I am probably crazy but...

[Ava]

I am ready to move back.

I have been here for a full month and due to leave in a couple of days.

While here, I have been insanely happy. This is  the longest vacation I have taken since I moved to the US. I have never befo re had so much time to spend with family and friends. I feel happy, connected and loved. The only thing that has gotten to me during the last few days is the thought of going back to a job that is not bad but not fulfilling enough, a lonely house, a long commute, and nothing else.

My mother and I have been talking.

The situation here is not perfect, far from it. At the same time, there is a huge need for well educated workers who are fluent in English.

This is a third world country and it shows. There is poverty and insecurity is high. However I know how to live within that reality.

Salaries are lower but enough to cover my expenses, including the student loan payment.

It may take me a few months to find a job, and that is a risk, but I will always have a roof over my head and food to eat, medical coverage, etc.

The credit card debt is gone.

The condo can be rented, I have found a good property manager from my community and I trust him. He is also a handyman and has been doing stuff in the condo for the last couple of years. He is very professional and we have an excellent working relationship. Hes willing and able to take on managing the condo.

The car can be sold, the money from the sale to cover the loan. I will have to put some money from my own pocket but I can take that from my Roth IRA. I am soon due for my bonus from last years work, plus tax refund. I will also have a last paycheck to cash, unused vacation days and an ESOP that I would also cash. All told I can leave with 10 or 12K by May.

After talking and talking, my mother and I realized the biggest issue is my cat. She is a very healthy 14 years old with hopefully many more years left. My mothers current apartment has no room for her, plus there is parket floor and nowhere to put a litter box without it being unsanitary and unpleasant.

I think I have come with a solution. We could rent out this apartment and move somewhere more appropriate for my cat.

TIme is so valuable and so finite. My mother and I get along so well here. We keep each other company, we laugh, we watch TV together, we go out. When she visits me in the US, on the other hand, she becomes completely dependent on me because of language and physical barriers, and I end up exausted and angry. I want to enjoy her for whatever time we have left. I want to be with my brother, my nephew, my friends and my cousins.

If my mother agrees to the idea of moving to another home, I will be living here full time by May.

If she doesnt agree I will have to keep on living in the US for the time being because I would not earn enough to afford to pay rent. My biggest fear is that she wont believe I am serious about this and dismiss my idea.

There is a new agreement between this country and the US that allows for years worked here to count towards retirement in combination with years worked in the US. That would be a great thing for me down the road.

[tskeeter]

If  you can figure out how to make it work, make the change.  I think you’ll be a lot happier closer to your family and life long friends.

(Did you know that even back in the 1800’s and early 1900’s, when international travel was much more difficult, about 1/3 of the folks who immigrated to the US returned to their home country to live.)

[mmhmm]

This sounds like an excellent idea, to me, Ava. You've not been happy here for the most part. If your mother agrees with your ideas, I hope this becomes a reality for you. 

[zibazinski]

Do it! You can always come back. I actually have been wondering how you were doing.

[Shooby]

You should go for it!  You know that is your heart's desire.  Just do it  and don't let anything be a stumbling block.  Personally, I think you should consider selling the condo and just make a clean break and have that financial liablity off your plate.  But, you can take your time in that decision if you could rent it awhile and feel confident in your property manager. 

[NoNamePerson]

Go for it. What's the worse that could happen??

[Blonde Granny]

If you can make it work, go for it!!!!

[plugginaway22]

Yes, seek happiness, life is too short!

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

Go for it. It doesn’t seem like there is any meaningful reason for you to stay here. That said, double check immigration rules into your country for animals. Will Ava have to be quarantined for any stretch of time when she arrives?

But, sell the condo if you can cover any potential shortfall. If salaries at home are that low, you don’t want to be stuck having to cover mortgage payments during turnover vacancies. The Spring season here in New England is the busiest real estate sales season. You have timed it perfectly. Come back, put it on the market, pack up, and leave when it sells.

Finally, and please understand that I don’t share the current President’s thinking at all, but bear in mind as you make this move home that it is possible given current anti-immigrant agendas that down the road you may not be allowed to return to the United States to live. These are uncertain times for non-citizens.

I wish you all of the best in your decision and move. I’m sorry that we never got to meet IRL.

[Deleted]

Ava, I don't think you are crazy, but I do think you are coming off the high of a really pleasant vacation.  Living with your mother full-time would be a lot different from visiting her for an extended period of time.  You are used to a certain amount of independence, some of which you are bound to lose.

Is there some sort of group of people with your similar background that you can connect with here in the U.S.? Your loneliness is obvious, and I can understand the appeal of being with family and old friends in easing that.

