably two poles
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jun 3, 2019 13:44:15 GMT -5
We have mostly pine trees in sandy soil. We have no good trees, in my opinion, to tie a line to.
I'm leaning towards wooden because then I can use one pole to sink a bolt in for a hammock. Because we have no good trees for hammock either.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 3, 2019 13:55:03 GMT -5
We have mostly pine trees in sandy soil. We have no good trees, in my opinion, to tie a line to.
I'm leaning towards wooden because then I can use one pole to sink a bolt in for a hammock. Because we have no good trees for hammock either.
I wouldn't use sandy soil as fill, get some small rock and sink the pole 4 feet deep (40-48"). Throw some gravel in the bottom of the hole first and compact it by tamping it with a 2x4. I wouldn't use concrete since you don't really need the weight of it since burying over 1/3 of the wood means it won't really be top-heavy, but if you're set on it, use a concrete collar at the top (the key to using concrete is you don't want it to act as a cup to catch the water that will inevitably get between the wood and the concrete as the wood expands/contracts...so you use it toward the top of the hole and not very much of it).
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jun 3, 2019 14:02:41 GMT -5
We used clothes line poles when I was a kid. Rather than a permanent structure, we tied a rope to an anchor point (tree at both ends, or a bolt on the house). You clothes pin the clothes onto the rope and then use laundry poles to raise the rope higher off the ground, to keep the laundry clean, higher than a dog and and small kids, and help it dry faster. Not having a permanent footer lets you move the line around, depending on where the sun is, and lets you take the whole thing down when you're not using it. (Empty clothes lines are notorious child entanglers).
They have them on amazon for 12 bucks each, look for clothesline props.
This is what my grandmother did too. The laundry lines were tied between the house and garage and when the laundry was hung, the poles raised the laundry lines up to catch the breeze.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jun 3, 2019 14:03:54 GMT -5
We have mostly pine trees in sandy soil. We have no good trees, in my opinion, to tie a line to.
I'm leaning towards wooden because then I can use one pole to sink a bolt in for a hammock. Because we have no good trees for hammock either.
You can sink an outlet into the trunk to tie the line to, then untie it when it is no longer needed.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Jun 3, 2019 14:49:00 GMT -5
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 3, 2019 15:12:53 GMT -5
Just a quick read...it's not intended for structural posts or posts exposed to sideways loads (I would say a hammock is a decent sideways load). It looks like the only advantage to it is that you can get a fill very quickly as it expands. Maybe I'm wrong, but as I read the specs, it sounds like it has all the worst properties of both concrete and soil...with the primary advantage that it's quick and convenient upon installation. It would probably be fine for a laundry line, because there isn't much sideways load there, but I wouldn't want to put a hammock on it (honestly I wouldn't personally want to use it anywhere, but I wouldn't have safety concerns if someone used it for laundry but I would for a hammock).
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Jun 3, 2019 15:14:57 GMT -5
Just a quick read...it's not intended for structural posts or posts exposed to sideways loads (I would say a hammock is a decent sideways load). It looks like the only advantage to it is that you can get a fill very quickly as it expands. Maybe I'm wrong, but as I read the specs, it sounds like it has all the worst properties of both concrete and soil...with the primary advantage that it's quick and convenient upon installation. It would probably be fine for a laundry line, because there isn't much sideways load there, but I wouldn't want to put a hammock on it (honestly I wouldn't personally want to use it anywhere, but I wouldn't have safety concerns if someone used it for laundry but I would for a hammock). Just thought it would be better that sticking the support pole in the ground with just dirt around it?