But as GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl points out, these are uncertain times.  It is not a given that you can return to the U.S. to live should you leave.

Don't make the decision right now.  Once you are "home" here, you may have second (and third) thoughts about this.

[Anne_in_VA]

I think you should consider this very carefully once you come back to the states.  I would sell the condo, the car and then move back to your homeland if that is what you think will make you most happy in the long run.  However, you should be aware that you may not be able to return to the US if for some reason the move doesn’t work out.

[TheOtherMe]

If this is what you want to do, go for it.  Yes, check on the rules for getting the cat in to the country.

I would also sell the condo.  Why have it (and US tax returns) for years to come?

You haven't been happy in the US for a long time.  Life is short so be happy.

[saveinla]

I am fairly sure she is a US citizen, so will be able to return even if she goes back and it does not work out or if she finds a better position in a warmer climate in the US.

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

Jan 19, 2019 11:07:04 GMT -5 saveinla said:

I am fairly sure she is a US citizen, so will be able to return even if she goes back and it does not work out or if she finds a better position in a warmer climate in the US.

Given current political agendas and how SOME other naturalized citizens are being treated, I would not rely on that citizenship to open doors for re-entry. Given the ugly rhetoric spewed all over the airwaves, the hate and fear being heaped on the caravan is likely to spread to all people of Central and South American descent. Heck, even some native-born citizens are seeing their rights abridged. JMHO. YMMV.

[Deleted]

Jan 19, 2019 10:56:13 GMT -5 TheOtherMe said:

If this is what you want to do, go for it.  Yes, check on the rules for getting the cat in to the country.

I would also sell the condo.  Why have it (and US tax returns) for years to come?

You haven't been happy in the US for a long time.  Life is short so be happy.

I think she is majorly upside down in the condo, which is why she always talks about renting it out.  I don't think she has that kind of money to bring to the table.

[weltschmerz]

"I am ready to move back.

I have been here for a full month and due to leave in a couple of days."

If you don't mind my asking....where is "here"?

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

If she is a citizen, it is one thing.  If she is a green card holder, you must live in the US for a certain period of time or your green card is given up.** 

However, even naturalized citizens have been having issues.....especially if they are of Hispanic origin.  

**  TD just told me that you cannot be out of the US more than one year after you have your green card.  They may allow more time under special circumstances (like if your US employer sends you overseas), but paperwork is necessary.  

[TheHaitian]

Let it be the Haitian Man be the one that comes and rain on your parade : I apologize in advance!

I am or was in a similar situation as you (still am at times) and it took a few talks to friends that live in Haiti, family members to kind of poo-poo that idea.

Vacationing and living somewhere permanently is 2 different things... I have vacationed many times in DC before moving there and romanticized the idea. Now? If we ever leave you cannot pay me enough to come back!

Second I was told it is the same idea with me moving back to Haiti. When I vacation everyone is happy to see me, everyone hangs out, everyone is welcoming, after all I am only there for a short time. When you live there the “newness” fade away, folks go back to their regular routine, life continues.

I want to move back to Haiti for the social aspect, while a third world country we appreciate life balance, having a life outside of work, getting together on the weekends of weekdays, going to concerts/festivals, regular gatherings. I miss that sense of community ... but to acquire that I will have to give up a few things we have come to appreciate :

- access to everything: I will use my wife best friend as an example. She comes to the US 1-2 times a year and when she comes we or her sister get about 30-50 amazon packages for her that she stuffed into 2-4 bags (if she travels with DD) to return to Haiti.

- I remember before moving to the US permanently (vacation during the summer) I did the same and so does everyone I know that lives in Haiti including my wife (my brother does it when he visits). Getting some of the things you want in Haiti price wise is prohibitive at times (and shipping cost for amazon makes it not worth it)... so a lot of people when they travel purchase everything they can get their hands on and go back.

- their is a comedy sketch out there about how when Haitians go to Haiti they have 2-6 bags and 2 carry ons and when they return they are empty handed, it is funny because it is 100% true and we all can relate.

- Healthcare : that is my wife concern about retiring in Haiti and one of the reason my MIL was in the US at least 6 months out of the year. Access to good healthcare! I have an aunt that passed away last year visiting Haiti of a stroke that if in the the US she would have survived. The General Hospital is a mess (no supplies, no nothing), the private hospitals wants to get paid before they will touch you and he overall service you get is sad.

- economic stability : they are good jobs in Haiti but the supply is limited. It is a lot about who you know, or who knows your family and how connected your family is. My wife and I could work for a non profit but then that would make me a hypocrite since I feel
Non profits are one of the main reasons Haiti remains in the state it is.

- but the pro for us beside she lifestyle, less expensive and have a better life there (nanny, maid, driver etc) on less... but also we would not have to pay rent or mortgage. Which was the #1 motivator for us. My wife cousin and her husband has done it the past ~6 years with him working for the department of defense (stationed in 3 different countries working at the embassies) and not having to pay 2k-3k/month towards rent or mortgage helps/improve your financial situation quickly.

All that said; for my wife is is a definite NO. She is more than happy to visit every year or every other year (I want to go back at least every other year now since we had DD) but moving back permanently is a no. For her it is mostly about the political atmosphere; people in the streets burning tires, building and political unrest gets old after awhile.

For me it is a yes but not without my wife or kids. So still browsing beach front properties on sale and looking for a good retirement deal even if my wife is against it. I figure I have 30 years to convince her...

In your case I say make sure you are not making this decision on a high, make sure it is realistic, feasible and something you can live with. Don’t romanticize the move, be sadistic. For me I knew I could move back when I accept it that even if everything went to hell I would prefer to be in Haiti then I’m the US.... even my wife best friend said that: she could see me moving back and being happy being back in Haiti; my wife? She is too Americanized now.

So if in your heart every single one of your plans did not work out and yet you would still be happy to be back home; GO FOR IT!

[weltschmerz]

I moved to the USA. I came back home after five and a half years.

[Deleted]

I think Carl makes some valid points about his thoughts about moving back to his home country, but I think there are also some big differences. Carl, it's not the same as living in Haiti, but you are a part of a Haitian community in the United States. You have a lot of family members here. I don't think Ava has any family here, it doesn't seem like she even has many good friends here, if any at all. And it doesn't seem like she has bonded with anyone in the US that knows exactly what she's talking about and can relate when she talks about home. You've built a life here and made it home as much as you could, and have friends and family that you do/can see on a regular basis and that kind of gives you a feeling of "home" because the vibe, traditions, language, whatever, are familiar. I don't think Ava has any of that. She doesn't sound like she's really comfortable or thriving here, and she often sounds like she is lonely, which is understandable.

Ava, at this point in my own life, I long for something different, where life and how I spend my time and energy is more about the people I love and the simple things I enjoy, instead of those things getting whatever is left of me after I chase the money I need to be ok. So I might not be the best person to listen to right now. 

But I do understand why you would want to move back home. I don't remember exactly where you are from, I  want to say Argentina, but I could be way off base. Wherever it is, you know more about it and what it's really like living there than I do. I just suggest you really think it through and be logical and realistic. And if you do that and decide that moving back home sooner than originally planned is what you need to do for your soul to be at peace, go for it.

[Ava]

Thanks to all the positive feedback.
Particularly huge thanks to Carl for his time and honesty writing that long post giving his point of view.
I wish I could tag him but I don't know how to do it.
Even though there are similarities our stories have also differences.

Carl is surrounded by immediate family but I have nobody.

There used to be a community but some people moved back home, others moved to different areas of the US.

There are a few families left but they don't get along.
I do get along with them but they have their own thing going and their dynamics are different. They are mostly couples with adult children. I see them every now and then and that's it.

I am aware that going back to live is not the same as visiting. However all my family and friends are here and I have nobody in the US.

Here is not Argentina. Here is Uruguay. I've said Argentina in the past because the Uruguayan community is so small I was afraid of putting my privacy at risk. I don't mind the regulars but this is the open internet after all.

I don't want to make a rush decision but this has been boiling inside me for years.
I don't have it bad in the US but it's a very lonely existence that is affecting my mental, emotional and physical health.

I am a US citizen and I want to keep my citizenship as well as my CPA license.
Yes there is a risk of Trump getting on my way but I don't think it would happen.

Healthcare in Uruguay is excellent and very affordable. My main frustration right now is having to sell the car at a loss and my biggest concern is finding a job here.

If I go back and forth understand I am talking to myself as well as all of you and trying to come up with the best possible solution.

[Deleted]

Ava, what about giving yourself a little more time, say a year or 2, and put everything you have into putting yourself in the best possible situation financially to move back home? Do you think you could stick it out here another year or so, if that gives you time to sort things out and save as much money as you can?

How much time would you need to be able to sell your condo? I'm not a big risk taker, so with that disclaimer out there, I'll say that I don't think I would be comfortable still being responsible for the condo and having tenants after I moved to another country. But that's just me, I'm sure you wouldn't be the first person to do something like that.

[TheHaitian]

What we do have is in family in the US but we have not live closed to them in over 10 years (since we got married). All our families have been 4-5 hours drive away but yes we do see them for major family occasions and events 3-5 times a year at least.