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 3, 2019 15:26:50 GMT -5
Just a quick read...it's not intended for structural posts or posts exposed to sideways loads (I would say a hammock is a decent sideways load). It looks like the only advantage to it is that you can get a fill very quickly as it expands. Maybe I'm wrong, but as I read the specs, it sounds like it has all the worst properties of both concrete and soil...with the primary advantage that it's quick and convenient upon installation. It would probably be fine for a laundry line, because there isn't much sideways load there, but I wouldn't want to put a hammock on it (honestly I wouldn't personally want to use it anywhere, but I wouldn't have safety concerns if someone used it for laundry but I would for a hammock). Just thought it would be better that sticking the support pole in the ground with just dirt around it? Sandy dirt? Maybe, because sandy dirt isn't good for the job. Clay dirt? No. Small Gravel? No. All IMO of course. The issue is it's not heavy (which is the only real benefit of concrete), and it doesn't drain water through it (which is the real benefit of dirt). That's what makes it kind of the worst of both (i.e. it'll let water trap between the hardened mixture and the post which leads to rot, and it's not even heavy enough to act as a good anchor for sideways load). The other advantage would be that unlike concrete it doesn't look like it's likely to hold moisture itself...and probably wouldn't crack. The convenience aspect is definitely a consideration. It's not a simple job to keep a post held in place while you actively compact dirt around it...the act of compacting the dirt often shifts the post in small ways that you have to constantly monitor as you do it (and while shoveling the dirt and compacting it isn't the hardest of jobs...it's certainly harder than opening a package and pouring the contents out). It's like a lot of things when it comes to building though. It's almost definitely not as good, but it might be a lot more convenient, so you've gotta balance those 2 things. If it weren't for the hammock aspect here, I might think it would work fine. It's almost definitely not BETTER than using dirt in terms of the final product, but for this kind of application good compacted clay dirt (or with this sandy soil, small gravels) is about as good as you can get.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2019 17:55:28 GMT -5
I vote metal posts in concrete. Lucky folks if you have an open area without trees for this, because I gave up when I realized that clotheslines and trees and birds aren't a viable dynamic. Local effort at banning clotheslines in new deed restriction amendment push won't get my support. When you get rid of the houses with 10+ itinerant laborers, and the grow houses, and a few other problems, then you can go after the clotheslines NOT
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 3, 2019 18:15:46 GMT -5
I vote metal posts in concrete. Lucky folks if you have an open area without trees for this, because I gave up when I realized that clotheslines and trees and birds aren't a viable dynamic. Local effort at banning clotheslines in new deed restriction amendment push won't get my support. When you get rid of the houses with 10+ itinerant laborers, and the grow houses, and a few other problems, then you can go after the clotheslines NOT I never understood why people don't like clothes lines in the backyard. To me, it makes a place look homey. Now, if you had them up 24/7 and left stuff hanging on them 24/7, maybe, just like Christmas lights left up 24/7, that would start to look shabby.
I always liked the way sheets felt when air dried. Once I retire, I hope to go back to drying things on the clothesline myself.
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on Jun 3, 2019 20:19:23 GMT -5
I need/want to put up laundry lines on our vacation land. We have 1.6 acres of unimproved land; so no structures, no power, and no water or sewer. We trailer camp and have a generator for the trailer. We fill the water tank on the way in and refill as needed. So we can do dishes, shower, and most importantly - have a flushing toilet. But no washer.
I'm starting to do research on laundry lines. I dislike the umbrella style. I'd prefer to do 2 posts, sunk in concrete. So - metal verses wood posts? I'll be using this for towels and maybe airing out blankets. I'm thinking 1-2 lines.
Any thoughts? Suggestions? Comments? Pros? Cons?
Steel post. Much more durable. A wood post will rot off in 5 - 10 years, in most areas. You will find out about the rot when several loads of laundry get dumped on the ground. You can fix up your hammock by wrapping a piece of flat stock around the post and using a bolt to pinch the flat stock tight to the pole If you want prettier than steel pipe, box in the pipe with wood.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Jun 3, 2019 21:00:41 GMT -5
Metal. That's what we had when o was growing up, and we'd climb and flip on them. Wet laundry is really heavy, and the line needs to be strung really tight to hold up.
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haapai
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Post by haapai on Jun 3, 2019 21:23:18 GMT -5
I'm surprised to hear myself say this, but I'm also leaning toward metal. It will never look great, but it will last much better than any wooden structure. I know because my grandparents had a wooden structure that they had to fight with quite a bit after 10 years. The uprights held but the crossbars didn't last too well there was a lot of decay in the wood where the hooks had originally been and wrapping the line around the crossbar instead meant that the line stayed wet and decayed quickly.