With my DD now I am making an effort to travel to NJ/NY more often (maybe every other month) so she can used to her family and cousins; we are starting that this month since she is getting better at recognizing people and remembering their names.

As for Haitian community, we have been pretty non-inclusive because my wife as underwaterchloe put it is very “prissy” lol... so we have been a bit touch and go. But now with a daughter and my desire for her to speak both French and creole I am working on getting more integrated in the Haitian community in the DMV area. But we actually went out of our way to avoid living close to or interacting with Haitian communities (and we lived in MA where there is a big Haitian community) because it is at times a little too much: example my family ; love to see them 3-5 times a year... 3-5 times a month or week will be overdoing it.

[TheHaitian]

But Good luck OP and wishing you the best with your decision... I understand how it feels like to miss home!

[Ava]

The condo has to be a rental because it's underwater. Anyway it's not the biggest problem at all.

As for staying another year or two before moving, I've done that several times in the past and then get cold feet. I'm not saying it's a now or never situation because it's not. The longer I stay in the US though I start getting used to being along and making do with whatever scraps of social life I manage to get and I continue to limp along.

Then I come here and see my family and friends and realize what I'm missing.

[laterbloomer]

There is a lot to be said for being with your family and community. I only moved within Canada but I'm 500 km from one side of my family and 1500 km from my parents and other side of my family. Sometimes I really miss that community. But most of the time I'm attached to the life I have built here, my partner, my girls, my job, my home and my current community. I can understand you deciding either way.

[toomuchreality]

Jan 19, 2019 18:47:50 GMT -5 Ava said:

Thanks to all the positive feedback.
Particularly huge thanks to Carl for his time and honesty writing that long post giving his point of view.
I wish I could tag him but I don't know how to do it.
Even though there are similarities our stories have also differences.

Carl is surrounded by immediate family but I have nobody.

There used to be a community but some people moved back home, others moved to different areas of the US.

There are a few families left but they don't get along.
I do get along with them but they have their own thing going and their dynamics are different. They are mostly couples with adult children. I see them every now and then and that's it.

I am aware that going back to live is not the same as visiting. However all my family and friends are here and I have nobody in the US.

Here is not Argentina. Here is Uruguay. I've said Argentina in the past because the Uruguayan community is so small I was afraid of putting my privacy at risk. I don't mind the regulars but this is the open internet after all.

I don't want to make a rush decision but this has been boiling inside me for years.
I don't have it bad in the US but it's a very lonely existence that is affecting my mental, emotional and physical health.

I am a US citizen and I want to keep my citizenship as well as my CPA license.
Yes there is a risk of Trump getting on my way but I don't think it would happen.

Healthcare in Uruguay is excellent and very affordable. My main frustration right now is having to sell the car at a loss and my biggest concern is finding a job here.

If I go back and forth understand I am talking to myself as well as all of you and trying to come up with the best possible solution.

One of the nicest people/person I've ever known was from Uruguay. 
I don't know where in the USA you live, but if it were near me, I would love to meet up with you!

For years, I had a neighbor who always was complaining about living in the city we live in. He ALWAYS carried on about how much he LOVED living in (Texas?) the town he grew up in. I asked him why he stayed here, instead of moving back. After 3-4 years (living near me), he did move back. Said he had everything arranged. Family and friends were expecting him and it was going to be marvelous! Within a month he was hating it! After living there about 3 months, he moved back to where I live. 

Biggest difference- He hadn't been back to visit for probably 30-40 years. A lot changes in that amount of time. The friends and family he made all of his arrangements with, weren't the same IRL as they were over the internet, or even the phone. Things weren't the same as what he remembered.

It sounds like you are giving this lots of careful consideration. Good for you. Wherever you end up, I hope you will be happy.
Now that I'm in my 60's and alone, I understand and appreciate the need to be happy and enjoy life (surroundings, people, etc) much more than I did when I was younger. The ability to 'just adapt', as you get older, esp if you don't have a partner, is MUCH harder.

I'm glad you have been enjoying your vacation and the time spent with your mother. That's something that you can't get back later. I wish I had spent more time with my mother (and father) when they were alive.

Do what you think will make you the happiest in the long run. Remember that nothing is 100% good all the time and either way will have it's struggles and challenges.    -Good luck to you, whatever you decide.  

[justme]

Don't forget to consider any US taxes if you move back. I don't know any specifics, but know the is done taxation on income earned abroad by US citizens. And it's ramped up in recent years. I've seen articles about the increase of renouncing citizenship by expats to stop paying that tax. Also remember it being in an article about Meghan markle becoming british.