FWIW, this was in Northern MI, pretty much the same latitude and soil.
I suspect that a metal pole may also have a much narrower diameter than a wooden one, which is a significant issue if you are the one digging or augering the hole. I'd sink that sucker in deep enough that a concrete anchor was superfluous. (It wouldn't have much virtue as a continuous weed guard either. Dirt will migrate over it quite quickly and you'll still have to weed-whack around it, if anything grows in your sand.) ETA: A wooden post may take a lot more damage from lawmowers and weedwhacking.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Jun 3, 2019 21:34:12 GMT -5
If you don't sit them in concrete they will give. Use metal or steel. And we have coated wire, was going to use just wire but they get a patina on them that gets on your clothes so he went with the coated wire. Also put toggles on each end, if they loosen you can just tighten them to take the slack out.
The inlaws had a clothes line with end posts that were actual train tracks, old ones. Hubs dug them up and brought them here and set them in concrete, I'm sure he had to use the backhoe to dig them out. I repainted them, those puppies are likely good for another 100 years or so. LOL! I have a super awesome clothes lines.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 4, 2019 7:45:58 GMT -5
If you don't sit them in concrete they will give. Use metal or steel. And we have coated wire, was going to use just wire but they get a patina on them that gets on your clothes so he went with the coated wire. Also put toggles on each end, if they loosen you can just tighten them to take the slack out. The inlaws had a clothes line with end posts that were actual train tracks, old ones. Hubs dug them up and brought them here and set them in concrete, I'm sure he had to use the backhoe to dig them out. I repainted them, those puppies are likely good for another 100 years or so. LOL! I have a super awesome clothes lines. If you sink them deep enough, and fill them with something other than sandy dirt, they won't go anywhere (heck you can just take a steel fence post and a post driver and slam that right into the ground without even digging a hole at all). Bury 1/3 of the length, 4 feet if you don't want them to heave (I wouldn't care about a little heaving with a laundry line personally). It's not that you "can't" hang a hammock from a steel post, but you're going to need a good strong beefy one...something that would be overkill for what you'd need for a laundry line. You'd be better off just buying a steel post made for hanging a hammock at that point.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 4, 2019 7:50:23 GMT -5
I'm surprised to hear myself say this, but I'm also leaning toward metal. It will never look great, but it will last much better than any wooden structure. I know because my grandparents had a wooden structure that they had to fight with quite a bit after 10 years. The uprights held but the crossbars didn't last too well there was a lot of decay in the wood where the hooks had originally been and wrapping the line around the crossbar instead meant that the line stayed wet and decayed quickly.
FWIW, this was in Northern MI, pretty much the same latitude and soil.
I suspect that a metal pole may also have a much narrower diameter than a wooden one, which is a significant issue if you are the one digging or augering the hole. I'd sink that sucker in deep enough that a concrete anchor was superfluous. (It wouldn't have much virtue as a continuous weed guard either. Dirt will migrate over it quite quickly and you'll still have to weed-whack around it, if anything grows in your sand.) ETA: A wooden post may take a lot more damage from lawmowers and weedwhacking.
Yes, if you're going to use wood...put the eyebolt into the side of the post if you're just going to have one line. You don't want holes in the top of the wood where water is just going to infiltrate constantly and sit (or you're basically just creating the same problem you have with filling the hole with concrete...sitting water). If you want more than one line and you're going to use a crossbar...attach it diagonally from below, and give it a slight slant so that the water will drain off of it.
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Wisconsin Beth
Distinguished Associate
No, we don't walk away. But when we're holding on to something precious, we run.
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 11:59:36 GMT -5
Posts: 30,626
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jun 7, 2019 9:25:06 GMT -5
I was spending time with my Dad and brother yesterday and asked them about wood vs metal for this. Dad thought wood, Brother thought metal. LOL.
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